Lively Case Discussion #634 6/4 - 6/5/2007

[truthseeker2]

Shango + Simaon = 2 crocks of shit

I disagree about Simian.  In the beginning he was not a crock of shit.  It wasn't until July of 2005 that some of Simian's posts turned into shit, IMO.

Back to work for me

name one thing they have done to help further the case, I cant think of anything

I'm not saying Simian furthered the case.  What I'm saying is that Simians posts in June 2005 appear to be true based upon the PV's we now see.  So Simian was telling the truth in June 2005.

So basically, your saying Simian could be anyone on the island who could see or hear what was going on but doesn't necessarily know anything that the rest of us don't know?

And only told us things that we were going to find out anyway?  


 I think that is all wrong about the boyfriend earlier in the week because they were on the island only 83 hours including sleeping time when Natalee disappeared and that is lame attempt is  cast blame on someone other than J2K.  There was no boyfriend earlier in the week and they did not spend that much time in the casino as there was not much time open to do so.

So what am I missing here?  Why should we believe him when this lie is very glaring and obvious?  

Was this a deliberate attempt to distract?  Must have been because how could he get it so wrong accidentally?.

.

What this is telling us is the direction the investigation was headed.  I do believe they questioned someone that Natalee may have spoken to in the casino, but not a 'boyfriend'.  I think they were trying to put some pieces together.

[blah]

Do S&S ever say WTH happened to Natalee and what they did with the body?

Yes

What and Where?  I must have missed that part.

.

me too, please show us !

[Buckeye]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

Columbian necktie??  No job??  Maybe he knew things weren't right "in the office" and he was hoping the message would get out without leading back to him.  Maybe he was upset with his boss because he wasn't getting overtime pay, so in his mind, he was screwing him....who knows...it's a crazy place.

[klaasend]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

BLAH - Simian was not cryptic in June 2005.  Shango was and I'm not sure what Shango's motivations were.  To me the Simian posts in June 2005 are pretty straight forward.

[Lala'sMom]

Do S&S ever say WTH happened to Natalee and what they did with the body?

Yes.

[Buckeye]

lila, Sidallee, Ree

No mistake.  Renfro got caught giving the misinformation.  The inspection was at 7am and this is Julia/Glenda's report at 12:44.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nKeZljVeFU

.

Buckeye, I could kiss your feet.

   

[Anna]

Do S&S ever say WTH happened to Natalee and what they did with the body?

Yes.

OK.   I'll ask again.

What happened to Natalee and what did they do with the body according to S&S?

.

[Rob]

OK..
I have not done the  Simian    route so bear with me..I'm a little slow

If you assume now that he is/was part of ALE... does what he had to say read any differently?  
If yaknowwhatimean
Just wondering

Only in that we may be able to apply some level of credibility to the posts regarding who was saying what and the direction the investigation was headed.

For a long time we all talked about the infamous Lorenzo.  Much of that was due to the posts below.  If Simian was either ALE or close to someone with ALE, then these posts seem more credible for me.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:48 pm
I am here. Can’t say the things I want… knows what happened

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:50 pm
Some people on the other side of the pond know more than what they are saying. There testimony, there’s security footage, there are witnesses. Guido, Lorenzo??, HI video.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:56 pm
The 5th suspect has an alibi so strong that he has everybody baffled. Paulus? or Lorenzo... Lorenzo was questioned by then

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:00 pm
The 5th suspect was the boyfriend from earlier in the week.
????? there is no boyfriend

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:03 pm
The party-goers said the 5th one was with them. He was the host. How could he have left? baffling...implies lorenzo

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:09 pm
A scorned lover needs a motive? Drives some people to some crazy deeds. Guido???

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:13 pm
A jealous boyfriend was at home with some friends. He couldn’t have done it. Sometimes friends will cover for each other. this is obvious

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:16 pm
He had to be let go

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:22 pm
This is not my theory. This is for real. for real Pharrel!!!

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:26 pm
The alibi story is the almost the latest.

The latest is that there’s a gap in the time-line for the boys.

It is true that one of them tried to off himself. Satish


Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:29 pm
I did not say an ex. Do you people read? I not into repeating myself.

Girl comes to Aruba. Meets cool and crazy guy in C@$ino. Goes out with him. He declares that to be the case. Can’t deny it. It’s on tape. Everybody in the C@$ino knows the group of teens, they have been drinking in there for free the whole week.

After a couple of days girl meets another boy in the same C@$ino. Goes out with him. This makes first guy really mad. So mad he confronts second boy. sounds like he believes Joran or Guido... who might be pointing the finger at GVC????

First guy never denies the affair. He knows they know he was with her. However, he has an airtight alibi. Some friends say they were at home with him. Until the morning.

How can this ever be solved? you tell us

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:55 pm
He has an alibi. So tight. So tight. Paulus???

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 6:01 pm
The first guy she met has all the motive. The second guy is scared shitless in a cell.Guido???

in bold

[blah]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

BLAH - Simian was not cryptic in June 2005.  Shango was and I'm not sure what Shango's motivations were.  To me the Simian posts in June 2005 are pretty straight forward.

where are Simians non-BS posts, is there a link to them?

