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Author Topic: The Slaying of Trayvon Martin in Florida #3 7/12/12 - 6/14/13  (Read 255831 times)
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alagary
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« Reply #900 on: June 08, 2013, 02:14:01 PM »

There was also something else I wanted to comment on and that was on GZ's weight gain. Strictly from a behavioral point of view I wonder what is going on with him.. 100 lbs in a year is extreme. I cannot help to wonder if it is partially stress and maybe to alter his physical appearance in prepartion for trial. It would make him more of the Pillsbury Dough boy than a formidible opponent supporting his self defense claim. We know what people are capable of and then some... food for thought
Not being able to work and needing to hide from certain groups.
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grace-land
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« Reply #901 on: June 08, 2013, 02:14:05 PM »

Saturday, May 8, 2013 Updates cont

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/06/07/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin-911-call-hearing

2:07 p.m. ET: Mantei points out that Doddington listened to the recordings despite the fact that he does not normally engage in reviewing this sort of material.

2:01 p.m. ET: Doddington speaks about the 911 call, saying, "Data of this sort is not going to provide any viable source for making a decision of any kind. I don't need to listen to it." but he admits that later, "curiosity got the best of me."

1:53 p.m. ET: Mantei says that Doddington does not typically do forensic analysis of voice recordings in his studies, and Doddington confirmed that to be true.

1:49 p.m. ET: Rich Mantei is back up to cross examine Doddington.

1:14 p.m. ET: Judge Nelson says the court will take recess for lunch until 1:45 p.m. She asks that Doddington not discuss anything about his current testimony with anyone, including his lawyers.

1:09 p.m. ET: O'Mara asked Doddington if he had a top secret clearance with the National Security Agency, and Doddington confirmed that he does and that he advises the NSA in the area of speech recognition.

1:03 p.m. ET: Doddington calls the current line of questioning "absurd."

12:54 p.m. ET: O'Mara asked Doddington if he had listened to the 911 recordings in headphones and Doddington confirmed that he had.

12:48 p.m. ET: Doddington says Tom own's method of analyzing ten seconds of speech over and over to reach a result is "ridiculous" and a "violation of common sense."

12:37 p.m. ET: Doddington is now discussing speech recognition used in other trials.

12:25 p.m. ET: When asked by O'Mara what happens to a normal voice when it becomes a scream, Doddington said he couldn't answer the question.

12:19 p.m. ET: Doddington says the variables of analyzing speech recording are many, and that the length of recording available is significant in analysis.

12:14 p.m. ET: Doddington has confirmed that he has examined the reports presented yesterday in regards to the Zimmerman 911 call.

12:04 p.m. ET: O'Mara has asked Doddington to define a spectographic analysis. Doddington says that it looks at a spectrographic display of speech to identify salient characteristics that can be used to identify speakers.

12:02 p.m. ET: Doddington explains that his role in a NIST evaluation was to create the test that was put out to the industry to be used for voice recognition analysis. He confirmed that he has been an independent contractor for the company since 2001.

11:55 a.m. ET: O'Mara is asking for a sample of a NIST evaluation process on a voice recording. Doddington is explaining the steps of the process.

11:52 a.m. ET: Doddington is explaining his role at the National Institute for Standards and Technology (NIST).

11:46 a.m. ET: Doddington says that there were no commercially available speaker recognition products on the market when he worked at Texas Instruments.

11:38 a.m. ET: O'Mara is asking Doddington what projects he worked on that covered the calibration of speech technologies. Doddington says all of his work in the last 20 years has focused on it.

11:35 a.m. ET: Doddington says that every voice analysis system is error prone, no matter how advanced.

11:31 a.m. ET: Doddington is talking about the work he did at Texas Instruments and that he worked on some of the first speech recognition products made. Doddington confirmed that he was the Chief Speech Scientist in his final position at the company.

11:21 a.m. ET: Lead Defense Attorney Mark O' Mara has asked Doddington to explain his educational background and his current work.

11:18 a.m. ET: Court has resumed. Dr. George Doddington, Ph.D is now on the stand. He is an electrical engineer who has worked for Texas Instruments for 20 years. For the last 10 years he has worked as an independent contractor and is an expert in speaker recognition.
 
