Theory - possibly explains why she got into car

[LilOrphan]

Beth Holloway Twitty has been consistant in her statements to the press, but confusing. I was just laying up in bed trying to sleep and had this really off the wall review of her statements and what they infer. We heard there's a twist in this case that's "not like any other cases" from elected officials. So, with that and BHT's statements in mind, a strange scenario:

1"The boys know what happened to Natalee."

She doesn't say they harmed her, or anythign about them 'doing something' to Natalee. Just that they know "where she is" or sometimes, "what happened to her." Why is she avoiding saying they did something awful to her, which would be every parent's first instinct about a girl alone in a car with three strangers?

2." Natalee is alive."

We've attributed that to perhaps simply hope, but she's vehement. Perhaps it is hope. But I'm thinking she's sure of it. So why would she be so sure? Under the scenario of a crime of passion rape/murder, she wouldn't believe her daughter was alive. Probably not under the scenarios of white slavery or drug lords, either, because Natalee is nothing more than a bargaining chip or easily discarded by those people. Also, the reward $$ seems awfully low to entice big time bad guys, or any real bad guys who have much more to lose than to gain in $150,000.

3. Natalee did not run away.

Note she doesn't say Natalee is being held against her will, though, either. Just that she didn't intend to disappear and is, by all accounts, a loving, caring, responsible girl --

who willingly got into a car with three guys she hardly knew.

Put all of this together.

Natalee is alive. Someone has her, not by her own volition but not necessarily harmed, and maybe not completely unwillingly. The boys know what happened to her.

This leads me to believe that Natalee is with someone who knows her, and whom she knows, to some degree. Enough of a degree that her parents are relatively certain she is unharmed, sure she didn't just trot away off forever on her own, and someone known to the boys. Someone, maybe who looks like one of the boys --- enough that students from MBHS who were on the trip might confuse the two guys and not be sure when Natalee met which one, or videotape might have them mixed up perhaps.

What if Natalee got into the car with the boys because these boys offered to take her to meet up with this other party, and on doing so, "something bad happened." But they did not cause it to.

All of this describes the person mentioned earlier in the week by aia, and in a few posts in other places. Someone whose actions might scare the three guys enough to keep quiet, but someone they also believe won't harm her. Someone who was questioned and later released, and someone everyone keeps asking about but nobody seems to know anything about: LvG.

Maybe it's just nutty, but it makes sense to me. It also explains the cryptic comments made by one of Natalee's relatives about the $ being contributed possibly going to "Natalee's legal fees."

[golden]

As good a theory as any other about this sad situation.  It is funny how Lorenzo has'nt been discussed much since he was questioned.  The rumour of him being VDS illegit. son fits.  Dash did'nt positively indentify J as they guy she saw with N. at C & C.  Says she saw tall guy with dark hair.  Have'nt seen any pics of Lorenzo, but if he's J's half brother, there could be resemblance.

[LilOrphan]

As good a theory as any other about this sad situation.  It is funny how Lorenzo has'nt been discussed much since he was questioned.  The rumour of him being VDS illegit. son fits.  Dash did'nt positively indentify J as they guy she saw with N. at C & C.  Says she saw tall guy with dark hair.  Have'nt seen any pics of Lorenzo, but if he's J's half brother, there could be resemblance.

You noticed the "lorenzo silence" too? Maybe it is just that nobody wants to drag an innocent person into it - but we heard some good potential background around the time of his questioning.  Also, there were a bunch of main page posts in the comments section of SM written by Arubans who alluded to Natalee meeting and having a romantic interest in someone prior during the week, someone they were calling the fifth suspect who had an airtight alibi for that evening.   Since these were folks who earlier gave info that came to be, I trust they have decent sources.  

This is such a sad case, but as long as Beth Holloway Twitty believes her daughter is alive, that's good enough for me.

