RBN # 13 - 6/20/05

[LilOrphan]

i'm from the south, but i know that you can't trust people. period.

I'm as cynical northerner jaded as they come, but at 18 I got into many different situations with "new friends."  How else does one meet new friends without deciding to trust them at some point? And it's pure fantasy to believe that everyone waits a set amount of time before their in a situation where they're forced to trust a person they don't know that well.  We all have done it. Unfortunately this time, because of the characters of those she trusted it went awry.  If she'd have gotten into a car full of good people, she'd be sitting poolside somewhere, laughing with her friends right now.

why are u still blaming the victim here???
can't you all send positive thoughts for natalee??
is that beyond you culturally??

Where are you getting that I'm blaming Natalee? I'm sticking up for her. We ALL trust people and time has nothing to do with it. Sometimes people are hurt by those they trusted for years. It's the character of the other person, not the victim, that determines what happens.

[friend of monkeys]

you must look at all sides and know all facts before coming to closure
in order to make an educated guess
its frustrating no one wants to look at things from all angles

If looking at things at all angles includes maligning a young woman and her family, insulting southern women, etc,,,then you might as well get used to being frustrated.

Because not only is it cruel and hateful, it isn't helpful.

i agree totally  
cant we all agree to just pray she is still alive??
that is why we are here is it not???

[puggywug]

CAST OF CHARACTERS
In the Mysterious & Heartbreaking Disappearance of Natalee Holloway

Good recap, Puggy.

But don't forget the possible connection to

Renee Van Hannikan (Hanigem?)
found murdered and partially decapitated 6/18/05 ?
in the neighborhood called Sabana.
(unconfirmed) reports say murdered in his house and then later dumped in cemetery close by.
and Sergio Gomez is missing on the island. His pickup truck found.

And Max is Maxito Arendsz, 26?
car racer
works at Aruba Speed Shop
Friend of Joran's
(not the Max Arends who went to school with him)

Afternoon all. Just logged on.

Thanks     I'll correct the Maxiot Arendsz part.  I am not including the decapitated victim or Sergio Gomez b/c this list is only people questioned or detained by police.  Thanks, though.

[HannieC]

If they hold Steve Croes for another 8 days then they must have also reasonable suspicion or some evidence that he sure is involved, because he gets instantly the 8 days!


Maybe is the "A" initial someone mentioned earlier; Maxito Arendsz
who the will arrest.

Pff even for a "Dutch"girl like me it`s getting confusing now!

[momto5]

you must look at all sides and know all facts before coming to closure
in order to make an educated guess
its frustrating no one wants to look at things from all angles

If looking at things at all angles includes maligning a young woman and her family, insulting southern women, etc,,,then you might as well get used to being frustrated.

Because not only is it cruel and hateful, it isn't helpful.

Nicely said

[DONTGETEXCITED]

we are here to speculate
and speak our minds and pray actually.

[DT]

but we must dig deep INTO ALL SIDES in order to fully investigate

Ill say it again, we have.  Nothing you have brought up about Natalee's character hasn't been debated extensively already here.  And the conclusion is that its perfectly understandable that a good girl who is naive, would get into a car with people she had only known a few days, and not think anything about it.

[friend of monkeys]

CAST OF CHARACTERS
In the Mysterious & Heartbreaking Disappearance of Natalee Holloway

Good recap, Puggy.

But don't forget the possible connection to

Renee Van Hannikan (Hanigem?)
found murdered and partially decapitated 6/18/05 ?
in the neighborhood called Sabana.
(unconfirmed) reports say murdered in his house and then later dumped in cemetery close by.
and Sergio Gomez is missing on the island. His pickup truck found.

And Max is Maxito Arendsz, 26?
car racer
works at Aruba Speed Shop
Friend of Joran's
(not the Max Arends who went to school with him)

Afternoon all. Just logged on.

Thanks     I'll correct the Maxiot Arendsz part.  I am not including the decapitated victim or Sergio Gomez b/c this list is only people questioned or detained by police.  Thanks, though.

     so if my math is right then 12??

[devilsadvocate]

I too have wondered why the friends let her go with the 3 guys in the first place

but I also think that if these guys have been hanging around this group since the beginning of the trip and many of the kids had gotten to know them, maybe they too trusted these guys

and maybe Natalee said to one of her friends, don't wait up for me, I'm hoping to spend some time with Joran before I have to go home, don't wait for me, or the friends assumed that is what Natalee wanted,  for all we know she fell for him hook line and sinker

consider this, this was an annual trip apparently for this high school, maybe Joran met some of last year's class and some of the girls were raving about him,  maybe Joran was emailing some of them?  maybe Natalee heard about Joran

there was a rumour which apparently was dispelled by one of
Natalee's friend that she may have been emailing Joran before she arrived in Aruba

Joran was accepted into two Florida universities and I think he was planning to go to Florida for university, Alabama and Florida not too far huh

maybe these guys had given Natalee or other girls rides during the week and they were perfect gentlemen

See this is where there is a contridiction in stories. Good girl wouldn't have done that, doesn't fool around etc. Yet we know she "willing" left with him.

