Lively Case Discussion #506 8/4 - 8/6/2006

[Ono]

To your question whether I have a girlfriend, I answer to you that I had a girlfriend. After this happened I told my girlfriend what had happened and she wasn't happy about it. My girlfriend's name is "Elaine" but I do not remember het last name now. I do not know the address where Elaine lives but I can point out her house to you. Elaine is Aruban and she studies at the Colegio Arubano Oranjestad. A few weeks ago she and her fellow students went to Venezuela. She now is in class V-4 on the Colegio Arubano and she is 17 years old. Elaine has a mobile phone, but her name is under the nickname "Fishy" in the memory of my mobile phone.

He does not remember her last name?!

  Yeah..he's into "serious" relationships.  LOL !
Every other sentence is laced with lies.  He is a piece of work.

[terryd270]

CUL ("see you later") — abbreviation used in text messaging and e-mails

[San]

So Joran knows his friends by nationality (Luis BETANCOURT is a Venezuelan and according to me Joshua is Colombian )..  

Freddy ZEDAN" Freddy is a Venezuelan  Nickname Fefi

 "Jaime CARASQUIA  Jaime is a Columbian

Koen GOTENBOS nickname Cul

Florencia METZ -is from Argentina - 16 most likely not a sweet 16..

Elaine is Aruban Don't remember last name  Girlfriend.. - Nickname is fishy..


Someone that is into the nationality of their friends are more likely to used the Hitler comment..  


Jaime CARASQUILLA Beto What does Beto mean?

Deepak's nickname is "Tupac"  I guess for the dead rapper..

The only Tupac I ever heard of was the rapper who is now dead and also went to jail for the rape of a young girl.

Wasn't there a statement not long ago that Deepak wanted to go out and rape a girl.

[Ono]

Klass:

Those stickers are absolutely gorgeous.

As far as Aruba/Venzuela  goes...Chavez is salivating at the thought of officially claiming that little island as his very own domain.  It isn't in the far distant future I believe...One interested in history contemplates what Holland will do if push comes to shove...Hhmmnn...??

The only thing I liked on my trips to Venzuela were the beautiful women!!!!   It is truly a Third world country and I never felt safe there! Always someone wanting to take advanatage of you!!!

Yes..I can only imagine.  Bad things afoot there and more to come in the future.  I would feel quite uneasy living on Aruba, for more reasons than one now.

[terryd270]

The sad thing is that there is no penalty for all the lies we can catch any of these PIMPS in..  It just shows that we that are just wanting Natalee's family to have some answers can see all the lies and the others just laugh at us because its their playground..

[terryd270]

I guess I better go before I get mad and start ranting but its really does make me mad to read stuff that we know are lies and big lies.. Joran is Aruba's hero, how sad is that..

[mishy]

To your question whether I have a girlfriend, I answer to you that I had a girlfriend. After this happened I told my girlfriend what had happened and she wasn't happy about it. My girlfriend's name is "Elaine" but I do not remember het last name now. I do not know the address where Elaine lives but I can point out her house to you. Elaine is Aruban and she studies at the Colegio Arubano Oranjestad. A few weeks ago she and her fellow students went to Venezuela. She now is in class V-4 on the Colegio Arubano and she is 17 years old. Elaine has a mobile phone, but her name is under the nickname "Fishy" in the memory of my mobile phone.

He does not remember her last name?!

         

and what a nickname!!

[Ono]

So Joran knows his friends by nationality (Luis BETANCOURT is a Venezuelan and according to me Joshua is Colombian )..  

Freddy ZEDAN" Freddy is a Venezuelan  Nickname Fefi

 "Jaime CARASQUIA  Jaime is a Columbian

Koen GOTENBOS nickname Cul

Florencia METZ -is from Argentina - 16 most likely not a sweet 16..

Elaine is Aruban Don't remember last name  Girlfriend.. - Nickname is fishy..


Someone that is into the nationality of their friends are more likely to used the Hitler comment..  



Jaime CARASQUILLA Beto What does Beto mean?

Deepak's nickname is "Tupac"  I guess for the dead rapper..

