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Author Topic: RBN # 15 - 6/21/05  (Read 315445 times)
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mbhs05
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« Reply #420 on: June 21, 2005, 12:28:58 PM »

Quote from: "bamajo"
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "bamajo"
Quote from: "CancunMole"
I do not believe that anyone sat in the lobby all night to track who in the MB group was in and not in which has been implied. If you have ever been to the HI, you can't see the driveway from the pool area.


jac, you are right.  i have a now 24 yo nephew who was arrested for trafficking cocaine.  if you looked at him, you would not think him a "druggie", he's nice, clean cut, has manners etc., but he did it for the $$$.   it was an easy way for him to make some money and live a nice lifestyle while in college.


and CM, it has been said that some of the MBHS crew waited until 5:00 a.m. in the lobby for Natalee, and she did not show.


Where'd ya here that?


i can't verify at this moment, but i think i read it on the TA post that was posted by someone's mother?  dash's maybe?  i don't remember.  i've read so much, and i do specifically remember reading that information on a post somewhere by someone's parent.  i do apologize for being so vague, but i just don't remember where i read it.  is that a false report?  i humbly apologize if it is.


I was just curious because I haven't heard that from any of my friends. THere were a lot of people at the pool, but they weren't waiting on her, or anything.
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katya
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« Reply #421 on: June 21, 2005, 12:29:42 PM »

Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "jagz2u"
Quote from: "MominTN"
Do an interview at the internet cafe and see who goes in there


MominTn,
I like the way you think.  An interview at the internet cafe seems very appropo.  Good next step for Greta.


alot of arubas residents go on setarnet thru cell phones/calling cards also.
my friend finds both expensive ...sometimes she spends $30/40 a day chatting/etc... the internet cafe is good for long time usage i guess.


Internet cafes are very common outside the US, and not particularly sinister, most people do not have computers in their homes. They are usually full of kids chatting, doing homework or downloading music. Also they are used by a lot of tourists, as well.
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Kelly
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« Reply #422 on: June 21, 2005, 12:29:43 PM »

Quote from: "Angiex911dsptchr"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Well, I am happy to hear that the investigation is actually composed of a "team" comprised of Aruban, Dutch and FBI....all working together and getting along well. (per Trapenberg) This is a much better picture than what was originally thought.


What are they saying? anything new?
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Kelly
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« Reply #423 on: June 21, 2005, 12:30:20 PM »

FOUND IT!!!!  THIS IS WHERE I GOT THE 5:00 A.M. IN THE LOBBY

http://www.bwcitypaper.com/  look under the title "Naked Birmingham".  Here is the reprinted article:

 

Publishers Notebook  
 

 


 
 
 
By Chuck Geiss write the author
 
June 16, 2005

Our plane touched down Friday evening, June 10, on the island of Aruba. As we approached the hotel where Natalee Holloway had stayed during her five-day vacation, yellow and white ribbons were evident everywhere. On June 5 the island had exhausted its supply of yellow ribbons, so white ribbons joined yellow ones on lampposts, street signs, and flagpoles. They were visible reminders of a tragic story that many island locals hoped would disappear.


 Naked Birmingham
 
 Recent
 
 
 
 

 
   
 
 
 
Since the day after she vanished, a group of closely knit friends had gathered with Natalee Holloway's family in Aruba. Initially, they came to provide emotional support, but soon found themselves acting as the lead detectives in an investigation to find the 18-year-old girl. Within hours of arriving on the island, they were troubled to learn that island police were tentative about beginning any investigation, since missing-person cases require a 24-hour waiting period. Police assured the family that Natalee would show up soon, exclaiming, "Things like this happen all the time, people love the island so much, and they just don't want to go home."

Friends of the family immediately took matters into their own hands; within hours they learned the identity of the three men last seen with Natalee at a local nightclub during the early hours of Monday, May 30. They conducted informal interviews at the home of 17-year-old Joran Van Der Sloot who, in the company of police officials, readily admitted to having been with Natalee on the previous evening before dropping her off at her hotel at 2:30 a.m. Later, it was learned that surveillance tapes from the hotel revealed no such activity. Moreover, friends who waited for Natalee in the lobby until 5 a.m. said she never even arrived at the hotel. Believing that Van Der Sloot was lying, the family and their friends pegged him as the leading suspect a mere 12 hours after Natalee's disappearance.

