August 18, 2018, 11:34:32 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
   Home   Help Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 »   Go Down
Author Topic: Isabel Mercedes Celis missing #2 5/25/12 - (Body Found)  (Read 101365 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 17081

« Reply #20 on: May 25, 2012, 09:20:21 PM »

Details from the report, Part 3

"A dog going crazy"
Many of the reports detail what nearby residents saw or heard around the time of Isabel's disappearance.
• Several reports list details about barking dogs and strange vehicles.
One officer reported that a resident on East 13th Street said she heard a "dog going crazy barking" at a house on East Cooper Street at about 2 a.m. April 21.
She also reported that around 8 a.m., she encountered one of Isabel's brothers walking toward an LA Fitness on Wilmot Road. She said the boy told her that he was looking for his missing sister and that he was crying.
• In another report, a man flagged down a police officer in the 5800 block of East Speedway and told the officer he had seen a little girl who appeared to be 6 or 7 years old running down North Columbus Boulevard late at night.
Officers checked the surrounding area but did not find anyone.
• Another officer wrote that he was sent to a motel in the 3300 block of East Benson Highway. Someone had called 911 saying he had Isabel and if police did not respond in 10 minutes he would kill her. The officer searched the area and questioned people staying in the motel but nothing suspicious was found.
• Another officer wrote that he was assigned to stop people entering and leaving a neighborhood at 12th Street and Van Buren Avenue, east of Isabel's house, on April 24. His report listed all the people he spoke with and the reasons they were driving or walking in the area.
The officer said a woman approached him and said she had been at Sears Park on East 14th Street south of Park Place mall and found a small pair of children's stockings, large shoe prints and tire tracks, a cigarette package and a receipt for a man's hat. He advised the woman to return to the park and call 911, which she did.
• A neighbor reported increased vehicle traffic in an alley by the Celis home days before Isabel was reported missing. He saw a 1990s minivan with tinted windows and a Ford Focus, possibly a 2001 model, with tinted windows.
• Another officer's report was 11 pages long, listing the names and phone numbers of every person he and several other officers questioned at an apartment complex.
• One officer wrote that on April 24, a man told him he had been digging in the trash behind businesses on East Irvington Road and found a plastic garbage bag with maggots and hair inside. Officers went to the business and found the bag, which contained a dead animal.
• Another officer wrote in a report that on the morning of Isabel's disappearance, he was canvassing a neighborhood on East 12th Street. He said a family told him about several suspicious vehicles they saw driving in the neighborhood that afternoon - one a Dodge Ram truck, another a Honda hatchback. They weren't able to get license plate numbers, the report stated.
The officer wrote he also searched a nearby house and an underground bomb shelter in the backyard of the house.
State Department of Corrections K-9 units initially deployed a tracking dog that alerted once to the residence located directly to the south of the Celis home. A search warrant was served on the house.
• In another report, an officer details how a set of footprints was discovered on top of a small electrical box at the rear southeast corner of the Celis home. The footprints appeared to be from a "Wolverine brand work boot or similar type shoe."
Three matching boot prints were discovered in the soft sand or dirt about 5 feet south of the electrical box. Crime scene units processed the prints.
K-9 units also discovered possible matching prints on top of a gas meter on the west side of the house
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 37008

« Reply #21 on: May 25, 2012, 09:59:02 PM »

550+ pages reveal details in extensive Celis investigation
Posted: May 24, 2012 8:04 PM PDT
Updated: May 25, 2012 9:29 AM PDT

TUCSON, AZ (Tucson News Now) - More than 550 pages relating to the Isabel Celis case were released Thursday.


What exactly was taken from the home is revealed in the documents, including Isabel's hairbrush and toothbrush. The window where the screen was removed was swabbed for DNA. Also, one of the documents states, "Overall interior views of the residence including views of items of evidence as marked by detectives on scene and overall views of the middle east bedroom including views of apparent blood on the floor."

Taken from a car at the residence was a white hat and a vinyl shower curtain. The items had "dark red-brown or brown stains." Tests were not performed on scene of the shower curtain because "it was decided to keep the item close to its original condition and allow crime lab personnel to screen the shower curtain for possible evidence if deemed necessary."

One detective reported a positive Luminol reason on the "driver's seat of the Toyota Corolla," that was at the residence. Luminol is used in forensic investigations to identify traces of blood.


The full PDF of the documents will be available by Friday afternoon.

Documents are there now:

<Respectfully snipped by Tamikosmom>

Thanks Klaas

Just catching up.  Life outside the computer room becked this afternoon.

6:51 PM

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 37008

« Reply #22 on: May 25, 2012, 10:04:15 PM »

Monkey King ... I missed JVM and NG.  However ... a NG repeat is beginning now.

Grace ... thanks for the updates.

7:00 PM PT

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 17081

« Reply #23 on: May 25, 2012, 11:04:30 PM »

You're welcome, Janet! 
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 17081

« Reply #24 on: May 25, 2012, 11:07:55 PM »

Video at link

Dr. Henry Lee on possible blood in Isabel’s home
By Staff
updated 8:36 PM EDT, Fri May 25, 2012

 •Forensic scientist discusses new details in Isabel Celis case
 •Dr. Lee explains what investigators can learn from an apparent blood stain or a footprint
Monkey King
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 3055

« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2012, 12:05:51 AM »

Monkey King ... I missed JVM and NG.  However ... a NG repeat is beginning now.

Grace ... thanks for the updates.

7:00 PM PT

Very good. Glad I located this link!

     ~Things aren't always what they appear to be~
Monkey All Star Jr.
Offline Offline

Posts: 8044

« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2012, 01:39:51 AM »

Does anyone know "why" these documents got released.

I mean, usually 911 calls are released when the press goes to court to get the judge to release the calls.

Florida has a Sunshine Law, whereby documents like this get released "after" the defense has received them.

This is different.

Puzzler - that which puzzles or perplexes; anything that arouses curiosity or perplexes because it is unexplained, inexplicable or secret.
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1931

« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2012, 08:35:54 AM »

Does anyone know "why" these documents got released.

I mean, usually 911 calls are released when the press goes to court to get the judge to release the calls.

Florida has a Sunshine Law, whereby documents like this get released "after" the defense has received them.

This is different.

I would like to know too.  I am also very surprised that they didn't block numbers and such out.  I also worry about the man that went up to the police and said that he suspects Sergio...this was someone he coached with. 

"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1565

« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2012, 09:07:39 AM »

Does anyone know "why" these documents got released.

I mean, usually 911 calls are released when the press goes to court to get the judge to release the calls.

Florida has a Sunshine Law, whereby documents like this get released "after" the defense has received them.

This is different.

Three possibilities that I can come up with for releasing the docs:

1.  The police are tired of answering questions by avoiding answering them.  I really don't believe this, but if I were the police, I would probably be to this point.

2.  There is nothing in the docs that the police believe is incriminating to any known potential suspect.

3.  There is something in the docs that the police believe will lead a potential suspect to believe that the police have more evidence on him/her which they are withholding while they are either gathering additional information or waiting for lab results to come back.  The motive for LE in this case is to put pressure on the suspect to either fess up or screw up.    This is the reason I am hoping is closest to the truth, whatever it is.

Thanks to all that have posted info about and from the 550 pages.  Sounds like it is going to be as exciting to read as Moby Dick (no offense to Melville lovers).   

A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones. Proverbs 17:22 NAB

We don`t know who the monsters are.  And as a parent, our job is to take care of our children. Ken Fries, Sheriff Allen County commenting on the death of Aliah
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1565

« Reply #29 on: May 26, 2012, 09:10:48 AM »

BOX INTRUSIONS ALERT -- SORRY LABUBSKE AND PUZZLER, I have been up since 4 am, unwillingly, I might add.   

