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Author Topic: RBN # 17 - 6/22/05  (Read 296455 times)
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DivaToo
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« Reply #860 on: June 22, 2005, 02:55:58 PM »

Quote from: "RB"
Diva, the first place they'll go is to the authorities to see if they have anything like it.  If they do, you won't hear a thing.


I Know, I really don't expect to hear anything back, if it gets investigated (hopefully it will) But IF I do, you all will hear it/ see it first
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Praying for Natalee's safe return & comfort for her family
chloe2
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« Reply #861 on: June 22, 2005, 02:56:36 PM »

Poking my head in only for a moment --

Nat's on the front page of America's Most Wanted:

http://amw.com/missing_persons/brief.cfm?id=32411
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CaliGirl
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« Reply #862 on: June 22, 2005, 02:56:59 PM »

If anyone is interested, I have been *throwing* around the idea of posting the complete factual things we know etc on a website.

Anyone think that woul dbe helpful so everyone doesn't have to go searching? lol I live in here practically, along with others, maybe it might be helpful to have simple facts we know? Yes no maybe so? lol Trying to be helpful  Wink
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jlspence
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« Reply #863 on: June 22, 2005, 02:57:12 PM »

Quote from: "luna"
One other thing before I have to run....no one has mentioned accidental alcohol poisoning for Natalee.

There have been lots more stories in the past year or so about sororities or fraternities and alcohol overdoses.  Plus, you hear a lot about students turning 21 and dying on their birthday cus they really aren't aware about the dangers of alcohol.

It is possible that Natalee became uncounscious when they were driving and they did leave her on the beach, rather than take her to the hospital.... stranger things have happened.  They may have thought she passed out and would wake up.

Just sayin it's possible.


The problem with this theory is that if it were true, none of the suspects would have a reason to fabricate other stories.
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absolut
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« Reply #864 on: June 22, 2005, 02:57:41 PM »

Quote from: "chloe2"
Poking my head in only for a moment --

Nat's on the front page of America's Most Wanted:

http://amw.com/missing_persons/brief.cfm?id=32411


Be prepared for an onslaught of new posters here.
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CaliGirl
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« Reply #865 on: June 22, 2005, 02:57:47 PM »

Quote from: "chloe2"
Poking my head in only for a moment --

Nat's on the front page of America's Most Wanted:

http://amw.com/missing_persons/brief.cfm?id=32411
I would LOVE to see John Walsh in Aruba!!!!!

I love that man!
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jpepling
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« Reply #866 on: June 22, 2005, 02:58:21 PM »

Quote from: "nisxan"
2. Is there any way to communicate to the DJ's at TOP 95 that neither NH's father or stepfather have ANYTHING to do with the U.S. government? That seems like a pretty simple thing to verify and clear up. In a case with so many question marks, any absolutes would be a welcome change.


Top 95's website is: http://www.top95fm.aw/

All types of contact info there including phone numbers, e-mail, and MSN Chat.
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klaasend
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« Reply #867 on: June 22, 2005, 02:58:29 PM »

Quote from: "iquitos"
THESE WERE ON THE SAME ARUBA MESSAGE BOARD LINK POSTED EARLIER TODAY.  THEY APPEAR TO BE POSTED BY A PARENT WITH A CHILD ON THE TRIP AND PROVIDE NICE INSIGHT.  I DID NOT FABRICATE THEM  NAMES REMOVED TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT, IF APPLICABLE
HAS ANYONE SEEN THIS BEFORE?  

Wednesday, June 1st, 2005, 08:51 AM
AXXXXX Member Join Date: May 31st, 2005Posts: 57

Re: HELP - POLICE?! how to contact?! Thank you both for the information! You're right, they're not likely to tell me anything, but I don't know what else to do. Our city paper finally published the story but with less details than we already know. The rumors are pretty awful. The girl was last seen about 54 hours ago, outside of Carlos and Charlies. Thank you for your prayers. Praying is likely the best we can do. True, this can happen anywhere, but it seems somehow the kids would use more caution elsewhere. The kids were made to feel it was a completely safe environment, even to walk around while drinking. This girl had no idea she was in danger until it was too late. And we parents back home were assured it was safe.We are still stunned, grieving, trying to be hopeful.Thank you for your thoughts.