[truthseeker2]

Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 2:58 pm
The music man’s song was not on the bill.
Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:09 pm
Simian, who else plays in the orchestra? A Babylonian….
Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:10 pm
The last hope rests on the shoulders of the cowboys. Ten days, two down, eight to go.The elder knows the passages in the palace too well. The Babylonians are afraid they might not be able to stop him.
Don’t shake the wire, ‘cause the bird will fy away.
Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:10 pm
Simian, older PVDS had one ot two cards up his sleeve. They have been played, and lost. Will one of the cards sing?

This is the first exchange between Shango and Simian.  They clearly know who each other are at this point.  In some ways Simian is egging Shango on with the riddles, even attempting to speak his language eventually.

What occured on June 24th ?   Sorry if this is common knowledge?

Nothing significant as far as I could tell.  The 26th was a court appearance for JP2k + Steve Croes.  Paulus and Steve were both released that day.  May be a reference to this, imo.

The 23rd is when Paulus was picked up and detained because of the gap in the timeline,

Waiting for a call…
 
Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Paulus has been picked up.

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:23 pm
The older Van Der Sloot has been taken in again by Aruban Police.

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:27 pm
Can’t confirm that he is detained. He has been taken in again by the authorities.

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:46 pm
Confirmed. He has been detained

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:56 pm
There is a gap in the stories between father and son.

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:57 pm
I mentioned yesterday that there is a gap in the timeline. Where’s Jake?

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:58 pm
One of the Kalpoes might be let go. Can’t confirm.

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:03 pm
The gap is in the timeline. Phone records. Log-on times on PC’s.

What we don’t know yet is what The Hague has found.

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:05 pm
If you were asleep who answered your phone?

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:09 pm
You can’t remember answering a phone call at 2:00 in the morning? When the next day your son was picked up?

[Easywriter]

Do S&S ever say WTH happened to Natalee and what they did with the body?

Yes.

That's the second time I read that and I know nothing more than I did before I asked.

[blah]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

BLAH - Simian was not cryptic in June 2005.  Shango was and I'm not sure what Shango's motivations were.  To me the Simian posts in June 2005 are pretty straight forward.

where are Simians non-BS posts, is there a link to them?

are these the quotes Rob just quoted in the post above?

[Anna]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

BLAH - Simian was not cryptic in June 2005.  Shango was and I'm not sure what Shango's motivations were.  To me the Simian posts in June 2005 are pretty straight forward.

But all I see is a little info as to who was being questioned and released during that small time slot before the false simians took over, not the answer to what happened to Natalee and where she is now located.

I have read this stuff a hundred times, too.  So instead of people just saying they tell all, please spell it out for those of us who are S&S challenged and don't see it at all.

.

[klaasend]

Blah - a bulk of Smians posts are at the top in this thread (although many have just been posted here as well):

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=281

[Artcolley]

OK..
I have not done the  Simian    route so bear with me..I'm a little slow

If you assume now that he is/was part of ALE... does what he had to say read any differently?  
If yaknowwhatimean
Just wondering

Only in that we may be able to apply some level of credibility to the posts regarding who was saying what and the direction the investigation was headed.

For a long time we all talked about the infamous Lorenzo.  Much of that was due to the posts below.  If Simian was either ALE or close to someone with ALE, then these posts seem more credible for me.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:48 pm
I am here. Can’t say the things I want…

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:50 pm
Some people on the other side of the pond
Most people refer to this as the Atlantic between Europe and the US. So, was Simeon in the Netherlands?

 know more than what they are saying. There testimony, there’s security footage, there are witnesses.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:56 pm
The 5th suspect has an alibi so strong that he has everybody baffled.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:00 pm
The 5th suspect was the boyfriend from earlier in the week.
Interesting since Natalee wasn't there that long.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:03 pm
The party-goers said the 5th one was with them. He was the host. How could he have left?

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:09 pm
A scorned lover needs a motive? Drives some people to some crazy deeds.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:13 pm
A jealous boyfriend was at home with some friends. He couldn’t have done it. Sometimes friends will cover for each other.
THis sounds like Glenda Crap

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:16 pm
He had to be let go

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:22 pm
This is not my theory. This is for real.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:26 pm
The alibi story is the almost the latest.

The latest is that there’s a gap in the time-line for the boys.

It is true that one of them tried to off himself.


Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:29 pm
I did not say an ex. Do you people read? I not into repeating myself.

Girl comes to Aruba. Meets cool and crazy guy in C@$ino. Goes out with him. He declares that to be the case. Can’t deny it. It’s on tape. Everybody in the C@$ino knows the group of teens, they have been drinking in there for free the whole week.
Again, reference to the whole week. Not possible.

After a couple of days girl meets another boy in the same C@$ino. Goes out with him. This makes first guy really mad. So mad he confronts second boy.
I believe this is BS

First guy never denies the affair. He knows they know he was with her. However, he has an airtight alibi. Some friends say they were at home with him. Until the morning.

How can this ever be solved?

