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Author Topic: The Slaying of Trayvon Martin in Florida #3 7/12/12 - 6/14/13  (Read 257223 times)
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Toler
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« Reply #140 on: July 23, 2012, 10:28:13 PM »

two words: Duke Lacrosse, Duke Lacrosse Duke Lacrosse

why have we not seen so far ANY evidence from the Prosecution that is is not a stand your ground case?

If GZ does get convicted by the jury, He will most likely win by appeal.

as of now, I still stand with GZ unless the prosecution has hard, cold evidence that this is not a stand your ground case.

and I think the whole "God's Plan" thing has been taken way out of context.

I did not get to watch the interview,...........  is there anywhere in that interview at all where GZ says " It was God's Plan for Trayvon to die'"?

SEAN HANNITY, HOST, FOX NEWS' "HANNITY": Is there anything you might do differently in retrospect now that time has passed a little bit?

ZIMMERMAN: No, sir. I feel it was all God's plan, and for me to second guess it or judge it --

I honestly don't understand how a known liar and accused child molester has been turned into the victim here. He shot and killed an UNARMED kid, for crying out loud!

By the way... I've worked with some pretty hard-core delinquents for the last 30 years - much bigger and badder than Trayvon Martin - and not once have I allowed myself to be sucker-punched and nearly beaten to death by a skinny 17-year-old kid. At the very least, GZ must be the biggest wimp around. Holy cow!

I keep trying to get an answer to this question, but nobody on GZ's side will discuss it: Trayvon Martin obviously felt threatened by George Zimmerman. If Trayvon Martin had actually beaten George Zimmerman to death, should he be exonerated under the Stand Your Ground law?


With respect...It's my understanding that no, stand-your-ground would not apply to TM, IF it is true that TM doubled back to confront GZ, that TM was almost home then decided to do an about face, sad that he didn't continue home and into the house.

Sucker-punched is just that..glad it has never happened to you, did anyone ever make an attempt?

BBM...SYG would have applied to TM; that is what the SYG is all about. Prior to SYG, an individual, if they felt threatened, had a duty to get to safety (if a safe area was available). In other words, if I was standing outside my front door, and I saw a stranger approaching in a threatening manner, I would be expected to get inside my house and call 911. The SYG laws changed this - under the same scenario, I would not have a duty to seek safety, but would instead be allowed to "stand my ground" - and if the threatening stranger got close enough, and I feared for my life (either reasonably or unreasonably) I could legally shoot him. So my point is, it didn't matter how close TM was to his house as to whether SYG would work for him or not - SYG eliminated the logic of getting to safety. That is why many people are against SYG - here in Florida, we've always had the right to shoot someone if we were in danger and could not get away. With SYG, people don't have to bother getting to safety and avoiding an altercation; they can just shoot away.

But it wasn't a matter of a threatening stranger 'getting close enough'. Martin wasn't even within sight of Zimmerman for a while, until Martin backtracked some distance and attacked him...according to Zimmerman. Doesn't sound like SYG to me.
...and your name and avi make me smile,   
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labubske
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« Reply #141 on: July 23, 2012, 10:29:25 PM »

Speaking for myself...I have not taken a side here...I am waiting on the facts.  Which I didn't realize ANYONE had.  I am sick of the racism though.  I, too work with criminals...and with psychotic people and I know how easy it could be to get sucker punched...it has happened to staff.  They are by no means wimps either.  Sucker punched by scrawny...by big...by girls...by adolescents...I have seen it all.  It happens.  If they are not paying attention. 
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Amys Sister
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« Reply #142 on: July 23, 2012, 10:38:15 PM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.