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grace-land
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« Reply #902 on: June 08, 2013, 02:24:22 PM »

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-george-zimmerman-trial-ruling-audio-20130608,0,5224051.story

George Zimmerman trial: Hearing continues on audio experts
2:11 p.m. EDT, June 8, 2013

George Zimmerman is back in court today in his second-degree murder case to continue a hearing on whether jurors will hear testimony about who was heard screaming in the background of a 911 call before Trayvon Martin was shot.

Circuit Judge Debra Nelson has been hearing testimony on the issue since Thursday, and is hearing from defense experts today. First to testify this morning was John Peter French of the United Kingdom, a voice-identification expert.

French testified that the voice of a screaming person is "completely different" than their normal speaking voice. He said he's "never come across a case" in his 30 year career "where anybody's attempted to compare screaming... with normal voice."

French added that the 911 audio in the Zimmerman case "isn't even remotely" appropriate for voice-comparison analysis. He said if a state agency had brought it to his lab, it wouldn't have even gotten "to first base" before he rejected it.

"There can't be any meaningful findings" with these screams, French said.

Another defense expert, California-based former Texas Instruments speech scientist George Doddington, was called to testify next. He expressed strong skepticism of voice-identification.

"Speech is not like fingerprints," said Doddington, who said he has also done work for the National Security Agency and National Institute of Standards and Technology. "Speech is not like iris scans. Speech is not like DNA."
 
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grace-land
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« Reply #903 on: June 08, 2013, 02:32:04 PM »

Saturday, May 8, 2013  Updates cont

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/06/07/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin-911-call-hearing

2:27 p.m. ET: Doddington has stepped down. The third witness is supposed to testify via Skype teleconference, but it will be 15 - 20 minutes until he is available.

2:20 p.m. ET: Doddington says he cannot address any questions that refer to the forensic community or how it operates.

2:10 p.m. ET: Mantei has completed his questioning, and O'Mara is back up.
 
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MuffyBee
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« Reply #904 on: June 08, 2013, 02:33:37 PM »

There was also something else I wanted to comment on and that was on GZ's weight gain. Strictly from a behavioral point of view I wonder what is going on with him.. 100 lbs in a year is extreme. I cannot help to wonder if it is partially stress and maybe to alter his physical appearance in prepartion for trial. It would make him more of the Pillsbury Dough boy than a formidible opponent supporting his self defense claim. We know what people are capable of and then some... food for thought
Not being able to work and needing to hide from certain groups.


BBM
Yes, it could make GZ more of the Pillsbury Dough boy than a "formidible" opponent supporting his self defense claim.  We know what people are capable of and then some...food for thought.  (Goes both ways)

And this years old photo of TM in his hoodie provided by the family which was published and released at the time of the shooting and since then made into posters, murals and etc.  Why didn't the family provide a recent photo?  There are some posted below that were less than 2 weeks old at the time of the shooting. When I first read the news stories  that also had the young TM photo in the hoodie, I was like    He looked like a really young boy.  Look closer at the photos posted below.  Look at how tall and how fit and how much mature TM appears.  I'm not saying he deserved to be shot, because I don't have enough information.  It's still a tragedy. TM may have appeared to look like an adult in the dark and rain and not a little kid running around the neighborhood.  I'm just showing the flip side here.  JMHO

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-trayvon-martin-pictures-20120328,0,3247003.photogallery
Pictures: Trayvon Martin through the years



Trayvon Martin
( COURTESY OF THE FAMILY )



Trayvon Martin (myfox.com)



http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/trayvon-martin-video-prior-shooting-16375723
Trayvon Martin Seen in Video Prior to Shooting
Evidence shows teenager in 7-11 store before altercation with George Zimmerman.
02:43 | 05/18/2012

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-trayvon-martin-pictures-20120328,0,3247003.photogallery


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grace-land
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« Reply #905 on: June 08, 2013, 02:54:03 PM »

Court in recess until 9:00 a.m. on Monday

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MuffyBee
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« Reply #906 on: June 08, 2013, 02:56:30 PM »

Court in recess until 9:00 a.m. on Monday



Thank you for posting the tweets grace-land. 
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« Reply #907 on: June 08, 2013, 02:57:46 PM »

Saturday, May 8, 2013  Updates cont

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/06/07/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin-911-call-hearing

2:50 p.m. EST: Judge Nelson has announced that the third witness has been detained and declared recess. Court will resume Monday morning at 9 a.m.
 
