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Author Topic: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #869 3/20/2015 -  (Read 716658 times)
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« Reply #260 on: May 16, 2015, 11:03:12 PM »

Remember how the Monkeys, here in the US, made protests outside where Aruba would have a travel booth to boost their tourism?

Maybe, Greta's program tonight, will made someone come forward as a real witness. dedicated to Monkeys who have gone on before us.
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« Reply #261 on: May 16, 2015, 11:06:38 PM »

Until tonight I didn't make the connection between Joran's extortion and the gambling trip to Peru. In a way, Beth's money was well spent. It got him into a mountaintop jail worse than anything Alabama will provide. Well worth it at twice the price. (Except for the price to Stephanie's family of course.)

It was a little aery to see Joran sitting at the casino table in Peru in 2010 looking pretty much identical to him sitting at the casino table in Aruba in 2005. Imagine if Aruba actually had just enforced their own laws and did not allow underage individuals, especially those from Aruba, in the casino, they would never have met.

When my family first started going to Aruba in the 70's and into the 80's and 90's Aruba was more strict on age and they set limits on the number of times a native could go to a casino. They didn't want their citizens to lose all their $'s to the casinos.

It is no coincidence that the deaths of Natalee and Stephany happened on the same day, five years apart. I am in the process of working on a piece called ' A Tale of Two Murders'.
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« Reply #262 on: May 16, 2015, 11:08:00 PM »

He was such a smug smart a-- ... Fancied himself a real stud muffin ... in my view, when Natalee rejected him, he went ballistic and lost it - it seems so very simple and clear.  Then the coverup began, and oh how it ballooned and mushroomed. So cold and so cruel. So vicious.
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« Reply #263 on: May 16, 2015, 11:10:09 PM »

Until tonight I didn't make the connection between Joran's extortion and the gambling trip to Peru. In a way, Beth's money was well spent. It got him into a mountaintop jail worse than anything Alabama will provide. Well worth it at twice the price. (Except for the price to Stephanie's family of course.)

It was a little aery to see Joran sitting at the casino table in Peru in 2010 looking pretty much identical to him sitting at the casino table in Aruba in 2005. Imagine if Aruba actually had just enforced their own laws and did not allow underage individuals, especially those from Aruba, in the casino, they would never have met.

When my family first started going to Aruba in the 70's and into the 80's and 90's Aruba was more strict on age and they set limits on the number of times a native could go to a casino. They didn't want their citizens to lose all their $'s to the casinos.

It is no coincidence that the deaths of Natalee and Stephany happened on the same day, five years apart. I am in the process of working on a piece called ' A Tale of Two Murders'.

Oh wow, Red-let us know when you complete it!  Sounds splendid.  I love the title.
You are a hero!  Wink
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« Reply #264 on: May 16, 2015, 11:11:29 PM »

Nytol ... great to see everyone.
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« Reply #265 on: May 16, 2015, 11:12:05 PM »

A Ben Franklin bio was on at the same time. Maybe Monkeys were there. I know Monkeys always have Natalee in their hearts.

On post before this, spelling error, senior moment .... I love using that excuse  "made" should have been "make"

I wish to live long enough to see him come to the Alabama! We should send him to Mars which would be a one-way trip.
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« Reply #266 on: May 16, 2015, 11:13:23 PM »

Remember how the Monkeys, here in the US, made protests outside where Aruba would have a travel booth to boost their tourism?

Maybe, Greta's program tonight, will made someone come forward as a real witness. dedicated to Monkeys who have gone on before us.

Scared Monkeys Go to Miami to Support Natalee Holloway against Aruban Tourism .. Justice For Natalee
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2007/04/30/scared-monkeys-go-to-miami-to-support-natalee-holloway-against-aruban-tourusm-justice-for-natalee/

Scared Monkeys at the Boston Travel Show Reminding Aruba and All … Justice for Natalee Holloway (Part I)
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/02/23/scared-monkeys-at-the-boston-travel-show-reminding-aruba-and-all-justice-for-natalee-holloway-part-i/


Boston Travel Show Part II: Aruba’s Travel Marketing Campaign vs Freedom of Speech
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/02/25/boston-travel-show-part-ii-arubas-travel-marketing-campaign-vs-freedom-of-speech/
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« Reply #267 on: May 16, 2015, 11:16:44 PM »

Until tonight I didn't make the connection between Joran's extortion and the gambling trip to Peru. In a way, Beth's money was well spent. It got him into a mountaintop jail worse than anything Alabama will provide. Well worth it at twice the price. (Except for the price to Stephanie's family of course.)