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Amys Sister
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« Reply #143 on: July 23, 2012, 11:11:49 PM »

Toler, I realized my post might be offensive.  I didn't mean for it to be that way.  You have every right to be disgusted about this turning into a race issue, especially if you percieve it not to be about race at all.   
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grace-land
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« Reply #144 on: July 23, 2012, 11:34:09 PM »

Video of Zimmerman interview on Fox at link

http://blogs.lawyers.com/2012/07/zimmerman-interview-on-fox-starts-media-storm/

Zimmerman Interview on Fox Starts Media Storm
Posted July 23, 2012

 ::snipping2::
Regrets? Oh Yeah, Those…
 
Money matters aside, Zimmerman makes a good witness – that much was clear. His only real misstep came when Hannity asked if he regretted anything about the night he shot Martin in what he says was a life or death struggle. “No, sir,” Zimmerman responded to Hannity’s line of questions including whether he regretted getting out of the car to follow Martin, carrying a gun, or anything else about that night. “I feel it was all God’s plan.”

At the end of the interview, when Hannity asked if there was anything Zimmerman wanted to say to the American public, he took the opportunity to correct himself, saying:
 
First, I would like to readdress your question when you asked if I would have done anything differently. When you asked that, I thought you were referring to if I would not have talked to the police, if I would have maybe have gotten an attorney, if I wouldn’t have taken the CVSA and that I stand by, I would not have done anything differently.
 
But I do wish that there was something, anything I could have done that wouldn’t have put me in the position where I had to take his life. And I do want to tell everyone, my wife, my family, my parents, my grandmother, the Martins, the city of Stanford, and America that I am sorry that this happened.
 
I hate to think that because of this incident, because of my actions, it’s polarized and divided America, and I’m truly sorry.
 
The media storm came fast and furious, regardless. Jonathan Capahart, in an opinion piece for a Washington Post blog, said Zimmerman should “regret” the interview. Many jumped on his “God’s plan” comment, and Martin’s parents went on NBC’s Today Show afterwards to call his interview “ridiculous” and to say they had no interest in taking him up on his offer to talk.
--------------------
Comments section
 ::snipping2::
Annette Kelly3 hours ago

He's not the angry guy the media described. I think the interview was a net gain in his public profile and I thought the retelling in this interview was consistent with his prior statements to police. The God's plan headlines were taken out of text and Sybrina Fulton herself has used God to explain the situation she finds herself in. "It's so easy for me to cry right now, but I can't because I have work to do," she told the congregation. "I was forced into this position, but I believe God is using me." Sybrina Fulton
 "But now I know that God has called Trayvon. He was chosen." Sybrina Fulton
"God is in control." Sybrina Fulton
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Toler
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« Reply #145 on: July 23, 2012, 11:38:28 PM »

Toler, I realized my post might be offensive.  I didn't mean for it to be that way.  You have every right to be disgusted about this turning into a race issue, especially if you percieve it not to be about race at all.   

Well, yeah. It's easily obvious that you hold strong beliefs....and do well at presenting them.
Just in case you have a change of heart here's a link to GZs new website so you can then donate it you wish.
http://therealgeorgezimmerman.com/    

Point is it's all about race now isn't it? Ever since the Justus brothers, Al and Jessie and now Ben Crump came on the scene, just as they meant it to be.
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MuffyBee
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« Reply #146 on: July 23, 2012, 11:42:52 PM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Amy's Sister, I don't believe George Zimmerman or his wife should risk getting a job at this time, considering the death threats they've received.  They are staying at a safe house for good reason in my opinion.

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labubske
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« Reply #147 on: July 23, 2012, 11:44:09 PM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Unfortunately, we have made this type of behavior okay.  America watches this stuff and that is how he is going to pay for his defense.  Just like Casey Anthony.  We are guilty of that.  Unless of course you watch absolutely none of it and boycott the stations and media that allow this.
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« Reply #148 on: July 23, 2012, 11:44:55 PM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Amy's Sister, I don't believe George Zimmerman or his wife should risk getting a job at this time, considering the death threats they've received.  They are staying at a safe house for good reason in my opinion.



I absolutely agree. 
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"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
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« Reply #149 on: July 23, 2012, 11:46:13 PM »

Not directed to anyone in particular, just a reminder...