Yes... the Hitler comment comes straight out of a Sloot's imagination and mindset.

[Ono]

To your question whether I have a girlfriend, I answer to you that I had a girlfriend. After this happened I told my girlfriend what had happened and she wasn't happy about it. My girlfriend's name is "Elaine" but I do not remember het last name now. I do not know the address where Elaine lives but I can point out her house to you. Elaine is Aruban and she studies at the Colegio Arubano Oranjestad. A few weeks ago she and her fellow students went to Venezuela. She now is in class V-4 on the Colegio Arubano and she is 17 years old. Elaine has a mobile phone, but her name is under the nickname "Fishy" in the memory of my mobile phone.

He does not remember her last name?!

I wonder If Fishy stood for the way she smelled

ROTFL! Probably.

[San]

I guess I better go before I get mad and start ranting but its really does make me mad to read stuff that we know are lies and big lies.. Joran is Aruba's hero, how sad is that..

You are right terry.  Aruba made Joran into a hero.

[mishy]

I guess I better go before I get mad and start ranting but its really does make me mad to read stuff that we know are lies and big lies.. Joran is Aruba's hero, how sad is that..

You are right terry.  Aruba made Joran into a hero.

[Ono]

The sad thing is that there is no penalty for all the lies we can catch any of these PIMPS in..  It just shows that we that are just wanting Natalee's family to have some answers can see all the lies and the others just laugh at us because its their playground..

An attorney with a magnificent mind could put it all together though with the help of other great minds and come up with an astounding argument.  The answers are everywhere...it's just so overwhelming piecing it all together...Every lie is a doorway to something..We need Sherlock Holmes AND Hercule Poirot.  One problem is that Joran and Company have deliberately thrown up too many lies just to deliberately confuse..we are awash with lies...brilliant strategy. We're in a fog of their lies.

[Sue]

I guess I better go before I get mad and start ranting but its really does make me mad to read stuff that we know are lies and big lies.. Joran is Aruba's hero, how sad is that..

You are right terry.  Aruba made Joran into a hero.

ROFLMFAO

[Shizaru]

1. According to C. Croes Joran told him that the girl whose money he won back and the girl he left CnCs wth were the same girl, Natalee.  Deepak e-mail allegedly sent to "Betty" on June 5 says the same thing.  It appears from this statement that Joran had switched to saying it was Ruth by June 9.  Altho in Dave's book he says Dennis Jacobs was questioning him about Joran winning Natalee's money back in October.

2. "The friend of Natalee said to me to go and dance with Natalee because she fancied me." Interesting.  On Greta he mentioned speaking to a friend of Natalee when he walked in but didn't say the friend asked him to dance with Natalee. I wonder if any of her friends confirmed this.

3.  "Natalee took me by the hand and said that she wanted to go home with me. I had told her that I would take her home with me but I knew that that would be impossible because my dad and my brothers were home. Satish, Natalee and myself walked together when she asked me if she could come home with me."

And now of course he says they actually did go to his home.  If that happened, why did he originally deny it?  And I wonder if Satish backs Joran's story that Natalee asked him to take her home with him.

4.  "After I told Natalee that she was allowed to go home with me she told her friends that she would meet up later with them at the Holiday Inn Hotel."

Is this the encounter with Alana Jordan and her two friends?   If so that's not what Alana says she told them, Alana said she pointed at another group of MB kids and said she was going with them.  This could also be the conversation inside the bar that Laraine Watson described in her 302, where Natalee wanted Aliie Anderson to come meet two guys.

5.  "At approximately 01.15 hours, we walked from Carlos & Charlies to the outside."

Joran told Greta they left the bar when it closed at 1:00.  And from his description to Greta it appeared he was saying they walked straight to the car, not that they loitered around for 15 minutes.

6. "We got into the car and before Deepak drove off I told Deepak and Satish that Natalee wanted to go to my house but that I could not take her there because my father and brothers were home. After I told Deepak and Satish this they said it was OK."

No mention of this in Deepak's June 9 statement.  He says Joran told him to "drive around" in Papiamento.

