The Slaying of Trayvon Martin in Florida #3 7/12/12 - 6/14/13

[grace-land]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-george-zimmerman-race-fight-fbi-fdle-20121012,0,6973848.story

O'Mara's strategy shift: Race has no place in Zimmerman case
8:09 p.m. EDT, October 12, 2012

George Zimmerman's lawyers this week signaled a new tactic: They intend to prove that race has no place in Zimmerman's prosecution.

It is a risky move, given that Zimmerman is accused of murder in one of the most incendiary criminal cases in the country, one that sent thousands of civil-rights protesters into the streets earlier this year, demanding his arrest.

On Thursday, defense attorney Mark O'Mara filed paperwork asking Special Prosecutor Angela Corey to turn over all the evidence she has showing whether 29-year-old Zimmerman, who is Hispanic, violated the civil rights of Trayvon Martin, the unarmed black 17-year-old he fatally shot in Sanford on Feb. 26.

Specifically, O'Mara asked for records from the FBI, the U.S. Department of Justice, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement and local law-enforcement agencies that would reveal whether investigators found that Zimmerman was motivated by race or acted to deprive Trayvon of his civil rights.

In an unusually long blog post Wednesday, O'Mara wrote that if race is a factor in this case, it's not because of Zimmerman — it's because Sanford police did not make an immediate arrest.
 ::snipping2::
In March, under pressure from national civil-rights leaders who had trekked to Sanford — including the Rev. Jesse Jackson, the Rev. Al Sharpton and Benjamin Jealous, the national president of the NAACP — the Department of Justice launched a civil-rights investigation.

It is still under way, FBI spokesman Dave Couvertier reported Thursday.

The Department of Justice would not give a status report, offer a preliminary summary of its findings or say when it might be concluded.

But Corey's office in July released several documents showing that FBI agents had interviewed three dozen of Zimmerman's friends, family members, co-workers and neighbors and found no evidence that he used racial epithets or is bigoted.
 ::snipping2::

[grace-land]

http://gzlegalcase.com/

Race and the George Zimmerman Case
on 10 October 2012.

In an interview with the Orlando Sentinel posted September 29, 2012, Martin family attorney Benjamin Crump describes race as the “elephant in the room” in the George Zimmerman case.

The term “elephant in the room” typically describes something that people won’t talk about -- despite how obvious and apparent it is. This term is misapplied in this case. Mr. Crump has led a chorus of voices in drawing attention to the race factor in the George Zimmerman case, including comments from the President of the United States. While it can be safely argued that it is largely the question of civil rights issues that has made the George Zimmerman case a national -- and international -- story, there is nothing to support the contention of racism in the Zimmerman case.

The real “elephant in the room,” however, is that race should not be a factor in the George Zimmerman case, and should never have been made one.

Here are Benjamin Crump’s full remarks:

"It shouldn’t be about race. But race is the elephant in the room. Nobody believes that if you make Trayvon Martin white [and the Neighborhood Watch volunteer black], there’s no way he would not be arrested, and that’s the unfortunate and tragic truth of the matter. There is a double standard. That’s why race is involved in this case.”

Let’s forget for a moment that George Zimmerman is Hispanic, not white. What Mr. Crump is saying is that race is an issue in the George Zimmerman case because, he insists, that if a black man shot a white person in a similar situation, the black man would have been immediately arrested. This is not an indictment of George Zimmerman; this is fundamentally an accusation that the Sanford Police Department acted in a racist way, and that perhaps the criminal justice system at large is biased against black men.
 
The truth is that there is credible evidence that black men are overrepresented in the criminal justice system, and that is evidence of an underlying problem. Mark O’Mara and Don West have each spent a career in criminal defense fighting against racial bias in the justice system that affected many of their clients. This is something that needs to be discussed as a nation, and if this case has brought that conversation to the forefront, then now is the time to have that conversation.