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grace-land
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« Reply #908 on: June 08, 2013, 03:04:07 PM »

Court in recess until 9:00 a.m. on Monday



Thank you for posting the tweets grace-land. 

You're welcome, Muffy.  I wasn't home this morning.  I'm glad that I got to listen to the last expert and to post the tweets from the hearing.
The judge said that she'll make some time next week for the expert.
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« Reply #909 on: June 08, 2013, 03:05:23 PM »

Muffybee, you make very valid points about the way they chose to present TM via photos. It did not go unnoticed by many. I find that his overall looks even with the hoodie etc reminds me of the way my kids and most of their friends look..I troll their facebooks and most of the pix TM had on his is not any different than most kids today... but......if I wasnt familiar with the look I would say it is a bit suspicious. You cannot walk into a bank with a hoodie, hat and/or sunglasses on here in koo koo Florida either...Jake Owen was wearing a mask in a steak and shake pranking on his family and ended up in handcuffs. I try to tell the kids to use common sense
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« Reply #910 on: June 08, 2013, 03:45:38 PM »

Fess up,have any of you avoided stopping at a gas station or store seeing someone that dressed like he he was? I'm a big ol boy and I would.
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MuffyBee
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« Reply #911 on: June 08, 2013, 03:54:22 PM »

Muffybee, you make very valid points about the way they chose to present TM via photos. It did not go unnoticed by many. I find that his overall looks even with the hoodie etc reminds me of the way my kids and most of their friends look..I troll their facebooks and most of the pix TM had on his is not any different than most kids today... but......if I wasnt familiar with the look I would say it is a bit suspicious. You cannot walk into a bank with a hoodie, hat and/or sunglasses on here in koo koo Florida either...Jake Owen was wearing a mask in a steak and shake pranking on his family and ended up in handcuffs. I try to tell the kids to use common sense

flamom, the point I was trying to make didn't have anything to do with the hoodie part of the photo. Please read my post closely.   I was pointing out that it was an older photo of a very youthful TM.  Gosh, I only mentioned the hoodie part because that is how that particular photo is often times identified.  Maybe a better comparison would have been this photo the Martin family provided:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-trayvon-martin-pictures-20120328,0,3247003.photogallery


Trayvon Martin
( HANDOUT, Reuters / March 28, 2012 )
An undated handout photo released by the Martin family public relations representative shows Trayvon Martin.
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« Reply #912 on: June 08, 2013, 04:06:06 PM »

Fess up,have any of you avoided stopping at a gas station or store seeing someone that dressed like he he was? I'm a big ol boy and I would.


 
Sometimes you have to do what you think feels safe.  It's not personal.  Being aware of your surroundings is important.  If something doesn't look right, don't stop.  Don't be a victim.  JMHO 

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« Reply #913 on: June 09, 2013, 12:36:16 AM »

Fess up,have any of you avoided stopping at a gas station or store seeing someone that dressed like he he was? I'm a big ol boy and I would.

WTH??  No!  Good grief... he was wearing a hoodie. 

Trayvon's father already stated the reason those pics were chosen is because they are photos they had readily available in the home.  The more recent photos came off phones later.  His answer seemed honest and forthright from what I recall.  There was nothing sinister behind it and I don't see a big difference at all in the photos.  I don't find Trayvon to be 'scary'.

These comments are bothersome.  It's not okay to be a black kid in a hoodie?  But it's okay to go after one when you're armed with a weapon?   
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« Reply #914 on: June 09, 2013, 12:40:52 AM »

Also, according to the 911 call Zimmerman's description was that Trayvon was a teenager, not an adult.

