RBN #20 - 6/23/05 Evening

[klaasend]

Sorry..here is the dingy pic.

http://community.webshots.com/photo/303774481/303790129keaFOC

Looks more like a raft to me?

[arrabba]

does any one think it alittle funny that dutch-bag was surpost to be home in bed  at 11 on sunday  but monday  when they was looking for natelee he was out past 1

Some here have posted that they think pvds reported jvds was at a casino as a diversionary tactic to get people away from his house.  When they all arrived at the casino jvds call his dad and said he was home.

[littletxlady]

cancon wrote:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
HannieC wrote:
Scott,

Dutch people in general are not 'homofobic'. We have a saying here that is;" Leven en laten leven" it means; Live and let live.

yes I would say that is the general Dutch philosophy of life, having a Dutch mother and father and aunts and uncles and cousins living in the Netherlands.......they are not totally void however of some prejudices and hang ups

my uncle disowned my cousin and his wife because they adopted black children, so sad, so silly is the position of the rest of the family including my father, then my cousin and his wife sued my uncle over the family business, and my father sided with the kids, oops so not so live and let live all the time

Yes sure there are prejudice people, I think you have them everywere
But in general the 'dutch'people are very liberal and that is why we have so many misunderstandings with some american people on what is right and/or wrong. But that liberal thing has nothing to do with crimesuspects for that effect. We also think if you do the crime, pay the time( or something like that).

People in Holland are very tolerant and open. There is even a "HOMOMONUMET" Dedicated all people opressed for their sexual pref. I have a picture of it.......GOTTA LOVE IT!  

[cancon]

Oh, Gawd! here comes Geraldo...

you mean he is alive?????

too bad Geraldo you've been outscooped by the masterful Greta Van Susteren

hey is VanSusteren a Dutch name..........

I always thought it was German  

I think the prefix Van is always indicative of a Dutch name

I do not speak Dutch but my take here is Van Der is 'Son Of'

I think that's right. Literally just "of," if I'm not mistaken.

As in Van Der A Beach?  

is that in a Van By Der River

[KackyLacky]

yes Van mean "of"

As you would the Duchess of York, or William of Orange

like we have a friend whose last name is Van Nieuwenhuizen

that means Of the New House,

yes and Van der Sloot means "of the ditch"
interesting huh?

[heartache]

How Deserted are the Beaches in the early morning hours?

[arubagirl]

ORANJESTAD — Plaatsvervangend lid van het Gemeenschappelijk Hof van Justitie van de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba, Paul van der Sloot, vader van Joran van der Sloot (17), is vanmiddag iets na twee uur lokale tijd gearresteerd. Zo bevestigt politiewoordvoerder Jan van der Straten. Hij wordt in verband gebracht met de verdwijning op Aruba van Natalee Holloway. De vader was de afgelopen dagen al eerder door de politie ondervraagd. Ook mocht hij zijn zoon – die nu twee weken vast zit – niet bezoeken in de gevangenis.

Temporary member of the Common Court of Justice of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba, Paul van der Sloot [same Court is now denying that he is a member, by the way], father of Joran van der Sloot (17), has been arrested today a little over 2 pm local time. This has been confirmed by police spokesperson, Jan van der Straten. He is being linked to the disappearance on Aruba of Natalee Holloway. The father was already questioned the last few days by the police. He was also not allowed to see his son-who has now been detaned for two weeks-in jail.

De familie van Natalee Holloway heeft de beloning voor de gouden tip die leidt tot Natalees veilige terugkeer verhoogd tot 150.000 dollar. Eerder werd er 35.000 dollar uitgeloofd, later werd dat verhoogd tot 50.000 dollar. Voor de beloning is intussen een speciale Reward and Recovery Trust gevormd bij de Amsouth Bank in Birmingham, Alabama.

The family of Natalee Hollow has increased the rewared for the golden tip that leads to Natalee's safe return to 150.000 dollars. Earlier a reward of 35.000 dollars had been offered, later that was increased to 50.0000 dollars. A special Reward and Recovery Trust was formed for the reward by the Amsouth Bank in Birmingham, Alabama.


