Lively Case Discussion #633 6/2 - 6/3/2007

[Elaine]

Does anyone know why the Worldjournier Natalee Timeline is down? I can't get to it.  TIA

Is this it Elaine?

http://tinyurl.com/39zppz

Thanks BB, that is certainly the google cache of it, the direct link tells me it's not there ....but yes that's it thanks

[Easywriter]

Easy, do you mean various dna?

Yeah, I was just trying to think why he gave those details about that location.  He was either worried that someone might of seen his car there, or he thought he might have left some type of bodily fluids in that location.

Then again, that stop could be a distraction pointing in the opposite direction of another.

Did Satish, or Joran confirm that story about stopping at Arashi?

[Angiex911dsptchr]

at the risk of being accused of being an idiot, I am going to write two words and most of the men will know what I mean about Deepak and urine.

"Golden rain."

  Glad you said it.. I was being quiet and thoughy of Golden Shower.

[Rob]

Guys, that bloody substance was not on the rocks before 6-5-2005. I know I have all the info on this Rocks thing. There is only one way that the rocks have anything to do with Natalee is if she was in a freezer, per Deepak key to auxiliary kitchen, and Natalee was frozen and then taken to the rocks on 6-9 / 6-10 2005 and then disposed of there... otherwise there is no chance.

I don't know what happened at that rock area still to this day and I have seen more video than anyone. It is still not clear what exactly happened there. It needs to be answered one way or the other.

How do you know the bloody substance was not on the rocks prior to 6/5?

Because Mr. Holloway told me he searched there multiple times. There was no red substance. ..he would have seen it and so would have his friends.

In a interesting shift. Ed SMIT told me that he saw Dave drive right by him, but it was actually Paul Reynolds in a red jeep.

[Angiex911dsptchr]

Guys, that bloody substance was not on the rocks before 6-5-2005. I know I have all the info on this Rocks thing. There is only one way that the rocks have anything to do with Natalee is if she was in a freezer, per Deepak key to auxiliary kitchen, and Natalee was frozen and then taken to the rocks on 6-9 / 6-10 2005 and then disposed of there... otherwise there is no chance.

I don't know what happened at that rock area still to this day and I have seen more video than anyone. It is still not clear what exactly happened there. It needs to be answered one way or the other.

How do you know the bloody substance was not on the rocks prior to 6/5?

 yeah? what she said? I was gonna ask too?

[klaasend]

Guys, that bloody substance was not on the rocks before 6-5-2005. I know I have all the info on this Rocks thing. There is only one way that the rocks have anything to do with Natalee is if she was in a freezer, per Deepak key to auxiliary kitchen, and Natalee was frozen and then taken to the rocks on 6-9 / 6-10 2005 and then disposed of there... otherwise there is no chance.

I don't know what happened at that rock area still to this day and I have seen more video than anyone. It is still not clear what exactly happened there. It needs to be answered one way or the other.

How do you know the bloody substance was not on the rocks prior to 6/5?

Because Mr. Holloway told me he searched there multiple times. There was no red substance. ..he would have seen it and so would have his friends.

In a interesting shift. Ed SMIT told me that he saw Dave drive right by him, but it was actually Paul Reynolds in a red jeep.

Rob - there are alot of rocks in that area that look similar.  How does Dave know that he was in that exact spot?

[Grande]

While I try to be open to everyone's theories, what I've always come back to thinking is that something happened at the rocks, she died either there or in Deepak's car, and she was put in the ocean in the fish trap.

Dr. Hodges theory doesn't include anything to do with the rocks, but it does make sense to me.

I have always felt that something significant happend at Arashi Beach.  There is no other explanation for Deepak's urinating statementS hence the alibi for being there out of his vehicle.

Is "taking a pee" a sexual innuendo? My guess is yes, but not being a guy, i would not know.

not in my book  

That's an interesting thought.  

The urinating alibi could be more of a result of the subconcious memories of having his 'unit' out @ Arashi, if in fact that is the case.  It also provided reasoning for being there.

He also claims to have urinated just 45 minutes earlier @ Carlos n' Charlies.  

Deepak likely retrieved the narcotics while @ C&C's when he claimed to have been urinating.

That is a lot of peeing for a person that was drinking whiskey and coke.  Could be that he wanted to cover in case something of him was found at that location.

Honestly, I don't think Deepak had the time to drink much if any at all.  He may have taken a 'road soda' for the ride, but time did not allow for much drinking between Joran's and Arashi IMO.