[Daniel]

This leads me to believe that Natalee is with someone who knows her, and whom she knows, to some degree. Enough of a degree that her parents are relatively certain she is unharmed, sure she didn't just trot away off forever on her own, and someone known to the boys.

Another argument in support of this idea would be that they've been hanging posters all over the island that showed her photo and read: "Kidnapped since 1:30 a.m. May 30". However, if it was a kidnapping, wouldn't someone have demanded a ransom for Natalees release by now?

[blfit]

This leads me to believe that Natalee is with someone who knows her, and whom she knows, to some degree. Enough of a degree that her parents are relatively certain she is unharmed, sure she didn't just trot away off forever on her own, and someone known to the boys.

Another argument in support of this idea would be that they've been hanging posters all over the island that showed her photo and read: "Kidnapped since 1:30 a.m. May 30". However, if it was a kidnapping, wouldn't someone have demanded a ransom for Natalees release by now?

Not necessarily....if she was kidnapped and sold into prostitution she'll be making them plenty of money.  It's not a happy thought but could be true.

[Daniel]

A forced prostitution scenario seems very unlikely to me. A girl like Natalee (clever, resourceful, english speaking, American, from a caring family) would be a liability rather than an assett to people in that kind of business.

[sandinmytoes]

As good a theory as any other about this sad situation.  It is funny how Lorenzo has'nt been discussed much since he was questioned.  The rumour of him being VDS illegit. son fits.  Dash did'nt positively indentify J as they guy she saw with N. at C & C.  Says she saw tall guy with dark hair.  Have'nt seen any pics of Lorenzo, but if he's J's half brother, there could be resemblance.

You noticed the "lorenzo silence" too? Maybe it is just that nobody wants to drag an innocent person into it - but we heard some good potential background around the time of his questioning.  Also, there were a bunch of main page posts in the comments section of SM written by Arubans who alluded to Natalee meeting and having a romantic interest in someone prior during the week, someone they were calling the fifth suspect who had an airtight alibi for that evening.   Since these were folks who earlier gave info that came to be, I trust they have decent sources.  

This is such a sad case, but as long as Beth Holloway Twitty believes her daughter is alive, that's good enough for me.

I only learned about Lorenzo tonight, and it's funny because my first thoughts were also of that "air tight" alibi that was spoken of yesterday. I asked in the other thread if anyone else had seen it but no one replied.

Things that make you go hmm...

[golden]

Beth Holloway Twitty has been consistant in her statements to the press, but confusing. I was just laying up in bed trying to sleep and had this really off the wall review of her statements and what they infer. We heard there's a twist in this case that's "not like any other cases" from elected officials. So, with that and BHT's statements in mind, a strange scenario:

1"The boys know what happened to Natalee."

She doesn't say they harmed her, or anythign about them 'doing something' to Natalee. Just that they know "where she is" or sometimes, "what happened to her." Why is she avoiding saying they did something awful to her, which would be every parent's first instinct about a girl alone in a car with three strangers?

2." Natalee is alive."

We've attributed that to perhaps simply hope, but she's vehement. Perhaps it is hope. But I'm thinking she's sure of it. So why would she be so sure? Under the scenario of a crime of passion rape/murder, she wouldn't believe her daughter was alive. Probably not under the scenarios of white slavery or drug lords, either, because Natalee is nothing more than a bargaining chip or easily discarded by those people. Also, the reward $$ seems awfully low to entice big time bad guys, or any real bad guys who have much more to lose than to gain in $150,000.

3. Natalee did not run away.

Note she doesn't say Natalee is being held against her will, though, either. Just that she didn't intend to disappear and is, by all accounts, a loving, caring, responsible girl --

who willingly got into a car with three guys she hardly knew.

Put all of this together.

Natalee is alive. Someone has her, not by her own volition but not necessarily harmed, and maybe not completely unwillingly. The boys know what happened to her.

