Lively Case Discussion #649 6/30 - 7/3/2007am

[klaasend]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

Aru-bay video rocks..I still think there is something to it.

[San]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

What was the quote that Van der Straaten said "I have seen the evidence" or "I know the facts of the case you don't".  Van der Straaten has seen the body or at least the crime scene to determine something bad happened.  He is also best friends with Paulus.  Van der Straaten has known a long time that Joran was a nut and he had always turned a blind eye to the crimes he has committed.

[truthseeker2]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

Aru-bay video rocks..I still think there is something to it.

I tend to agree.  Too coincidental not to be significant. imo

[truthseeker2]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

What was the quote that Van der Straaten said "I have seen the evidence" or "I know the facts of the case you don't".  Van der Straaten has seen the body or at least the crime scene to determine something bad happened.  He is also best friends with Paulus.  Van der Straaten has known a long time that Joran was a nut and he had always turned a blind eye to the crimes he has committed.

I would like to know if the Dutch investigators questioned Van Der Straaten.  If not, then I don't have much hope that they are wanting to solve this.

[San]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

What was the quote that Van der Straaten said "I have seen the evidence" or "I know the facts of the case you don't".  Van der Straaten has seen the body or at least the crime scene to determine something bad happened.  He is also best friends with Paulus.  Van der Straaten has known a long time that Joran was a nut and he had always turned a blind eye to the crimes he has committed.

I would like to know if the Dutch investigators questioned Van Der Straaten.  If not, then I don't have much hope that they are wanting to solve this.

I don't believe the Dutch investigators will ever question Van der Straaten and if they did they won't get much out of him.

[Blonde]

I thought that Joran confessed... on behalf of Deepak.
Any new book translations ?

" that something very bad happened", referring to the time that he and his two friends were with Natalee the night before her disappearance. These three young men, whose names are Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, a pair of brothers, as well as Joran van der Sloot, the 17 year old son of a high ranking official with the Justice Ministry on this island.

it was one of the young suspects who led (her) to her body, it would suggest that it was in a place that that body would not have easily moved, suggesting she wouldn't have been out in open waters, carried away, that she was either found on land or in very shallow water, again, this is all speculation.
http://www.exposetheleft.com/2005/06/11/natalee-holloway-is-dead/

[robots]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

[San]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

NOPE.  If he confessed it would bring his father down.

[Blonde]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

What was the quote that Van der Straaten said "I have seen the evidence" or "I know the facts of the case you don't".  Van der Straaten has seen the body or at least the crime scene to determine something bad happened.  He is also best friends with Paulus.  Van der Straaten has known a long time that Joran was a nut and he had always turned a blind eye to the crimes he has committed.

http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2005/07/reports_of_thre.php
Jan: Because I know the details of the investigation and you don't !

[San]

Why would Van Der Straaten offer to make sure Joran would be sent to Holland, not to jail but to a mental institution?  Did they find Natalee's body between 6-11 and 6-13?  Why would Joran need that 'non-plea' bargain situation?  Just for lying?  Suspects are allowed to lie in their system, according to Arlene, so why would he need to this 'offer'?

What was the quote that Van der Straaten said "I have seen the evidence" or "I know the facts of the case you don't".  Van der Straaten has seen the body or at least the crime scene to determine something bad happened.  He is also best friends with Paulus.  Van der Straaten has known a long time that Joran was a nut and he had always turned a blind eye to the crimes he has committed.

http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2005/07/reports_of_thre.php
Jan: Because I know the details of the investigation and you don't !

Thank you Blonde.

Van der Straaten knows it all.

[Buckeye]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

I agree.

Joran had to mention the "stop" at home because the neighbor heard all the noise and told him to be quiet (he attributes this to the next night).  Now, if he was dropped at the beach by the K2, maybe Freddy drove him back to his house.

Joran confessed and got caught in his lies...you can see it in his face....the only time he has shown regret (for himself).  

I think June 10th was a Friday....Interesting they questioned Freddy the 12th (a Sunday)...hmmmmm...body removal team?? Why not wait until after breakfast Monday???

[truthseeker2]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

I agree.

Joran had to mention the "stop" at home because the neighbor heard all the noise and told him to be quiet (he attributes this to the next night).  Now, if he was dropped at the beach by the K2, maybe Freddy drove him back to his house.

Joran confessed and got caught in his lies...you can see it in his face....the only time he has shown regret (for himself).  

I think June 10th was a Friday....Interesting they questioned Freddy the 12th (a Sunday)...hmmmmm...body removal team?? Why not wait until after breakfast Monday???

Because Jacobs doesn't work on Sunday so they don't have to wait for him to have his cornflakes before they can do anything?????  

[Observer]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

NOPE.  If he confessed it would bring his father down.

I think it was Joran because diario had a reporter that saw the confession that day and he was crying and said he and deepak buried her. The translation is here at SM.

[igsigs]

Possibly, but on that particular day Deepak was still using the HI story, unless there is a second interview later that same day with Deepak.  

Deepak interviewed at 13:45 by ERASMUS and BURKE
Joran interviewed at 14:30 by JACOBS and CROES
Satish interviewed at 12:20 and again at 15:55 by BOEZEM and KELLY (in his second interview Satish clams up about half way through.  They had asked him a lot of questions about Deepak in the second interview.)

So if Deepak "broke" it was after the interview at 13:45 because at that time he was still telling the HI lie.

In the Kalpoe's 6/10 PVs it is obvious that ALE knows the HI story is bunk, and that the Kalpoes are wavering. I believe that they all dropped the HI story on 6/10, but we do not know the exact progression.