It was a little aery to see Joran sitting at the casino table in Peru in 2010 looking pretty much identical to him sitting at the casino table in Aruba in 2005. Imagine if Aruba actually had just enforced their own laws and did not allow underage individuals, especially those from Aruba, in the casino, they would never have met.

When my family first started going to Aruba in the 70's and into the 80's and 90's Aruba was more strict on age and they set limits on the number of times a native could go to a casino. They didn't want their citizens to lose all their $'s to the casinos.

It is no coincidence that the deaths of Natalee and Stephany happened on the same day, five years apart. I am in the process of working on a piece called ' A Tale of Two Murders'.

Oh wow, Red-let us know when you complete it!  Sounds splendid.  I love the title.
You are a hero!  Wink

Be sure to put it up here, with a link via your site to Amazon, so you will get a % of the sale. I hope your second book will be about the positive effects that this forum has had on finding missing and exploited children and adults.
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« Reply #268 on: May 16, 2015, 11:18:21 PM »

Until tonight I didn't make the connection between Joran's extortion and the gambling trip to Peru. In a way, Beth's money was well spent. It got him into a mountaintop jail worse than anything Alabama will provide. Well worth it at twice the price. (Except for the price to Stephanie's family of course.)

It was a little aery to see Joran sitting at the casino table in Peru in 2010 looking pretty much identical to him sitting at the casino table in Aruba in 2005. Imagine if Aruba actually had just enforced their own laws and did not allow underage individuals, especially those from Aruba, in the casino, they would never have met.

When my family first started going to Aruba in the 70's and into the 80's and 90's Aruba was more strict on age and they set limits on the number of times a native could go to a casino. They didn't want their citizens to lose all their $'s to the casinos.

It is no coincidence that the deaths of Natalee and Stephany happened on the same day, five years apart. I am in the process of working on a piece called ' A Tale of Two Murders'.

Oh wow, Red-let us know when you complete it!  Sounds splendid.  I love the title.
You are a hero!  Wink

Oh, thought it was a book. How about book Red on your experiences?

Be sure to put it up here, with a link via your site to Amazon, so you will get a % of the sale. I hope your second book will be about the positive effects that this forum has had on finding missing and exploited children and adults.

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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #269 on: May 16, 2015, 11:22:15 PM »

This is a blogtalk radio show from a couple days ago, and haven't listened to it all yet, but thought others might be interested.

Robin Sax mentions SM sleuthers, Dana, and Red, in some of the early comments.

(I don't really care for the host so far, and he obviously hasn't followed Natalee's case very closely since he doesn't even have the correct date of her disappearance.) 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGqD5E1RE5w

Robin Sax & Stacey Honowitz talk Natalee Holloway 10 years Later on KJR!!!

Published on May 15, 2015
Stacey & Robin & King Discuss 10 years Later a case that Amazed The US & Aruba The Story of Natalee Holloway who went missing 10 years ago on May 25 2005


<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/lGqD5E1RE5w" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/lGqD5E1RE5w</a>

Thanks to Robin Sax for the shout out and remembering who was there in the beginning and at the forefront of the Natalee Holloway missing persons case. I have to admit, this is a tough listen. Robin and Stacy did a nice job and the funny part was there is a part in this interview where they take over and keep talking and following up each other.

 It should make everyone say thank you and give Dana Pretzer big time kudos for the work he does on the radio. Dana has the facts, the dates, the personality, the where with all to know what to ask and how to say it and he'd got the pipes.

What was up with the intro's like it was announcing players at a basketball team? YIKES!!! 

Robin made a great point and she is 100% correct ... this was the first social media case and it was long before Facebook.

