Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 - 10/27/11

[trimmonthelake]

http://www.patriotledger.com/mobile/x804699188/WENDY-J-MURPHY-Understanding-the-Baby-Lisa-case-and-the-power-of-spin
WENDY J. MURPHY: Understanding the Baby Lisa case and the power of spin
GateHouse News Service
Posted Oct 23, 2011 @ 10:00 AM
 ::snipping2::
The lawyer for Lisa’s mother says we should pay no mind to the mother’s inconsistencies about when she last saw Lisa alive because traumatized people always make mistakes. This same lawyer told a jury in New York recently that a severely traumatized rape victim’s inconsistent statements proved she was lying about the crime.

So much for the effects of trauma.

He also criticized cops for being too tough on the parents even though in 99 percent of cases like this one, one or both parents is responsible and the child was killed, sold or given away to pay off a drug debt. In other words, cops have been tough on Lisa’s parents because they’d be idiots to waste too much time looking outside the family.

Most people find it hard to believe that a mother would harm her own sweet-faced little baby. They find it less hard to believe that a cranky-faced guy might be guilty, which is another reason to be mindful of why, IF the father is involved, the defense is likely to exploit the behavior of the mother when it comes to influencing our perception of reality.

We’ve seen enough of these cases to keep our eyes wide open this time. Lisa’s parents have a right to remain silent, but the Constitution says nothing about silencing those of us who believe that justice matters for a voiceless little girl.

Read more: http://www.patriotledger.com/archive/x804699188/WENDY-J-MURPHY-Understanding-the-Baby-Lisa-case-and-the-power-of-spin#ixzz1bcHg9ZxA

[4myjoey]

Why would a anonymous benefactor chose this case?  Why Taco and Meathead?  Sadly there are other cases
of missing persons that have gotten media attention.  Why the Lisa Irwin case?

[trimmonthelake]

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011

[Ono]

It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 

[Ono]

It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 

Ooops- meant :  " 8 x 10 "

[mymonkey]

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011

Good Morning...


I have been reading but not posting..my thoughts....Could one of the boys dropped Lisa when Mom was outside and the boys panicked   and did not tell the mom and she found Lisa deceased..could that be why the boys will not be allowed to be questioned...I am curious if the boys are in school and are telling anything to school counselors.

[Tamikosmom]

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011

Good Morning...


I have been reading but not posting..my thoughts....Could one of the boys dropped Lisa when Mom was outside and the boys panicked   and did not tell the mom and she found Lisa deceased..could that be why the boys will not be allowed to be questioned...I am curious if the boys are in school and are telling anything to school counselors.

Good Morning Mymonkey

I believe if baby Lisa's demise was a result of an accident ... 911 would have been called.  However ... an act of wrongdoing implies a cover up.

Have a good Sunday all.

Janet
8:41 AM PT

+++++++

As with each day ....

Psalm 118:24
This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it

[klaasend]

It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 

You are likely correct.  It didn't look like a carpet, looked like an area rug.  They may have had an area rug covering an older carpet.

[stayhomemommy]

Has anyone seen how long after death until a body gives off scent that he dogs can detect?
o/t for stayathomemommy and the rest of he cableless,most news channel links here work;
http://worldtvsite.net/usa.html
 

Thanks Alagary!!! 

[starshadow]

Re: Effexor

From this page:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000947/

"Venlafaxine extended-release (long-acting) capsules are also used to treat generalized anxiety disorder (GAD; excessive worrying that is difficult to control), social anxiety disorder (extreme fear of interacting with others or performing in front of others that interferes with normal life), and panic disorder (sudden, unexpected attacks of extreme fear and worry about these attacks). "

So yes, that specific medication is used to treat anxiety. It doesn't require or presume a diagnosis of depression.

"remember that alcohol can add to the drowsiness caused by this medication"

This does NOT mean "mixing alcohol and this medication will kill you"; it means "having this medication in your system while you are drinking means that the alcohol may make you sleepier than you normally would be for that amount of alcohol".
-----------------------
Re: the GMA video released this morning

The surveillance video is interesting, but the video inside the house with the lawyer is even more interesting.
Highlights:
- the carpet in the room where the dog supposedly hit was NOT removed.
- there appeared to be very little fingerprinting done
- the contents of the home were less disturbed than usual for a search, especially unexpected since the search was so lengthy
-----------------------
re: the Rx bottles

Heck, I have four on my desk right now, because I just refilled my fibro med and my painkiller. And if I had to leave the house and stay elsewhere, you can be sure they'd go with me. I'm fairly certain that there's still some vicodin and oxycodon left in the kitchen cupboard from the last time I broke myself while being clumsy. Now that I think about it, there might even be some Rx ibuprofen. Plus a full and a partial of my son's medication, and I think an empty or two might be living in there, too.

And if you looked in my craft cupboard, you'd find a baggie with a whole bunch of empties. They make great "rattles" (add beads, dried peas, beans, corn, whatever) to use inside crocheted baby toys.

So... four doesn't sound like many at all, not for a household of five.
-----------------------
re: the clothes, the purple shorts

When my daughter was that size, 95% of her wardrobe was pink, purple or both. (Unsurprising, especially after three boys!)

Having 3 or 4 purple shorts, and half a dozen pink ones, and about the same number in pants, wouldn't surprise me at all.
-----------------------
re: the alcohol

The logic is confusingly circular.

1. Because she drank alcohol and took her anxiety meds while she was the caregiver for her children, she's a bad mother.

2. Something happened to Lisa because DB was so drunk, whether it was accidental, or she was angry, or whatever.

3. Because DB had to be able to hide Lisa's body so well that LE can't find her, she must be lying about how much she drank - because to cover her tracks that well, she couldn't possibly have been incapacitated.