Trayvon was extremely skinny for his height.  If he was formidable looking why did Zimmerman leave his truck to go after him?
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« Reply #915 on: June 09, 2013, 11:13:18 AM »

Maybe it's just me, but I wonder why this older more youthful photo of TM is still being used when there are updated ones available.  And it's posted right alongside one of GZ that was current at the time of the shooting.  This could be considered a form of media manipulation IMO.  I understand this younger photo of TM was released by the family at the time of the shooting because it was readily available at the time and that
makes sense.  So why use that photo alongside the one of GZ now?  I find it very concerning. 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/06/09/jury-selection-in-george-zimmerman-murder-case-begins/2399235/
Fla. town on edge as Trayvon Martin case goes to court
June 9, 2013


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« Reply #916 on: June 09, 2013, 11:23:55 AM »

This has been my concern since this case first came to light.   There are too many special interest groups/people using this case to further their own agenda.  JMHO

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trayvon-martin-trial-thrusts-u-s-issues-of-race-justice-guns-into-spotlight-1.1317802
Trayvon Martin trial thrusts U.S. issues of race, justice, guns into spotlight
June 8, 2013


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« Reply #917 on: June 09, 2013, 12:12:04 PM »

This has been my concern since this case first came to light.   There are too many special interest groups/people using this case to further their own agenda.  JMHO

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trayvon-martin-trial-thrusts-u-s-issues-of-race-justice-guns-into-spotlight-1.1317802
Trayvon Martin trial thrusts U.S. issues of race, justice, guns into spotlight
June 8, 2013



"
O'Mara said he doubts he will find six jurors and four alternates who haven't heard about the case but his goal is to find jurors who haven't formed opinions"
Anyone know how they decide whether to have 6 or 12?
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« Reply #918 on: June 09, 2013, 12:32:20 PM »

This has been my concern since this case first came to light.   There are too many special interest groups/people using this case to further their own agenda.  JMHO

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trayvon-martin-trial-thrusts-u-s-issues-of-race-justice-guns-into-spotlight-1.1317802
Trayvon Martin trial thrusts U.S. issues of race, justice, guns into spotlight
June 8, 2013



"
O'Mara said he doubts he will find six jurors and four alternates who haven't heard about the case but his goal is to find jurors who haven't formed opinions"
Anyone know how they decide whether to have 6 or 12?


From the jury support thread: 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=14277.msg1563002#msg1563002
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/os-george-zimmerman-trial-jury-selection-20130529,0,2098457.story

Judge wants four alternate jurors for George Zimmerman trial
10:16 a.m. EDT, May 30, 2013

SANFORD Six jurors will decide whether George Zimmerman is guilty of second-degree murder, but during jury selection at his trial, attorneys will pick a panel of 10, four of them alternates, according to Seminole County Clerk of Courts Maryanne Morse.

Normally at a second-degree murder trial attorneys pick six jurors and two alternates, but in this case Circuit Judge Debra S. Nelson is apparently building in extra protection by adding more alternates.

They typically sit in the jury box with other jurors and listen to the evidence then are released when the others go into a closed room and begin deliberations.

 
As for jury selection, the judge asked Morse to summon 500 potential jurors for the trial. Those jury service notices went into the mail May 1.

All 500 people will not show up the first day of jury selection, Morse said. On Day 1 it will be 100 to 200 people, she said, and each day after that about 100 new prospective jurors.

"The objective of the court is basically to spread them out over the five-day cycle," Morse said.

Potential jurors will be required to fill out a questionnaire then will be questioned individually, outside the earshot of other potential jurors.

They'll be asked about their jobs, family, experience with police and the court system and what they've heard about the case.

Morse said she hopes jury selection can be completed during the first week. Defense attorney Mark O'Mara earlier predicted it would take two to three weeks.

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« Reply #919 on: June 09, 2013, 12:41:30 PM »

This has been my concern since this case first came to light.   There are too many special interest groups/people using this case to further their own agenda.  JMHO

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trayvon-martin-trial-thrusts-u-s-issues-of-race-justice-guns-into-spotlight-1.1317802
Trayvon Martin trial thrusts U.S. issues of race, justice, guns into spotlight
June 8, 2013




Media, special interests, and politicians sully the waters of issues our country needs to face.  It doesn't mean these are not legitimate issues.  Not guns so much, most of us have a right to carry. 

If I was a young black man I would be angry and fearful with so many racists lurking everywhere who pretend they're not but secretly harbor anger toward black folk.  It's a very real issue and the reason Trayvon was killed and people automatically think it was justified.  If he was white many of the responses here would be vastly different.
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