Lively Case Discussion #507 8/6 - 8/7/2006

[Nut44x4]

I gues what really stuck in my head re: Celeste's pictures of Joran and his new blonde' friend was that in ALL or almost ALL other pictures I have ever seen of him and girls of choice, were girls/young women with dark hair...not a blonde. THEN, all of a sudden he returns to the beach area with this 'blonde. WTF did he expect??? I dunno, perhaps it is just me.......but it seems in past photos he prefers dark haired girls, then we see this. It just seems too staged, imo.

Nut... good point... they probably did hire someone to play his adoring gf....


and the letter from julia to celeste... they beat joran???  FOR the love of JOB, Julia think about your lies before you tell them.... my cat is smart enough to know better....[/quote]

I am not convinced she was 'hired', but it just seems very ODD to me that when he reappears on the beach, it is with a blonde and not his norm. I can't say I believe she was hired...that isn't what I meant. Just found it odd. Now this woman is no where to be seen and probably back in the Netherlands where he picked her up. It is just weird....a blonde.

[Nut44x4]

with blue eyes....strange

[mrs. red]

with blue eyes....strange

Nut, I know you didn't think she was hired... that my $.02...  

but seems like they are trying really hard to convince the aruban ppl that these ppl are worth it....

[Kimmy53]

OK - In Joran's statement, He tells what color Natalee's panties are and that they are embroidered.  The only place he supposedly "sees" them is in a dark car while they are "messing around" ??(sorry - I can't force myself to type what he said he did)  For one thing - it had to be pitch dark, for another, He did not say he had her clothes off - So how can he tell color and embroidery?

[Easywriter]

Just checked out FOB and those people are almost as bad as RU.  What a waste of oxygen.

It's a lack of oxygen to the brain that causes people to think this way.

They (FOB) are as bad, easy. Except they do not have wangchung as their main poster for what they call humor. They are all very sick, IMHO. However.....I can't stop reading at either site because I feel someday someone in either place will screw up and say something that we all need to know. I wish I did not have to go to either place.......but I can't stop and I won't stop until this is over.

Better you than me!  My BP couldn't take much of that chit! lol

I've read at RU a couple of times and will not be going back.  My visit to FOB today was enough for me as well.  That senseless garbage provides nothing of value.  Any sane person knows who the true victims are in this case.  All that peculiar cheerleading for the primary suspects and the constant belittling of Natalee's family doesn't sit well with me.

Some of that trash talk has been allowed to drift onto the BFN threads as well and that is very disappointing.  I read one post this morning that claimed Jossy was a terrorist funding the Hezbollah.  Where dose that kind of unsubstantiated garbage come from and why?

Is there a motive for starting such salacious rumors, or is it just complete ignorance fearing what it does not understand?

[SunFreak2]

HI Story and June 9

Thanks to all for finding the news reports of jvds apprehension.

According to Panhaul, this looks like pre-dawn arrest of jvds and reports confirm computer taken from sloot house.  In same report, we see reports of k2 arrest at similar time, but no mention of arresting officers.  The procedure followed is not significantly different from previous guards arrest on June 5 -- except that Jannsen and van der Straaten were prominently on the scene for Mickey and Abe's apprehension.

Pre-dawn raid on June 5, 2005, at one of security guards home.





Removing computer from Kalpoe home on June 9, 2005.

[San]

Hey Nut you can have as many scallops as you want!

Could it be None is here!

I almost went nuts trying to email you on Friday - I will try again right now!

I always thought whatever Jvds said to classmates at the beginning was the truest story.   It has no time to evolve.

I agree.  They were so egar to interview the MB kids but they were unwilling to interview the classmates of the main suspect.  The ALE made sure that didn't happen.

[nonesuche]

Kimmy-

Good point , just recollect the lighting in that Dutch re-enactment, it looks dark as pitch night doesn't it?

Hi Mrs Red-

I'd like to know what the "20 others" Joran and the pimps did prior, all look like? Wouldn't you? Do you suppose Greta even asked ONE detail regarding that statement?

[Nut44x4]

with blue eyes....strange

Nut, I know you didn't think she was hired... that my $.02...  

but seems like they are trying really hard to convince the aruban ppl that these ppl are worth it....

indeed

[Easywriter]

Wouldn't it be great if she turned out to be bait!

What do we know about her other than that she is blonde and Dutch?

[mrs. red]

Kimmy-

Good point , just recollect the lighting in that Dutch re-enactment, it looks dark as pitch night doesn't it?

Hi Mrs Red-

I'd like to know what the "20 others" Joran and the pimps did prior, all look like? Wouldn't you? Do you suppose Greta even asked ONE detail regarding that statement?

Right???  I wish there was a way for one of the 20 other girls to remember something.... and to do something that would help Natalee's family.....

what ever became of the person in the Boston airport.... I always thought she may have been one of the 20...

[nonesuche]

Does anyone recall the date around which Paulus was no longer allowed to have visitation alone with Joran? Remember that? There were concerns he was coaching him even then?

And it was Anita who called out the ALE for exceeding the interrogation time limit on one occasion for I believe it was the warden for KIA who divulged that too?

[the big hammer]

HI Story: Why So Long?

nonesuche writes: "...I think the answer could be as simple as Papa Sloot told these boys around the pool that day, what the story was. Kids do that, if an adult has enough information to truly hurt them, or worse if Paulus chose to - to hang them out to dry - they are like Pavlov's dog. They will ring that bell again and again..."