4. If she wasn't incapacitated, than #1 and #2 aren't valid anymore and we're back to where we started.
-----------------------
Other random comments and curiosities:
- How much did the neighbor have to drink that night?
- Has the neighbor allowed her child to be questioned?
- Have any of the nearby neighbors spoken out about their interactions with and impressions of the family?

- If you had done nothing wrong, and you'd had a terrible experience with law enforcement trying to extract a false confession from you, would you really allow them unlimited access to your child(ren) that are already traumatized by the disappearance of their sister?

- If law enforcement really felt that they needed to talk to those boys, they could ask a judge for it - thing is, that would entail lawyers and child psychology specialists and all that to be present to reduce trauma to the children - which, by the very nature of the situation, would make it difficult for law enforcement to influence the children's statements. I can see why LE would want unfettered access - it's too difficult to stack the deck if everyone is watching.

- If they're on TV asking for help about their missing child, they're attention whores that just want their 15 minutes. If they're not on TV, they don't care enough about their child to put themselves out there. Damned if you do, damned if you don't?

- It's common knowledge that it's appropriate and expected to lawyer up as soon as you are (or suspect you will be) accused of something, regardless of whether it's true or false. If you're innocent and don't lawyer up, you're a fool who is putting yourself at risk by not having someone knowledgeable about the system on your side. If you're innocent and do lawyer up, you're presumed guilty by the public. Again, no winner.

[labubske]

I feel like I am an open minded person...I like to look at all angles of a story.  I have to admit my thoughts that the mom is likely guilty of something comes nothing from the long list that starshadow has provided (thanks starshadow).  I do want to clear up the possible sightings of a man walking a baby, though.  I would like to find out WHO spotted this man walking with a baby.  As far as the man coming from the woods...where was that location?  I guess I can go and look it up.  Was it close to the bar?  It doesn't look like a thickly wooded area...like there is a lot of activity around there BUT I cannot see it clearly AT ALL.  I pray Lisa is safe.  If it is NOT someone from inside the home that took Lisa then I would be scared if I were around the KC area!

[Blonde]

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707

[trimmonthelake]

http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-representing-parents-discusses-latest-developments?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Local attorney representing parents discusses latest developments
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 23, 2011 10:55 AM CDT
Video at link.
 
 
KANSAS CITY, MO (KCTV) -

It has been quite a Sunday at the home where baby Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin have been staying.

The parents of baby Lisa have scaled back their media presence.

The local attorney representing the parents, Cynthia Short, is thankful that the parent's home was not destroyed during the search.

"Although that search was described as a search that was supposedly going to be invasive, I was concerned for the family that I would go in and see their home destroyed...one that they had worked on for a long time.  In fact, there is thankfully no destruction," said Cynthia Short.  "There are no walls torn out."
 ::snipping2::

[trimmonthelake]

http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2011/10/23/missing_baby_lisa_irwins_mother_we_hav
Missing Baby Lisa Irwin's Mother: 'We Have Absolutely Nothing To Hide'
October 23rd, 2011 9:00am EDT

[trimmonthelake]

http://video.foxnews.com/v/1233416093001/are-baby-lisas-parents-telling-the-truth
Are Baby Lisa's Parents Telling the Truth?
Oct 23, 2011- 7:45 -
Body Language Tonya Reiman weighs in

[Fanta]

Question Please:

I've been looking through the posts and at the 'floor plan' of Lisa's house.  There is a 'dn' label on the staircase indicating what I would think to mean a 'down' staircase.

Why have we not heard anything about the 'basement' - or is there not a basement?  I'm a bit confused over this point.

Thanks in advance

~ fanta

[yuknomenot]

The 2nd half of the full surveillance video at the ABCnews link above shows their attorney walking thru the house after the LE search.  Keeping in mind I don't believe anything defense attorneys say but I did notice she walked into the kitchen and got a screen capture of the refrigerator agaon.  NOTE, the meds are gone now:

Is that a wine box I see posed on the stove?  I don't trust any of these new pictures, surveillance footage, witnesses, and any "exclusive" information from ABC, that are coming out now.  It is much too convenient now that it is coming out after the lawyers and that whacko I mean wild Bill character have become involved.  Their job is to muck up things, not clear them up.

[klaasend]

Right.  All that exclusive was, was the attorney going thru the house complaining about what LE did or didn't do.

[trimmonthelake]

http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
Local attorney: 'We might not get the happy ending that we want.'
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 23, 2011 1:01 PM CDT
KANSAS CITY, MO (KCTV) -

The parents of baby Lisa have scaled back their media presence, but their local attorney, Cyndy Short, representing them discussed the latest developments in the case Sunday.

Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17 hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Cyndy Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."
 ::snipping2::

[higherhopes]

One of the things Im wondering bout is maybe the reason DB doesnt want the investigators to question the 2 boys is maybe because she is afraid that since this has all came out about "her drinking and pill taking" if maybe now the police might question the 2 boys about their life in that home in the previous years, maybe when they questioned the boys to begin with they probably just asked about the night in question when baby Lisa first came up missing, but now they would probably ask about how their lives have been all along, "did their Mother drink every night" how many times did they find her passed out in different places in the home, " how many times did they wake up and hear the baby crying in her crib and the Mother still asleep and they had to care for the baby......stuff like that.......then the other 2 boys would probably be removed from their care also, there is some reason she doesnt want them talking anymore with LE.......I believe that something did happen to Lise that night or day at that home and even if the boys didnt see anything they still could shed light on their everyday life there with DB........