He did say in one of his suspect statments that he and Satish to a yard to go when leaving C+C's

I recall.   The issue is, Deepak claims to have urinated twice from the time they arrived at C&C's to the time they arrived @ Arashi.  Unless Deepak was drinking from the time he got off of work, It would seem very unlikely he had to pee two times within that appx. 1 hour time period.  Again, I think one or both of the statements regarding 'urinating' are alibi's for something else, whether that be DNA as Easy suggested, an attempt to fill the gaps in the timeline, or even a glimpse into the subconcious mind and a sexual assault.

[Easywriter]

While I try to be open to everyone's theories, what I've always come back to thinking is that something happened at the rocks, she died either there or in Deepak's car, and she was put in the ocean in the fish trap.

Dr. Hodges theory doesn't include anything to do with the rocks, but it does make sense to me.

I have always felt that something significant happend at Arashi Beach.  There is no other explanation for Deepak's urinating statementS hence the alibi for being there out of his vehicle.

Is "taking a pee" a sexual innuendo? My guess is yes, but not being a guy, i would not know.

not in my book  

That's an interesting thought.  

The urinating alibi could be more of a result of the subconcious memories of having his 'unit' out @ Arashi, if in fact that is the case.  It also provided reasoning for being there.

He also claims to have urinated just 45 minutes earlier @ Carlos n' Charlies.  

Deepak likely retrieved the narcotics while @ C&C's when he claimed to have been urinating.

That is a lot of peeing for a person that was drinking whiskey and coke.  Could be that he wanted to cover in case something of him was found at that location.

Honestly, I don't think Deepak had the time to drink much if any at all.  He may have taken a 'road soda' for the ride, but time did not allow for much drinking between Joran's and Arashi IMO.

If Deepak had pouring back a bunch of beer he might of had a frequent need to stop and take a leak, but whiskey and coke doesn't do that to a person.

So, the question is why did he even bring up the stop?

[Tamikosmom]

Dr. Hodges's theories which encompass aspects of the Natalee Holloway case ... mirrors to some extend ... the theories of many.  However ... this guy's "respected" professional expertise in the field of psychiatry commands attention ... provides him with a measure of credibility.  He is not claiming a visionary experience ... he is not putting his theories in a riddle ... he is not claiming a psychic experience.  Most of us Monkeys have come to many of the same conclusions as Dr. Hodges but ... these  conclusion has been arrived at through logic based on research that has been derived through the media ... articles ... documents ...

Think about ... in Dave Holloway book ... Aruba: The Untold Story of Natalee Holloway and Corruption in Paradise .. he acknowledges that "Out of Desperation" (Chapter 3) the family afforded platforms to those whose theories were arrived at through some very unconventional methods and ... then the Appendix of his book was devoted to Shango's Riddle.

Janet

http://forensicthoughtprints.com/contact.html

[Rob]

Rob - there are alot of rocks in that area that look similar.  How does Dave know that he was in that exact spot?

I'm quite sure he is correct and I would be willing to bank that RED is also familiar with this area.

Something happened there, but I'm not sure what. Believe me Klaas, I'm still   not sure what happened down there. Something really bizarre for sure.

You have to know, these people did it all the first 10 days and who knows what is real and not real....that could be a staged event... we don't know for sure.

[Tylergal]

I told Satish, "She has had enough...."  What had she had enough of?

[Grande]

While I try to be open to everyone's theories, what I've always come back to thinking is that something happened at the rocks, she died either there or in Deepak's car, and she was put in the ocean in the fish trap.

Dr. Hodges theory doesn't include anything to do with the rocks, but it does make sense to me.

I have always felt that something significant happend at Arashi Beach.  There is no other explanation for Deepak's urinating statementS hence the alibi for being there out of his vehicle.

Is "taking a pee" a sexual innuendo? My guess is yes, but not being a guy, i would not know.

not in my book  

That's an interesting thought.  

The urinating alibi could be more of a result of the subconcious memories of having his 'unit' out @ Arashi, if in fact that is the case.  It also provided reasoning for being there.

He also claims to have urinated just 45 minutes earlier @ Carlos n' Charlies.  

Deepak likely retrieved the narcotics while @ C&C's when he claimed to have been urinating.

That is a lot of peeing for a person that was drinking whiskey and coke.  Could be that he wanted to cover in case something of him was found at that location.

