Madeleine McCann Missing-Praia Da Luz, Portugal 3/05/07 #1

[robots]

Janet- I still just do not get it. I can not mentally wrap my mind around this aspect.

The McCanns with half of Portugal observing them, decide to rent a car, drive to the location where the body was so well hidden for 25 days that no one could find it, retrieve the body and then dispose of the body in such a way that it is still unaccounted for.

If this is the theory, I can not understand how and why the police are not laughing at themselves. This goes beyond the realm of unbelievability for me.

the parents may have rented it BUT had someone else move the child

 

[Tamikosmom]

Janet- I still just do not get it. I can not mentally wrap my mind around this aspect.

The McCanns with half of Portugal observing them, decide to rent a car, drive to the location where the body was so well hidden for 25 days that no one could find it, retrieve the body and then dispose of the body in such a way that it is still unaccounted for.

If this is the theory, I can not understand how and why the police are not laughing at themselves. This goes beyond the realm of unbelievability for me.

the parents may have rented it BUT had someone else move the child

 

Robot ... the assistance of others in hiding Madeline for 25 days and ... then moving her body is a real possibility.  It will be interesting to see if interrogators request Dr. Russell O'Brien and his partner, Jane Tanner to come back to Portugal for interrogation.

Janet

+++++++++++++++++

The three crucial hours before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing
By NEIL SEARS
Last updated at 15:30pm on 8th September 2007

Another member of the group, Jane Tanner, took a turn around ten minutes later. She has told police that as she returned to the bar she saw a dark-haired man aged around 35 carrying a child. Again, she thought nothing of it.

A further detail from the evening is that the McCanns' friend Dr Russell O'Brien, 36, is understood to have left the table at some time after 9pm, to attend to his own ill daughter …..

Link


Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave
By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007

Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick. It is understood he shared duties with his partner Jane Tanner ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml

[Rob]

Janet and Robots-
We all want to know the same thing. I have no idea unless they moved the body. The fact that Kate did not confess is not a vindication of her by me, but I wouldn't confess to something I did not do either. After everything they have been through, at some point if she were guilty she would prolly just confess and get it off her chest..imo...

As you see by the articles posted by vms, there could be some explanation for the results. 

Seems to be very minute trace samples.

[Rob]

Janet- I still just do not get it. I can not mentally wrap my mind around this aspect.

The McCanns with half of Portugal observing them, decide to rent a car, drive to the location where the body was so well hidden for 25 days that no one could find it, retrieve the body and then dispose of the body in such a way that it is still unaccounted for.

If this is the theory, I can not understand how and why the police are not laughing at themselves. This goes beyond the realm of unbelievability for me.

the parents may have rented it BUT had someone else move the child

 

however Kate is alleged to have the scent of a cadaver on her clothing... yet not Gerry.. so this could mean that she moved the body.

Also the car key had the scent.

I personally still think Maddy is alive.

[sleddogs]

Breaking news SKY. McCanns coming home in 9 hours

[sleddogs]

Forgot the link

http://news.sky.com/skynews/home

[vms]

Now we're fighting for our lives

By Sara Nuwar

ANGUISHED dad Gerry McCann, fought back after he and wife Kate were named official suspects over Maddie, and declared: "We're entirely innocent. But now we're fighting for our lives."

The 39-year-old heart surgeon vowed to take on the Portuguese legal system and insisted: "We did NOT kill our daughter! We WILL clear our name and we will NOT give up on Madeleine."

But Gerry confessed the couple are bracing themselves for still more shock twists in the four-month investigation. And he revealed how he:

BACKS wife Kate 100 per cent.

FEARS cops are under too much pressure to come up with a result.

HARBOURS serious doubts about the Portuguese legal system— which tried to wheedle a confession out of Kate by offering her a light jail sentence.

KNOWS that, amazingly, under local laws they may have cobbled together enough to charge them. 

He added the family now want to return to the UK with their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, as soon as they can—but will do everything they can to prove their innocence.

Pressure

Despite his refusal to buckle under the growing pressure, Gerry admitted: "We thought we were in our worst nightmare but now it just keeps getting worse and worse.