VERSCHILLENDE VERSIES

Volgens de politie verandert de zeventienjarige verdachte Joran van der Sloot steeds zijn versie van wat er op de avond van Natalee Holloways verdwijning gebeurde. De politie verhoort de vier vastzittende verdachten regelmatig en zegt daarnaast ook nog steeds getuigen te verhoren. Wat de echte toedracht is en wat er met de Amerikaanse scholiere is gebeurd, blijft echter nog steeds gissen.

DIFFERENT VERSIONS

According to the police 17-year-old Joran van der Sloot keeps changing his version of what happened on the night that the disapperance of Natalee Holloway occured. The police regulary interrogates the four detained supsects and additionally says that there are still witnesses to interrogate. What the true story is and what happened with the American schoolgirl, is still guesswork.

Het verhoor van de verdachte jongemannen gebeurt meestal in koppels van twee agenten. Ook worden er confrontaties gehouden, waarbij twee of meer verdachten aanwezig zijn en met elkaars tegengestelde versies worden geconfronteerd.

The interrogation of the suspected young men usually occurs in teams of two agents. Confrontatations are also held, where two or more suspects are present and are confronted with their opposing stories.

Het is niet de eerste keer dat Van der Sloot zijn versie van het verhaal verandert. In eerste instantie vertelden alle drie de jongens, toen nog als getuigen, aan de politie dat zij met Holloway naar de vuurtoren zijn gereden en naar Arashi en haar daarna bij het Holiday Inn hebben afgezet. Dit verhaal veranderde toen zij werden aangehouden. Holloway en Van der Sloot zouden bij de Fisherman’s Huts zijn afgezet en de twee broers Satish en Deepak Kalpoe zouden daarna naar huis zijn gegaan.

This is not the first time that van der Sloot changes his version of the story. In the first place all three boys, then still witnesses, told the police that they drove with Holloway to the lighthouse and then to Arashi and dropped her afterwards at the Holiday Inn. This story changed when they were detained. Holloway and van der Sloot alllegedly would have been dropped off at Fisherman's Huts and the two brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpe allegedly would have gone home.



KLACHTEN ADVOCATEN

Advocaten klagen ondertussen dat zij niet alle stukken krijgen. Rudy Oomen, advocaat van Deepak Kalpoe: “Men doet er alles aan om mij het werken zo moeilijk mogelijk te maken. Ik moet steeds druk uitoefenen en dreigen met een procedure om stukken te krijgen.” Ook advocaat Anthony Carlo, die samen met Ariean de Bie en Richie Kock de 17-jarige Joran van der Sloot verdedigt, bevestigt dit beeld. Het advocatenteam heeft een verzoek ingediend om bij de verhoren van Van der Sloot aanwezig te mogen zijn. Carlo: “Volgens het Wetboek van Strafvordering mag de verdediging bij de verhoren aanwezig zijn nadat de verdachte door de rechter-commissaris is gehoord.” De rechter-commissaris interpreteert dit artikel echter anders. Het verzoek werd gisteren door de rechter-commissaris afgewezen.

COMPLAINTS BY LAWYERS

In the meantime lawyers are complaining that they are not getting all documents. Rudy Oomen, lawyer of Deepak Kalpoe: Everything is being done to make my work as difficult as possible. I have to constantly put pressure and threaten with court cases to get the documents. Also Anthony Carlo, who defends 17-year-old Joran van der Sloot together with Arieaan de Bie and Richie Kock, confirms this view. The lawyer team has entered a request to be present at the interrogation of van der Sloot.  Carlo:" According to the Book of Criminal Law is the defense allowed to be present at the interrogation after the suspect has been interrogated by the Judge of Instructions". The Judge of Instructions, however, interpreted this article differently. The request has been denied yesterday by the Judge of Instructions.