A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones. Proverbs 17:22 NAB

We don`t know who the monsters are.  And as a parent, our job is to take care of our children. Ken Fries, Sheriff Allen County commenting on the death of Aliah
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1931

« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2012, 10:58:27 AM »

Edit to add link from labubske.  MB
From the first 98 pages:
One neighbor stated that one month ago they were approached by a Hispanic man, 5’0 tall that held on to her and only released her once a car passed by.
One neighbor reported that an older white Lincoln full size sedan passed through the neighborhood 2-3 times at around 0930 on 4/22  Black male.
Peter P did not give phone number or DOB.
Mark T –coached with Sergio and states that he knows him well.  Approached an officer and says that he would like to speak with a detective.  Believes Sergio is involved. He may have pertinent information.
LE contacted every house with in border except one house…they did not answer (which house)?
1988 red Acura-white hat and hued green vinyl shower curtain taken into evidence. Possible blood stains.
Joseph M flagged LE down at 5810 E. Speedway Blvd (Brake Masters). Reported seeing young female (6-7 years old) running northbound on Columbus…someone was following her.  LE checked it out and found nothing. This was on 5/2.
Noted vehicles:
2003 Blue Toyota Corolla
2000 Maroon 4 door Lexus RX300
1988 Red Acura
2008 2 door extra-cab Chevrolet Silverado pick-up
Blood stain possibly found on driver’s seat Corolla
Beer can, knife, pair of black gloves, search warrant paper work on passenger seat, and towel found in Silverado. Towel was taken in as evidence.  
Handwriting found on wall, door jam, inside wall of closet in southeast bedroom.
Male and female were in yard that morning when LE arrived…said they were Uncle and his wife.  This wouldn’t be Justin M., right?  He isn’t married is he?
Becky asked if LE contacted US/Mexican border.
One of the son’s has __________? This led LE to ask if this could cause him to harm Isa. What does he have?
Both Becky and Sergio say that she left at 0730.
Sex offender on the block and Sergio states he knows him and doesn’t believe that he is responsible.
Sergio states that he went into Isa’s room, kissed her goodnight, and dimmed the lights the night she disappeared.
The boys were still awake when Isa went to bed, playing video games.  Sergio told them to keep the noise down so Isa could sleep.
Sergio states that he fell asleep watching a prerecorded Diamondbacks game in living room and fell asleep.
Sergio states that he woke up about 5am and went to bed-Becky asked if he was just getting to bed.
Ms. H. from E 13th reported a dog going crazy barking at a house on E. Cooper St N of her residence at 2am Friday night/Saturday morning.
Found an unlocked door at an abandoned Circuit City building just W of command post (SE corner of E. Broadway and N. Craycroft) on April 21.
Level 3 sex offender Michael Clay Dimitrov lives at E. 12th St.
P. family E. 12th had possibly pertinent information.
Vacant property S. Essex Lane.
Stephen M. E. 13th St. says something happened to his mailbox and vehicle lens was found by it…LE took this into evidence.
Loretta G. said that pedophile neighbor took Isa to Mexico for sex and that this happened to another little girl in the neighborhood a few years ago.
Anna T. on E. 13th St. Calls came from her residence (very close at least) saying that they know the possible location of Isa. When LE arrived she said that she didn’t make the calls.  The calls came from 911 only phone.  She stated that no one in the home had a 911 only phone.  LE noted that there is a park behind the residence but did not notice any disturbed dirt in that area.
Sergio did not borrow money from 401K and was a model employee. He also does not administer drugs to patients.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2012, 12:01:22 PM by MuffyBee » Logged

"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1931

« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2012, 11:23:00 AM »

My last post is of course from the released documents found at:

Sorry, I forgot to add this link to it.  Is that all of the released says it is 98 pages.  I am sure that I am missing something.

"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 37008

« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2012, 11:54:13 AM »

My last post is of course from the released documents found at:

Sorry, I forgot to add this link to it.  Is that all of the released says it is 98 pages.  I am sure that I am missing something.


Thanks for the overview!! 

Some of Sergio's statements to responding officers appear to conflict with his words in the two afforded interviews.

Anyways ... I plan on reading the entire document on Monday.  Hubby and BIL are going fishing.  I will be alone but not lonely.

Have a good Saturday all.


Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1931

« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2012, 12:15:46 PM »

Searches performed based on information in the released documents:

(Order based on order of paperwork...)

Home and area searches/interviews
Indianhouse Rd to Wilmot and 5th St. to Broadway

Door to Door:
N. Wilshire and Treston Ln
8th St. and Craycroft
6th St. and Leonora Ave

Los Realos landfill

E. 18th St.
E. Eastland St.
19th St.
20th St.
Jefferson Ave. to S. Brighton Lane
1005 S. Craycroft apt. complex

Foot search:
E. Broadway Blvd
Craycroft Rd.
NW and SW quads checked

Foot search:
S. of Broadway
W of Craycroft

Trash cans, tunnels, all places that could be looked at.

Residential area south of 16th.

Walked 17th

SW area of Broadway (Craycroft)

Foot search of business complex on SW quad of Broadway/Craycroft and door to door search of neighborhood to south of this area.

Canvassed apts on Bellevue

Foot canvass of area N of E. Broadway Blvd in neighborhood N of crime scene.

W. of N. Craycroft Rd South side of E. 5th St. from Craycroft to N. Rosemont Blvd and E. 7th St. from N. Craycroft Rd to N. Rosemont Blvd.

Alleyway S. of E. 7th from E. Alberta Dr. to N. Craycroft Rd.

Swept business area along Broadway Blvd E from N Indianhouse Rd. stopping at E. Broadway Blvd.

Neighborhood S of crime scene. Northside of E. 13th St.

E. 5th St to E 9th St
N Sahuara Ave to N Ironhouse Rd

E 12th (Southside of St) to N Van Buren

Southside of E. Cooper St. from S. Van Buren Ave to S. Chantilly Dr.

Wilshire Heights Park

Vacant property at S. Essex Lane


Sears Park around Park Mall

Lakeside Park (dive team too)

Desert area between N. Rosemont and E. Burns

E. Broadway

E. 8th

E. Wendrew

Desert areas of Swan and 22nd

Rim of Reid Park Lane and Lakeside Park Lane

Parking lot and dumpsters of the Sonterra apartments (located on Craycroft, S. of Broadway)

School grounds of Vail Middle School

Neighborhood S. of Vail (yards, brush, trashcans)


"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
Former Moderator
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 44681

« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2012, 01:20:02 PM »

Blood Found in Isabel Celis House; More Info Revealed in Trayvon Martin Shooting
Aired May 25, 2012 - 19:00   ET


JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you from Los Angeles.

Hundreds and hundreds of pages of documents just released in the case of missing 6-year-old Arizona girl, Isabel Celis, and in those documents some real stunners. Reports claiming apparent blood, a child running in the dark, a mysterious debtor, and that`s just for starters. The very latest next.


VELEZ-MITCHELL (voice-over): Tonight, brand-new information in the disappearance of 6-year-old Isabel Celis. We`ve got new reports that cops found blood in Isabel`s house, and that`s just the beginning. Cops released hundreds of pages of records that include some stunners: reported claims of money owed to the family, and mysterious calls to cops.

Were footprints found outside Isabel`s house? Will all of this lead to a break in the case? We`re investigating.

And the Trayvon Martin shooting case just took a 180. Witnesses are reportedly changing their stories. And now we`re learning that accused shooter George Zimmerman felt that he was very friendly with the Sanford, Florida, cops who refuse to arrest him. What`s going on here? Is everything we know about this case changing?

And our new adventure to slim. How this former "Biggest Loser" winner lost 129 pounds. What`s her secret to keeping it off?

BECKY CELIS, MOTHER OF ISABEL: My husband loves those boys, loves my daughter.

(via phone) Hello.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ma`am, are you the mom?

B. CELIS: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. What is your name?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Rebecca Celis. C-E-L-I-S.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Who noticed her gone, your husband?