Around 4/5 in the afternoon of the 10th J2K were brought before a judge for the first time. This being the 1st time they face accountability (sotaspeak) and it would be very interesting to know if the Kalpoes lied at this hearing. We know Joran did.

[San]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

NOPE.  If he confessed it would bring his father down.

I think it was Joran because diario had a reporter that saw the confession that day and he was crying and said he and deepak buried her. The translation is here at SM.

Or was he referring to the statement where Joran thinks Deepak raped and killed Natalee.

Joran would need to make a statement like that after he heard that Deepak confessed.

[Observer]

Very fishy circumstances San..This lil confession just gets forgotten about..

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/?p=1260

“No body means no case” were the words of the Kalpoe brothers to the Detectives FIRST DECLARATION OF JORAN WAS THAT THEY BURIED NATALEE

According to information that DIARIO is receiving, when Joran van der Sloot was detained he started crying during interrogation and he even told officers that they buried Natalee in the neighborhood of Fishermen huts.

It could be deduced that he doesn’t remember precisely where, but in the neighborhood of Fishermen huts, the elder Kalpoe brother buried Natalee. He told police that he would cooperate but that didn’t last long.

When he said that they buired Natalee, he was confronted by the two Kalpoe brothers who almost went crazy on him and denied what Joran said.

After that he did not give his cooperation either to the Detectives who were investigating.When he was being interrogated, he even told the cops: ” I don’t have any f*c* to tell you.”During interrogation he was very angry with our cops and only calmed down when he was brought back to his cell. As for the Kalpoe Brothers, they also made fun of our authority because they simply told the cops: “No Body means No Case”.Looking at the declarations of the suspects proofs that they were well trained by a person who knows the law. Here we don’t want to speculate who this is, but it can be assumed who could be behind this whole matter if you look that “Around the Pool” there were certain agreements made where even a lawyer was present.

[truthseeker2]

Possibly, but on that particular day Deepak was still using the HI story, unless there is a second interview later that same day with Deepak.  

Deepak interviewed at 13:45 by ERASMUS and BURKE
Joran interviewed at 14:30 by JACOBS and CROES
Satish interviewed at 12:20 and again at 15:55 by BOEZEM and KELLY (in his second interview Satish clams up about half way through.  They had asked him a lot of questions about Deepak in the second interview.)

So if Deepak "broke" it was after the interview at 13:45 because at that time he was still telling the HI lie.

In the Kalpoe's 6/10 PVs it is obvious that ALE knows the HI story is bunk, and that the Kalpoes are wavering. I believe that they all dropped the HI story on 6/10, but we do not know the exact progression.

Around 4/5 in the afternoon of the 10th J2K were brought before a judge for the first time. This being the 1st time they face accountability (sotaspeak) and it would be very interesting to know if the Kalpoes lied at this hearing. We know Joran did.

On June 11th 2005 at about 12:10 hours, we, the reporting officers, interviewed the suspect D.S. KALPOE, for further information.

"I am now willing to make a statement that is in accordance with the truth. Several details were missing from my last statement. I am going to tell you exactly what happened that night."

"I asked Joran if I should head back to town. Joran said no, no, let me out here. That was in the vicinity of the “Marriot Hotel”. I asked, where is here. He said here. I turned into a side street. To your question as to what kind of a road it was, I can say the following. I am not sure if it was a sand/dirt road or a paved road. I am willing to show you where the street is that I just mentioned."


On June 11th 2005, at approximately 17:30 hours, we interviewed the suspect S.S. KALPOE for further information.

"The statements I gave before were not entirely based on the truth.
I am now willing to make a statement in accordance with the truth. "

"On the way to the Holiday Inn Hotel Joran told my brother to turn right at some point. At Joran's request my brother turned right and drove into the street just north of the Marriot Hotel. My brother continued driving up the street until Joran said that he should stop the car. My brother then brought the car to a full stop. My brother asked Joran how he was going to get home. Joran answered that he would find a way to get home. My brother asked Joran if he was sure he would find another way to get home. Joran said that he was sure that he would find a way to get home. At that moment it was approximately 01.45 hours on May 30th 2005."

[Buckeye]

i think JORAN was the one that CONFESSED

then it was RETRACTED



BET THE FARM on it  

NOPE.  If he confessed it would bring his father down.

I think it was Joran because diario had a reporter that saw the confession that day and he was crying and said he and deepak buried her. The translation is here at SM.

Or was he referring to the statement where Joran thinks Deepak raped and killed Natalee.

Joran would need to make a statement like that after he heard that Deepak confessed.

Possibly.  I think it was Joran.  When did he say the K2 dropped him at home and left with Natalee??  I think Freddy had already told what he knew, Antonio had spoken with Jansen, they confronted Joran and then after JVDS and "the team" discussed it, he came up with Deepak going back, etc.  What was the "one witness is no witness" Shango/Simian thing??  Is Freddy the "witness"??

[BlueKYGirl]

San--you said something the other day about Freddy being the original fourth suspect. How did you learn this? Why wasn't it widely publicized? Do you think Freddy joined the group after C&Cs and J2K left that detail out (along with the rest of the truth)?

[BlueKYGirl]

I think the "One witness is no witness" statement isn't just from Simian/Shango--I think it's a part of Dutch law where if only one person can corroborate a story (or incriminate someone else), that's not enough; you need more than one.

I'm not an international legal mind, but that is how I've always understood it.