Yes.  Quite possibly.  With the 3 apprehended and in jail, paulus cannot coach them all.  In fact, it would be extremely risky to even attempt to do so.  So they go into jail without the coaching benefit, and all they can do is to continue to mouth the words they were told to say.  And this is what they do...UNTIL...

jvds moves off the story, and brings us to beach, as Steve Croes comes forward to corroborate the HI drop off lie, after the need for the lie had expired.  Did k2 move off HI drop at the same time as jvds? I bet not, and this could very well be a failed double cross of kalpoes.

But coming back to main point: from May 31 to June 9, they continued w/ HI drop off lie.  I could see them sticking to story through and including June 5, as at this point it seemed like successful railroading of Mickey and Abe was completed.  But this was derailed BEFORE the 3 were arrested on June 9.  From June 6 - June 8: guards produce viable alibi, contract w/ Allegro had ended on May 28 - they had no reason to be near the HI, HT family is publicly questioning police procedure, media is in frenzy around the island.

Somebody within ALE capitulates as a growing debacle is evident; jvds/k2 are arrested June 9 -- AND THEY STILL STICK WITH HI DROP OFF STORY!?! (If the HI story was so believeable to ALE, why didn't they continue search for a walkie-talkie holding man dressed in black?)

So ok, paulus can't get the new script to them beacuse they are jailed: they have to stick with the story because they don't know what else to say...

...and one of them "confessed" on June 10.

[Tylergal]

with blue eyes....strange

Well, I went to Refugess with hip waders on like hog farmers wear once, and found that there is a reason for this.  It is not fit to print in blogs with any modicum of decency, so I will leave it there.  Suffice it to say, there are kinky reasons, according to the refugees that he prefers dark skin, dark haired, dark eyed women, but it is not going to be said by me here on this board.  Maybe this girl just had a blond wig, blue contact lenses and one of those skin jobs, a la Michael Jackson.  You think?  Maybe it is really MedleyRelay.

[nonesuche]

Mrs Red-

I wish you could get that info from Greta on that person in Boston, that was such a teaser on her part, and might well have been concocted for ratings too - who knows about her ethics? I surely don't trust them now.

But why didn't at least ONE of those 20 girls come forth? It's a huge clue that Greta didn't ask that question, isn't it? Or "Joran why don't you ask one of those girls to exonerate your intentions by sharing her story?".

But no, Greta did nothing but let it lay there like a pregnant pause....

[Nut44x4]

Just checked out FOB and those people are almost as bad as RU.  What a waste of oxygen.

It's a lack of oxygen to the brain that causes people to think this way.

They (FOB) are as bad, easy. Except they do not have wangchung as their main poster for what they call humor. They are all very sick, IMHO. However.....I can't stop reading at either site because I feel someday someone in either place will screw up and say something that we all need to know. I wish I did not have to go to either place.......but I can't stop and I won't stop until this is over.

Better you than me!  My BP couldn't take much of that chit! lol

I've read at RU a couple of times and will not be going back.  My visit to FOB today was enough for me as well.  That senseless garbage provides nothing of value.  Any sane person knows who the true victims are in this case.  All that peculiar cheerleading for the primary suspects and the constant belittling of Natalee's family doesn't sit well with me.

Some of that trash talk has been allowed to drift onto the BFN threads as well and that is very disappointing.  I read one post this morning that claimed Jossy was a terrorist funding the Hezbollah.  Where dose that kind of unsubstantiated garbage come from and why?

Is there a motive for starting such salacious rumors, or is it just complete ignorance fearing what it does not understand?

I understand Easy, I do...and I hope that people here understand why I must continue to see other sides. 'Darksides' as we call them. I have learned in apx. 9 years of being involved with people on the internet, whether it be in chat at yahoo, or blogs and forums or message boards...for me after all this time here and there it is very easy to spot 'freaks', and I know how to watch them. Good people as we all are will hopefully understand my process in this matter.

[mrs. red]

I think the beach story came about because the ALE knew of the woman that had been accosted there... remember her?  The fisherman did come to her aid.....

so pvds gets a call from one of his buddies at the police station reminding him or telling him (since it probably wasn't reported) that this incident took place... wala, the beach story was concocted....

I don't believe they were ever at the beach.... I think it took place at the house... and they buried her in the shallow grave that Tim Miller found, then they moved her out to the landfill or the sea....

[nonesuche]

All great insights on your part Hammer...

What keeps troubling me is we know that 'confession' was ruled inadmissable due to exceeding the timeline allotted daily for interrogation.

We know Anita complained about that at least once...

Are those two events one and the same?

[mrs. red]

Mrs Red-

I wish you could get that info from Greta on that person in Boston, that was such a teaser on her part, and might well have been concocted for ratings too - who knows about her ethics? I surely don't trust them now.

But why didn't at least ONE of those 20 girls come forth? It's a huge clue that Greta didn't ask that question, isn't it? Or "Joran why don't you ask one of those girls to exonerate your intentions by sharing her story?".

But no, Greta did nothing but let it lay there like a pregnant pause....

Of course not... Greta is stuck on boeti (stupid!!)

[SunFreak2]

Does anyone recall the date around which Paulus was no longer allowed to have visitation alone with Joran? Remember that? There were concerns he was coaching him even then?

And it was Anita who called out the ALE for exceeding the interrogation time limit on one occasion for I believe it was the warden for KIA who divulged that too?

June 17, 2005 – Dutch judge Bob Wit rules that Paulus not be allowed visitation with Joran. Wit also barred Carlos (Joran’s attorney) from visting b/c Carlo had visited with security guards during their arrest.  Joran’s family hires Richie Kock and Arjan Debie as attorneys for Joran.  Judge Wit extends remand of J2K