B. CELIS: My husband. I went to work this morning at 7. She has brown hair.


B. CELIS: No. I didn`t hear anything at all.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police continue to re-interview neighbors. They`re hoping to contact about 120 people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We happen to have in excess of 540-some registered sex offenders.

ALICIA STARDEVANT, NEIGHBOR: My dogs were going crazy. Their dogs were going nuts.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There were some bones found earlier today, possible human remains. It`s still not definitively clear.

SERGIO CELIS, FATHER OF ISABEL: We will do anything for her. We are looking -- we`re looking for you.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight police release massive amounts of evidence in the case of missing 6-year-old Isabel Celis. New information includes one staggering fact: that there may have been blood on the floor of the little girl`s bedroom.

This is an enormous download of information, hundreds of documents spanning the entire investigation that began five long weeks ago. Police only gave out a couple of hard copies of this evidence, so we`ve been working off published reports tonight.

The volume of information absolutely staggering, more than 550 pages - - 550 pages -- of police reports. The docs reveal this investigation has already cost over a million dollars, mobilizing hundreds of officers from various agencies.

Now this comes hot on the heels of the 911 call, which kicked off the frantic search.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You looked everywhere, under the bed, the closets, everything?

B. CELIS (via phone): Yes, I looked everywhere. I even looked -- the window`s out of our house. Somebody took the window out of our house.


B. CELIS: Please hurry, please, and get here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`re almost there, ma`am, OK?


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where is your husband and your kids?

B. CELIS: They`re outside waiting for the cops.


B. CELIS: Oh, my God.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Isabel`s mother clearly hysterical. From all the new evidence, this may be the key item: photos of the middle East bedroom in the Celis home include, quote, "views of apparent blood on the floor," end quote. That is Isabel`s bedroom. The one she was sleeping in when she apparently vanished.

So whose blood was found? When was it left there?

The evidence also states DNA samples were taken from Isabel`s parents and brothers. Their mouths swabbed and blood collected from Isabel`s parents, mom and dad.

Straight out to Claire Doan, a reporter for KGUN on the ground in Tucson, Arizona.

Claire, you`ve been pouring over these documents. What`s the most startling evidence that`s popping out at you tonight?

CLAIRE DOAN, REPORTER, KGUN: You know, you mentioned it, Jane. It is that blood that was found on pictures, apparent blood that they captured at that middle East bedroom.

But also, there wasn`t just blood in the bedroom. There was also what they considered red or brown stains found on items in the car near the Celis home: a white hat, vinyl shower curtain that had stains on them. And that is what police collected as well for evidence.

They found footprints, as well, around the home. Boot prints near the small electrical box also feet away, as well; footprints, as well, that could be consistent. So a lot of evidence found at the home that police have detailed in some of those records that were released today.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I just want to clarify. You said something about blood and a car? Is that what you said?

DOAN: Blood in -- from a white hat, possible blood because it has red, brown or brown stains from a white hat, as well as from a vinyl shower curtain that police did get from inside the car that they took to their compound to analyze for evidence.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Is that the Celis` car?

DOAN: Yes. From what we know of those documents, yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Wow. Wow. Well, you know --

DOAN: Very startling information.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: People are wondering about -- stand by, because we`re going to come back to you. But people have been wondering about Isabel`s father ever since hearing this 911 call. Listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is mom there, also?

S. CELIS (via phone): She just left for work. I just called her, and I told her to get her butt home. (CHUCKLES)


VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. The dad is apparently heard chuckling, if you listen very carefully, as he reports his daughter missing. His tone has raised eyebrows.

And now the just-released reports reveal that a police officer was approached by somebody who claimed to be a friend of Isabel`s father, and that friend told cops, quote, "Something didn`t seem right about what was going on" and alluded that he believed the father was in some way involved.

Now I want to stress that nobody has been named a suspect. Nobody has been eliminated. But nobody has been named.

This person could some kind of busy body, somebody with a grudge, a total crackpot, somebody playing detective who has no evidence, but you`ve got to wonder about this comment.

So I want to go out to David Pike. We have an exclusive interview with Isabel`s neighbor, David Pike.

David, I understand that your boys played with Isabel`s brothers. Is that true, sir?

DAVID PIKE, NEIGHBOR (via phone): Yes, ma`am. We...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So -- go ahead.

PIKE: Yes, they -- early on a couple years ago they -- after they had moved in, they -- their younger boys and Serge Jr. were into BMX bicycles. So they came over and visited with my boys who were also into BMXs. And my older son, who`s now 18, talked to them about bicycles and went down to their house and visited with Serge Sr. and -- because he also rides bicycles.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Speaking of Serge Sr., what do you make of him? There`s a lot of -- obviously the police focus on who`s there first. They focus on the family first. What would you like to say about the father of missing Isabel Celis?

PIKE: In passing and seeing him walking back and forth to his mother and father`s house, which would be Grandma and Grandpa, who we`ve known for 16 years. And everything seemed -- and apparently, you know, the kids seemed like they were doing well prior to this incident taking place. Seeing them walking up and down the street with Isabel to Grandma and Grandpa`s house, riding on dad`s shoulders, typical, you know...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So, David, did he seem like a good dad? Did he seem in any way, shape or form creepy or just like a good dad who was nothing to see here?

PIKE: No, not to us. We`re about five -- we`re five houses down from them on the same side of the street, and we`ve been here for 16 years. And they moved in about four years ago.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me jump in and ask you. I just want to get a sense, because I`m not sure what you`re saying. Would you trust your kids with Isabel`s dad?

PIKE: I have trusted them down there.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So how would you like to characterize him? What would you say if you were asked about him?

PIKE: He seemed like a nice person to me. Whenever I stopped by and visited him going in and out of the neighborhood, when he was out there with the boys or doing, you know, things in his garage, working on bicycles or whatever it was he was doing. I didn`t see a whole lot of Mom, because she worked all the time.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, that`s interesting, and I think it`s really important to get a balanced perspective on this. The Celis family started out quiet, but they`ve since opened up and they`ve talked to the media a lot.

Isabel`s mom has defended her husband after he was told to have no contact with his two young sons. Listen to this.


B. CELIS: My husband is a great father. The kids -- my husband loves those boys, loves my daughter, is a great husband, a great -- a great father to the boys and to Isabel. And you know, at the end of -- at the end of the day when Isabel comes home, everybody`s answers -- or everybody`s questions will be answered.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: But here`s another disturbing new piece of evidence. ABC News is reporting that one person interviewed during the investigation said that, quote, "a guy who was staying with the family owed someone a lot of money, and that`s why she was taken."

Extraordinary. Tanya Acker, attorney, your reaction.

TANYA ACKER, ATTORNEY: I think that one of the things that`s so striking about this case is that there`s all of this loose evidence, and this is particularly important. Who is this guy? Who is the person who gave the police information about his alleged debt that he owed? Who did he owe the money to? There are so many questions here.

We`re still early in the action. But, you know, the further -- the longer that we go on with this, the harder it becomes to get really firm answers. I think that it`s important that investigators pin this down as quickly as possible.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Is there a mystery person who owed the Celis family money? And, if so, why are we just hearing about it now? More on the other side.



B. CELIS (via phone): I went to work this morning at 7, and I just -- and I didn`t even come and check on her. I should have come and checked on her.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. All right. Take a deep breath, OK. I know it`s hard.

B. CELIS: Oh, no, I can`t even...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does she have a medical condition?

B. CELIS: No, she has nothing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m sorry, she has what?

B. CELIS: She has nothing. No medical condition. She`s healthy. No allergies, no medical conditions. She has brown hair.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Didn`t hear anything at all?

B. CELIS: No, I didn`t hear anything at all.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Five hundred and fifty pages of new documents released in the disappearance of Isabel Celis. The headline: blood, apparent blood, found on the floor of her bedroom.

Forensic psychologist Brian Russell, isn`t, though, there an innocent explanation, given that young Isabel lived in the house?