This case put web sleuthing and the Internet as a media tool on the map. I can't begin to tell you the number of shows that contacted SM and wanted to use us as background material, of course not giving us credit because their bosses would have gone mental that they got their news and sources from the web. Remember, 10 years ago the MSM did not really have a web presence and it was not at all interactive like it is today.

I have so many stories like this that would just astound people as to how it happened. A major news organization that will go unnamed once contacted us as to how in the hell we were beating them to the story with all the resources and $'s they had in play.

many stories to follow because in the end, we sadly never found Natalee, but what came of it was a new way to investigate, cover and provide law enforcement and families with new tools.

  

YES, a huge shoutout to Dana Pretzer for being totally awesome!   

I sat here shaking my head and saying OMG what's he doing on radio...listening to this guy.   

At least he was able to get some really good guests.  And it was worth the listen, nice remembering the early days of this investigation here in the Scared Monkeys Forum; and all the years of going over ever detail trying to find Natalee and get justice for her.

Missed the first one, so I'm waiting on the second run of Greta's show in a little over an hour, from what I'm reading...no Renfro?  That's a relief!   

Thanks to everyone that posted an update from the show!

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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #270 on: May 16, 2015, 11:26:43 PM »

A Ben Franklin bio was on at the same time. Maybe Monkeys were there. I know Monkeys always have Natalee in their hearts.

On post before this, spelling error, senior moment .... I love using that excuse  "made" should have been "make"

I wish to live long enough to see him come to the Alabama! We should send him to Mars which would be a one-way trip.

Good to see you, IBE!   

We can "modify" our own posts now, so go look for the post with your mistake and you should see "modify" up there by "quote", click on it and fix your mistake and then click "save" where you would usually click "post".

I absolutely LOVE this new feature.   
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #271 on: May 16, 2015, 11:45:33 PM »

Quote
TexasMom

YES, a huge shoutout to Dana Pretzer for being totally awesome!   

I sat here shaking my head and saying OMG what's he doing on radio...listening to this guy.   

At least he was able to get some really good guests.  And it was worth the listen, nice remembering the early days of this investigation here in the Scared Monkeys Forum; and all the years of going over ever detail trying to find Natalee and get justice for her.

Missed the first one, so I'm waiting on the second run of Greta's show in a little over an hour, from what I'm reading...no Renfro?  That's a relief!   

Thanks to everyone that posted an update from the show!

Yeah, that was something, eh?

I sent Dana an email of it and said ... "do not try this at home, these are trained professionals". LOL

Tonight's Greta show was a good recap of Natalee Holloway, but nothing new.

Here is a story from the past regarding Greta. I first met Greta in 2005 when I went to Aruba with TES to search for Natalee. Greta was going her show from Aruba in an outside venue. I met her following one of the shows as she usually had a large crowd waiting to meet and great both her and Beth. As I go closer and closer in the line I saw some of the staff kind of pointing at me and they whispered to her. As I finally got to introduce myself she looked at me and said, I know who you are, You are RED from the Scared Monkeys web site. I nodded my head and said, yup, that's me. I never realized how small she was. It was quite remarkable just how many of the media knew who I was and tried to follow me knowing that I had inside connections.

We chatted for a while and she invited me to a get-together that she and her staff were having later that night. She also introduced me to Beth for the first time. You have to remember my first involvement in the case was through Dave and TES. Beth also was very aware of SM and knew what we did. I gave Beth a big hug and said this was for all the members of SM who were behind her. That was the beginning of my dealings with Beth and the many emails & talks ... most of which were never made public.
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« Reply #272 on: May 17, 2015, 12:11:49 AM »

Until tonight I didn't make the connection between Joran's extortion and the gambling trip to Peru. In a way, Beth's money was well spent. It got him into a mountaintop jail worse than anything Alabama will provide. Well worth it at twice the price. (Except for the price to Stephanie's family of course.)

It was a little aery to see Joran sitting at the casino table in Peru in 2010 looking pretty much identical to him sitting at the casino table in Aruba in 2005. Imagine if Aruba actually had just enforced their own laws and did not allow underage individuals, especially those from Aruba, in the casino, they would never have met.