 i tried to make that exact point but i was called a troll......my main point is that in order to find natalee the search has to be for the "real" natalee not the goodie 2 shoes natalee.......and i really do hope they find her save

The reason you were called a troll is because a lot of people on this board seem to have the mentality to attack the character of the victim, and your posts look similar to theirs even though I think you had good intentions.  The problem I have with what you are saying is this: how do you know that the goodie two shoes natalee wasn't the real natalee?  It seems to me that you judge her based on your presumptions of how teenagers behave.  All of her friends have said that she was a good girl and all of her family has said it.  Certainly, they could all be trying to defend her character. But without some reason to think she wasnt good why doubt the family/friends?

if she was a goodie 2 shoes her friends would have noticed she didnt get back to the hotel after leaving with 3 dudes......thats just my opinion...the fact they didnt notice or think anything wrong suggest she stayed out very late before while hanging out with locals

[DONTGETEXCITED]

ok so in a nutshell
natalee is miss perfect.
she can do no wrong?

[keepfaith]

foxnews want to intervieuw the people  in aruba but all the time when the people in aruba wants to defend themself  from what the F.B.I. or other americans ON T.V. blames them  for wrong doing, foxnews has to go to commercial. americans what's up with you??? it seems that you want to hear what you like to hear. people in aruba are doing their best. you think if one arubian was lost in alabama, alabama would be searching for him or her like the arubians are doing right now??. if the F.B.I. is so damn good like they say start Seaching the thousands of people missing in the states. I really want them to find N.H. alive and well. no.1,  2 be with her family and no2. to shut the mouth of everyone that speaks bad about aruba especially that radio lady "dee fine ", with her porno name. and if it results that n.h is a runaway, i do not want to be her!!

[absolut]

If they hold Steve Croes for another 8 days then they must have also reasonable suspicion or some evidence that he sure is involved, because he gets instantly the 8 days!

Or it is an obstruction of justice charge. Many will be guilty of that in the end.

[cancon]

if the roomates were at all concerned why didn't they sound the alarm when Natalee didn't show up at the hotel a few minutes after they did, [they must have known Natalee had a thing for Joranm trust me even quiet shy girls gush over guys with their girlfriends and it would be very exciting on a trip]

assuming they went back to the hotel directly themselves

you see in my crowd if we had any concerns and we've done this many times, if we thought our friend was too drunk to make a smart decision,we'd tell loverboy to take a hike, if the friend was drunk and got into the car some of us would have jumped in with her to make sure she got home, and lastly if she didn't show up at the hotel, then is when I would have started panicking

now if I thought my friend wanted to go off with this guy, and she knew what she was getting into, I wouldn't worry until the next morning.......

and it was already reported that Natalee was hollering out of the car window, something like yeah Aruba when she passed a taxi with other kids in it

[LilOrphan]

ok so in a nutshell
natalee is miss perfect.
she can do no wrong?

apparently, some of us are here to stir up garbage unnecessarily and get renamed Casper?

[kandeyingeorgia]

you must look at all sides and know all facts before coming to closure
in order to make an educated guess
its frustrating no one wants to look at things from all angles

If looking at things at all angles includes maligning a young woman and her family, insulting southern women, etc,,,then you might as well get used to being frustrated.

Because not only is it cruel and hateful, it isn't helpful.

I agree.  It is also very ignorant of this poster (DGE) to slander anyone from the South.  He/she is talking out of both sides of his/her mouth by saying "you must look at all sides", when he/she is obviously not.  Pfffft.  Grow the ef up.

[DT]

ok so in a nutshell
natalee is miss perfect.
she can do no wrong?

hardly, but it would be out of character for her to do the sort of things you are alledging she did.  And what we do know she did is perfectly in keeping with what we know from her friends family.

[friend of monkeys]

we are here to speculate
and speak our minds and pray actually.

since when are prayers speculative in nature?

[writenow]

ok so she got in the car thinking she was going back to the hotel
which when she realized she wasnt going back to the hotel..
why did she stay?
why didnt she get out at a light or stop sign?
why didnt she do anything?
when she knew she wasnt going back right away?

ummm... because she had 3 guys who were bigger and stronger than she holding her and preventing her from leaving?

[amillerwvu]

you must look at all sides and know all facts before coming to closure
in order to make an educated guess
its frustrating no one wants to look at things from all angles

If looking at things at all angles includes maligning a young woman and her family, insulting southern women, etc,,,then you might as well get used to being frustrated.

Because not only is it cruel and hateful, it isn't helpful.

i agree totally  
cant we all agree to just pray she is still alive??
that is why we are here is it not???

I hear you FOM,
I am praying that she is alive...that is what brought me to this site to begin with!  God bless Natalee, her family, and her friends!

[DivaToo]

I know I'm not supposed to feed the trolls but I'm breakin' the rules:

DONTGETEXCITED
I am from the South my hubby is from Baltimore, YES A BIG CITY, and I have done just fine on my multiple visits to the "big city"  

This is no ones fault but whoever took or hurt Natalee!!! Leave her friends and everyone else ALONE!

I am a site admin on a website and if I had the power here I would shut you down!  
Take your weird posts somewhere else, I'm sure there's some ppl at courttv's msg boards you could get along with  

YOU are mean!

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