BRIAN RUSSELL, FORENSIC PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, you`re right, Jane. You could find blood in many homes in small quantities, in predictable places like the sink where people shave, for example. And so it`s all about the quantity and the location.

And I think the bigger bombshell tonight is the assertion that there may be a new player involved in this case that we`re just now hearing about.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, this apparent man who somebody mentions in these reports that allegedly, purportedly owes the Celis family money and may have been staying with him. And why are we just hearing about that now?

Now, some of the evidence lines up very carefully with the 911 calls. Listen to Isabel`s father and how he called in the disappearance of his daughter.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tucson Police Department.

S. CELIS (via phone): Hello, I need to report a missing child. I believe she was abducted from my house.


S. CELIS: Six years old.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, is it your daughter or...?

S. CELIS: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why do you think she was abducted?

S. CELIS: I have no idea. We woke up this morning, and I went to get her up for her baseball game and she`s gone.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Claire Doan, KGUN reporter, "The Arizona Daily Star" now reporting that, in one of these reports, a man says he flagged down a police officer and told the cop he had seen a little girl who appeared to be 6 or 7 years old, running down North Columbus Boulevard late at night. How close is this boulevard to where the Celis family is, and is this a credible report?

DOAN: You know, it is relatively close. It takes minutes to get from the house to Columbus Boulevard.

But police at this point are telling us they are checking every lead, no matter how ridiculous it is. No matter what, they are following up on it.

But what was really interesting in the reports, Jane, is that there was a man who also flagged police down and said that he actually knew the father, Sergio Celis, really well. Alluded to the fact that there was something going on, there was something strange there going on with the father. And he believed the father had some kind of involvement in his daughter`s disappearance. And he wanted to talk to detectives further about the information he had. And that was very interesting in some of the documents that we received today.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, and the other big headline -- David Pike, you are Isabel`s neighbor. Your boys played with Isabel`s brothers. This report that there was some guy staying reportedly, allegedly, with the Celis family, who owed them a lot of money. Have you ever heard anything about this claim before just now -- David.

PIKE: No, Jane. We knew that I believe Becky`s brother was staying with the family for a while, a year or so ago, and the boys had alluded that it was their uncle or cousin. And he was...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well -- go ahead.

PIKE: Yes, he was staying with them, but I think it was, like, maybe six or eight months. I`m not sure how long he stayed with them, but, yes, he was living there.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tanya Acker, attorney, you`re here on set with me in L.A. You`ve covered so many of these cases. Should the police have let us know about this mystery figure beforehand?

TANYA ACKER, ATTORNEY: I think that the police should at the very least, before they let us know, they should have taken his statement. They should have found out who he was.

I mean, you know, it`s one thing simply to have these reports, to have these allegations, to have these third-party witness statements. But, you know, if there is a person who was in that house, the police, hopefully by this time, know who he is, have taken his statement, even if they`re not releasing that evidence to the public.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, but when you hear these parents pleading for information, either the police are telling them don`t reveal that somebody was staying there allegedly, purportedly. Don`t reveal that somebody owed you money, or they`re holding it back intentionally. Or it just didn`t happen, and it`s a false report.

Either way it`s a confusing case. Police are working around the clock to find this precious child. We certainly hope they do.

  " Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."  - Daniel Moynihan
Former Moderator
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 44681

« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2012, 01:33:43 PM »
Apparent Blood Found in Missing Isabel`s Bedroom
Aired May 25, 2012 - 20:00   ET

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live, Tucson. A parent`s worst nightmare, Mommy and Daddy tuck 6-year-old Isabel into bed. 8:00 AM, she`s gone. She usually sleeps with her two brothers, but not that night. After a third search at the home and a landfill, police seizing fabric and pillows from the family car.

Then a stunning reveal from Tucson police that the parents have, quote, "no sense of urgency." Mommy and Daddy take polygraphs but won`t they passed. A secret home security camera trained on the path to Isabel`s window not working that night.

In a major twist, Isabel`s father banned from any contact with the two remaining young sons, Isabel`s brothers, Mommy and Daddy now living separately. We obtain 911 calls showing a stunning contrast between Mommy and Daddy, both on the 911. Daddy is calm, cool, even chuckling, this just moments after he discovers his 6-year-old girl is gone. Mommy, on the other hand, hysterical. We learned child services in the home just before Isabel disappears. And has Daddy lawyered up?

Bombshell tonight. A blood-like substance found in Isabel`s bedroom. Repeat, a blood-like substance found on the floor of the 6-year-old`s room. Similar stains, we learn tonight, also found on a white shower curtain stuffed inside that family car, luminol testing done throughout. And tonight, another clue. A man`s Wolverine brand boot prints discovered behind the home. Tonight, is there finally a crack in the case of missing 6-year-old Isabel?


SERGIO CELIS, ISABEL`S FATHER: Just please, please, to the person or persons who have Isabel...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just hearing about this for the first time...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) blood on the floor...

SERGIO CELIS: Tell us your demands.

BECKY CELIS, ISABEL`S MOTHER -- my husband. I went to work this morning at 7:00, and I just I didn`t even come and check on her (INAUDIBLE)

SERGIO CELIS: Tell us what you want.

Hello. I need to report a missing child. I believe she was abducted from my house.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This new theory that somebody staying at the house may have owed somebody money and that the little girl was taken as a ransom.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Reported footprints on a utility box behind the home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you tell us how much money might be available if ransom ever happened to be paid, just hypothetically?

BECKY CELIS: Out of us?


BECKY CELIS: Nothing. Nothing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nowhere in the documents, however, is there mention of a ransom or any notes found inside.

BECKY CELIS: (INAUDIBLE) can`t see anything else. And the door`s locked to outside (INAUDIBLE) come (INAUDIBLE) fence, or I don`t know what they did, but oh, my God!

If you know how we`re supposed to be acting, please let us know.


GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. A blood-like substance found in Isabel`s bedroom. Repeat, found on the floor of the 6-year-old`s bedroom. We are just learning that tonight. Similar stains also found on a white shower curtain stuffed inside the family car. Luminol testing done throughout.

And tonight, another clue. A man`s Wolverine brand boot print discovered behind the home. Is there a crack in the case? Where is 6- year-old Isabel?

We are taking your calls. Straight out to ABC News correspondent Neal Karlinsky. Neal, thank you for being with us. What can you tell us about -- first of all, I`m not crazy about the boot print. That could be anybody, anytime. I`m concerned about the blood-like substance found in her bedroom and what was on that white shower curtain and why was the shower curtain in the car?

NEAL KARLINSKY, ABC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, a lot of good questions. I mean, we have 550 pages of police documents that are released, with all kinds of information, some of it relevant, some of it likely not.

But of course, the standouts do include what is described in the documents as photographs of a blood-like stain in a middle bedroom on the east side of the house. We know from witnesses, also from blueprints that we`ve obtained of the house, that that was Isabel Celis`s bedroom, the one with where there is the blood-like substance.

Now, what we don`t know is what the lab analysis told police, if, in fact, it`s come back yet, about what exactly that was. We do know they took DNA from all of the relatives. They took a toothbrush and a hairbrush from Isabel to make a comparison.

Is there a match? That is something that is not revealed.

GRACE: We also learned that there was, in fact, Neal Karlinsky, writing in her bedroom closet. We learned that, too.

KARLINSKY: Police scoured this house inch by inch. The writing on the bedroom closet, we have no reference point of that. Is that something a little girl writes on her wall or something more? There`s no indications of a ransom note...

GRACE: Neal...

KARLINSKY: ... or of anything like that.

GRACE: Neal?


GRACE: Did your parents let you write on the wall?

KARLINSKY: I can`t speak for how other people raise their children.

GRACE: So that would be a no!

KARLINSKY: I`m the father of a 6-year-old. She does some things I don`t like her to do, also.

GRACE: Well, long story short, we learned that some type of message had been scrawled on the inside of the wall of Isabel`s closet. We are also learning a blood-like substance found on the floor of her room. And based on everything we know, based on the exterior of the home and the blueprint that we obtained, that is her bedroom.