7. "We drove off the parking lot and Natalee saw that her friends and girlfriends were standing between Royal Plaza Mall and the bus stop. We couldn't turn left so Deepak had to drive another around the front of Carlos & Charlies again. After that Deepak was able to turn left and Deepak stopped his car on the public road between Royal Mall Plaza and the bus stop."

This differs from Deepak's June 9 statement. Deepak said that after leaving, Joran asked him to drive around, they circled passing CnCs twice, "crawled" in traffic", would have passed CnCs 3 times but turned left instead of right due to seeing polis car and Deepak not wearing seatbelt.

Joran doesn't mention telling Deepak to drive around, has Deepak passing CnCs once instead of twice.  

8. "After this we drove past the front of "Karma" and then north of the Reinnassance Hotel. There Deepak turned right and then right again into the direction of the hotels. We drove south of Royal Plaza Mall but I did not see Natalee's friends anymore."

Here Deepak and Joran do agree, Deepak also says they turned around and drove back thru the Plaza intersection without seeing her friends.

9. "When we arrived at the stoplights and before we drove in front of Benihana/Hooters Natalee grabbed me by the chin and we started kissing each other".

Joran told PTL that he kissed Natalee first.

10. In this June 9 statement Joran says the "fingering" and slave comment occurred after they passed the Marriott.  Now he's saying they never passed the Marriott, that's where he and Natalee got out.

11.  "We drove up to the lighthouse and then we took the same road down again towards the Holiday Inn."

And of course now he says they never went to the lighthouse.  And he's never offered an explanation for why he lied about that, if he did. I lean towards thinking that the lighthouse trip is the truth and the trip to his home a lie.

12. "Natalee got out the back door on the right side and she fell to the floor."

The Deepak e-mail said the exact same thing, she fell to the "floor", not the ground.  

I think this faling down when she got out did happen, but at the beach not her hotel.

13. "After I did that Natalee said to me not to touch her and she walked into the direction/towards the lobby

I do believe she told him not to touch her at some point.

14. "You are informing me that when I was first interviewed as a witness that I told the detective that Natalee and me got out of the car close to/near Fisherman's Hut and walked in the sea."

So Joran may have actually been the first to claim they went to the beach?

And he mentioned being in the water with Natalee?

This is also intersting because in his Greta interview Joran did not say they got out near the Fisherman's Huts, he said they got out at the Marriott where there were other couples around, then walked north away from her hotel to the area near the Fisherman's Huts.  I wonder where Deepak and Satish say they got out, at the Marriott or the desrted area near Fisherman's Huts.

[MuffyBee]

Ohhh!  I see the BarfDoll is being trotted out.  Talk about long time no seeeee!!  

[SunFreak2]

4.  "After I told Natalee that she was allowed to go home with me she told her friends that she would meet up later with them at the Holiday Inn Hotel."

Wow, Joran makes it sound like he was doing Natalee a favor!

[Ono]

All throughout the canvas is the thread sewn by Joran that Natalee is chasing him..she is the agressor..he is the one kissed, desired, sought after...this is an attempt to whittle away any culpability in her kidnapping.

[San]

All throughout the canvas is the thread sewn by Joran that Natalee is chasing him..she is the agressor..he is the one kissed, desired, sought after...this is an attempt to whittle away any culpability in her kidnapping.

I agree Ono.  They are very worried about the Kidnapping charge.  Especially Deepak in his statement.

[Ono]

4.  "After I told Natalee that she was allowed to go home with me she told her friends that she would meet up later with them at the Holiday Inn Hotel."

Wow, Joran makes it sound like he was doing Natalee a favor!

It's his arrogant persona injected into his lie.  And we have to remember that Natalee thought he was a fellow student guest on holiday at the Holiday Inn.  She thought she was getting a ride back to the hotel with him.

[Ono]

All throughout the canvas is the thread sewn by Joran that Natalee is chasing him..she is the agressor..he is the one kissed, desired, sought after...this is an attempt to whittle away any culpability in her kidnapping.

I agree Ono.  They are very worried about the Kidnapping charge.  Especially Deepak in his statement.

They still are...as that is the one charge which they all know would stick like glue.  There's no getting around that one if only the charge would come.