Wednesday, June 1st, 2005, 10:20 AM
AXXXEEJ Member Join Date: May 31st, 2005Posts: 57

Re: HELP - POLICE?! how to contact?! From what I've heard about the trip, there were excursions to all the bars. The legal drinking age is 18, and these were kids that graduated the day before. We knew there would be drinking. The hotel package was all-inclusive -- all you can eat, all you can drink. That last fact was not something I knew. I had told my daughter not to leave the hotel compound unless on a chaperoned tour/activity. But kids often have a false sense of safety -- especially when they've been told they ARE safe -- and after a few drinks I'm sure they wouldn't exercise the best of judgement. This girl was last seen waving to her friends from a taxi en route to the hotel (the others were walking). They had all exited the bar more or less in a group.Please keep a tight rein on those kids, especially the girls. I can't figure out how so many people I've talked to recently somehow knew there was a "huge problem" of this sort in Aruba. The only "news" I've found via internet reads like a tourism brochure. Thank you all for your kind thoughts and suggestions. I will post when we find out something. It is agonizing to wait and not know anything...

Wednesday, June 1st, 2005, 03:11 PM
AXXXXX Member Join Date: May 31st, 2005Posts: 57

Re: HELP - POLICE?! how to contact?! Elaine,That is the part that is confusing to me, too. The newspaper report is different from what I heard from my daughter.My daughter ACTUALLY WITNESSED Natalee right outside the entrance to Carlos & Charlie's at around 1:00 a.m. Monday morning. (The paper says she left at 1:30.) My daughter was leaving the bar with two friends, and they were right behind another group. She called to Natalee and asked if she wanted to walk with them (I forget now if my daughter was headed to the hotel or the bar across the street; I think the latter). Natalee cheerfully said no, she would catch up to the group right ahead and walk with them (implying she would be along in a few moments). My daughter had no idea she would not see Natalee again.This part my daughter didn't see, but was told by her friends: That Natalie passed them on the road a short while later, and that she was a passenger in a taxi with another person. She clearly did not know she was in danger; she leaned out the window and shouted something like "Aruba!!! WOOHOO!" Still having a wonderful time. I have read and heard other versions since then -- that she was actually seen getting in a car with three men; that she was alone with the guy in his car; that it was a grey car; that it has been impounded by the police. I don't know which is the accurate account.The kids she passed assumed she was headed back to the hotel complex. No one thought there was any danger; obviously Natalee did not think so either.That's the only bit I know was witnessed by my daughter or her other friends. But it is agreed that the guy misrepresented himself, and that she got in willingly. Also, I assume everyone in the bar had been drinking, but none of those who passed Natalee had the impression that Natalee was falling-down-drunk or anything like that. I mean to say, probably she had been drinking and wasn't exercising good judgement, but she wasn't bad off enough to cause concern, or someone with the group would have taken her back to the hotel. There were chaperones there, the kids were of legal drinking age, and no one realized there was any danger.I'll post if I hear any more news, and now that the media is covering this, I'll very much appreciate reading anything that you guys find out.Thanks, all!

Seen them all before!  They were all written by Arlee.  If you have a question regarding these posts, why don't you ask her?
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DivaToo
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« Reply #868 on: June 22, 2005, 02:58:38 PM »

Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "DivaToo"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "DivaToo"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
This is for whom I consider head MONKEY SLEUTHS..Cali and Kerin...have either one of you guys tried to contact media, authorities, etc reagrding the wonder woman email?


I emailed it to Greta



DIVA? No chit??? YOU GO WOMAN......<bowing down> I have underestimated you....lol


As soon as WW posted, I was waiting. Told Greta to see what she thought of it, she's REALLY good at getting down to the truth!




Girl, if you hear back, YOU HAD BETTER TELL US...lolol


Hope they do get back to you.

 Laughing  Laughing  Laughing
I do not mean to laugh, but some how I get the feeling if the email gets talked about by Greta we will be seeing it tonight on Fox with no reference of where it came from or attribution. Call it a hunch. I would like to think not, but its a hunch.