What can you tell me -- Neal Karlinsky joining us tonight, everyone, ABC News correspondent -- regarding a white shower curtain in that family car, the red car that was parked in the driveway, the car that wouldn`t crank up, that nobody would use? That was parked in the driveway. We have video -- pull it, Liz -- of police removing fabric and pillows from the car.

Tonight, we learn that fabric is a white shower curtain with similar stains on it, blood-like stains on it.

KARLINSKY: Yes. This is very curious. I was there right after the disappearance for more than a week, and we watched police just tearing apart that red car, just going through it methodically day after day. Now we know from these documents they did, in fact, find what they describe as a white hat and also a shower curtain inside with a brown or reddish-brown substance on it.

Of course, that leads you to be curious as to whether that`s blood. They say that it wasn`t field-tested. Again, we don`t know what the lab results were on that. But as you mentioned, we have been told by police sources that red car never left the house. It was actually parked off to the side of the driveway, sort of adjacent, and we`re told it didn`t run.

GRACE: Well, I want to go to Dr. Bill Lloyd, board-certified surgeon and pathologist. Dr. Lloyd, thank you for being with us. We know that white shower curtain was stuffed into the car, OK? All this occurred -- Isabel`s disappearance occurred between 11:00 PM that night and 8:00 AM, when her father discovers she`s gone. To our knowledge, no one left the home during the night.

If the shower curtain was removed from the home that night, where else would there be to stuff it, the trash or a car that doesn`t work, that nobody will think to look in? The mom wouldn`t look in it. The dad wouldn`t look in it. So if you have this shower curtain it can be stuffed in the car and no one would think to look there for a period of time because the car didn`t work. So why was the shower curtain stuffed in the car?

But my question to you, Dr. Lloyd, is this. Police chose at that moment not to field-test the shower curtain. But there`s a reason for that. Their reasoning, Dr. Lloyd -- and I want your thoughts on this -- is that they wanted that shower curtain in as much -- as close to the condition they found it as when the lab got it. They didn`t want to touch it. They didn`t want to handle it. They didn`t want to destroy any evidence. They saw it, they seized it, they sent it to the crime lab.

Was that a mistake, or would you agree with their decision, Dr. Lloyd?

DR. BILL LLOYD, SURGEON AND PATHOLOGIST: No, that`s standard protocol, Nancy. They want a very contained environment when they unravel and open up that shower curtain. It`ll be just as important to retrieve fingerprints as it will be to test whatever substance is on the shower curtain.

That takes time. It takes a controlled environment. They don`t want anybody else`s fingerprints on that shower curtain, as well. Once the fingerprints are captured, then they can go about testing the stain, take small samples and reconstitute that to identify, is this blood, and then test for blood antigens to identify whose blood it is.

And remember, Nancy, I bet you that car was locked. Whoever put that shower curtain in the car had to have a key.

GRACE: You know what, Dr. Lloyd? I just wrote the question, Who had access to the car? Because that car was always parked. I confirmed that with the next-door neighbor. And she told me that car had never been moved in all the time she had lived there. To my understanding, it didn`t work or it didn`t crank. I`m sure it was locked. The reality is...


GRACE: ... had a key.

LLOYD: ... the shower curtain. Testing for blood rescue, you need a dark environment. Nancy, you can only do it once. You can only test for luminol once, then the reaction is over. So you have to be ready to view it in the dark and to have your photographic apparatus all set up. Again, a controlled environment is the best way to capture solid evidence.

GRACE: Apparently, Dr. Lloyd, when they saw it, they recognized a similar stain on the shower curtain and what they saw on the floor in Isabel`s bedroom. And we`ve been told that was a blood-like substance on the floor of her bedroom. They could, I think, have taken a scratch of it for a field test, but why bother? I agree.

And if you see that video again, Liz, please, they all have on their latex gloves. They`re not leaving fingerprints. God help (ph) them. So they wouldn`t have been contaminated in that way.

Everybody, we are taking your calls. To Alexis Tereszcuk, senior reporter, What more do we know, Alexis?

ALEXIS TERESZCUK, RADARONLINE.COM: You know, Nancy, there was even more potential blood evidence found in another car. They found a small spot of blood on the front seat of the car. This is another -- so that`s three examples of potential blood that they found in Isabel`s residence.

GRACE: You know what? I`ve got a problem with that car, Ellie Jostad, because I don`t understand -- there`s two cars in play here...


GRACE: ... the car that -- the red, I think, is an Acura Integra...

JOSTAD: Right.

GRACE: ... old model, right there parked in front of -- beside the home. It`s always there. I think it doesn`t crank. That`s where they got a shower curtain, a hat, which many people believe to be a shower cap. I`m going to go back to Karlinsky on that in just a moment.

But then there`s another car, Ellie, that they say they did luminol tests on.

JOSTAD: Right.

GRACE: What is that? Where does that car fit into the scenario?

JOSTAD: Right. Well, that`s the other car that`s involved here. It is a Toyota Corolla. Apparently, they did a luminol test and there was a stain in there that had a positive reaction to the luminol when it was examined under an ultraviolet light. We don`t know, though, whose car that is or where the car was in it relation to the house.

GRACE: Neal Karlinsky, ABC News correspondent, is joining us right now from the field. Neal, what do we know about this second car in which they did a luminol test with a positive result?

KARLINSKY: So there`s two cars. There`s the red car you`re talking about. That just sits on the side of the house.

GRACE: Right.

KARLINSKY: It does not go anywhere. There is the car in the garage. We`re told that`s a Toyota Corolla the family apparently drives. And the luminol test, the positive result for blood was on the driver`s seat -- the driver`s seat. I think that`s critical.

I want to make one other point, Nancy, about the blood found in Isabel`s bedroom, or what appears to be blood. If you remember back early on in this case, police were wrapping up their search of the house. They were going to give it back to the family.

Then they came out and told reporters that some of the new dogs that were brought out by the FBI lab in Quantico hit on something in her bedroom, and that led them to search her house further for another 24 hours. It looks like possibly that could be the stain they`re now talking about in these documents.

GRACE: At this hour, the search is on for 6-year-old Isabel. And tonight, blockbuster evidence that we have just obtained, including blood evidence, possible blood evidence, and also boot print evidence. Police have narrowed it down to what they believe, Wolverine brand boot prints behind the back yard.

Let`s see a mock-up of the Wolverine boot print, please, or the Wolverine boot. OK, and also, take a look at those shoes being worn by dad, Sergio Celis. What does that look like to you, Jason Oshins?

JASON OSHINS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Looks like a Wolverine boot print right there. So you know, as you`re looking at that, you certainly give pause. You`ve got a lot of evidence working here against Mr. Celis for the moment, and it seems to be mounting. But the point we must remain (SIC) is that police have got to be fair. They`ve invested a lot of money on this.

GRACE: Another issue is a lot of boots can look like a Wolverine. You have to make a test inside of a lab to match up any boot print. We don`t know whose boot print that was, and even if it was Sergio Celis`s boot print, he has a right to be in his back yard, people.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Isabel Celis disappearing from her family`s Tucson home.

911 OPERATOR: 911. What`s your emergency?

SERGIO CELIS: I want to report a missing person, my little girl who is 6 years old. I believe she was abducted from our house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A witness telling them that a guy who was staying with the family owed someone a lot of money, and that`s why she was taken.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anybody who would hold a grudge against you for any reason?


BECKY CELIS: No, that`s the whole problem is that we don`t understand why or how we made Isabel a target.

SERGIO CELIS: To the person or persons who have Isabel, tell us your demands. Tell us what you want.


GRACE: And tonight, we learn from volumes of police documents that a neighbor said they think this was some kind of retribution for money owed by a relative living in the home.

Now, we know of a cousin living in the home. Ellie, was it a cousin or the brother of Sergio Celis?

JOSTAD: It was a cousin. And I believe it is actually on Becky Celis`s side of the family.