"It's such a vulnerable position. It's appalling. We've never had to say it until now...but we did not kill our daughter. I never believed it would come to this.

"But when the paranoia sinks in, you're under severe pressure and things are going down a certain line, then it does look bad.

"In a system that you don't know and you don't really trust it's incredibly frightening."

Gerry spoke out after he and Kate endured a tense grilling by detectives and were officially labelled ‘arguidos'—Portuguese for suspects.

The couple were quizzed in the town of Portimao—30 miles from the Praia da Luz holiday apartment where Madeleine vanished on May 3—for a total of 24 hours.

Legally, Gerry is now barred from talking about the detail of the inquiry.

Rebuff

He is not allowed to explain why police now suspect him, or rebuff the new evidence they believe they have unearthed more than 100 days after Maddie went missing.

Although he is "absolutely confident" there is no evidence to link him and Kate with any suspicion of murder, Gerry admitted the latest twist of events had left him with "anxieties".

"I don't need to tell you how things don't stack up," he said. 

"I know 100 per cent Kate could NOT have done anything. I know that's true from what I did that night.

"And in terms of what Kate knows about me, I was away from her for just ten minutes."

Gerry and Kate, who continues to hold onto Maddie's favourite Cuddle Cat toy for comfort, have always said that they put their three children to bed in the apartment at 7pm. They told police that at 8.30pm they went for a meal with a group of friends in the family resort.

Each adult in the party of nine took turns to check on the children.

Gerry denied he would have had time to hide a body, if as police suggested, he or his wife had killed Maddie by accident.

"As I said, I was away from the table for ten minutes," he said. "Six minutes of that was spent speaking to another guest I met as I came out from checking on Madeleine.

"All of this can come out. And it doesn't stack up."

But friends fear there is now evidence that raises suspicions about the McCann's chronology of events. They worry that any apparent discrepancies in timings are being given undue weight by police. Nevertheless they are convinced such doubts can be blown out of the water.

Gerry could only say: "I hope that the due diligence and processes will win through in the normal way and not the need for a result."

He said the Portuguese police's attitude towards him and Kate had shifted in the last five weeks.

There has been a steady stream of slurs against them in the local and national Portuguese press.

The Leicester couple's family in the UK believe these came directly from police sources. The McCanns now fear the cops may be about to arrest and charge them. Gerry told us: "Our lawyer said the weight of it is that, under the Portuguese legal system, they've got enough to move forward against us." 

Then he revealed they may consider flying in a crack legal team from the UK to assist their Portuguese advisor.

Worse

But he confessed he is frustrated they are not allowed to use any of the £800,000 Madeleine Fund— boosted by celebrity appeals including Harry Potter author J.K. Rowling and soccer star David Beckham—to pay their mounting legal bills.

"It seems like a disaster that we've got this huge donated fund and now we're not allowed to use it for legal costs because we're under suspicion," said Gerry.

"I never really imagined we'd be in this situation.

"And it could get worse I suppose. But ultimately if it comes to that, sooner or later, there'll be a formal process whereby we can rebut things in court. Then it will all come out.

"We'd have to be patient but ultimately we'll have the opportunity to have all of the evidence examined and discover the whole picture about what happened. And that's what's sustaining me.

"At least now we've got a clearer view of what we're up against whereas what we had before was smear and innuendo. We know what we have to fight now. The problem is we DO have a fight, but before I wasn't quite sure.

"You get paranoid when there's a political shift.

"Because of the amount of pressure there's been on the Policia Judicia, and all the criticism, you always wonder how far they'll go.

"Now I've seen what they've got I'm actually clearer in my mind why they've shifted and treated us so differently.

"I'm still concerned with their perception of the evidence, but that's for us to sort out with legal support."

Gerry then voiced their other big concern now that the spotlight has turned on him and Kate. "It's a real double-edged sword," he said. "While this investigation focuses on us it's NOT focusing on looking for Madeleine."

He admitted the last few days of gruelling police interviews had been draining on the couple. But he said that despite everything Kate was coping under the strain.

Trouble

"I'm thinking clearer this morning," he added. "What we're negotiating with police is whether we'll be allowed to go home to the UK. I don't know if they will agree but we're desperate to get back for the kids' sake and emotional reasons. It's not that we're running away.