Mr. Crump is right in talking about the George Zimmerman case when he says: “It shouldn’t be about race.” But by projecting race onto the George Zimmerman case, Mr. Crump is pinning a supposed civil rights victory on a Zimmerman conviction. The problem is that by associating a Zimmerman conviction with a civil rights victory, Mr. Crump has framed a scenario where a Zimmerman victory in a Self-Defense Immunity Hearing or a Zimmerman acquittal will represent a civil rights defeat. That is inappropriate and dangerous to us as a nation.
 ::snipping2::

[grace-land]

http://gzlegalcase.com/

Regarding Robert Zimmerman Jr.'s Media Campaign and Twitter Comments
on 11 October 2012.

Regarding Robert Zimmerman Jr.'s media campaign and Twitter comments, Robert is acting on behalf of his family, and he is not acting with the approval or the input of the defense team. We're naturally concerned about anyone associated with the case speaking publicly, because there is always a risk that their comments could complicate our defense efforts. The Zimmerman family has been through a lot, and they have been frequently misrepresented in the media, so we do not begrudge Robert for wanting to speak out and set the record straight.
Continue Reading »

[Gypsy DD]

Here's what I think about how the trial is going to go down.  Race is out of the question as far as death or not..what is in question is that a man of legal age murdered a child in cold blood because he was an over zealous vigilante.  There is no room for anything else.  A teen walking home from a convenience store is murdered by someone who does not recognize him as a regular in the neighborhood..although he was there visiting a parent.  How does that equate to murder unless someone pushed the fear button too fast. 
The whole vigilantly stance in the US has gone to far.  Yes you have a right to protect yourself..but you do not have the right to question someone being on a street in your neighborhood just because you do not know them..and then pushing that issue to the point of murdering them.  I am sick and tired of people living like the old West..I have a gun and I will use it..really..this man belongs in jail..he is a fool..you don't shoot teens because you don't know them..and that is what this boiled down too.

[carpe noctem]

Here's what I think about how the trial is going to go down.  Race is out of the question as far as death or not..what is in question is that a man of legal age murdered a child in cold blood because he was an over zealous vigilante.  There is no room for anything else.  A teen walking home from a convenience store is murdered by someone who does not recognize him as a regular in the neighborhood..although he was there visiting a parent.  How does that equate to murder unless someone pushed the fear button too fast. 
The whole vigilantly stance in the US has gone to far.  Yes you have a right to protect yourself..but you do not have the right to question someone being on a street in your neighborhood just because you do not know them..and then pushing that issue to the point of murdering them.  I am sick and tired of people living like the old West..I have a gun and I will use it..really..this man belongs in jail..he is a fool..you don't shoot teens because you don't know them..and that is what this boiled down too.

He shot Tray because he was pushing George's head into the cement... and tossing him around like a beanie baby. I would have shot him just for coming at me in a menacing manner... which is also allowed.  But I now see the wisdom of waiting. George has actual photographic proof to document the fact that he was severely beaten. Leaving him no other choice but to do what he did.

Anything George did or didn't do up to the point of being jumped (as long as it complies with the law) really means very little. His flaws and shortcomings -- they mean very little, as well.

I agree with you on the old wild west thing, though. Chicago, IL 2012 - 500 homicides - shootings around the clock. From cars, bicycles, streets, lots, alleys, and even right in broad daylight.

They have the strictest gun control in the USA. Criminals know there is no way to fight back there --- it's a shooting gallery.

Gun crimes have gone down consistently since the passage of stand your ground in Florida. It is supported by roughly 75% of the population. I think it may be tweaked post Trayvon, but I don't

see it vanishing anytime soon. Too many keep voting for it.

[Amys Sister]

Here's what I think about how the trial is going to go down.  Race is out of the question as far as death or not..what is in question is that a man of legal age murdered a child in cold blood because he was an over zealous vigilante.  There is no room for anything else.  A teen walking home from a convenience store is murdered by someone who does not recognize him as a regular in the neighborhood..although he was there visiting a parent.  How does that equate to murder unless someone pushed the fear button too fast. 
The whole vigilantly stance in the US has gone to far.  Yes you have a right to protect yourself..but you do not have the right to question someone being on a street in your neighborhood just because you do not know them..and then pushing that issue to the point of murdering them.  I am sick and tired of people living like the old West..I have a gun and I will use it..really..this man belongs in jail..he is a fool..you don't shoot teens because you don't know them..and that is what this boiled down too.