When my family first started going to Aruba in the 70's and into the 80's and 90's Aruba was more strict on age and they set limits on the number of times a native could go to a casino. They didn't want their citizens to lose all their $'s to the casinos.

It is no coincidence that the deaths of Natalee and Stephany happened on the same day, five years apart. I am in the process of working on a piece called ' A Tale of Two Murders'.

Oh wow, Red-let us know when you complete it!  Sounds splendid.  I love the title.
You are a hero!  Wink

Oh, thought it was a book. How about book Red on your experiences?

Be sure to put it up here, with a link via your site to Amazon, so you will get a % of the sale. I hope your second book will be about the positive effects that this forum has had on finding missing and exploited children and adults.

'A Tale of Two Murders' will be a post on the Scared Monkeys.com 

It will basically analyze the Natalee and Stephany murders and show the similarities and glaring differences. One difference cost Joran Van der Sloot is freedom.

A book, you never know.

I think most people would be stunned if they ever knew some of the behind the scene stuff. Especially some of the networks when they got scooped. Many a network contacted me and wanted to know how I was getting the stories before them. What was funny if all remember back is that the news was so fluid on Aruba and breaking that we were talking about it on SM long before the news outlet shows were talking about it at 7, 8 or 9 pm.

There was no Twitter or Facebook back then.

We literally had people sending emails, VIDEOS and pics from Aruba from the top of hotels and showing us the latest searches as they were happening live. That and I had many a contact down there as my family had been traveling there since the 70's.

Way back when Tom and I had to create the Forum as a way to have people discuss the case and provide info and data as we could not keep up with the comments on the Front page blog. It was the first website to really ever incorporate the two. If people remember we had to create posts that were just for comments originally to try and keep up with the 1000's of comments. Every time we refreshed there was another 200 that needed to be moderated.
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texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #273 on: May 17, 2015, 12:12:10 AM »

I hope Greta shows us where some of the friends are today. Married? Children? That's where Natalie would probably be today. What a loss.

Yes it was.

I remember driving Beth back to Alabama from Florida, we were both taking part in one of the searches for Caylee Anthony in FLA. This was not the MB home you see in tonight's Greta special, but the one she lived in after that. I went to her home and saw all the items that were Natalee's, the pics and just broke down. I told her I was so sorry and I felt like I had failed her in not finding Natalee. Being down there in Aruba and going thru that living hell of searching for her, especially in the landfill, was something that changes a person forever.

I meet and know Beth is to love her. She is such a strong person and understood that so many cared and stopped their lives for her and her family to find Natalee. There was never a time whenever I saw or talked to Beth that she didn't ask about the Monkeys. Beth is a special kind of person.

I haven't been through all you have searching for her, Red, but this case definitely changed me too.

I'd never posted on an internet forum, or researched an MP case.  It seems like a lifetime ago now!

And I think we've all felt inadequate at times, wishing we could have done more to bring Natalee home where she belongs.

My oldest also graduated HS in 2005, and that drew me in at first.  Beth, and her love for Natalee, understanding as a mom her determination to find her; and learning more about sweet beautiful Natalee, kept my interest.  There were years that I know my family secretly resented the amount of time I spent captivated by and going through every detail of this case.  I could sense their frustration at times.  But after five years, when Aruba's failure to prosecute allowed Joran to murder Stephany too, that was the wake up call for them.  They have always been supportive, but after that they started trying to be helpful too, making sure I didn't miss anything that came out about Natalee's or Stephany's cases, and that was heartwarming.
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #274 on: May 17, 2015, 12:26:25 AM »

Quote
TexasMom

YES, a huge shoutout to Dana Pretzer for being totally awesome!   

I sat here shaking my head and saying OMG what's he doing on radio...listening to this guy.   

At least he was able to get some really good guests.  And it was worth the listen, nice remembering the early days of this investigation here in the Scared Monkeys Forum; and all the years of going over ever detail trying to find Natalee and get justice for her.

Missed the first one, so I'm waiting on the second run of Greta's show in a little over an hour, from what I'm reading...no Renfro?  That's a relief!   