I hope this thread can continue to stay open and dialog and discussion can continue in a reasonable manner.  I realize this case brings a lot of emotions and there are going to be varying opinions, especially since the case has not gone to trial yet. It's possible to express an opinion without offending others with a differing opinion.  I would encourage those with strong feelings particularly in threads like this one with hot button issues to think before they hit "post".  JMHO 
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kcrn
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« Reply #150 on: July 23, 2012, 11:50:21 PM »


Hindsight is 20/20. Maybe he should have. & maybe trayvon would be akive if he had continued on home.
[/quote]

Also with respect....If this statement was true. Then know one that didn't carry a gun could not and should not go outside their own homes to do things as innocently as walking to the store for candy and a drink.  Because you should know that people with guns may think you don't look right and on drugs. If you get shot you have caused your own death for leaving your home. IMOO
[/quote]
With all due respect to you, that is completely assanine & not even remotely what I meant. My point was that gz should not have pursued tm, IF he did, but I think there is pretty good evidence to suggest that tm may have confronted gz for following him. I leave my home every day without a gun. I dont own a gun. I would never own a gun with children in my home. I dont think I implied in ANY way that tm caused his own death by going to the store for a drink without a gun. Come on. This case has alot of what ifs & NONE of us know what really happened. I just strongly believe, as is my right, that both parties were to blame here & I dont think anything about this case sounds racially motivated. That is my biggest problem with this case. What proof is there of racism that we needed a civil rights uproar?  Gz may spend some time in jail for this & maybe he should. I dont know that at this point. I do know im sick to death of seeing this kid & his family immortalized as some kind of martin luther king, rosa parks figures. Ive sait it before & I will say it again, these parents are riding a gravy train til the wheels fall off & with no grounds to do so.
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labubske
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« Reply #151 on: July 23, 2012, 11:52:00 PM »

Not directed to anyone in particular, just a reminder...

I hope this thread can continue to stay open and dialog and discussion can continue in a reasonable manner.  I realize this case brings a lot of emotions and there are going to be varying opinions, especially since the case has not gone to trial yet. It's possible to express an opinion without offending others with a differing opinion.  I would encourage those with strong feelings particularly in threads like this one with hot button issues to think before they hit "post".  JMHO 

Thanks Muffy...my stomach always gets into knots when I open this particular thread.  I don't know why I keep opening it.
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"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
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« Reply #152 on: July 23, 2012, 11:57:08 PM »

Not directed to anyone in particular, just a reminder...

I hope this thread can continue to stay open and dialog and discussion can continue in a reasonable manner.  I realize this case brings a lot of emotions and there are going to be varying opinions, especially since the case has not gone to trial yet. It's possible to express an opinion without offending others with a differing opinion.  I would encourage those with strong feelings particularly in threads like this one with hot button issues to think before they hit "post".  JMHO 

Thanks Muffy...my stomach always gets into knots when I open this particular thread.  I don't know why I keep opening it.

I totally understand labubske, and hope I can take my own advice.    
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kcrn
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« Reply #153 on: July 24, 2012, 12:02:01 AM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Amy's Sister, I don't believe George Zimmerman or his wife should risk getting a job at this time, considering the death threats they've received.  They are staying at a safe house for good reason in my opinion.



I absolutely agree. 
Might be difficult for them to get a job at this point, nevermind the fact that with death threats they might just be "askeered" to leave their home. Cant imagine why. I cant imagine for the life of me how anyone could possibly think these people are going to somehow live the high life with these donations. How much do u think this defense will cost? Thats not even figuring how much money it costs to simply have a safe place to live & food to eat. Somehow I doubt theyre eating steak & lobster & wearing armani.
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Toler
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« Reply #154 on: July 24, 2012, 12:21:33 AM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Unfortunately, we have made this type of behavior okay.  America watches this stuff and that is how he is going to pay for his defense.  Just like Casey Anthony.  We are guilty of that.  Unless of course you watch absolutely none of it and boycott the stations and media that allow this.