He shot Tray because he was pushing George's head into the cement... and tossing him around like a beanie baby. I would have shot him just for coming at me in a menacing manner... which is also allowed.  But I now see the wisdom of waiting. George has actual photographic proof to document the fact that he was severely beaten. Leaving him no other choice but to do what he did.

Anything George did or didn't do up to the point of being jumped (as long as it complies with the law) really means very little. His flaws and shortcomings -- they mean very little, as well.

I agree with you on the old wild west thing, though. Chicago, IL 2012 - 500 homicides - shootings around the clock. From cars, bicycles, streets, lots, alleys, and even right in broad daylight.

They have the strictest gun control in the USA. Criminals know there is no way to fight back there --- it's a shooting gallery.

Gun crimes have gone down consistently since the passage of stand your ground in Florida. It is supported by roughly 75% of the population. I think it may be tweaked post Trayvon, but I don't

see it vanishing anytime soon. Too many keep voting for it.

How do you know Tray came at George in a menacing manner, threw him around, and pushed his head into the ground?  George is a proven liar.  The images of his superficial wounds only show an altercation took place, they are not evidence that George's story is an accurate portrayal of what happened.

George could easily have been the attacker, threatening Trayvon, pulling aside his shirt to reveal his gun as he approaching the teen, then Trayvon reacted to the George's threat.  Trayvon's body was far away from the sidewalk George was walking on as he followed Tray, a clear indication George was 'going after' Trayvon.  I do not believe Trayvon pulled George away from the sidewalk, that scenario makes no sense.  Trayvon probably did punch George to the ground as George was coming after Tray which caused scratching to George's head when he went down, but if Tray was repeatedly hitting his head on the concrete as George would like us to believe there would have been far more and worse contusions, especially on a baldie.

Trayvon then sat on George to hold him still and figure out what George wanted and why he was following him.  Tray was trying to stop the threat and at this point likely called for help because he couldn't sit there and hold George, who he knew had a weapon, all night.  Somehow George broke his hand free, pulled his weapon, and shot the kid.

George was the aggressor as I see it and all of his actions leading up to the shooting matter very much to the outcome. 

[carpe noctem]

Hi Amysistser - I appreciate your passion in the defense of Tray -- and your articulate points, you make well.

I don't see how anyone can look at the pictures of George's wounds which he needed many stitches to zip back up...

Also, beware of Tray's autopsy report that speaks of his many bruised knuckles (consistent with throwing punches)

Additionally knowing - George not only volunteered to take a liar detector test --- he took two! The guilty have a lot to

lose by taking them. Yet, he did and they were consistent with his version of events. His scars -- consistent with what

he said.  I think if it wasn't for the race pimps, who make a great deal of cash on these unfortunate events --- and

the Ministry of "Truth" and their sadistic  Media Machine Multiple Crime Scenario Generator stayed out of it. (abc/cbs/nbc/fox/cnn/)

George would be out on the streets by now. Much like this one that happened at close to the same time frame.

Attorney for shooter recently cleared in Palm Harbor 'Stand Your Ground' case says his client just wants to move on and be left alone
 By Kameel Stanley, Times Staff Writer
 In Print: Wednesday, September 26, 2012

http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/article1253356.ece

Trayvon wasn't special in what he did. Neither was Zimmerman. It was a political op. that chose this one to try and create it into a football game for the masses. Presidents should never toss their two cents in on a case --- it makes it personal and causes controversy and it devolves into chaos. Yet, this is precisely what BO did. He could have gotten more people killed with this foul move!!!

It's simple: Justifiable Homicide *** provided all evidence lines up with the victim's story. It does. If he failed the lie detector tests (both) I'd be the first to say, hey something doesn't add up. Get him in here --- let's go at him again!