Honestly, I don't think Deepak had the time to drink much if any at all.  He may have taken a 'road soda' for the ride, but time did not allow for much drinking between Joran's and Arashi IMO.

If Deepak had pouring back a bunch of beer he might of had a frequent need to stop and take a leak, but whiskey and coke doesn't do that to a person.

So, the question is why did he even bring up the stop?

Good question.  He was there IMO.  I don't recall if Joran and/or Satish backed up the alibi.  I do recall his statement about Arashi was very detailed down to the spot at 'the end of the asphalted area' where he parked.  I posted some images of that precise spot at one point.  I will see if I can find them.

[Tylergal]

Take the vide out....she's had enough... "was it a video?"  What did he tell him to take out? She had had enough?  Was it take the belt off, she has had enough?  Or take your organ out of her, she is choking.

[klaasend]

Rob - there are alot of rocks in that area that look similar.  How does Dave know that he was in that exact spot?

I'm quite sure he is correct and I would be willing to bank that RED is also familiar with this area.

Something happened there, but I'm not sure what. Believe me Klaas, I'm still   not sure what happened down there. Something really bizarre for sure.

You have to know, these people did it all the first 10 days and who knows what is real and not real....that could be a staged event... we don't know for sure.

Rob - Dave didn't even get to Aruba until June 1 or 2.  There are several rock formations near the Lighthouse.  How would Dave have known back then where to look?  We didn't even know about it then?

[bleachedblack]

Easy, do you mean various dna?

Yeah, I was just trying to think why he gave those details about that location.  He was either worried that someone might of seen his car there, or he thought he might have left some type of bodily fluids in that location.

Then again, that stop could be a distraction pointing in the opposite direction of another.

Did Satish, or Joran confirm that story about stopping at Arashi?

I wonder if this from Sander Gottenbos statement 6/16/05 should really be interpreted to read  ".....that the girl in the neighborhood of Arashi beach lost consciousness."

 Joran said that they drove in the direction the "Lighthouse" and that the girl in the neighborhood of Arashi fell asleep.

[klaasend]

Take the vide out....she's had enough... "was it a video?"  What did he tell him to take out? She had had enough?  Was it take the belt off, she has had enough?  Or take your organ out of her, she is choking.

Exactly.  What did she really have enough of.

[bleachedblack]

I told Satish, "She has had enough...."  What had she had enough of?

The porn video the put in the DVD?

[Tylergal]

"We washed the car.  There was a white car."  Some psychiatrists will tell you that people who rape or have been raped, can never get clean enough and wearing white, or talking about white things washes the guilt away, the dirt, the filth.

She said "slaves..."  Sex with a belt is considered "master and slave.."

[yapperz1]

In the beginning Deepak's attorney said they made a stop at another bar or a store after leaving CnCs. What did they stop for? Drugs or another pimp?

[Grande]

While I try to be open to everyone's theories, what I've always come back to thinking is that something happened at the rocks, she died either there or in Deepak's car, and she was put in the ocean in the fish trap.

Dr. Hodges theory doesn't include anything to do with the rocks, but it does make sense to me.

I have always felt that something significant happend at Arashi Beach.  There is no other explanation for Deepak's urinating statementS hence the alibi for being there out of his vehicle.

Is "taking a pee" a sexual innuendo? My guess is yes, but not being a guy, i would not know.

not in my book  

That's an interesting thought.  

The urinating alibi could be more of a result of the subconcious memories of having his 'unit' out @ Arashi, if in fact that is the case.  It also provided reasoning for being there.

He also claims to have urinated just 45 minutes earlier @ Carlos n' Charlies.  

Deepak likely retrieved the narcotics while @ C&C's when he claimed to have been urinating.

That is a lot of peeing for a person that was drinking whiskey and coke.  Could be that he wanted to cover in case something of him was found at that location.

Honestly, I don't think Deepak had the time to drink much if any at all.  He may have taken a 'road soda' for the ride, but time did not allow for much drinking between Joran's and Arashi IMO.

If Deepak had pouring back a bunch of beer he might of had a frequent need to stop and take a leak, but whiskey and coke doesn't do that to a person.

So, the question is why did he even bring up the stop?

Good question.  He was there IMO.  I don't recall if Joran and/or Satish backed up the alibi.  I do recall his statement about Arashi was very detailed down to the spot at 'the end of the asphalted area' where he parked.  I posted some images of that precise spot at one point.  I will see if I can find them.