Equal Justice for All....if you can afford it. What option does Zimmerman have? On top of that no job, having to pay for security because of death threats and a safe house. 

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Bongosmom
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« Reply #155 on: July 24, 2012, 12:28:31 AM »

two words: Duke Lacrosse, Duke Lacrosse Duke Lacrosse

why have we not seen so far ANY evidence from the Prosecution that is is not a stand your ground case?

If GZ does get convicted by the jury, He will most likely win by appeal.

as of now, I still stand with GZ unless the prosecution has hard, cold evidence that this is not a stand your ground case.

and I think the whole "God's Plan" thing has been taken way out of context.

I did not get to watch the interview,...........  is there anywhere in that interview at all where GZ says " It was God's Plan for Trayvon to die'"?

SEAN HANNITY, HOST, FOX NEWS' "HANNITY": Is there anything you might do differently in retrospect now that time has passed a little bit?

ZIMMERMAN: No, sir. I feel it was all God's plan, and for me to second guess it or judge it --

I honestly don't understand how a known liar and accused child molester has been turned into the victim here. He shot and killed an UNARMED kid, for crying out loud!

By the way... I've worked with some pretty hard-core delinquents for the last 30 years - much bigger and badder than Trayvon Martin - and not once have I allowed myself to be sucker-punched and nearly beaten to death by a skinny 17-year-old kid. At the very least, GZ must be the biggest wimp around. Holy cow!

I keep trying to get an answer to this question, but nobody on GZ's side will discuss it: Trayvon Martin obviously felt threatened by George Zimmerman. If Trayvon Martin had actually beaten George Zimmerman to death, should he be exonerated under the Stand Your Ground law?


With respect...It's my understanding that no, stand-your-ground would not apply to TM, IF it is true that TM doubled back to confront GZ, that TM was almost home then decided to do an about face, sad that he didn't continue home and into the house.

Sucker-punched is just that..glad it has never happened to you, did anyone ever make an attempt?

BBM...SYG would have applied to TM; that is what the SYG is all about. Prior to SYG, an individual, if they felt threatened, had a duty to get to safety (if a safe area was available). In other words, if I was standing outside my front door, and I saw a stranger approaching in a threatening manner, I would be expected to get inside my house and call 911. The SYG laws changed this - under the same scenario, I would not have a duty to seek safety, but would instead be allowed to "stand my ground" - and if the threatening stranger got close enough, and I feared for my life (either reasonably or unreasonably) I could legally shoot him. So my point is, it didn't matter how close TM was to his house as to whether SYG would work for him or not - SYG eliminated the logic of getting to safety. That is why many people are against SYG - here in Florida, we've always had the right to shoot someone if we were in danger and could not get away. With SYG, people don't have to bother getting to safety and avoiding an altercation; they can just shoot away.

But it wasn't a matter of a threatening stranger 'getting close enough'. Martin wasn't even within sight of Zimmerman for a while, until Martin backtracked some distance and attacked him...according to Zimmerman. Doesn't sound like SYG to me.
...and your name and avi make me smile,   
I was speaking hypothetically, and mainly to the statements I have read to the effect of "if only he'd kept walking home." The SYG laws take away any duty or expectation for TM to have kept walking home - he had the right to stop and confront his (perceived) pursuer. As for TM to have doubled back, I'm staying out of that one until the trial shows some evidence one way or the other. For TM to have doubled back to follow a (perceived) threat is the same as GZ following a (perceived) threat; all we have right now is one side's word against the other. I think it will take the trial (if even then) to find out who was following who. But I think the original poster's question is still valid, as a hypothetical: If, in fact, GZ had not walked back to his car but was still in pursuit of TM, caught up with him and confronted him, would TM have then been protected by the SYG law if he had killed GZ in the resultant scuffle? And the answer is...probably.
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Bongosmom
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« Reply #156 on: July 24, 2012, 12:41:29 AM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Amy's Sister, I don't believe George Zimmerman or his wife should risk getting a job at this time, considering the death threats they've received.  They are staying at a safe house for good reason in my opinion.