Angela Corey better be sitting on something huge to jail a man who should have been let go that night. It would have to be huge
to raise this to 2nd degree murder charge-- which sounds IMPOSSIBLE. If she doesn't have that big piece of evidence... I see her working
in WALMART by the year 2015. She will be destroyed, if that is the case. If we write laws that are subject to change by who gets
their feelings hurt most, expressing it with uncontrollable rage --- we will have MOB RULES! Mobocracies die a chaotic death.

Think Mad Max or Planet of the Apes as an ending... that's how those wind up.

[Toler]

'Halloween Hoodie' campaign spins off of Trayvon Martin's shooting death
 orlandosentinel.com ^ | 10/14/2012 | Arelis R. Hernández

Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2012 6:16:21 PM by massmike

If a young man walks by wearing a sweatshirt with a hood tight around the chin, face somewhat concealed and hands tucked inside the pouch pockets, what comes to mind?

Thug? A mugging is imminent? What's in his hands? Trayvon Martin?

More often than not, Rochelle Oliver and Gauis Benbow believe, its a negative stereotype that emerges. That's what they are trying to challenge with their "Halloween Hoodie" campaign — an effort to have Americans of all shades don hoodies on the one day of the year when fear is supposed to be fun.

"The hoodie is this ubiquitous piece of clothing that everyone wears but when black people wear it, it's interpreted as a symbol of criminal activity," Benbow said, a 30-year-old Miami-based graphic artist. "There are a lot of stereotypes that get thrown around and we need to be aware of them to deconstruct them."

He teamed up with Oliver, an independent producer in South Florida, after a conversation about Halloween festivities turned into a discussion about the shooting death of Trayvon Martin.

"This isn't about being pro-Trayvon. It's about being anti-stereotyping," Oliver said "Seeing someone wearing a hoodie on Halloween will hopefully allow people to examine what they are feeling if they are scared or why they may be judging the person as a threat."   ::snipping2:: 

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2944834/posts

[Amys Sister]

"A responder at the crime scene told CBS News that he and others saw wounds on the knuckles of one of Martin's hands as he lay dead on this lawn. This suggests that Martin had thrown a punch."

"The case also includes Zimmerman's medical report the day after the shooting, which listed a broken nose, two black eyes and a cut in the back of the head."

"A source also told CBS News an unreleased police report noted Zimmerman's sweatshirt had "grass stains, and was wet on the back."

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57436083-504083/trayvon-martin-shooting-autopsy-results-say-slain-teen-had-injuries-to-his-knuckles/



"No stitches were needed to close the head cuts, which he was advised to clean with soap and water daily. Zimmerman reported no headaches, blurred vision or loss of hearing."

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2012/07/doctor-zimmerman-suffered-no-serious-head-trauma/1




Hey Carpe.  The above mentioned injuries show only one of Trayvon's hands had knuckle wounds and George did not need stitches.  I think this fits with the scenario I outlined in which Trayvon was acting defensively to protect himself.



Lie detector tests are largely unreliable.  According to this article the polygraph is only admissable in Florida courts as evidence if both the prosecutor and the defense agree to it so I'm not sure we'll see them in this trial.

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/admissability-of-polygraph-tests-in-court.html

[Puzzler]

George Zimmerman Defense Files Demand for Specific Discovery


Link to GZLegal: 
http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/court-documents/52-george-zimmerman-defense-files-demand-for-specific-discovery


Link to PDF:  http://184.172.211.159/~gzdocs/documents/october_hearing/demand_for_specific_discovery.pdf


On October 11, 2012 the Zimmerman defense team filed a Demand for Specific Discovery requesting all records held by the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Department of Justice Community Relations Services as they pertain the the organizations' respective investigations and communications regarding the State of Florida vs. George Zimmerman or any related matters, including the investigation of the Sanford Police Department’s handling of the initial investigation.

[Puzzler]

http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/press-releases/51-race-and-the-george-zimmerman-case

Race and the George Zimmerman Case
on 10 October 2012.


In an interview with the Orlando Sentinel posted September 29, 2012, Martin family attorney Benjamin Crump describes race as the “elephant in the room” in the George Zimmerman case.