GRACE: OK. Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, death penalty- qualified prosecutor, Karen Conti, defense attorney, Chicago, Jason Oshins, defense attorney, New York.

Eleanor, all this business about it was for a debt or a drug debt -- BS. That only happens in the movies. And number two, if it was, where`s the ransom? Where`s the ransom request?

ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Exactly, Nancy. That`s just sort of a bogus theory that`s going out there. People take children -- and I hate to say it, but they only take them for one reason, Nancy, to sexually abuse them because why else are you going to take a small child? There`s no note. There`s no nothing. And this is what is so frightening about these cases. It`s abuse, and often murder.

GRACE: Jason Oshins?

OSHINS: Eleanor is right on target. I mean, there`s no other -- ransoms are from the movies. I mean, that`s the only place that they sit well. They -- it doesn`t occur in modern times. It`s for sexual purposes, and that`s the unfortunateness of this abduction.

GRACE: Karen Conti?

KAREN CONTI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It looks to me like they`re just trying to divert attention -- We didn`t do anything, it`s the guy who`s owed money. So I agree with the other lawyers.

GRACE: To you, Caryn Stark. The reality is that when you think back on all the cases you`ve covered and analyzed, how often do you really see anyone kidnapped for money, a legitimate ransom case, or payback? I mean, this is not a Colombian drug lord case, OK? He worked as a dental assistant.

CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: That`s the whole point, Nancy. It would make a lot more sense if this was a very wealthy family. So no, we see kidnappings so that people can take the child and abuse the child, sometimes turn them into a slave, as we`ve seen in some cases, but not for money. It doesn`t make any sense at all.



911 OPERATOR: Any marks, scars?

BECKY CELIS: Other than the window out, I can`t see anything else. And the door`s locked to outside, so they had to have jumped over the fence.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can see that it would quite simple for someone to get over this wall directly to Isabel`s bedroom window.


GRACE: Straight out to Neal Karlinsky, ABC News correspondent. Neal, what can you tell me about these footprints police say are Wolverine brand boot prints?

KARLINSKY: Apparently, they were on a utility box behind the house. Now, as you know, there`s a wall that goes all the way around the house, and depending on where in the house you are, the wall is actually higher or lower because the ground is at different heights.

You know, it`s a working-class neighborhood. That boot, as you said, it could belong to anyone. I`m sure police are analyzing that. But that back side of the house where they found the boot prints is also an alleyway. That`s where all the garbage was, and there was a lot of traffic going through there.

GRACE: Hey, take a look at your monitor if you can, Neal. We`ve got Greg Overzat, our producer, just stood up on the very box they`re talking about.

Neal, were any of these boot prints found in between the house and the wall? Because right now, I`m understanding boot prints on that box, which looks over the fence -- it`s on the other side of the wall away from the home.

KARLINSKY: Well, I can`t see the monitor that you have, but they did find other prints. And dogs certainly tracked to a house on the other side. But you know, police were scouring every house in this neighborhood. I mean, you had a high-level sex offender five doors down to the right as you walk out of the Celis door, 17 within a three-square-mile area.

We watched police interview and reinterview and go through homes all throughout there. In some of these documents, they talk about finding substances in the homes that they want to test and see if they`re blood or not. But it`s all incredibly random, and without the lab analysis, we don`t know what they found.

GRACE: To Jean Casarez, legal correspondent "In Session," joining us from the field. Jean, what do you know?

JEAN CASAREZ, "IN SESSION": Well, you know what`s interesting is that Sergio Celis, who we thought was the last one to have seen his daughter, said to investigators that he fell asleep on the couch, went to his bedroom at 5:00 AM in the morning and did not check on Isabel.

GRACE: Repeat, Jean.

CASAREZ: That he fell asleep on the sofa watching, we believe, the Diamondbacks baseball game rerun, woke up at 5:00 AM, went to his bedroom, did not check on his daughter. So when was the last time Isabel was even seen by a family member, 10:30 at night?

GRACE: You know what? You`re right, Jean. And Jean, what is your understanding as to where these Wolverine brand boot prints are found?

CASAREZ: On the utility meter box. And a meter box, we saw, is outside the property, and then there are some footprints about five feet away. And a meter box could be used to get up and over, so that is true.


CASAREZ: Here`s what I`m so concerned about...

GRACE: ... on the other side of the wall, Jean?

CASAREZ: And that`s a question and I think that`s an important question. Were those boot prints on the other side of the wall? Were they found there?



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tell us your demands. Tell us what you want.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: New evidence police have revealed from inside her own home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The room with the apparent blood, according to a blueprint of the house, is the missing 6-year-old.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is mom there, also?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She just left for work. I just called her and told her to get her butt home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is Sergio. That is him because his 10-year- old son is right there when he`s making the call.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From early on, very early on, there`s been talk of ransom.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If there were demands, please let us know something. Let us know something. Why is this happening? What is the reasoning behind it?


GRACE: And there you hear the only reference about demands made by Sergio Celis, the father.

Out to Neal Karlinsky, ABC news correspondent.

Is that where all of this is coming from, this line of investigation regarding a ransom demand because Sergio Celis and the public statement he made refers to what are your demands?

NEAL KARLINSKY, ABC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: It`s unclear. It`s interesting. I was standing right in front of him when he said that and a lot of people were finding that curious. It`s something you hear more about in television shows, in the movies, and we were wondering where that came from.

In the police reports we know that the report of someone in the house owing money, and that`s what this is all about, according to the report. That comes from a witness, not a family member, in a statement to police. We don`t know the veracity of it.

GRACE: What can you tell us, Neal Karlinsky, about the dogs that searched the various homes?

KARLINSKY: This is interesting because we spoke, when I was there, to the next door neighbor who lives in a bedroom that is immediately a few feet across from Isabel Celis` bedroom. She told us, she tells police in the reports we now have that at 6:30 a.m., she was woken up by dogs barking loud, going crazy, she said, and we know that`s her dog and also dogs in the Celis home. More than one they had that barked routinely.

She also heard men`s voices. There are other reports of dogs barking.

Sergio, however, talks about waking up on the couch at 5:00 a.m., walking back to bed, not waking up until after 7:00, and he says he didn`t hear a thing. He didn`t hear any dogs.

GRACE: You know what, we spoke to her and she confirms what you`re saying, and your point is?

KARLINSKY: Well, why would he have not heard dogs? It seems to be an odd mismatch there between someone who is right next door and other neighbors and someone who was inside the house and who even concedes to police that his dogs bark at the drop of a hat.

GRACE: You`re right, Neal. With me ABC news correspondent Neal Karlinsky.

Out to lines.

Susan in Missouri. Hi, Susan. What`s your question?

SUSAN, CALLER, MISSOURI: I was just wondering if they ever said what was written inside of the encloses.

GRACE: No, they have not, Susan. We are still trying to find out.

Out to Wendy in, Ohio. Hi, Wendy. What`s your question?

WENDY, CALLER, OHIO: Hi. My question, if the blood was found inside the house, it`s surprising nobody would hear like, you know, a child being hurt, you know. So like, you know, I`m just wondering if the family or someone was in the house, you know, that night.

GRACE: Good question. I want to go to Bill Lloyd on that. But I want to quickly follow up on the blood. The blood like evidence found in the home, with renowned professor of forensic science out of the university of new haven, with us tonight, Dr. Henry Lee.

Henry, thank you so much for being with us.


GRACE: Dr. Lee, what do you make of the police decision not to field test the blood like substance found on the shower curtain stuffed in the family car?

LEE: OK. It`s pretty simple, Nancy. Basically here must be a small amount of blood, minutia amount of blood. Usually make the decision if we do the field it test, you are going to exhaust it, use up all the sample that will prohibit the future to do DNA. More likely to collect the whole item a modest sample must be very small. It took them almost a month to find out that`s blood.