I absolutely agree. 
Might be difficult for them to get a job at this point, nevermind the fact that with death threats they might just be "askeered" to leave their home. Cant imagine why. I cant imagine for the life of me how anyone could possibly think these people are going to somehow live the high life with these donations. How much do u think this defense will cost? Thats not even figuring how much money it costs to simply have a safe place to live & food to eat. Somehow I doubt theyre eating steak & lobster & wearing armani.
I don't know...according to the documents he spent $1305 on food for the 18 days he was out. Maybe not lobster, but that kind of food budget could definitely buy some steak. I tried to post the link but it gave me a ridiculously long url; sorry!
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Toler
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« Reply #157 on: July 24, 2012, 12:50:49 AM »

two words: Duke Lacrosse, Duke Lacrosse Duke Lacrosse

why have we not seen so far ANY evidence from the Prosecution that is is not a stand your ground case?

If GZ does get convicted by the jury, He will most likely win by appeal.

as of now, I still stand with GZ unless the prosecution has hard, cold evidence that this is not a stand your ground case.

and I think the whole "God's Plan" thing has been taken way out of context.

I did not get to watch the interview,...........  is there anywhere in that interview at all where GZ says " It was God's Plan for Trayvon to die'"?

SEAN HANNITY, HOST, FOX NEWS' "HANNITY": Is there anything you might do differently in retrospect now that time has passed a little bit?

ZIMMERMAN: No, sir. I feel it was all God's plan, and for me to second guess it or judge it --

I honestly don't understand how a known liar and accused child molester has been turned into the victim here. He shot and killed an UNARMED kid, for crying out loud!

By the way... I've worked with some pretty hard-core delinquents for the last 30 years - much bigger and badder than Trayvon Martin - and not once have I allowed myself to be sucker-punched and nearly beaten to death by a skinny 17-year-old kid. At the very least, GZ must be the biggest wimp around. Holy cow!

I keep trying to get an answer to this question, but nobody on GZ's side will discuss it: Trayvon Martin obviously felt threatened by George Zimmerman. If Trayvon Martin had actually beaten George Zimmerman to death, should he be exonerated under the Stand Your Ground law?


With respect...It's my understanding that no, stand-your-ground would not apply to TM, IF it is true that TM doubled back to confront GZ, that TM was almost home then decided to do an about face, sad that he didn't continue home and into the house.

Sucker-punched is just that..glad it has never happened to you, did anyone ever make an attempt?

BBM...SYG would have applied to TM; that is what the SYG is all about. Prior to SYG, an individual, if they felt threatened, had a duty to get to safety (if a safe area was available). In other words, if I was standing outside my front door, and I saw a stranger approaching in a threatening manner, I would be expected to get inside my house and call 911. The SYG laws changed this - under the same scenario, I would not have a duty to seek safety, but would instead be allowed to "stand my ground" - and if the threatening stranger got close enough, and I feared for my life (either reasonably or unreasonably) I could legally shoot him. So my point is, it didn't matter how close TM was to his house as to whether SYG would work for him or not - SYG eliminated the logic of getting to safety. That is why many people are against SYG - here in Florida, we've always had the right to shoot someone if we were in danger and could not get away. With SYG, people don't have to bother getting to safety and avoiding an altercation; they can just shoot away.