The term “elephant in the room” typically describes something that people won’t talk about -- despite how obvious and apparent it is. This term is misapplied in this case. Mr. Crump has led a chorus of voices in drawing attention to the race factor in the George Zimmerman case, including comments from the President of the United States. While it can be safely argued that it is largely the question of civil rights issues that has made the George Zimmerman case a national -- and international -- story, there is nothing to support the contention of racism in the Zimmerman case.

The real “elephant in the room,” however, is that race should not be a factor in the George Zimmerman case, and should never have been made one. (snip)

[Puzzler]

The Florida Evidence Manual:

Section 90.404(1)(b) allows evidence of a pertinent trait of character of the victim of a crime to be offered by an accused; or by the prosecution to rebut the trait; or evidence of a character trait of peacefulness of the victim offered by the prosecution in a homicide case to rebut evidence that the victim was the aggressor.

[carpe noctem]

"A responder at the crime scene told CBS News that he and others saw wounds on the knuckles of one of Martin's hands as he lay dead on this lawn. This suggests that Martin had thrown a punch."

"The case also includes Zimmerman's medical report the day after the shooting, which listed a broken nose, two black eyes and a cut in the back of the head."

"A source also told CBS News an unreleased police report noted Zimmerman's sweatshirt had "grass stains, and was wet on the back."

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57436083-504083/trayvon-martin-shooting-autopsy-results-say-slain-teen-had-injuries-to-his-knuckles/



"No stitches were needed to close the head cuts, which he was advised to clean with soap and water daily. Zimmerman reported no headaches, blurred vision or loss of hearing."

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2012/07/doctor-zimmerman-suffered-no-serious-head-trauma/1




Hey Carpe.  The above mentioned injuries show only one of Trayvon's hands had knuckle wounds and George did not need stitches.  I think this fits with the scenario I outlined in which Trayvon was acting defensively to protect himself.



Lie detector tests are largely unreliable.  According to this article the polygraph is only admissable in Florida courts as evidence if both the prosecutor and the defense agree to it so I'm not sure we'll see them in this trial.

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/admissability-of-polygraph-tests-in-court.html

Amy-

Point taken about the stitches. Thanks! Of course, he was still beaten by Trayvon. Which  I believe justifies what he had to do to stop it.

A reasonable person being attacked will fight back even if they have to kill to stop the assault.

I know lie detector results can't be used in court. This is not my point. Who said anything about using it in court?

----
kcrn -
Trayvon did not deserve to die, you are correct -- He chose it through actions and poor choices. There is a big difference.

[iluvmua]

I think many of us would have done what GZ did. I do not think george murdered anyone. Killed Yes, Murdered No.

everything up to this point says that GZ is telling the truth and if anybody has any evidence that says otherwise, please post it here.

also, GZ only has to be in fear for his life in order to use his gun.

In order for GZ to be IMO, lying about the whole thing: GZ, his family, his attorney, The Police, dispatchers, EMT's Media (TV and News, Radio) etc.  ALL have to be lying.

it must be one big conspiracy.

[iluvmua]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-zimmerman-discovery-complaints-20121015,0,4408070.story

[Amys Sister]

I don't believe anyone has lied except George, his wife, and his father by ommission in the blog he created when he failed to mention he's a retired commissioner.

If the facts of the case are lined up, including statements of the EMT and other witnesses, the jury will still have a tough decision so the attorney's need to be very diligent.

A boy was killed.  This should go to court to either find the shooter innocent or guilty of murder.  I believe in the right to carry but unless it is painstakingly obvious it was used for self defense then it should go before a court of law.

As an example, a man shot an intruder as he came through his kitchen window.  The intruder was killed.  LE never arrested the homeowner and through forensics it was discovered the dead man had robbed numerous homes and businesses.  The stranger was coming through the window... painstakingly obvious his intentions were nefarious.