This is the thing that keeps nagging at me.  I keep having the feeling that Natalee is somewhat compliant in this and BH knows that.  By swearing not to leave the island until she gets Natalee back, she's hoping to flush her out.  The stepmom said last night on Fox that she is going home to her children.  I'm sure Dave will follow soon.  Everybody else has to leave eventually.  Beth might not.  This is all just theory and conjecture.

[Dutchlady]

If you have ever been in this situation the hope is there as a person, the moment Beth talks of her dead daughter the search dries up, she is being forceful, hopeful and like many victims mothers positive during the times she still 'has her daughter'. Hence why she is saying I AM Natalees mom, it is a common thing. Equally common is the guilt and denial of the moms of those involved. It has to be someone else in complete opposite of  the victims loss. If this had been an Aruban girl then this could have been hidden from outside interference as a missing girl. Internationally every country including Holland is as vociferous in justice for Natalee.

I do not buy the alternative stories, yes some persons took Natalee and parents do not want to see the ugly side explained to them. To have her her campaign as long as it takes is a threat to those incarcerated as if they are freed and no  Natalee she will stay. Her former husbands wife has two small children under school age so that is why she has to go back.  Lets grant Beth the positive image of her daughter till if and when there is no hope. Being active in   speaking of Natalee is keeping locals involved in a real person requardless of where she comes from, so the US bit is a bitch from a mother that is feeling guilty and not wanting the discomfort that she has.. This happens. She said in past her son got into a fight and they the parents sorted it out, that means the judge in training did and it was all forgotten. Not this time, that is what she is saying. It has not dawned on her that when they find Natalee, which they will, she will be mortified with those scenes if she is in  fact murdered.

[Pete]

It has not dawned on her that when they find Natalee, which they will, she will be mortified with those scenes if she is in  fact murdered.

Yes, she will be mortified at the horror of it all, if her daughter has been murdered. And if Beth Twitty is the kind of parent I think she is, she will have to look at her child to know for herself that it is her child lying there. I know that I would, if I was in her place. Those will be images that she can never forget. I don't know how she will bear it. I couldn't.

[golden]

Dutchlady;  I have read several of your posts here at SM and on Reihl.  I respect some of the things that you have to say.  But you seem to be implying that others should not voice opinions, theories or speculate on this situation out of respect for Natalee and Beth.  Please know that I have posted many times of my great admiration and respect for BH and her quest for her daughter.  However I do think that thinking outside of the box and exploring all possiblities is the reason this thread is called
THEORY AND SPECULATION.  I would think that everyone would like to see Natalee returned to her family alive and well.

[Dutchlady]

I do not  take control of any opinions. I would ask that you look at the victims of Harold Shipman  MD who committed suicide and of his victims. I would ask why he got away with it so long, for we are still in shock.


I would ask why those who have no scientific background do not see the pattern.  You are all entitled to the opinion, meanwhile I am knee  deep in dirt looking for those who do not have funds to pay me as Miss Marple.

[RazzyBerry]

Theres not a mother in the world that would admit their child is dead until they see their body before them..

Youre theories are nuts.

[jump85ft]

This leads me to believe that Natalee is with someone who knows her, and whom she knows, to some degree. Enough of a degree that her parents are relatively certain she is unharmed, sure she didn't just trot away off forever on her own, and someone known to the boys.

Another argument in support of this idea would be that they've been hanging posters all over the island that showed her photo and read: "Kidnapped since 1:30 a.m. May 30". However, if it was a kidnapping, wouldn't someone have demanded a ransom for Natalees release by now?

Not necessarily....if she was kidnapped and sold into prostitution she'll be making them plenty of money.  It's not a happy thought but could be true.