Now, the next thing is this human blood? If it`s human blood, we`ll have to do some DNA. It`s her blood or somebody else. Also, we have to look at the blood, is this whole blood? It (INAUDIBLE) means, it may be washed. And, of course, we`ll look at the pattern. Is that an impact spatter pattern or a blood dripping or a transfer pattern?

So, very important thing they have to do. Of course given that`s her blood, this is occasional contact, transfer on the surface quite a while ago or very recent. Just like you measure the shoeprint that`s not really a footprint. That`s a shoeprint and the shoeprint, no, that`s two dimensional, three dimensional. It`s the indentation on the flat print. Of course we can look at the size and look at the width and determine more likely the individual`s height and the weight and, of course, trace the brand name of this shoeprint, determine what type of boots. Because so many different work boots, now we have a database of the work boot that`s easy to track down.

GRACE: To Dr. Bill Lloyd, I want to go back to Wendy in Ohio`s question, Dr. Lloyd.

She asked if there had been a death or injury resulting in blood being spilled on to the floor of Isabel`s room, why wouldn`t anyone else hear it, Dr. Lloyd?

DOCTOR BILL LLOYD, M.D., BOARD CERTIFIED SURGEON, PATHOLOGIST (via telephone): Well, that`s the great mystery, Nancy. There are stories about dogs barking like crazy in the middle of the night. Dad is sleeping on a sofa just a few feet away from her. There are so many of these puzzle pieces that don`t fit together.

GRACE: But wouldn`t you agree there are ways for blood to be spent without noise?

LLOYD: Well, certainly. If you have someone silenced with a hand over the mouth, et cetera, and you`re injuring them enough to draw blood, you know, it`s possible if they were unconscious or drugged it would also be possible as well.

It would also be possible to date how long that blood has been there. Was it blood from perhaps a previous abuse event, or was it the current event that we`re talking about that led to the disappearance of this poor girl?

GRACE: To Marc Klaas, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation.

Marc, what do all of these developments mean to you?

MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT, FOUNDER, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, there`s a couple of things. First of all, the police might very well have told Sergio and Becky to be aware of the fact that somebody might call in with some kind of ransom demand. They certainly did that in our case.

Secondly, I said this many times, Polly`s mother slept through the entire kidnapping incident and she was mere feet away from Polly`s bedroom at the time. So I think these are things that need to be -- there`s something I have to say here, Nancy.

Today is national missing children`s date. And it`s national missing children`s date for a specific reason. President Ronald Reagan felt that child safety should be a national priority and that was based upon the kidnapping of Etan Patz which happened exactly 33 years ago today.

And I`ve heard more than once through this investigation, even today, somebody bringing up the cost of this investigation, that the police have spent so much money looking for this little girl. I never hear that in any other crime, the reference to the kind of money that`s being spent. And I`m absolutely insulted that anybody, whether it`s a cop or a reporter or anybody else would start making this connection between the amount of money that`s been spent on this investigation and the fact this little girl is not missing.

Their job, the police`s job, is to find and secure and keep us safe. It`s not to be bookkeeping. And I think anybody who is following the dollars and cents in this case has their priorities very mixed up.

GRACE: You know what, Marc Klaas, I heard the same thing and my response was equal to yours. The reality is I`m paying half my money to taxes. I`m happy that it`s being spent to try to find Isabel as opposed to paying some fat cat laid up kicked back on Capitol Hill spending my money. All right?

So they`re going to take our money whether we like it or not. And don`t get me wrong, IRS, I`m OK with it. But, what I`m saying is, good, spend it to find Isabel Celis. That`s how I feel about it, Marc. And I`m pretty sure you agree with me.

I want to go back to Jean Casarez, legal correspondent "In Session" joining us from the field right now.

So many developments. What do we know about Luminol tests in a red Toyota? We`ve now learned there is the car parked in the driveway, which is the a Acura Integra, and then the other car where Luminol results were positive, parked in the garage.

JEAN CASAREZ, LEGAL CORRESPONDENT, IN SESSION: You know, there`s so much, Nancy, we learned from the beginning that now we can put together with some of the information from the reports. The red car that had the smashed in windshield that it doesn`t move, it tested positive with Luminol in the driver`s seat area. And we also know that pillows and a blanket were taken out of that vehicle.

Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, Karen Conti, Jason Oshins.

To Eleanor Odom, what now?

ELEANOR ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, what they`re looking at now are the people closest to Isabel. That`s nothing to get upset about. That is normal in these cases just like a ransom note is kind of TV stuff, so is a stranger coming in and abducting. I mean, the odds are against that. It happens. Don`t get me wrong as we`ve seen with Polly Klaas and others. But that`s why they look at the inner circle first and that`s what they`re focusing on.

GRACE: Jason?

JASON OSHINS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t disagree with Eleanor by the same token, we`re not going to just expediently go move against the father.

GRACE: You already said that Oshins.

OSHINS: It sort of looks like that from --

GRACE: We`re talking about the truth.

OSHINS: I understand that. And we`re determined --

GRACE: Your theories what may or may not come into evidence. We`re not in a courtroom. You`re sitting in a TV studio.

OSHINS: I understand.

GRACE: And we can talk about the facts. There`s nobody here to suppress the evidence, Jason Oshins, so don`t start.

OSHINS: We`re not suppressing anything, we`re trying to be as broad as we can be and not narrow our focus to just the father.

GRACE: Conti?

KAREN CONTI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I think we need to look at what the department of family service is doing, keeping the father away from those boys. Why are they doing that, Nancy? And I think they`re doing that because the father might be trying to poison those boys into not talking and telling the truth.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still no sign of Isabel --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 911, what`s your emergency?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to report a missing person, my little girl. I believe she was abducted --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I got woken up by my dogs. They were barking their heads off. Their dogs were just going crazy, too.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Protective services banned Sergio from having contact with his children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are cooperating to the fullest extent. We will not stop looking for you.


GRACE: We are live and taking your calls.

Out to Lori in West Virginia. Hi, Lori. What`s your question?

LORI, CALLER, WEST VIRGINIA: Did the parents ever say anything about the polygraph test?

GRACE: Oh, Lori of West Virginia, you know, you really crack me up on that one.

No, they did not, and they have been asked point blank. Pull the sound, Liz.

You know, to Susan Constantine, body language expert, you have observed them over and over and over and analyzed them for us. Have you noticed how the mom a lot of times when they`re asked a question they`re always sitting together, she typically will have her arm over his arm --


GRACE: A lot of times when they ask a question, she looks up at him as if -- you take it or she`s looking to him for guidance. I`m an amateur. What does that really mean?

CONSTANTINE: Well, she`s looking, you know, to see his response. And the other thing is, you`re right, that his hand is underneath hers. She is actually more in a dominant role, but when you see when he`s getting ready to sit down, he sits down very slowly. He moves -- his movements are very slow and kind of sheepish. So what I`m looking at here is when she`s looking --

GRACE: Go ahead.

CONSTANTINE: OK, when she is looking at her husband or he`s looking at his wife, he`s actually looking at her response to see how he`s going to respond.

GRACE: To Marc Harold, former APD, author of "observations of white noise." What do you think about the developments, Marc?

MARC HAROLD, FORMER OFFICER, ATLANTA PD, ATTORNEY: Well, I don`t think the boot prints much of anything. It doesn`t tell us a whole lot. I think the idea that this is about ransom, I agree. I think you have to look just like everyone has said even if you don`t like to say it, you have to look at the people in the house, the people closest to the victim, and go from there. I think at this point they`re trying to use the physical evidence to ex clues people and then try to focus in on someone. But, I don`t think they have anyone they are really focusing in on yet. They are waiting for the lab results.

GRACE: You know, back to you, with us renowned professor of forensic science, Dr. Henry Lee.

Dr. Henry Lee, I hate to bring up bad memories of that double murder that you helped get acquitted, Orenthal James Simpson, but, let`s talk about footprints again. The Bruno Mali footprints.

LEE: Right.

GRACE: Go ahead, sir.