"If there are two people in the world that can't run away it's us. Anyway, we have to move accommodation because the lease on our villa is up this week.

"The trouble is I don't know how long all this is going to take.

"It's four months already.

"Everything is slow. It's just the culture. Kate's not too bad, though. In fact, she's pretty resilient. But when we were trying to decide whether to return to Britain that's when this smearing started in the papers. And Kate just thought, ‘They want us out!'

"I said, ‘Kate, there's no point in staying if it's counter-productive.' She realised that was right but the thought of returning home brought back all the emotions of pain almost as bad as the first few days after Maddie vanished.

"That sense of loss and the thought of never seeing her again.

"Kate gets that more than I do. It's still intermittent grief and pain."

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/0909_maddie.shtml

[Tamikosmom]

Rob ... this is a forum.  Varying opinions.

Yesterday I was straddling the fence but ... today when I consider what those close to the McCanns are revealing regarding what authorities have told Kate regarding finding Maddie's blood in the rental vehicle together with my suspicions regarding Russell Obrien and Jane Tanner ... I am leaning towards the possibility the parents have first hand knowledge regarding what happened to their daughter and  ... they had assistance in a coverup.  Then ... tomorrow something may be revealed and ... this wannabe detective may change her mind.

Nevertheless ... when all is said and done ... I pray the truth will be revealed and ... there will be justice for Maddie McCann.

Janet

[Tamikosmom]

Breaking news SKY. McCanns coming home in 9 hours

Thanks sleddogs

McCanns To Fly Home Today - Sources
Updated: 01:05, Sunday September 09, 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann are to fly home to Britain from Portugal on Sunday morning ...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283278,00.html

[Kat_Gram]

I haven't been following this as closely as some, but it is hard to believe that the parents had anything to do with this. DNA evidence in a car they rented aferwards ? Well, who had the car before ? And who did the DNA testing ? How much DNA, what type ? And all the etc's. How accurate ? Don't forget there are two other kiddos who are close relatives. The " evidence " against the parents is sketchy at this time and IMHO, the Portuguese are trying to deflect their stupidity and the negative attention away from themselves onto the parents. Or anyone else. Didn't they name some other person as a suspect ?

[BlueKYGirl]

Breaking news SKY. McCanns coming home in 9 hours

Thanks sleddogs

McCanns To Fly Home Today - Sources
Updated: 01:05, Sunday September 09, 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann are to fly home to Britain from Portugal on Sunday morning ...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283278,00.html

If I were them, I'd be getting the heck out of Portugal, too.

[Rob]

Rob ... this is a forum.  Varying opinions.

Yesterday I was straddling the fence but ... today when I consider what those close to the McCanns are revealing regarding what authorities have told Kate regarding finding Maddie's blood in the rental vehicle together with my suspicions regarding Russell Obrien and Jane Tanner ... I am leaning towards the possibility the parents have first hand knowledge regarding what happened to their daughter and  ... they had assistance in a coverup.  Then ... tomorrow something may be revealed and ... this wannabe detective may change her mind.

Nevertheless ... when all is said and done ... I pray the truth will be revealed and ... there will be justice for Maddie McCann.

Janet

WELL SAID.

[sleddogs]

Breaking news SKY. McCanns coming home in 9 hours

Thanks sleddogs

McCanns To Fly Home Today - Sources
Updated: 01:05, Sunday September 09, 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann are to fly home to Britain from Portugal on Sunday morning ...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283278,00.html

If I were them, I'd be getting the heck out of Portugal, too.

Same here!!!

Pretty much leads me to believe the police pulled a bluff and it failed. Currently I side with the parents.

[Kat_Gram]

I agree with you SledDoggie, what part of the country are you from ?
I am in Canada and although it is cold in the winter here, no sled dogs. There are some clubs here and some of the winter festivals feature sled dog races, so I have seen them..

[San]

Breaking news SKY. McCanns coming home in 9 hours

Thanks sleddogs

McCanns To Fly Home Today - Sources
Updated: 01:05, Sunday September 09, 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann are to fly home to Britain from Portugal on Sunday morning ...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283278,00.html

If I were them, I'd be getting the heck out of Portugal, too.