Thanks to everyone that posted an update from the show!

Yeah, that was something, eh?

I sent Dana an email of it and said ... "do not try this at home, these are trained professionals". LOL

Tonight's Greta show was a good recap of Natalee Holloway, but nothing new.

Here is a story from the past regarding Greta. I first met Greta in 2005 when I went to Aruba with TES to search for Natalee. Greta was going her show from Aruba in an outside venue. I met her following one of the shows as she usually had a large crowd waiting to meet and great both her and Beth. As I go closer and closer in the line I saw some of the staff kind of pointing at me and they whispered to her. As I finally got to introduce myself she looked at me and said, I know who you are, You are RED from the Scared Monkeys web site. I nodded my head and said, yup, that's me. I never realized how small she was. It was quite remarkable just how many of the media knew who I was and tried to follow me knowing that I had inside connections.

We chatted for a while and she invited me to a get-together that she and her staff were having later that night. She also introduced me to Beth for the first time. You have to remember my first involvement in the case was through Dave and TES. Beth also was very aware of SM and knew what we did. I gave Beth a big hug and said this was for all the members of SM who were behind her. That was the beginning of my dealings with Beth and the many emails & talks ... most of which were never made public.

I bet Dana gets a kick out of that one, Red.   Monkey Devil!

Thanks so much for sharing your experiences.  Scared Monkeys was definitely the place to be for breaking news early in the case.  I was here even when I was too scared to post, and it was hard to keep up!  Finally got a login and then got shutout after the crash for over a year or so, but finally got back in.  So glad to be a part of this wonderful group, thanks for having us!
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #275 on: May 17, 2015, 03:54:05 AM »

I thought it was absolutely excellent-so good to see her two friends, Claire Fierman and Mollie Tucker; Beth looks so good-her attitude is so inspiring; I need to purchase that book Portrait of a Monster, by Cole Thompson and Lisa Pulitzer as in their interview quips they sounded very in tune with the facts and have Joran's diabolical persona down pat. And..... John Q. Kelly is still gorgeous ...and nice.

I agree Ono, glad I was able to catch the replay. 

Hope someone will put it on Youtube as well, for Klaas and others that might have missed it. 

I bought the book and posted some excerpts here while reading it.  http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=11854.0

Cole Thompson and Lisa Pulitzer gave us a closer look at Stephany's family details in the early days after her murder, and we gain more of an understanding of how LE worked in her case from the book imo. 

Hoping there will be some updates soon from Stephany's family and how they're doing too.

Logged

I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #276 on: May 17, 2015, 08:52:04 AM »

I watched the show twice, and although it was good, it offered nothing new.  I did find some of Joran's answers more revealing in his duplicity, or maybe I was just reading between the lines after following the strange twists in the case.
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« Reply #277 on: May 17, 2015, 12:32:51 PM »

I thought it was absolutely excellent-so good to see her two friends, Claire Fierman and Mollie Tucker; Beth looks so good-her attitude is so inspiring; I need to purchase that book Portrait of a Monster, by Cole Thompson and Lisa Pulitzer as in their interview quips they sounded very in tune with the facts and have Joran's diabolical persona down pat. And..... John Q. Kelly is still gorgeous ...and nice.

I agree Ono, glad I was able to catch the replay. 

Hope someone will put it on Youtube as well, for Klaas and others that might have missed it. 

I bought the book and posted some excerpts here while reading it.  http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=11854.0

Cole Thompson and Lisa Pulitzer gave us a closer look at Stephany's family details in the early days after her murder, and we gain more of an understanding of how LE worked in her case from the book imo. 

Hoping there will be some updates soon from Stephany's family and how they're doing too.



Wow, Texasmom, thank you for your time and trouble in posting those excerpts.  Now I simply must purchase that book-what in-depth research they did.  One can only conclude that nobody ever taught Joran from a wee age that he should control his temper. 
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« Reply #278 on: May 17, 2015, 12:39:42 PM »

Red:
Write that behind-the-scenes book! Nothing would be more fascinating and interesting!!! 
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #279 on: May 17, 2015, 01:17:53 PM »






 
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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