De vader van Joran mag zijn zoon al een aantal dagen niet meer bezoeken, nadat een bezwaarschriftprocedure hierover in eerste instantie in het voordeel van de vader was gewonnen. Paul van der Sloot gaat tegen deze beslissing van de rechter-commissaris niet in hoger beroep, ook al zou hij zijn minderjarige zoon graag bezoeken. Advocaat Carlo: “Hij wil niet dat zijn positie de aandacht afleidt van de zaak.”


The father of Joran isn't allowed to visit his son for a few days already, after a courtcase  about this issue had been won in favor of the father. Paul van der Sloot is not going to appeal this decision of the judge of instructions, even though he would love to visit his underage son. Lawyer Carlo: "He doesn't want that his position would detract attention from this case."

De drie jonge verdachten worden waarschijnlijk morgen weer voor de rechter-commissaris geleid. Het OM zal dan om verlenging van hun bewaring vragen. Van de vierde verdachte, de 26-jarige dj Steve Croes, loopt de inverzekeringstelling zondag af. Als het OM hem langer vast zal willen houden zal het verzoek tot ‘inbewaringstelling’ waarschijnlijk ook morgen worden voorgelegd aan de rechter-commissaris. Rechter Bob Wit zal niet degene zijn die deze rol vervult, aangezien hij deze week is begonnen met zijn nieuwe taak als rechter aan het Caribbean Court of Justice in Trinidad.

The three young suspects will probably be brought before the judge of instructions tomorrow. The JD will then ask again for prolonging of their detention. On the fourth suspect, 26-year-old dj Seve Croes, the detention period will expire Sunday. If the JD wants to keep him detained longer, then the petition to "iplace in custody" [my mom is getting the dictionary, hold on] will also be probably be put to the judge of instructions tomorrow. Judge Bob Wit will not be the one who is in charge of this role, seeing that he has just started this week with his new job as judge on the Caribbean Court of Justice in Trinidad.

There are prob. some mistakes, sorry. Perhaps someone else could help translating

[inthepacific]

Sorry..here is the dingy pic.

http://community.webshots.com/photo/303774481/303790129keaFOC

Looks more like a raft to me?

That is a tube you stick behind a boat for pleasure use.(like waterskiing) LOL, that is no dinghy.

[Juvenal]

Aruba girl,

I am sure it is the same for visitors and residents.  I just don't think a legal system where the prosecutor, the judge and the supposed defense attorneys are just three stooge inquisitior, is something I want to be exposed to.  It seems to me that the defense attorney is not an advocate for the suspected, but a rubber stamp for the system.  Why even have a defense attorney who does not tell his client to keep his mouth shut?

Given enough time just about anyone can be encouraged to "confess".   Maybe it will turn out that Joran et.al., are guilty and can lead the officials to the body.  Maybe they will "confess", but not know where the body is or "confess" and say they dumped her at sea, and then nobody will have any confidence that the "confessions" are anything but forced.

There are flaws in the US system also, but at least in principle, one is entitled to the advice of a defense attorney immediately, and any defense attorney will refuse to allow his client to be interrogated.  From what I hear the Aruba system is closer to inquisition than questioning.  

Nobody wants a conviction of an innocent and nobody wants the guilty to go free.  This is all yet to be known, but I for one have no confidence in what I have seen thus far.

Neil--

I think it can be a good system, when it's done right, or get really fouled up when it's not. Same as common law in U.S.

One advantage it might have: It's "inquisitorial," rather than "adversarial."

The adversarial nature of common law, in my opinion, is what causes people who can afford better lawyers to get their way more often. That's probably the biggest weakness of common law. But we probably do other things better than civil law. It's sort of a trade off.

The problem is not really with either system, which are both ancient systems that have worked for a long time. It's the people who have to run it.

[nancy_drew]

OK ---- is the father a judge or not??????   All the people on the news keep calling him a judge....Natalees stepdad interupted Nancy Grace and told her he wasnt.  I didn't think he was either.  But it's annoying me that they keep calling him a judge if he really isnt!  Help me...is he or isnt he?

