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Author Topic: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion # 863 1/13/12 - 2/07/12  (Read 263660 times)
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grace-land
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« Reply #380 on: January 18, 2012, 01:33:52 PM »

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2088207/Joran-van-der-Sloot-My-Personal-Story-Convicted-murderers-chilling-life-story.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Wednesday, Jan 18 2012
'My Personal Story': Convicted murderer Joran van der Sloot's chilling handwritten life story

 ::snipping2::

VAN DER SLOOT'S NOTE TO FORENSIC PSYCHOLOGIST
- Born in Arnhem on the 6th of August 1987.
- Moved to Aruba when I was 2 years old.
- Went to the International School of Aruba from 2nd to 12th grade. Graduated with honors.
- from 8 years old played tennis almost daily even represented Aruba in the Queens games, also played soccer.
- always had a lot of friends and even girlfriends when I was 14 I had my first serious relationship.
- started playing poker when I was 16. When I was 17 I got arrested by the police on Aruba. They suspected me of the disappearance of an American girl. I was in jail for three months and then released.
- After this my dream of studying in the United States was impossible. I went to Holland and returned to my home town to study IBMS at the HAN. I studied there for 2 years and had 1 serious relationship before I decided to go to Thailand to continue my study and play poker in Asia.
- I studied in Thailand for 2 years as well as opened my own business that sells pizza, bread, baguettes, coffee, liquor and beer. I had a good staff and travelled all over Asia playing cards.
- I lived together with my girl in Thailand for two years she was from the U.S. and I met her their (sic)
- My father died on the 14th of February 2010 and I returned to Aruba to be with my mother and help her with things.

He finishes the letter with:

- On the 14th of May 2010 I came to Peru to play a poker tournament for the LAPT

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2088207/Joran-van-der-Sloot-My-Personal-Story-Convicted-murderers-chilling-life-story.html#ixzz1jpsJwQSE
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Monkey King
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« Reply #381 on: January 18, 2012, 01:44:28 PM »


Wow, how heartbreaking is that?

I can honestly say I don't know how I would have reacted put in Beth's shoes.
 

Monkey King

Fifteen years ago friends lost one son (20) in a motorcycle accident and two years later they lost their second son (25) when the helicopter he was piloting while fighting forest fires in the interior went down.  This couple conceded if they had been forewarned that after raising a family for 25 years they would again be on their own ... it would have been a burden too much to bear.  However ... when the strength to endure was required ... in their grief God did not fail them.  Out of the tragedies a God-given purpose was realized ... a God-given purpose to provide comfort and support to other parents who have experienced the loss of children.

Janet

+++++


Psalm 28:
The LORD is my strength and my shield; in him my heart trusts, and I am helped.


Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Pages 100:
He entrusted me with her care for eighteen years.  Now I must trust Him to care for her.  So I never ask Him why.  Why Natalee?  Why me?  I don't ask.  To do that undermines faith.  Instead, I form an "acceptance trust" with Him there on the windy hillside.

Page 103: I think about what just happened, pondering the human spirit.  Apparently it can withstand a lot more than I every dreamed possible.  Mom is right; God is good.  All my life I've heard people of many faiths talk about "taking it to the cross and turning it over to the Lord" or just simply "turning it over.  Not the work that has to be done.  Just the burden.  I cast it upon Him so that I may be sustained.  And I am renewed, resilient.  Thankful for however long this resurgence in energy will carry me.  I will pick up one foot and put it down.  Then the other one will follow.  I will breathe.  There is much to be done.
 
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.



That is pretty intense.   an angelic monkey

Thank you for sharing.  
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jamcakes
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« Reply #382 on: January 18, 2012, 02:43:44 PM »

What is Aruba's stance on murder investigations?

Can/will they ever close a murder investigation without having it solved?

Seems like a "catch 22" with no catch.

Here in America, if they fail to prosecute before the statute of limitations expire, then they are SOL and the case is closed automatically. We don't have a statute of limitations on murder cases. But Aruba does!
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Monkey King
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« Reply #383 on: January 18, 2012, 03:32:15 PM »

What is Aruba's stance on murder investigations?

Can/will they ever close a murder investigation without having it solved?

Seems like a "catch 22" with no catch.

Here in America, if they fail to prosecute before the statute of limitations expire, then they are SOL and the case is closed automatically. We don't have a statute of limitations on murder cases. But Aruba does!