The kid Joran didnt even have a car!!! what white slave trader cant affort a vehicle and rides a bike to school.
cmon ive been to aruba its almost a 2 hour boat ride to caracas venezuela at midnight or later  with coastguards patroling the waters to Caracas...i dont think shes going to get into a car unless she thought she was going to continue partying somewhere else and sleep on the planeride home.  JORAN called his paki friends to come pick them up and then the case grows cold.  i think they killed her and the father tried to help cover it up as well as get rid of evidence.  The aruban authorities are not going to arrest one of their own ie the father a judge in training unless they believe hes guilty. I HOPE THOSE {{edited}} ROT IN PRISON.  Women are to be respected and not forced to do things against their will. obviously JORAN didnt learn from his father how to treat a woman. Those VANDERSLOOTS are guilty and will pay the price of their actions. ....What idiot would come up with the excuse i left her at the beach and i went home.  JORAN may have told his parents this and they believed him but no one else does.

[FeliX]

The kid Joran ( pronounced URINE) didnt even have a car!!! what white slave trader cant affort a vehicle and rides a bike to school.
cmon ive been to aruba its almost a 2 hour boat ride to caracas venezuela at midnight or later  with coastguards patroling the waters to Caracas...i dont think shes going to get into a car unless she thought she was going to continue partying somewhere else and sleep on the planeride home.  JORAN (pronounced URINE) called his paki friends to come pick them up and then the case grows cold.  i think they killed her and the father tried to help cover it up as well as get rid of evidence.  The aruban authorities are not going to arrest one of their own ie the father a judge in training unless they believe hes guilty. I HOPE THOSE BASTARDS ROT IN PRISON.  Women are to be respected and not forced to do things against their will. obviously JORAN didnt learn from his father how to treat a woman. Those VANDERSLOOTS are guilty and will pay the price of their actions. ....What idiot would come up with the excuse i left her at the beach and i went home.  JORAN may have told his parents this and they believed him but no one else does.[/quote]

AGREED!  He did not have a car & Natalee never met the brothers....
She thought she was getting into a taxicab.....

[LilOrphan]

Theres not a mother in the world that would admit their child is dead until they see their body before them..

Youre theories are nuts.

Not sure if you're still around, but am 99 percent sure you don't know a thing about what a mother thinks in any kind of crisis situation. Unfortunately, I have firsthand knowledge -- and a mother knows.  Which reminds me, the Utah mother of that missing 11 year old scout swore he was dead --- right before they found him very much alive.

And according to reporters, what we've all been theorizing is way off the mark.  That would include your endless recounts of the same theory over and over and over.  Hmmmm, looks like both our theories are wrong.  

[MominTN]

There are boats tied up at the dock and also two small boats owned by the Tattoo for ferrying passengers.  Venezuela is 16 miles away.  I have an old boat that does 30 mph easily.  You do the math.

[Michael22]

It has not dawned on her that when they find Natalee, which they will, she will be mortified with those scenes if she is in  fact murdered.

Yes, she will be mortified at the horror of it all, if her daughter has been murdered. And if Beth Twitty is the kind of parent I think she is, she will have to look at her child to know for herself that it is her child lying there. I know that I would, if I was in her place. Those will be images that she can never forget. I don't know how she will bear it. I couldn't.

the worst part is not knowing

[Michael22]

There are boats tied up at the dock and also two small boats owned by the Tattoo for ferrying passengers.  Venezuela is 16 miles away.  I have an old boat that does 30 mph easily.  You do the math.

you ain't gonna go out in the middle of the night
in a 'small' boat
headed in a direction
that's 16 miles away
no nav tools
no real seamanship skills
(granted dj may have some)
but 16 miles away
with all probablity of getting lost at sea
even going as far out
that you would need to dump a body
in a small boat
think about it
you know how far you have to go out..?
pretty far till the lights on the shore are barely
visable
and then there's a chance of the current out there
overtaking the boat
you could be at full speed against the current
and just staying in one spot
(I'm 3/4 away from private pilots license.. and I've seen a small plane
going 'into' a strong wind... and actually go backwards..)

[mia]

How hard is it to leave Aruba on a private plane?  Would you have to register a flight plan?  How hard to leave Aruba on a private yatch?  Would you have to register any plan with any authority?  How many people on Aruba have private planes?