LEE: Nancy, you remember two type of shoeprints, one is Bruno Mali, the second one, the Bruno Mali is 14, size 14, and the second type of bloody shoeprint which is parallel size 10 which clearly tells us could be two individuals.

GRACE: And I think I know who one of them is. How are we going to get footprints in this case?

LEE: This case we should look at that shoeprint near -- near -- the wall, whether or not we can find similar shoeprint inside the house or next neighbor`s or any so-called linkage theory you can link together. Then, of course, the luminol which you just mentioned is on the front seat. We don`t know it`s in the back of the seat, how big it is, yet still have enough DNA to link that.

GRACE: Luminol shows a host of substances. It doesn`t have to be blood, does it?

LEE: Definite. Definite. You are smart. But, however, in a car seat, unless somebody used detergent or peroxide to clean up the car. So that by itself is becoming important. So a lot of physical evidence we have to look at.

The last time we talk about it or when you were asked the question as trace evidence could be the key of this case. Any hairs. Nip dust particle or pollen particle can give us clue.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, Karen Conti, Jason Oshins and also, Caryn Stark.

Let`s go crazy.

OK, Eleanor Odom, have you ever tried a footprint case? Because, you know, I know it`s been done, but that print could have been left by anybody.

ODOM: Well, believe it or not, Nancy, I have tried one that had a footprint in it. But, what we also had was other evidence.


ODOM: That`s one piece of the puzzle. And that makes it great.

GRACE: Oshins?

OSHINS: Only to disprove. Prosecutor produced it. We were able to segment it out. It had nothing to do with it.

GRACE: You were able to segment it out? Did you get an acquittal?

OSHINS: We did.

GRACE: What`s the name of the case?

OSHINS: I don`t want to discuss it in public.

GRACE: Yes. you can`t remember because it didn`t happen.

OSHINS: It`s too old, Nancy, like me.

GRACE: Karen Conti?

CONTI: I`m not finding that jury is always buy that footprint evidence. You know, one way or the other because it can be manipulated. So, again, I believe there has to be other evidence with it.

GRACE: Yes. I think you`re right. And Caryn Stark, that can be behavioral evidence.

CARYN STARK, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: When we look at this father in particular, Nancy, he`s not allowed to visit his sons. There`s a past history. He doesn`t make sense even when he`s asking for, what are your demands? There are things that are confusing to me about him.

GRACE: Well, another thing is, you know, if they passed the polygraph, then put it out there. How`s that going to hurt the investigation? Back to Wendy`s question. And if you failed it, then there`s a problem. So those are the two choices in that answer.

STARK: And if they passed they would have it out there.

GRACE: You`re right, Caryn Stark.


  " Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."  - Daniel Moynihan
Monkey All Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 11030

Brandi's Avatars

« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2012, 02:15:02 PM »

Could a monkey help me look-up a business license, please, for a Robert/Rob Snyder? TIA

Curious, if he is the father (or not) to RC. 

I have nothing conclusive.

I just am not clever at digging, just lucky, sometimes.

Robert Snyder,
or ROB Snyder?

"Lost Resorts"

Challam Bay, Washington (a link with to many choices)

Wynton Marsalis~
"Let us Give, Forgive, and Be Thankful"

 Zayra is remembered
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 74235

« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2012, 03:08:09 PM »

Could a monkey help me look-up a business license, please, for a Robert/Rob Snyder? TIA

Curious, if he is the father (or not) to RC.  

I have nothing conclusive.

I just am not clever at digging, just lucky, sometimes.

Robert Snyder,
or ROB Snyder?

"Lost Resorts"

Challam Bay, Washington (a link with to many choices)

Per the documents:  -took photos of Blackberry cell phone belonging to Robert Snyder Rodriguez (texts, phone logs,contacts)

Robert Rodriguez - facebook friends with Becky Celis

Robert Rodriguez
This is a beautiful song about my niece
« Last Edit: May 26, 2012, 03:10:06 PM by klaasend » Logged

If you need to get into the forum and have forgotten your password, email me and I'll reset it for you:
Monkey Mega Star
Offline Offline

Posts: 74235

« Reply #38 on: May 26, 2012, 03:12:07 PM »

Isa with Robert's sunglasses on:


If you need to get into the forum and have forgotten your password, email me and I'll reset it for you:
Monkey Junky
Offline Offline

Posts: 1931

« Reply #39 on: May 26, 2012, 03:15:13 PM »

Next 90 pages

Child Sexual Assault Unit found no bodily fluid in middle east bedroom (requested by LE).
Shoe impressions located in the dirt from alleyway located S. of residence and several shoe impressions located on top of an electrical box located directly behind the residence in same alleyway (4/21)
Photos of: Window screen from exterior southeast bedroom window, hairbrush from a clear tupperware bin on top of dresser in SE bedroom, toothbrush from E. bathroom and all taken into evidence.
Writing on closet door frame and walls in SE bedroom.
Psychic from BC states that Isa is on 2nd floor of a U shaped complex at 10th/Lenora behind Tucson Collect and AZ babies.  Located in left wing when you enter building from 10th.  Says abductors are late teens, early 20s.
Photo of Blackberry belonging to Robert Snyder Rodriguez collected as evidence.
Loretta again advised LE that sex abuser 5 doors down is responsible.  Search trash, BBQ pit, and freezer.  She also claims to hear voices of ghosts.
E. Bellevue suspicious burnt material.
Blood drawn on Sergio and Rebecca 4/24
Brian P. says he has information related to the case.  Told a bizarre story...identified the five walking on video (per him). States they are out to get him. Document name blocked out, but he states that he pulled a name from his a%$ and whatever the name is was blocked out...but, has to be related to this case.  That's odd. Also, suppose to be on medication.
This document lists a lot of the family members and there relation.
Wandering disoriented child walking--not found.
Pink tye dye shirt found on E. 17 by man.
This week was brush and bulky pick up for this neighborhood (week of disappearance).
Increase in vehicle traffic in alley.
90s minivan with tinted windows in alleyway
2001 Ford Focus with tinted windows in alleyway.
Miguel C. grandfather of Isa.
Dimitrov (sex offender) allowed search of home and initiated to LE that he was a sex offender.
K9 alerted on house on E. Cooper St (same area where dogs were barking crazily at 2am) Difficult to reach residents...I believe that damaged door to get in. Searched and found nothing.
Collect evidence in alleyway at 270 S. Stone Ave. Did not specify.
Searched grandfather's address
Kids like to play in the alley N of grandfather's residence.
Screen was "crunched in."
Robert Rodriguez gf Celeste
Bed sheet and skirt found at Downing Ln and Wilshire Dr by wash. Also found was a plastic bag of clothing articles.  All placed into evidence.
Pam E. reports seeing a girl that looked like Isa with an older W/M, 60, long thin white hair, stocky and looked like an older version of Sergio. Walmart Salon San Mateo St.  She was getting her long hair cut.
I did not understand the report on Krause (anyone else)?
House across the street has been vacant for two years.
A lot of psychics have called in (not writing all of that).
Eileen M. called in to report a man named James O'Harley or O'Larley lives on Valencia with his mom and feels he may be responsible.  Two other girls disappeared on bikes in the area.
Barbara H. observed on 4/22 at 0700 a white flatbed truck and a maroon chevy truck with camper shell close to the home...felt Isa was in camper.
Francisco R states there is a strong Satanic and Wicken following in Tucson. Cult calendar. Says Isa was taken during the time on the cult calendar to need a virgin sacrifice.


"It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities." Sir Josiah Stamp

“I don't have anything to gain. It's not going to save my daughter's life. But it could save your daughter's life.”  ~Mark Lunsford
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 »   Go Up
Jump to:  

Use of this web site in any manner signifies unconditional acceptance, without exception, of our terms of use.
Powered by SMF 1.1.13 | SMF © 2006-2011, Simple Machines LLC
Page created in 0.858 seconds with 20 queries.