What is Aruba's statute of limitations on murder?
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jamcakes
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« Reply #384 on: January 18, 2012, 03:45:12 PM »

BUMPED

http://www.curacao-law.com/2007/11/26/aruba-criminal-law/

ARUBAN Statute of Limitations

ARUBA CRIMINAL LAW

Holloway case raises questions

I received several questions from US news channels about the legal system of Aruba. Basic information can be found on this official website: click here.
 ::snipping2::

All prohibited acts are classified either as crimes or felonies (misdrijven), infractions or transgressions (overtredingen). The legislature determines whether an offense constitutes a crime or an infraction. Imprisonment is only imposed for serious crimes. The minimum sentence is 1 day, the maximum is 15 years. Murder sentences can be extended to 20 years. A life sentence may be imposed for murder or manslaughter with aggravating circumstances, although this is rare.

According to the Aruba Penal Code (Article 72) with respect to adults (18 years and older):

    There is a 6 year statute of limitations on crimes with a maximum term of imprisonment of 3 years (involuntary manslaughter: max. 9 months imprisonment)
    There is a 12 year statute of limitations on crimes with a term of imprisonment of at least 3 years (voluntary manslaughter: max. 15 years and murder: max. 20 years imprisonment)
    There is a 18 year statute of limitations on crimes which result in a life sentence (e.g. murder committed by terrorists / kidnapping resulting in the death of the kidnapped person / killing someone to hide a crime: life sentence)

If you need anything further, please feel free to contact me at: Karel.Frielink@Spigthoff.com.

Karel Frielink
Curacao-based Attorney (lawyer) / Partner


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Monkey King
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« Reply #385 on: January 18, 2012, 04:10:38 PM »

BUMPED

http://www.curacao-law.com/2007/11/26/aruba-criminal-law/

ARUBAN Statute of Limitations

ARUBA CRIMINAL LAW

Holloway case raises questions

I received several questions from US news channels about the legal system of Aruba. Basic information can be found on this official website: click here.
 ::snipping2::

All prohibited acts are classified either as crimes or felonies (misdrijven), infractions or transgressions (overtredingen). The legislature determines whether an offense constitutes a crime or an infraction. Imprisonment is only imposed for serious crimes. The minimum sentence is 1 day, the maximum is 15 years. Murder sentences can be extended to 20 years. A life sentence may be imposed for murder or manslaughter with aggravating circumstances, although this is rare.

According to the Aruba Penal Code (Article 72) with respect to adults (18 years and older):

    There is a 6 year statute of limitations on crimes with a maximum term of imprisonment of 3 years (involuntary manslaughter: max. 9 months imprisonment)
    There is a 12 year statute of limitations on crimes with a term of imprisonment of at least 3 years (voluntary manslaughter: max. 15 years and murder: max. 20 years imprisonment)
    There is a 18 year statute of limitations on crimes which result in a life sentence (e.g. murder committed by terrorists / kidnapping resulting in the death of the kidnapped person / killing someone to hide a crime: life sentence)

If you need anything further, please feel free to contact me at: Karel.Frielink@Spigthoff.com.

Karel Frielink
Curacao-based Attorney (lawyer) / Partner



Technically, he'd be considered a "lifer" in Aruba.
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #386 on: January 18, 2012, 04:45:36 PM »

Monkey King

Joran van der Sloot was a 17 year old minor ... when Natalee Holloway went missing ... a 17 year old minor whose father abetted him in illegal activities..

Janet

++++++

NANCY GRACE
Aired August 29, 2005 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

GEORGE "JUG" TWITTY, NATALEE`S STEPFATHER Well, I hope they haven`t. I mean -- but you know, the way this whole investigation`s going it seems that way. You know, what I wish, Nancy, is I wish what should have happened in this thing is Paul Van Der Sloot should have been a man, he should have stepped forward in the beginning. He should have talked to Joran that night. They should have admitted that something went wrong out there, which I know he knows that happened.

And if he would have come forward and said Joran did this, it`s a terrible mistake, it`s an accident, he`s still underage, he`s a minor, even if they killed Natalee he probably would have gotten off with about five years. Paul could have held -- kept his job, and we could have gone on with our lives, you know, or whatever.