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:55 pm
He has an alibi. So tight. So tight.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 6:01 pm
The first guy she met has all the motive. The second guy is scared shitless in a cell.

Okay, From my first take on this, it sounds like The Darksiders setting up what is to be one of their theories on this case.
That Natalee was with the blue eyed Dutchman or that One of the Mountain Brook boys killed her, either one out of jealousy.
The timeline is messed up and the events are ridiculous. They couldn't have happened.
Of course, its possible, if Simeon was ALE, that the theory ALE was trying to put forth was that a Mountain Brook boy killed her.
At least that is what it sounds like to me.

[Lala'sMom]

I suppose you could say neither said the exact location, just hints.  For instance...

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 10:31 pm
Mary never heard the buoy toll
ask the men who play dice and “roll”

We have been all over this passage many times...I still assert it references the possibility of her being in the water.  I know, I know. JMO.

[truthseeker2]

Blah - a bulk of Smians posts are at the top in this thread (although many have just been posted here as well):

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=281

Simian began posting in response to some of the 'sold into slavery' theories.  I think he/she was defending not just Aruba, but those involved in the early stages of the investigation.  As things began to unfold and the obvious 'screw-ups' were pointed out, Simian spend less time defending and more time sharing.

[Easywriter]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

BLAH - Simian was not cryptic in June 2005.  Shango was and I'm not sure what Shango's motivations were.  To me the Simian posts in June 2005 are pretty straight forward.

But all I see is a little info as to who was being questioned and released during that small time slot before the false simians took over, not the answer to what happened to Natalee and where she is now located.

I have read this stuff a hundred times, too.  So instead of people just saying they tell all, please spell it out for those of us who are S&S challenged and don't see it at all.

.

Yes, I would just like the abbreviated translation of the stuff that tells what and where.  Many have invested several hours going through all the posts, so it would be helpful if one of them would just boil it down into simple English.

[Rob]

Grande.. Klaas... anyone have any idea which station Burke worked at?

He sounds .. to me at least.. that he is waiting for some info from another station.

[Grande]

NO - have you looked at Simians posts in late June 2005 and compared them to the PV's taken at that time?  Several of Simian's posts match up almost identical to the subject in the PV's.  I believe Simian was a member of ALE and he was telling us what was going on, until he was told to STOP.

I am trying to look at this with an open mind but I just aint convinced yet.

What did this guy/girl have to gain by giving somewhat cryptic clues to some internet bloggers?  What could the bloggers do with any clues he was giving?

If he had some real inside info that could help the case but was afraid of the rest of the ALE, why wouldnt he go to the family, the FBI, the Dutch, Interpol, MSM, a lawyer, someone with power?  The MSM and family had detectives an searchers all over that island, why wouldnt he go to one of them?  Why type out cryptic seemingly nonesense on the internet if he wanted to be taken seriously?

PROCES VERBAAL

We, Roland Ramiro TROMP and Clyde Anthony Burke,
respectively inspector and sergeant first class, with the Korps
Politie Aruba and attached to the section Often Occurring Crime
District 2, state the following.

On June 23rd 2005, at approximately 14.30 hours, as a
suspect, a man was interviewed who stated his name was:
Paulus Antonius Petrus Johanna van der SLOOT,
born in the Netherlands on February 15th 1952, judge (common court)
and living at XXXXXXXX number XX on Aruba.

Before the interview the suspect P.A.P.J. van der SLOOT
was informed that he was under no obligation to answer.

The suspect P.A.P.J. van der SLOOT has asked if his council
Mr. A. SWAEN could be present at this interview and this was also
requested by his council. This request was denied.
His statement in dutch was transcribed by us, the reporting
officers and goes as follows:

“To you question what I can declare with regards to me being
arrested as a suspect of accessory to murder, manslaughter and
robbing someone of their freedom with death as the result, I can
state the following. I find this totally ridiculous and absurd.

To your question what level of ridiculousness this reaches,
I can state the following. I am of the opinion that my arrest
reaches the highest possible levels of ridiculousness and absurdity.

To your question whether I picked up Joran on the 30th
of May 2005, in the early morning hours, I can state the following.
I have previously stated that I had picked up Joran on Sunday
May 29th at approximately 23.00 hours near Mc Donalds. Subsequently
I woke up at that Monday morning at approximately 05.45 hours. In
the hours between I had gone to sleep and I did not hear Joran
leaving or hear him return home. 05.45 hours is the normal time for
the alarm to go off and I wake up. The children I wake up at
approximately 06.00 hours. I awakened Valentijn, Sebastian and Joran.
To your question whether it was difficult to wake up Joran on that
Monday morning, I can state the following. It is always difficult
to wake up Joran..."

AND THEN 35 minutes later this was posted on the SM FP

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:05 pm (15:05)
"If you were asleep who answered your phone?"

Then on June 24th this post…

Simian Says: June 24th, 2005 at 3:54 pm "...Based on my
knowledge they will be confronted. A set up for the behaviour
specialists?"  

This happens to be just prior to the June 24th Police car confrontation that
resulted in the transcript we have all seen.