As flyers were posted around the island, the search for Natalee began in earnest. Efforts concentrated around the hotel and at the lighthouse on the north end of the island, where Van Der Sloot, 18-year old Satish Kalpoe, and his brother, 21-year old Deepak, said they had taken Natalee after leaving a local downtown nightclub. As an avalanche of leads and anonymous tips flowed in, friends of the family mobilized into an investigative task force armed with cell phones, two-way radios, and a fleet of rental cars. Psychics, prevalent on the island, began demanding the attention of the family. Each told family associates that "she is in a dark place, and near water." One claimed that Natalee's soul was sitting next to her. "Ask her what the name of her dog is," a family associate asked. "She is crying," she told him, "she is too upset to talk." During that early period of the family's investigation, attempts to get the police involved were unsuccessful. According to a friend of the family, the Police Commissioner actually suggested that they go to Carlos & Charlie's (the bar Natalee disappeared from) on Wednesday night. "It is Ladies Night," he said, "and I am sure she will be there."

As the search became more desperate and the tips became more bizarre, missions into the island's darkest barrios, including the red-light district and assorted crack houses, were orchestrated. The editor of the island newspaper informed the family that a group of drug dealers were holding Natalee for a $10,000 ransom (an odd amount considering that the posted reward was in excess of $50,000). A late-night rendezvous between the drug dealers and family friends was arranged, and after a wild series of events an American girl was rescued by the police, who called to report that "they are 98-percent sure they have Natalee." The family raced to the police station only to discover that the female in custody had dark hair, brown eyes, weighed about 130 pounds, and looked to be about 45 years old. Natalee had blonde hair, blue eyes, weighed 110 pounds, and was 18 years old. That was the first of many letdowns and false leads.

On Day 5, police arrested two security guards, leaving the family perplexed as to why the investigation had not yet led to the persons last seen with Natalee: Joran Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers. From all accounts, the three have bad reputations. Joran Van Der Sloot is a son of privilege; his father has been appointed to a judgeship on the island and rumors swirled that he was using his influence to impede the investigation. There were varying descriptions of Joran, ranging from model student athlete to casino playboy (he met Natalee in a casino). He is tall, handsome, and looks older than his age. His friends, Satish and Deepak, also sons of wealth and privilege, were described to me by a local islander "as bad men who mistreat women." One scenario has the trio involved in a seedy scam that involves meeting attractive female tourists, learning the date of their departure, and taking advantage of them on their final night in town.

The family was informed, however, that paying $1,000 to a certain official might make him work harder to find Natalee. Friends of the family concluded about that official that "no sum of money could make him smart enough to help us." Finally, a team of FBI agents arrived in Aruba. Island police arrested the three boys last seen with Natalee, but offered no information about their investigation. Despite their frustration, the family maintained a positive spin for the media, saying "they are pleased with the process." Behind the scenes, that was hardly the case.

The lobby of the Aruba Holiday Inn was a peculiar mix of scantily clad, well-sunscreened hotel guests, members of the media, and people engaged in the search for Holloway. Those involved in the search had established a war room in the hotel, but most of them hung out in the lobby in between search activities because the war room was too depressing. Eleven days after Natalee's disappearance, the flow of tips and leads had abated, mainly because family friends had become adept at screening them. Efforts were concentrated on getting scuba divers in the water, defining specific locations for organized searches, and staying visible to police and government officials. Natalee's mother, Beth, spent her days visiting schools and churches, speaking with children and handing out wrist bracelets made by friends in Birmingham.

"The only thing we have going for us is maintaining a high profile and letting these people know that we aren't leaving without Natalee," said one family friend, "otherwise it's just another missing girl." Indeed, it was clear that virtually everyone on the island wanted the family and friends to go home because they were jeopardizing the tourist economy, hindering the local drug trade, and drawing intense media scrutiny to local police and government officials who have no experience managing this kind of case.

Late Friday evening, June 10, rumors circulated that police had taken members of the family to the lighthouse to identify a body. On television, CNN reported that Natalee was dead, and both CNN and Fox News were reporting a confession "that something bad has happened to Natalee." Both stories were without merit. The next morning, CNN was still reporting that Natalee was dead, but Fox had retracted its story about a confession. At 10 a.m., Vivian Van Der Biezen, spokesperson for the Attorney General, held a press conference at the hotel to report "they are at a very critical point in the investigation and they will neither confirm nor deny information being reported from other sources." This was typical of the information being provided to the family, in that it had absolutely no substance.

On Saturday night, Geraldo Rivera conducted a live interview with Beth Holloway Twitty [Natalee's mother], George Twitty [her step-father], and Prime Minister Nelson Oduber. The interview went smoothly until the Prime Minister revealed a fact undisclosed to the Holloways—that the police found blood in one of the cars impounded during the investigation (a lab test later proved this to be false). Twitty took the opportunity to criticize Oduber. "This is typical of what we're going through. They have information that we know nothing about and this is the first time we're hearing it. You hear it before we do." Off camera, Oduber was having a total meltdown.