But this guy, Paul Van Der Sloot is so thick in this thing it`s unbelievable. And you know, my mission is to keep pressure for them to keep asking questions of Paul because he knows more than he`s saying.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/29/ng.01.html


'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for April 3
updated 8:24 a.m. PT, Tues., April. 4, 2006


<snipped>

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY: Well, if you look at the surveillance video footage, it appears that he’s the one sitting directly next to her and tries to engage her in conversation a couple of times.  And it’s sort of ironic that it’s his father who brought his underage son to a casino and left him there after he left, with access to his line of credit, to put this unfortunate chain of events in process.

You know, if Joran had never been there, not been allowed in there, because he’s underage and wasn’t accompanied by his father, the whole rest of the night wouldn’t have happened.

COSBY: You know, and, John, also, why would that be a significant—why is that in conflict to something else we’ve heard maybe from Paulus before?

KELLY: Well, he’s just claiming that, you know, he’s kept an eye on his son, you know, he’s kept him on a short leash, and, you know, his son is very well-behaved. And it turns out that he’s, you know, got him at casinos. If you’re under 18, you’re not legally even allowed in casinos, so his son was breaking the law with him enabling it.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12150698/
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Tamikosmom
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« Reply #387 on: January 18, 2012, 04:56:14 PM »

continued


DANA PRETZER- July 23, 2007

Dana Pretzer: One thing that makes my listeners scratch their heads so to speak and wonder, myself included and we'll talk about it again, is the fact of the underage drinking and gambling that had been going on admittedly by young van der Sloot.  Was there ever any discussion or has there ever been any discussion at least of filing some charges as far as that goes?

Jossy Mansur:  No, there hasn't been any of that. The authorities have just (inaudible) it aside, they haven't paid any attention to it then and they're not paying any attention to it now and over the past 26 months.    I haven't seen anything in the direction of trying to make some kind of statement that this is not (inaudiable) at least make some sort of a statement that this is not (inaubible) because it is a known fact that as an underage he wasn't supposed to be in the casino, much less in the company of his father. He was there, there are video tapes to prove that and still the authorities haven't done anything with regard to that specific case.

http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/2007/07/23/the-dana-pretzer-show-monday-july-23rd-2007-special-guests-larry-sinclair-jossy-mansur-ladonna-meredith-attorney-jay-paul-deratany/
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Ono
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« Reply #388 on: January 18, 2012, 05:18:13 PM »

What is Aruba's stance on murder investigations?

Can/will they ever close a murder investigation without having it solved?

Seems like a "catch 22" with no catch.

There are no murders in Aruba--only suicides ...........................

.....just kidding. lol

Oh yeah, I forgot about that!!  Tsk, Tsk! 

My mind hasn't been right since the doo-lolly clackers!
 



 
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jamcakes
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« Reply #389 on: January 18, 2012, 06:05:02 PM »


Technically, he'd be considered a "lifer" in Aruba.

Joran was first arrested on June 9, 2005, under  “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence” but released b/of lack of evidence to prosecute.

Joran was arrested a 2nd time on November 21, 2007, for "suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily harm that resulted in the death of Natalee Holloway." The Aruban authorities still couldn't find enough evidence to make a murder charge stick; they released Van Der Sloot about three weeks later.
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Monkey King
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« Reply #390 on: January 18, 2012, 06:33:57 PM »

Monkey King

Joran van der Sloot was a 17 year old minor ... when Natalee Holloway went missing ... a 17 year old minor whose father abetted him in illegal activities..

Janet

++++++

NANCY GRACE
Aired August 29, 2005 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

GEORGE "JUG" TWITTY, NATALEE`S STEPFATHER Well, I hope they haven`t. I mean -- but you know, the way this whole investigation`s going it seems that way. You know, what I wish, Nancy, is I wish what should have happened in this thing is Paul Van Der Sloot should have been a man, he should have stepped forward in the beginning. He should have talked to Joran that night. They should have admitted that something went wrong out there, which I know he knows that happened.

And if he would have come forward and said Joran did this, it`s a terrible mistake, it`s an accident, he`s still underage, he`s a minor, even if they killed Natalee he probably would have gotten off with about five years. Paul could have held -- kept his job, and we could have gone on with our lives, you know, or whatever.