Hey!!! I want my shout-out!! NO no J/K  Laughing
I thought the same & will be watching...
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absolut
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« Reply #869 on: June 22, 2005, 02:58:49 PM »

Quote from: "CaliGirl"
If anyone is interested, I have been *throwing* around the idea of posting the complete factual things we know etc on a website.

Anyone think that woul dbe helpful so everyone doesn't have to go searching? lol I live in here practically, along with others, maybe it might be helpful to have simple facts we know? Yes no maybe so? lol Trying to be helpful  Wink


Yes, but.....how to agree on the facts.

I can host it if needed.
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melrose
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« Reply #870 on: June 22, 2005, 02:59:41 PM »

Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "melrose"
Quote from: "ScubaSteve"
I have already said this don't know if anyone seen it, I feel it is very plausible and a lot more realisitc than many of the other proposed scenerios (international kidnapping, drug rings, etc.)

If you consider the Deepak email to be authentic, and furthermore their time of arrival at the bar to be truthful.... then the theorized "drugging" of natalee by JVS and company doesn't really fit.

JVS arrives at 12:30 bar closes at 1... that's a 30 minute gap. Now consider Natalee has already had her fair share of drinks leading up to this point. I don't know about you but the drinks don't go down as smooth after you have already had your fair share. In order for JVS to drug her he would have to hand her a drink upon his immediate arrival to the bar, which doesn't make much sense. Furthermore, I speculate it would take NH a good 25 plus minutes to even finish the drink after already having her fair share...especially if she was dancing.

Perhaps she and some of the MBHS boys (and girls who knows) voluntarily drugged themselves to make their last ngiht of vacation special?

Or perhaps MBHS boys could have slipped something into Natalees drink? (They were with her the majority of the drinking window that night)

Where do the MBHS students get the drugs from? Consider this scenerio: IT has already been reported that some of the students took the Tatoo boat with DJ Steve Croes....
...Some of the boys make friends with Croes (not common I have befriended and drank with DJ's on past trips).... They get to talking, Croes offers a connect for drugs if they are looking for it... one thing leads to another....

...Perhaps that is why Croes has been reported as cooperating with authorites.. many of you have even speculated he may just be a witness


I belive that is the more likely scenerio. As to what happened after leaving CC, I do not really know. MY guess would be that Nat OD's... JVS and the boys panic and get rid of the body...they know it doesn't look good since they were the last ones with her... which could explain why they act as if they are guilty.

Aslo- with the recent reporting of fights between MBHS boys and Joran... leads to further speculation.  Why would MBH boys get into a fight with Joran?  Did they want to "hook up" with Natalee and feel Joran was impeading that?  That is usually the most common reason for such fights; over a girl.

The fact that Joran knew that MBH boys knew who he was ever further confirms why Joran and the brothers would act guilty.  Put yourself in their position.  You take a girl away from a bar, the same girl whose guy friends you got into a fight with, and she mysteriously dies on you on the beach.... Joran and the brothers to realize "hey this is not good we are goign to be the first people they suspect"  
....plus Joran and the boys would almost definetly have 0 knowledge of Natalee being drugged by MBHS boys.... so her death to them is just as big of a mysterious as it is to us... so what do they tell the police?  "UM yea she just went unconcious and died... police do an autopsy and find the cause to be drugs.. who do you think is taking the rap for that???


I am also thinking this same scenerio is what happened.  Until we find out when the scuffle occurred, what it was about and what was going on in C&C before Jorvan and Co arrived we can only speculate.


I don't think that fits.  Someone that is behaving innocently would have called an ambulance/police immediately, not think up a scenario and dispose of a body.  Doesn't fit the rational train of thought.


adult rational thought or teenage rational thought?  They may have also left her on the beach as one of the rumoured various stories.  I just think we won't have a complete picture of the truth until we know what happened at the bar before Joran arrived.
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Angiex911dsptchr
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« Reply #871 on: June 22, 2005, 02:59:50 PM »

Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Poking my head in only for a moment --

Nat's on the front page of America's Most Wanted:

http://amw.com/missing_persons/brief.cfm?id=32411
I would LOVE to see John Walsh in Aruba!!!!!

I love that man!