By Sunday morning, June 12, Natalee's parents were modifying their media strategy. Worried early on that any criticism of the investigation would jeopardize their relationship with the police department, they ultimately concluded that things couldn't get much worse. After 14 days with no answers, it seemed that the media was their only hope of getting any results. Government officials continued to defend the investigation's credibility to the media.

Two weeks after Natalee Holloway was reported missing, I left the island. Understandably, her family won't leave without her, and by now police and government officials on the island are keenly aware of that fact. My lasting impression of Aruba is the license tag on the rear of the car that brought me to the airport. The slogan at the top of the plate read "One Happy Island." &
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Rob
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« Reply #424 on: June 21, 2005, 12:30:56 PM »

i also have a question.. does anyone remember some incidences outside of the hyatt? possibliy involving renovation workers at the allegro? this was before natalee went missing, maybe like in the one -two week period before.....
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CancunMole
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« Reply #425 on: June 21, 2005, 12:31:03 PM »

Quote from: "bamajo"
Quote from: "CancunMole"
I do not believe that anyone sat in the lobby all night to track who in the MB group was in and not in which has been implied. If you have ever been to the HI, you can't see the driveway from the pool area.


jac, you are right.  i have a now 24 yo nephew who was arrested for trafficking cocaine.  if you looked at him, you would not think him a "druggie", he's nice, clean cut, has manners etc., but he did it for the $$$.   it was an easy way for him to make some money and live a nice lifestyle while in college.


and CM, it has been said that some of the MBHS crew waited until 5:00 a.m. in the lobby for Natalee, and she did not show.


If this is what you are referring to:

Quote
arlee
Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:41 pm    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Quote:
Moreover, friends who waited for Natalee in the lobby until 5 a.m. said she never even arrived at the hotel.


CancunMole responded: This is new. Everything that I've seen posted indicated that there were MB students out by the pool, not in the lobby.


Mole, there were students all over the hotel property, inside and out. There was a group of 10-20 students mingling, coming and going, out by the pool from before 1:30 a.m. til after 5 a.m. A great many students did not go to bed at all that night but moved in small groups here and there.

The pool group's story was posted so often because their presence seemed to contradict the boys' story of dropping Nat off near the pool area
.


Why was nothing said about being in the lobby before 6/19. Sorry, but as I said, you can't see the driveway from the pool and actually, I don't think you can see the lobby from the pool, so why would they have used the pool as the story.

Also, per O'Reilly, it is not the FBI who has told anyone from MB to keep quiet.
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iquitos
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« Reply #426 on: June 21, 2005, 12:32:04 PM »

Quote from: "Professor"
Here is an observation, that can explain a lot about the handling of this case.

Aruba is a closed society. Residents there don’t need to lock their doors at night, because their neighbors have been neighbors for 3 and 4 generations. To cheat a neighbor, or to steal from a neighbor could result in a tarnish upon a family’s reputation that would be passed on to one’s children, and to one’s children’s children. And so a highly trained police department is not necessary in a closed society. That might explain the lack of expertise in the Aruban police investigation.

But there is also a dark side to such a closed society. Tourists come and go. And, in a closed society, there is a tendency to develop an us-and-them attitude about tourists. Us being the native Arubans, and Them being the American and Venezuelan and Dutch tourists who visit the island. We might expect to see a closing of the ranks, as this case proceeds, and in fact we are already seeing it. Already, there are gushes of sympathy for the poor, beleaguered Paul van der Sloot, and for the “stain upon his family’s reputation.” Already there are gushes of compassion for the poor Joran van der Sloot, following reports that he may have been heard sobbing in his jail cell, or that he might have tried to hang himself. (A cowardly act, if true, that would deny the family of Natalee Holloway any answers into the disappearance of their lovely daughter.)

Of course, there is also professed sympathy for the family of a girl who went missing on the island. But the death or disappearance of a young American tourists is somehow no more important than the “stain upon a family’s honor,” or loss of tourist revenues.

I don’t think that this is unique with Aruba. I think we see the same behavior in the Bahamas, the Virgin Islands, and in other closed societies. In the Virgin Islands, American tourists with no motive and iron-clad alibis were convicted for a crime that had been committed by a native. In Saudi Arabia, American citizens were arrested for a bombing that had been committed by Saudis. And in Aruba two security guards were rounded up, to take the fall for the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The only exception in this case was that the two security guards were native Arubans. But they obviously didn’t count, since they were not of the middle class.