But this guy, Paul Van Der Sloot is so thick in this thing it`s unbelievable. And you know, my mission is to keep pressure for them to keep asking questions of Paul because he knows more than he`s saying.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/29/ng.01.html


'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for April 3
updated 8:24 a.m. PT, Tues., April. 4, 2006


<snipped>

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY: Well, if you look at the surveillance video footage, it appears that he’s the one sitting directly next to her and tries to engage her in conversation a couple of times.  And it’s sort of ironic that it’s his father who brought his underage son to a casino and left him there after he left, with access to his line of credit, to put this unfortunate chain of events in process.

You know, if Joran had never been there, not been allowed in there, because he’s underage and wasn’t accompanied by his father, the whole rest of the night wouldn’t have happened.

COSBY: You know, and, John, also, why would that be a significant—why is that in conflict to something else we’ve heard maybe from Paulus before?

KELLY: Well, he’s just claiming that, you know, he’s kept an eye on his son, you know, he’s kept him on a short leash, and, you know, his son is very well-behaved. And it turns out that he’s, you know, got him at casinos. If you’re under 18, you’re not legally even allowed in casinos, so his son was breaking the law with him enabling it.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12150698/


I know, I forgot he was 17~
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klaasend
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WWW
« Reply #391 on: January 18, 2012, 08:02:42 PM »

Nothing new posted at the court website for the Kalpoe vs. Dr. Phil case.  Remember, the Kalpoes had like 5 days to produce documents.

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grace-land
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« Reply #392 on: January 18, 2012, 11:12:58 PM »

Thank you, Klaas.  And thank you to the person who paid for the document.
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grace-land
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« Reply #393 on: January 19, 2012, 12:35:36 AM »

Video at link

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/01/joran-van-der-sloot-lawyer-ripped-claims-guardian-angel

Van Der Sloot's Lawyer Ripped Me Off, Says Joran’s ‘Guardian Angel’Van Der Sloot's Lawyer Ripped Me Off, Says Joran’s ‘Guardian Angel’
Posted on Jan 18, 2012 @ 07:00PM
By Debbie Emery - Radar Reporter

As Joran van der Sloot faces 28 years in prison for murder, the woman who has been paying his legal bills is fighting a battle of her own as she embarks in a bitter stand-off with the convicted killer's lawyer, RadarOnline.com can exclusively reveal.

Mary Hamer, who has described herself as van der Sloot's "guardian angel," claims that his Pervuian attorney Jose Luis Jimenez has swindled $75,000 from her that he said was going towards the Dutchman's bail.
 ::snipping2::
Upon learning that it was impossible for van der Sloot to get bail, the Florida-based radiologist asked his attorney to return her hard-earned money. Not only does she want a refund, she also thinks that Jimenez's actions justify a mistrial.

"I consider it unprofessional conduct so I am asking the Peruvian legal system to vacate Joran van der Sloot's sentence of Friday, January 13," said Hamer, who claimed to RadarOnline.com that the lawyer had violated attorney-client privilege repeated times by telling her details of the case.
 ::snipping2::
It is not only Jimenez that has been ripping off the well-meaning 55-year-old, who revealed the convicted killer's mother also took money from her.

"In the second part of 2010, I sent Anita van der Sloot about $20,000 for Joran's care - for food, clothes, legal fees and other expenses. He said he'd never seen any of that money," said Mary.

PHOTOS: Celebrity Mugshots

"Where did that money go? I don't know."
 ::snipping2::
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grace-land
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« Reply #394 on: January 19, 2012, 12:52:30 AM »

Also, from the article above --

Quote
"The key concern of mine is the unprofessional conduct of Attorney Jimenez," said Hamer from the Lake City, Florida, in an exclusive interview with filmmaker Albert Harris, Jr of Whitelight Productions and cameraman Kell Ramos, that was recorded as part of their upcoming documentary on van der Sloot.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/01/joran-van-der-sloot-lawyer-ripped-claims-guardian-angel
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MuffyBee
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« Reply #395 on: January 19, 2012, 01:14:28 AM »

Also, from the article above --

Quote
"The key concern of mine is the unprofessional conduct of Attorney Jimenez," said Hamer from the Lake City, Florida, in an exclusive interview with filmmaker Albert Harris, Jr of Whitelight Productions and cameraman Kell Ramos, that was recorded as part of their upcoming documentary on van der Sloot.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/01/joran-van-der-sloot-lawyer-ripped-claims-guardian-angel


 
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Monkey King
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« Reply #396 on: January 19, 2012, 01:22:35 AM »

Video at link

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/01/joran-van-der-sloot-lawyer-ripped-claims-guardian-angel

Van Der Sloot's Lawyer Ripped Me Off, Says Joran’s ‘Guardian Angel’Van Der Sloot's Lawyer Ripped Me Off, Says Joran’s ‘Guardian Angel’
Posted on Jan 18, 2012 @ 07:00PM
By Debbie Emery - Radar Reporter

As Joran van der Sloot faces 28 years in prison for murder, the woman who has been paying his legal bills is fighting a battle of her own as she embarks in a bitter stand-off with the convicted killer's lawyer, RadarOnline.com can exclusively reveal.