I agree with you Cali.. hes awesome.
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KerinTX
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« Reply #872 on: June 22, 2005, 03:01:08 PM »

Quote from: "DivaToo"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "DivaToo"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
This is for whom I consider head MONKEY SLEUTHS..Cali and Kerin...have either one of you guys tried to contact media, authorities, etc reagrding the wonder woman email?


I emailed it to Greta



DIVA? No chit??? YOU GO WOMAN......<bowing down> I have underestimated you....lol


As soon as WW posted, I was waiting. Told Greta to see what she thought of it, she's REALLY good at getting down to the truth!


Nikki, sorry I  am behind.  Confused Actually yes, I sent it to the Houston Chronicle since Natalee's uncle lives here and they are following the story closely (wanted to have it go to one local). Then I sent it to ABC and sent a copy specifically to The View (hoping selfishly they would use it in HOT TOPICS today since Bo Bice was there as co-host and would maybe "say my name") LOL. I am an ABC viewer so that's all I sent it to. FOX is making me mad  Evil or Very Mad lately so I didn't bother...figured someone else would. Plus I do like CNN but I think someone in here works for them so I left that alone. OH...and I also printed it and added it to the board and cross-referenced the supposed facts.
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luna
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« Reply #873 on: June 22, 2005, 03:02:26 PM »

Quote from: "CaliGirl"
If anyone is interested, I have been *throwing* around the idea of posting the complete factual things we know etc on a website.

Anyone think that woul dbe helpful so everyone doesn't have to go searching? lol I live in here practically, along with others, maybe it might be helpful to have simple facts we know? Yes no maybe so? lol Trying to be helpful  Wink


ArubaGirl I think that would be great!  Have thought of the same thing, but no time.
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Getagrip
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WWW
« Reply #874 on: June 22, 2005, 03:02:27 PM »

Quote from: "chloe2"
Poking my head in only for a moment --

Nat's on the front page of America's Most Wanted:

http://amw.com/missing_persons/brief.cfm?id=32411


Interesting...I don't recall seeing this factoid anywhere before:
According to Natalee's stepmother, Robin Holloway, friends say Natalee was last seen with a local resident who claimed to be a foreign exchange student (AP).
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nikkibnurse
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« Reply #875 on: June 22, 2005, 03:02:33 PM »

Quote from: "Angiex911dsptchr"
Quote from: "arlee"
Quote from: "Angiex911dsptchr"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Angiex911dsptchr"
While on the trip.. have any of the MB kids stated at anytime during the trip before NH went missing.. IF she stayed out all night and didnt return any of the other days? Maybe this was asked long ago.. I know when I was younger.. things like that happened.. and friends covered our backs.. I was curious to know ??


I have asked repeatly and never gotten an answer.


To my knowledge, this has not been answered, more like dodged.I would love to ask, if they are claiming that they were not worried because everyone was switching rooms etc etc.. but Natalee is not everyone. She's been said to be responsible, level-headed etc. Would love to know if she had switched room prior to them thinking this. Otherwise, I have a problem with that claim IMHO because normally, someone as she has been described as, would tell someone....gotten something out of the room. Her bags were packed and left on her bed. I think that to be disturbing. Yeah, girls borrow clothes etc etc but she was already packed up and not there. Just odd that no one when waking up wondered why Natalee bags were packed and still ont he bed prior to meeting at the bus.


My point exactly Cali and Karin..Im not blaming her roomates or anything like that.. I know what we did on our senior class trip.. close friends knew if we wernt going to be in our room that night..You know how girls like to tell one another everything... I guess it made me think back to my trip which was years ago. 1983 exact.. Just made me wonder if her friends may know of other evenings she may have not come back to the hotel and thought nothing of her bag being packed on the bed.. figuring perhaps shes been on all night before one of the days..?? Confusing as hell!


Reading too much into this, folks.  My daughter is about as level-headed as they come, smart as a whip, not always so organized but has herself together.  (OK, that's a mom talking, but I am pretty objective.)  She (Dash) tells me that Natalee is MORE so.  She looks up to Natalee.  She admires her.  Natalee has earned her accolades, believe me.  And the fact that her bags were neatly packed and ready to go the night before *does* say something about her routine, her level of responsibility even on a vacation.  I've seen photos of my daughter's hotel room.  Oof.  For a girl as responsible as Dash is, her own bags looked like they'd exploded.  What I'm saying is that in so many ways, Natalee is above and beyond.  It's part of why what happened is so confounding.