What is the bottom line? The bottom line is that a tourist in one of these closed societies needs to be aware that he or she does NOT have full standing as a resident, and will never have the undivided sympathy of the residents, in the event something bad happens. So, why not come to Key West, or to Panama City?
 

GREAT POST PROFESSOR.  ONE THING THOUGH, ONE OF THE GUARDS WAS A FOREIGNER TOO.
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Kelly
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« Reply #427 on: June 21, 2005, 12:32:07 PM »

yeah i didnt hear anything about them waiting for her, because dash said that they didnt assume that anything was wrong or what not..even when she didnt show up for check in for plane, they thought she just slept in..it wasnt until they couldnt find her that morning that they went looking for her
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Kelly
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« Reply #428 on: June 21, 2005, 12:33:25 PM »

Quote from: "Kelly"
Quote from: "Angiex911dsptchr"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Well, I am happy to hear that the investigation is actually composed of a "team" comprised of Aruban, Dutch and FBI....all working together and getting along well. (per Trapenberg) This is a much better picture than what was originally thought.


What are they saying? anything new?


Nothing new Kelly.. just speaking of the authorities there..and how they all are getting along and supposedly more will be sent also..
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CaliGirl
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« Reply #429 on: June 21, 2005, 12:33:46 PM »

Hey Kerin.. whadem up homie? lmao

Sorry, I had to loft.. can you believe I actually had to do some work? *sigh* How dare they expect me to work! lol Laughing
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KerinTX
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« Reply #430 on: June 21, 2005, 12:34:18 PM »

Quote from: "Kelly"
Quote from: "Angiex911dsptchr"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Well, I am happy to hear that the investigation is actually composed of a "team" comprised of Aruban, Dutch and FBI....all working together and getting along well. (per Trapenberg) This is a much better picture than what was originally thought.


What are they saying? anything new?


Not really. Just kind of going through the same things. But Trapenberg was on talking about how the LE are working together and about the rumor of the Holloway lawsuit.
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sarah
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« Reply #431 on: June 21, 2005, 12:34:40 PM »

Quote from: "Professor"
Here is an observation, that can explain a lot about the handling of this case.

Aruba is a closed society. Residents there don’t need to lock their doors at night, because their neighbors have been neighbors for 3 and 4 generations. To cheat a neighbor, or to steal from a neighbor could result in a tarnish upon a family’s reputation that would be passed on to one’s children, and to one’s children’s children. And so a highly trained police department is not necessary in a closed society. That might explain the lack of expertise in the Aruban police investigation.

But there is also a dark side to such a closed society. Tourists come and go. And, in a closed society, there is a tendency to develop an us-and-them attitude about tourists. Us being the native Arubans, and Them being the American and Venezuelan and Dutch tourists who visit the island. We might expect to see a closing of the ranks, as this case proceeds, and in fact we are already seeing it. Already, there are gushes of sympathy for the poor, beleaguered Paul van der Sloot, and for the “stain upon his family’s reputation.” Already there are gushes of compassion for the poor Joran van der Sloot, following reports that he may have been heard sobbing in his jail cell, or that he might have tried to hang himself. (A cowardly act, if true, that would deny the family of Natalee Holloway any answers into the disappearance of their lovely daughter.)

Of course, there is also professed sympathy for the family of a girl who went missing on the island. But the death or disappearance of a young American tourists is somehow no more important than the “stain upon a family’s honor,” or loss of tourist revenues.

I don’t think that this is unique with Aruba. I think we see the same behavior in the Bahamas, the Virgin Islands, and in other closed societies. In the Virgin Islands, American tourists with no motive and iron-clad alibis were convicted for a crime that had been committed by a native. In Saudi Arabia, American citizens were arrested for a bombing that had been committed by Saudis. And in Aruba two security guards were rounded up, to take the fall for the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The only exception in this case was that the two security guards were native Arubans. But they obviously didn’t count, since they were not of the middle class.

What is the bottom line? The bottom line is that a tourist in one of these closed societies needs to be aware that he or she does NOT have full standing as a resident, and will never have the undivided sympathy of the residents, in the event something bad happens. So, why not come to Key West, or to Panama City?