But it wasn't a matter of a threatening stranger 'getting close enough'. Martin wasn't even within sight of Zimmerman for a while, until Martin backtracked some distance and attacked him...according to Zimmerman. Doesn't sound like SYG to me.
...and your name and avi make me smile,   
I was speaking hypothetically, and mainly to the statements I have read to the effect of "if only he'd kept walking home." The SYG laws take away any duty or expectation for TM to have kept walking home - he had the right to stop and confront his (perceived) pursuer. As for TM to have doubled back, I'm staying out of that one until the trial shows some evidence one way or the other. For TM to have doubled back to follow a (perceived) threat is the same as GZ following a (perceived) threat; all we have right now is one side's word against the other. I think it will take the trial (if even then) to find out who was following who. But I think the original poster's question is still valid, as a hypothetical: If, in fact, GZ had not walked back to his car but was still in pursuit of TM, caught up with him and confronted him, would TM have then been protected by the SYG law if he had killed GZ in the resultant scuffle? And the answer is...probably.

quote:If, in fact, GZ had not walked back to his car but was still in pursuit of TM, caught up with him and confronted him, would TM have then been protected by the SYG law if he had killed GZ in the resultant scuffle? And the answer is...probably.quote


Yes, I agree if that was the case. Problem today is that this case has already been tried by the media and by a load of grifters inciting race warfare. I'm not even sure that Zimmerman will ever get a 'fair' trial. The president, justice dept and FBI involed. Do you wonder why? 
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kcrn
Monkey Junky Jr.
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« Reply #158 on: July 24, 2012, 12:56:04 AM »

My disgust is with the eerily soft spoken proven liar who drives a fab pick up yet can't pay his bills and needs free handouts from the public because he's too askeered for either he or his wife to get a job.  Oh, and he shot a kid and feels it was God's plan for him to do so. 

I just do not understand how anyone can believe what he says.  I watched the video of his reenactment and IMO it is so obvious he's lying.

Plus, talk about milking the system!  He wouldn't talk to Barbara Walters without her paying a month's worth of a hotel stay??  I LOL'd when he tried to call into her show the next morning and she refused to have him on air.

 ::snipping2::George Zimmerman, the man who fatally shot unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in Sanford, Florida, has started a website "to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries." ::snipping2::

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57411603/george-zimmerman-seeks-donations-on-his-new-website/

Blech!!  He wants to give his supporters his "full attention"... in exchange for more money.   

The truth becomes clearer with each passing day and GZ is going to be his own undoing.  I only hope he keeps on talking.



Amy's Sister, I don't believe George Zimmerman or his wife should risk getting a job at this time, considering the death threats they've received.  They are staying at a safe house for good reason in my opinion.



I absolutely agree. 
Might be difficult for them to get a job at this point, nevermind the fact that with death threats they might just be "askeered" to leave their home. Cant imagine why. I cant imagine for the life of me how anyone could possibly think these people are going to somehow live the high life with these donations. How much do u think this defense will cost? Thats not even figuring how much money it costs to simply have a safe place to live & food to eat. Somehow I doubt theyre eating steak & lobster & wearing armani.
I don't know...according to the documents he spent $1305 on food for the 18 days he was out. Maybe not lobster, but that kind of food budget could definitely buy some steak. I tried to post the link but it gave me a ridiculously long url; sorry!
Well I my family doesnt eat caviar or lobster regularly but I can easily spend 400 every 2 weeks on food for my house & thats not even counting toiletries, cleaning supplies etc. I guess he should be eating ramen noodles & bologna like the prisoner he is. I find it disturbing & comical at the same time that people actually know to the dollar what he spent on food in 18days. If I was in fear of my life o&the lives of my family, im pretty sure id throw some hard liquor in that grocery cart too & I dont even drink
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kcrn
Monkey Junky Jr.
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Posts: 712



« Reply #159 on: July 24, 2012, 01:12:30 AM »

two words: Duke Lacrosse, Duke Lacrosse Duke Lacrosse

why have we not seen so far ANY evidence from the Prosecution that is is not a stand your ground case?

If GZ does get convicted by the jury, He will most likely win by appeal.

as of now, I still stand with GZ unless the prosecution has hard, cold evidence that this is not a stand your ground case.

and I think the whole "God's Plan" thing has been taken way out of context.

I did not get to watch the interview,...........  is there anywhere in that interview at all where GZ says " It was God's Plan for Trayvon to die'"?