Here we have something completely different.  George was told to stay in his vehicle.  He was far off the sidewalk that leads back to his truck and he states in the video of the reenactment that he doesn't know how he got there, that Trayvon must have gotten him over there somehow.  He has made countless calls to 9-11 and shows clear frustration with people getting away before LE arrives.  It is not obvious that Trayvon was up to something nefarious or intended anyone harm.  We may believe that but there is no proof of his intentions.  The injuries do not tell the whole story.  Because he is dead he cannot speak for himself and so the case should be heard. 

[Amys Sister]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-zimmerman-discovery-complaints-20121015,0,4408070.story

From the article:
"The state is simply not turning over what it should, West complained. For example, it's given defense attorneys grainy photocopies of crime scene photos instead of digital copies.

Prosecutors also have failed to turn over witness sketches, have handed over recordings that are unplayable and have failed to hand over certain witness interviews, West alleged.

"The state's approach to discovery has been to require the defense to figure out what the state has failed to provide and then ask for it rather than fulfill the state's legal obligation to provide complete and timely discovery," West wrote."


That's lame and unacceptable.  There's no reason for it that I can think of except to delay the inevitable and frustrate the defense.   

[iluvmua]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-zimmerman-discovery-complaints-20121015,0,4408070.story

From the article:
"The state is simply not turning over what it should, West complained. For example, it's given defense attorneys grainy photocopies of crime scene photos instead of digital copies.

Prosecutors also have failed to turn over witness sketches, have handed over recordings that are unplayable and have failed to hand over certain witness interviews, West alleged.

"The state's approach to discovery has been to require the defense to figure out what the state has failed to provide and then ask for it rather than fulfill the state's legal obligation to provide complete and timely discovery," West wrote."


That's lame and unacceptable.  There's no reason for it that I can think of except to delay the inevitable and frustrate the defense.   

yep, it is.

If the state was SO confident they would get a conviction, they would turn over everything.

I believe they have a very weak case and I believe  they know it.

it's going to be like the Duke Lacrosse scandal all over again. JMO

[cookie]

I don't believe anyone has lied except George, his wife, and his father by ommission in the blog he created when he failed to mention he's a retired commissioner.

If the facts of the case are lined up, including statements of the EMT and other witnesses, the jury will still have a tough decision so the attorney's need to be very diligent.

A boy was killed.  This should go to court to either find the shooter innocent or guilty of murder.  I believe in the right to carry but unless it is painstakingly obvious it was used for self defense then it should go before a court of law.

As an example, a man shot an intruder as he came through his kitchen window.  The intruder was killed.  LE never arrested the homeowner and through forensics it was discovered the dead man had robbed numerous homes and businesses.  The stranger was coming through the window... painstakingly obvious his intentions were nefarious.

Here we have something completely different.  George was told to stay in his vehicle.  He was far off the sidewalk that leads back to his truck and he states in the video of the reenactment that he doesn't know how he got there, that Trayvon must have gotten him over there somehow.  He has made countless calls to 9-11 and shows clear frustration with people getting away before LE arrives.  It is not obvious that Trayvon was up to something nefarious or intended anyone harm.  We may believe that but there is no proof of his intentions.  The injuries do not tell the whole story.  Because he is dead he cannot speak for himself and so the case should be heard. 

They did lie. But so did Trayvon's parents by showing a photo of him when he was years younger, to imply that he was a small young looking boy when in fact other photos have shown him to be a grown looking man. also, they "implied" that Trayvon was just your average kid who never got into any trouble when in fact he had been in quite a few scrapes himself, being expelled from school a few times, committing robberies etc...supposedly...
...
That being said, he did not deserve to die, he probably was minding his own business when GZ tried to play Barney Fife...things escalated and none of us will ever know what really happened that night except GZ cause Trayvon is dead. And we all know that GZ is going to say what ever he has to say to maintain that he is innocent of any wrong doing. hopefully a court of law will sort this mess out and justice will be served in what ever way that is the right way. jmo

[iluvmua]

How much money to Trayvon's parents need? before they stopped asking for donations for the Justice fro Trayvon site, they had $35,000 and some change.

These parents are repulsive

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-trayvon-martin-stand-your-ground-20121015,0,3075360.story