Your post actually reminds me of small southern towns in my neck of the woods.  We just moved from a town with population of 660.  We never locked our doors (wasn't sure where the key actually was), left the keys in the car and yes even our personal belongings in our vehical at times.  There was never a need to worry because of so little crime.  There was one police officer who only worked part time because of the little crime.  When there was a crime, they would usually bring in the county cops because our man was so inexperienced.  Folks have been in this community for a long time and no matter what they do, everyone has a long standing reputation that is upheld.  Everyone is sympathetic to their neighbors but weary of outsiders---outsiders being those who were not born and raised in the community.  People come and go, due to the agricultural nature  of the town and there is a feeling of us and them.  If an outsider, one who has not been in town for generations, is guilty of something--there is the same mindset that "they are not from around here,"  which hopefully helps clean the stain left on the town.  My point is that many of us should be able to relate to your post.  It is of a small town mentality, in my opinion.  Many of us have seen it for ourselves.
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pinemeadows
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« Reply #432 on: June 21, 2005, 12:35:15 PM »

Quote from: "bamajo"
and CM, it has been said that some of the MBHS crew waited until 5:00 a.m. in the lobby for Natalee, and she did not show.


Where'd ya here that?[/quote]

I saw this a few times last week as well...and can't remember where it was written.
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« Reply #433 on: June 21, 2005, 12:35:17 PM »

Texas EquuSearch isn't taking any horses--just the side-scan sonar and 3 cadaver dogs, plus 17 people.  They plan to leave tonight to go to Aruba and stay 5 days.
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Angiex911dsptchr
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« Reply #434 on: June 21, 2005, 12:36:52 PM »

Quote from: "Kelly"
yeah i didnt hear anything about them waiting for her, because dash said that they didnt assume that anything was wrong or what not..even when she didnt show up for check in for plane, they thought she just slept in..it wasnt until they couldnt find her that morning that they went looking for her


Was their anyone else in NH room that noticed she wasnt in bed when they woke up?
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pinemeadows
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« Reply #435 on: June 21, 2005, 12:40:00 PM »

["Was their anyone else in NH room that noticed she wasnt in bed when they woke up?[/quote]

This is a GREAT question - have not seen it before.  Weren't there 3 or 4 girls in that room?
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veme
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« Reply #436 on: June 21, 2005, 12:40:39 PM »

Quote from: "sarah"
Quote from: "Professor"
.

What is the bottom line? The bottom line is that a tourist in one of these closed societies needs to be aware that he or she does NOT have full standing as a resident, and will never have the undivided sympathy of the residents, in the event something bad happens. So, why not come to Key West, or to Panama City?


Your post actually reminds me of small southern towns in my neck of the woods.  We just moved from a town with population of 660.  We never locked our doors (wasn't sure where the key actually was), left the keys in the car and yes even our personal belongings in our vehical at times.  There was never a need to worry because of so little crime.  There was one police officer who only worked part time because of the little crime.  When there was a crime, they would usually bring in the county cops because our man was so inexperienced.  Folks have been in this community for a long time and no matter what they do, everyone has a long standing reputation that is upheld.  Everyone is sympathetic to their neighbors but weary of outsiders---outsiders being those who were not born and raised in the community.  People come and go, due to the agricultural nature  of the town and there is a feeling of us and them.  If an outsider, one who has not been in town for generations, is guilty of something--there is the same mindset that "they are not from around here,"  which hopefully helps clean the stain left on the town.  My point is that many of us should be able to relate to your post.  It is of a small town mentality, in my opinion.  Many of us have seen it for ourselves.


Couldn't agree more! I married into a small town/rural situation. Been here almost 20 years - myown mother-in-law still thinks of me as an outsider Rolling Eyes
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Sorry for the spelling & typos..... I'm a  funtional illiterate.
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« Reply #437 on: June 21, 2005, 12:41:21 PM »

Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Hey Kerin.. whadem up homie? lmao

Sorry, I had to loft.. can you believe I actually had to do some work? *sigh* How dare they expect me to work! lol Laughing


{{{Cali}}}} Workin? I am just chillaxin with my homies at the crib.
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« Reply #438 on: June 21, 2005, 12:41:46 PM »

angie, you are assumming that her roommates went to their room and went to bed.  they could've been at the pool until the wee hours and then when they got to the room and she was not there, they could've assummed that she was in someone else's room.  perhaps they had the key?  you know hotels usually only issue two keys per room - if it were me and i had the key and knew that my roommate that went off did not have the key, she would either find me, or sleep in another friend's room.
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« Reply #439 on: June 21, 2005, 12:42:28 PM »

Quote from: "Rob"
i also have a question.. does anyone remember some incidences outside of the hyatt? possibliy involving renovation workers at the allegro? this was before natalee went missing, maybe like in the one -two week period before.....


It was reported that a camera at the Hyatt had picked up a young woman walking along the beach. FYI. The Hyatt and the Allegro are separated by a street-like thoroughfare.
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