As for the packed bags & no Natalee raising a red flag to the roommates -- well apparently it did.  As soon as they realized something was wrong -- and we *cannot* speculate as to when that was or why that was or why it didn't happen sooner -- they said they immediately began working with the chaperones on the situation.  At this point, I think the particulars of that are not for any of us to know.

But going back to this example of the how/where/why's of a responsible, level-headed girl's behavior on this trip:  Dash (who fits that description nicely) was by the pool with 10-20 friends until 5 a.m.  Some of those friends came & went during that time.  Some of them included one of Natalee's roommates for at least part of the time.  Dash was with a group, she knew she was safe, & that was good enough for her.  She didn't bother to check in with anyone, close friends or roommates included.  And it was good enough for Dash's roommates as well, evidently.  When she got back to her room, it was empty.  And she wasn't worried at all.  Is it a great mystery where any of these roommates were, Dash included?  Does it cast doubt on any of the 3 girls that they didn't inform each other of whereabouts?  Nope.  Typical teen behavior on a trip.  Not saying that's *good,* but it's typical, & especially for the kids on this trip, going by individual reports.  Not all girls check in & confide the way it's assumed here.

Another thought:  Natalee was with some of her best friends on this trip, but maybe not *all* of her best friends went.  Maybe her *best* best friend wasn't there.  Dash's wasn't.  So maybe *the* girl she confides in wasn't available & she kept her feelings somewhat to herself.  I don't know -- I'm just throwing that out.

Since their return, not all of the 150 or so kids are in direct phone contact with each other.  You couldn't expect them to be.  And most haven't considered calling Natalee's very best friends.  Through the grapevine we've heard they've been in a terrible state for these weeks.   So no one would have been able to -- or wanted to -- intrude on them with questions as to Natalee's whereabouts 24 hours a day for the entire trip.  As I've said before, who but the roommates even know if the *roommates* stayed in their same room every night?  Them and the FBI, I should say.  Yes, almost if not all the students have been individually question by this time.

I've been following this board for several days but never saw your questions before.  How many posts on each page?  How many pages per thread?  How many threads in succession?  If I or Dash or MBHS05 or others had seen the queries, we'd have answered best we could, but we still wouldn't likely know *the* answer.  Just because a post isn't answered doesn't mean the question was dodged.  Odds are that it just wasn't seen.  (A fact in my case.)

We all have been assuming facts not in evidence, on everything.  Which of you said you're realizing that all we really know is that Natalee is missing?  You are EXACTLY RIGHT, frustrating as it is.   Sad



Thank you very much for your post!



Excellent post from mom of Dash...very well said and matter of fact...
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KackyLacky
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« Reply #876 on: June 22, 2005, 03:03:38 PM »

Quote
="iquitos"edited for space


iquitos, these were posted by Dash's mom, known here are "arlee" This was determined earlier and were posted from 5/31 thru 6/2
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nikkibnurse
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« Reply #877 on: June 22, 2005, 03:04:04 PM »

Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "DivaToo"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "DivaToo"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
This is for whom I consider head MONKEY SLEUTHS..Cali and Kerin...have either one of you guys tried to contact media, authorities, etc reagrding the wonder woman email?


I emailed it to Greta



DIVA? No chit??? YOU GO WOMAN......<bowing down> I have underestimated you....lol


As soon as WW posted, I was waiting. Told Greta to see what she thought of it, she's REALLY good at getting down to the truth!


Nikki, sorry I  am behind.  Confused Actually yes, I sent it to the Houston Chronicle since Natalee's uncle lives here and they are following the story closely (wanted to have it go to one local). Then I sent it to ABC and sent a copy specifically to The View (hoping selfishly they would use it in HOT TOPICS today since Bo Bice was there as co-host and would maybe "say my name") LOL. I am an ABC viewer so that's all I sent it to. FOX is making me mad  Evil or Very Mad lately so I didn't bother...figured someone else would. Plus I do like CNN but I think someone in here works for them so I left that alone. OH...and I also printed it and added it to the board and cross-referenced the supposed facts.


you are Da bomb
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ScubaSteve
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« Reply #878 on: June 22, 2005, 03:04:29 PM »

Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "melrose"
Quote from: "ScubaSteve"
I have already said this don't know if anyone seen it, I feel it is very plausible and a lot more realisitc than many of the other proposed scenerios (international kidnapping, drug rings, etc.)