I wonder if this is exactly what Portugal wants them to do.  Remember how hard Aruba tried to get Beth & company to go home.  It seems to me that Portugal wants this to go away like it never happened.  What better way to get them to leave than accuse them of murdering their own daughter.  JMO.

[sleddogs]

Breaking news SKY. McCanns coming home in 9 hours

Thanks sleddogs

McCanns To Fly Home Today - Sources
Updated: 01:05, Sunday September 09, 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann are to fly home to Britain from Portugal on Sunday morning ...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283278,00.html

If I were them, I'd be getting the heck out of Portugal, too.

I wonder if this is exactly what Portugal wants them to do.  Remember how hard Aruba tried to get Beth & company to go home.  It seems to me that Portugal wants this to go away like it never happened.  What better way to get them to leave than accuse them of murdering their own daughter.  JMO.

Bingo!

[sleddogs]

I agree with you SledDoggie, what part of the country are you from ?
I am in Canada and although it is cold in the winter here, no sled dogs. There are some clubs here and some of the winter festivals feature sled dog races, so I have seen them..

I sent you a Yahoo IM

[robots]

Mrs McCann was interrogated for 16 hours in two sessions on Thursday and Friday. Friends said she remained strong despite the onslaught.

The couple were reported to have refused to answer more than 40 questions.



IF true, this cant be good 

[robots]

I agree with you SledDoggie, what part of the country are you from ?
I am in Canada and although it is cold in the winter here, no sled dogs. There are some clubs here and some of the winter festivals feature sled dog races, so I have seen them..

I sent you a Yahoo IM

i like Yoohoos...

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[MuffyBee]

MADELEINE: THE INCREDIBLE STORY MADELEINE:
snipped
On the evenings immediately prior to their daughter’s abduction, Kate and Gerry, along with their friends, dined without their children who were left, at least according to Pamela Fenn, a resident in a nearby apartment, screaming for their parents.
 
This despite holiday company Mark Warner offering professional babysitting for just £10-a-night. Had the wealthy Kate and Jerry opted to have all three children looked after for the duration of their holiday, it would have cost them just £140.

and this:  snipped
There are fears that Kate could be heading for the same dire situation as Leonor Cipriano, who was jailed for 16 years in Portugal three years ago for the murder of her own daughter.
 
Cipriano was convicted by the same detective, Goncalo Amara, who heads the hunt for Madeleine. Cipriano maintains that she was framed and the confession was beaten out of her during questioning.
http://www.express.co.uk/features/view/18573/Madeleine-The-incredible-story-

I have read of rumors concerning the McCann children crying with the parents gone, sometimes for a hour at a time, but haven't been able to find that stated by her in an article I can cite.  So, I feel that could just be a rumor.
I was wondering what the cost of a sitter for the night would be for three children at the resort.  This is the first article than mentioned it.  10 British pounds is just over 20.00.  For a night for three kids, that isn't too bad.

I was searching the web  for news from Britain concerning this case and I'm not certain how good some of the sources are.  How reliable a newspaper might be.  I have been reading in some of the commentary sections and I find some are very much pro McCann and to think the family could have a hand in the reason Madeleine is missing is "ludicrous". There are others that feel the McCann family knows what happened to their daughter and are involved in her death by accident and coverup.  Then there are others that feel like I do:  the McCann's are innocent until proven guilty, if in fact they did have a hand in Madeleine's death.  I do feel that the parents did need to be questioned.  Kate McCann had only been questioned I think the day after Madeleine went missing, and I think that was very briefly.  I believe if nothing else, it was correct to question the McCann's to see if there is anything they may remember that would help, to rule them out as having a hand in it or to find out if were responsible for Madeleine's disappearance.  To question the McCann's at this point is not "ludicrous".  It is part of an investigation, and it should have been done earlier.  I understand the forensics brought about the questioning at this time.  That, and the fact the McCann's were going to leave Portugal.  I don't know if the McCann's were responsible for Madeleine's missing status or not.  In the meantime, where is Madeleine?