Mary Hamer, who has described herself as van der Sloot's "guardian angel," claims that his Pervuian attorney Jose Luis Jimenez has swindled $75,000 from her that he said was going towards the Dutchman's bail.
 ::snipping2::
Upon learning that it was impossible for van der Sloot to get bail, the Florida-based radiologist asked his attorney to return her hard-earned money. Not only does she want a refund, she also thinks that Jimenez's actions justify a mistrial.

"I consider it unprofessional conduct so I am asking the Peruvian legal system to vacate Joran van der Sloot's sentence of Friday, January 13," said Hamer, who claimed to RadarOnline.com that the lawyer had violated attorney-client privilege repeated times by telling her details of the case.
 ::snipping2::
It is not only Jimenez that has been ripping off the well-meaning 55-year-old, who revealed the convicted killer's mother also took money from her.

"In the second part of 2010, I sent Anita van der Sloot about $20,000 for Joran's care - for food, clothes, legal fees and other expenses. He said he'd never seen any of that money," said Mary.

PHOTOS: Celebrity Mugshots

"Where did that money go? I don't know."
 ::snipping2::


 Monkey Devil!   I'm sorry but, how many people do you suppose told her NOT to get involved, to keep her money?
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can
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« Reply #397 on: January 19, 2012, 05:40:24 AM »

Thank you, Klaas.  And thank you to the person who paid for the document.


   thank you.
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« Reply #398 on: January 19, 2012, 06:08:35 AM »

Attny says his fees are  $1,500. per month and that he is 3 months in arrears.  Guardian angel sends $16,000.     talk about overkill!
I'll bet Jiminez hasn't got a signed agreement that Mary is responsible for Joran's legal costs.  Just a very willing (former) Guardian angel and gravy train.
There's a sucker born every minute.   

We'll hear lots more from Mary I'm sure. . . she's not going away and I expect she has everything documented. 
Her marbles have been spent and she's not getting them back.

Sad, really.
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Anna
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« Reply #399 on: January 19, 2012, 06:26:29 AM »

It seems that --

The investigation was inadequate.

The prosecution wanted a winable indictment--Modified Murder with Simple Theft.

The 3 judges (in November, 2011) accepting the prosecutor's indictment over the families' request for Robbery followed by Murder.  Even the defense attorney said that they won a major victory that day.

The family worked so hard to put Joran away for life.  What courage and determination! 


 

Could it be that Aruban/Dutch "powers that be" were negotiating behind the scenes with the Peruvian prosecutor and ... the panel of judges to create an outcome that would be beneficial to Joran van der Sloot but at the same time appease to some extent the family of Stephany Flores?

Think about it.  Can 28 years translated into less than 9 years be considered justice for Stephany?  In Tamikosmom's world ... justice implies the scale balances.

Janet

Please stop it. Aruba and the Dutch have NO influence over Peru. No one but Joran's lawyer is saying 9 years. 35 years is life in Peru.
If somehow he does get out in 9 years -- it won't be because of the "powers that be" in Aruba. Joran will either be on trial in the U.S. or dead. I prefer the latter.


Agree, Wreck.  Drug dealers are often able to buy small amenities in jail as well.  It's the money that counts where guards are paid so little.  However, the stench, rats, chaos, filth and disease are still ever present no matter and so I am quite pleased that Joran is behind bars in such a dreadful place where his life can be snuffed out any minute and he knows it.

He'd better learn to quit picking at his pimples in such a place, too, as most disease is spread hand to face.

 

I do hope he survives to stand trial in Alabama on the extortion charges even if he doesn't make it back alive to serve out the 25-30 year sentence that carries. 

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PERSONA NON GRATA

All posts reflect my opinion only and are not shared by all forum members nor intended as statement of facts.  I am doing the best I can with the information available.

Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
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