If you consider the Deepak email to be authentic, and furthermore their time of arrival at the bar to be truthful.... then the theorized "drugging" of natalee by JVS and company doesn't really fit.

JVS arrives at 12:30 bar closes at 1... that's a 30 minute gap. Now consider Natalee has already had her fair share of drinks leading up to this point. I don't know about you but the drinks don't go down as smooth after you have already had your fair share. In order for JVS to drug her he would have to hand her a drink upon his immediate arrival to the bar, which doesn't make much sense. Furthermore, I speculate it would take NH a good 25 plus minutes to even finish the drink after already having her fair share...especially if she was dancing.

Perhaps she and some of the MBHS boys (and girls who knows) voluntarily drugged themselves to make their last ngiht of vacation special?

Or perhaps MBHS boys could have slipped something into Natalees drink? (They were with her the majority of the drinking window that night)

Where do the MBHS students get the drugs from? Consider this scenerio: IT has already been reported that some of the students took the Tatoo boat with DJ Steve Croes....
...Some of the boys make friends with Croes (not common I have befriended and drank with DJ's on past trips).... They get to talking, Croes offers a connect for drugs if they are looking for it... one thing leads to another....

...Perhaps that is why Croes has been reported as cooperating with authorites.. many of you have even speculated he may just be a witness


I belive that is the more likely scenerio. As to what happened after leaving CC, I do not really know. MY guess would be that Nat OD's... JVS and the boys panic and get rid of the body...they know it doesn't look good since they were the last ones with her... which could explain why they act as if they are guilty.

Aslo- with the recent reporting of fights between MBHS boys and Joran... leads to further speculation.  Why would MBH boys get into a fight with Joran?  Did they want to "hook up" with Natalee and feel Joran was impeading that?  That is usually the most common reason for such fights; over a girl.

The fact that Joran knew that MBH boys knew who he was ever further confirms why Joran and the brothers would act guilty.  Put yourself in their position.  You take a girl away from a bar, the same girl whose guy friends you got into a fight with, and she mysteriously dies on you on the beach.... Joran and the brothers to realize "hey this is not good we are goign to be the first people they suspect"  
....plus Joran and the boys would almost definetly have 0 knowledge of Natalee being drugged by MBHS boys.... so her death to them is just as big of a mysterious as it is to us... so what do they tell the police?  "UM yea she just went unconcious and died... police do an autopsy and find the cause to be drugs.. who do you think is taking the rap for that???


I am also thinking this same scenerio is what happened.  Until we find out when the scuffle occurred, what it was about and what was going on in C&C before Jorvan and Co arrived we can only speculate.


I don't think that fits.  Someone that is behaving innocently would have called an ambulance/police immediately, not think up a scenario and dispose of a body.  Doesn't fit the rational train of thought.



Heavyheart--

What if they weren't behaving totally innocently?  When the story first broke it was reported that all 3 had their way with her.  Which is very possible if it was her first time being "drugged".  Possible that she could have even went unconscious during intercorse..... I think at that point the boys need to start thinking about thinking up a scenario and disposing of the body...

In sumation.. the only thing I am fairly certain of is what occured before Nat left CC.  If JVS and the boys arrived at CC at 12:30.. it is practically impossible for them to have drugged her.  That is of course if she was even drugged, which many of you are leaning towards... if she wasn't my theory is baseless
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amillerwvu
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Posts: 151



« Reply #879 on: June 22, 2005, 03:04:35 PM »

Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Oh, BTW, FYI, and all that jazz..for anyone interested and anyone who was on about 12;30 this a.m., i went to the MD...no cancer..no benign tumors..nothing..nada...zilch..and zippo!!!!!!!


Ok, back to your regularly scheduled programming......


I am so happy to hear that!...how wonderful!
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