SEAN HANNITY, HOST, FOX NEWS' "HANNITY": Is there anything you might do differently in retrospect now that time has passed a little bit?

ZIMMERMAN: No, sir. I feel it was all God's plan, and for me to second guess it or judge it --

I honestly don't understand how a known liar and accused child molester has been turned into the victim here. He shot and killed an UNARMED kid, for crying out loud!

By the way... I've worked with some pretty hard-core delinquents for the last 30 years - much bigger and badder than Trayvon Martin - and not once have I allowed myself to be sucker-punched and nearly beaten to death by a skinny 17-year-old kid. At the very least, GZ must be the biggest wimp around. Holy cow!

I keep trying to get an answer to this question, but nobody on GZ's side will discuss it: Trayvon Martin obviously felt threatened by George Zimmerman. If Trayvon Martin had actually beaten George Zimmerman to death, should he be exonerated under the Stand Your Ground law?


With respect...It's my understanding that no, stand-your-ground would not apply to TM, IF it is true that TM doubled back to confront GZ, that TM was almost home then decided to do an about face, sad that he didn't continue home and into the house.

Sucker-punched is just that..glad it has never happened to you, did anyone ever make an attempt?

BBM...SYG would have applied to TM; that is what the SYG is all about. Prior to SYG, an individual, if they felt threatened, had a duty to get to safety (if a safe area was available). In other words, if I was standing outside my front door, and I saw a stranger approaching in a threatening manner, I would be expected to get inside my house and call 911. The SYG laws changed this - under the same scenario, I would not have a duty to seek safety, but would instead be allowed to "stand my ground" - and if the threatening stranger got close enough, and I feared for my life (either reasonably or unreasonably) I could legally shoot him. So my point is, it didn't matter how close TM was to his house as to whether SYG would work for him or not - SYG eliminated the logic of getting to safety. That is why many people are against SYG - here in Florida, we've always had the right to shoot someone if we were in danger and could not get away. With SYG, people don't have to bother getting to safety and avoiding an altercation; they can just shoot away.

But it wasn't a matter of a threatening stranger 'getting close enough'. Martin wasn't even within sight of Zimmerman for a while, until Martin backtracked some distance and attacked him...according to Zimmerman. Doesn't sound like SYG to me.
...and your name and avi make me smile,   
I was speaking hypothetically, and mainly to the statements I have read to the effect of "if only he'd kept walking home." The SYG laws take away any duty or expectation for TM to have kept walking home - he had the right to stop and confront his (perceived) pursuer. As for TM to have doubled back, I'm staying out of that one until the trial shows some evidence one way or the other. For TM to have doubled back to follow a (perceived) threat is the same as GZ following a (perceived) threat; all we have right now is one side's word against the other. I think it will take the trial (if even then) to find out who was following who. But I think the original poster's question is still valid, as a hypothetical: If, in fact, GZ had not walked back to his car but was still in pursuit of TM, caught up with him and confronted him, would TM have then been protected by the SYG law if he had killed GZ in the resultant scuffle? And the answer is...probably.

quote:If, in fact, GZ had not walked back to his car but was still in pursuit of TM, caught up with him and confronted him, would TM have then been protected by the SYG law if he had killed GZ in the resultant scuffle? And the answer is...probably.quote


Yes, I agree if that was the case. Problem today is that this case has already been tried by the media and by a load of grifters inciting race warfare. I'm not even sure that Zimmerman will ever get a 'fair' trial. The president, justice dept and FBI involed. Do you wonder why? 

I know right. I dont buy what the media sells most of the time fortunately. I hate when people say that the media influenced people to think casey anthony was guilty. Um, no, the evidence spoke quite loudly in forming my opinion on that one. The fact that the media emphasized the 31 days made no diffetence to me. Noone who is not guilty of something forgets to report a missing 2 year old for 31 days. Its common sense.  unfortunately, it looks like alot of people are believing media without evidence here. We even call him a child molester here. Is george anthony a child molester because jose baez said so?
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