He's technically NOT a judge, but he calls himself a judge.  He's a judge in training and a former prosecutor.

I don't know what to think about his title. Even the former Asst. DA and now defense attorney in Aruba said he was a judge.  I don't think we have a point of truth about this.

[sandy]

Oh, Gawd! here comes Geraldo...

you mean he is alive?????

too bad Geraldo you've been outscooped by the masterful Greta Van Susteren

hey is VanSusteren a Dutch name..........

I always thought it was German  

I think the prefix Van is always indicative of a Dutch name

I do not speak Dutch but my take here is Van Der is 'Son Of'

I think that's right. Literally just "of," if I'm not mistaken.

As in Van Der A Beach?  

It crossed my mind as I wrote my post but 'beach' wasn't quite the way I spelled it.

[absolut]

Some one needs to have geraldo read the scaredmonkeys.com forum. He has it all wrong.

[writenow]

K, you're only allowed to read the Bible while you are in the jail at the police station.

I'm amazed by the reams of useless information I have stored in my brains.

Funny.

[Juvenal]

Oh, Gawd! here comes Geraldo...

you mean he is alive?????

too bad Geraldo you've been outscooped by the masterful Greta Van Susteren

hey is VanSusteren a Dutch name..........

I always thought it was German  

I think the prefix Van is always indicative of a Dutch name

I do not speak Dutch but my take here is Van Der is 'Son Of'

I think that's right. Literally just "of," if I'm not mistaken.

As in Van Der A Beach?  

is that in a Van By Der River

I think "Van der Sloot" literally translates "of the ditch."

[Ben]

Who's Grandpa is this?

http://community.webshots.com/photo/303788721/303788721DYbGof

[da wench]

yes Van mean "of"

As you would the Duchess of York, or William of Orange

like we have a friend whose last name is Van Nieuwenhuizen

that means Of the New House,

yes and Van der Sloot means "of the ditch"
interesting huh?

Are you serious??  That just made my stomach turn.

[Terry]

Listening to Jessica Lunsford Dad cry about trying to help others in other US states. oops he just used the sh*t word on NG

I am in tears    

S word again? That poor guy.    

[iquitos]

OK ---- is the father a judge or not??????   All the people on the news keep calling him a judge....Natalees stepdad interupted Nancy Grace and told her he wasnt.  I didn't think he was either.  But it's annoying me that they keep calling him a judge if he really isnt!  Help me...is he or isnt he?

Ijust heard on N ancy grace that he is in the early stages of judgeship.

Sounds like a student teacher kind of thing.

 

not a student teacher at all.  typical ignorant american news media they yak on about the guy for weeks and can't figure out basic facts like what he is.  I posted his appointment decree on here a week ago.  Maybe it is because its in a foreign language and in a foreign country xenophobes that we are.  he has a law degree, meester in rechten.  the has been a prosecutor on the island and now he is a substitute judge.  some dumbkopf woman reporter on fox was braying the other day that "he is not even a lawyer let alone a judge" and suddenly he is now a judge on fox because that makes his arrest more interesting.  I don't know what you have to do to be a full judge but he is a lawyer and a long time employee of the aruba (read dutch) judicial system  mondo cane

[clevfan1234]

Arubagirl, thank you very much!

[Juvenal]

OK ---- is the father a judge or not??????   All the people on the news keep calling him a judge....Natalees stepdad interupted Nancy Grace and told her he wasnt.  I didn't think he was either.  But it's annoying me that they keep calling him a judge if he really isnt!  Help me...is he or isnt he?

He's technically NOT a judge, but he calls himself a judge.  He's a judge in training and a former prosecutor.

I don't know what to think about his title. Even the former Asst. DA and now defense attorney in Aruba said he was a judge.  I don't think we have a point of truth about this.

From what I've been given to understand, he was studying to become a judge, and, as a justice official, occasionally got to "fill in" on cases, where he was needed. Sort of on the job training I guess. Very different from the U.S., were all judges are either appointed or elected.