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Author Topic: RBN #21 - 6/24/05 Wee Hours of The Morning  (Read 243632 times)
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« Reply #600 on: June 24, 2005, 11:07:32 AM »

Quote from: "Just Wunderin'"
She is VERY concerned about what her neighbors and others in her community think of HER.  Take note of her reaction when one of the interviewing reporters tries to broach the subject of Natalee going with the boys, being drunk, having sex; she always brushes that aside and says something to the effect that she doesn't want to dwell on the past, she just wants to find Natalee.  I suspect Natalee did get drunk and did have sex and did, possibly, do some drugs (knowingly or not).   They keep saying that she was so perfect, i.e., 4.0 average, gonna be a doctor, full academic scholarship, never did anything wrong, etc., etc., etc.  Come on people, we have all known parents who push their kids to the end of their rope and then that rope snaps.  In the photos of NH, her eyes are sad.  And, I am now sad for her.


Mrs. Twitty's community has shown consistent sincere support and commitment to finding Natalee.  They are doing constant fund raisers, making bracelets, prayer services.  Mrs. Twitty is well-respected in the community, especially after the strength and perseverence she has shown to find her daughter.  She is not concerned about what people are saying about her...regardless, it is all benevolent.

Also, Natalee excelled on her own.  Her parents have been very laid back and never forced her to do anything or guilted her into good grades/honors.  They are not extremely anal parents that would have caused their daughter to "swim away"...which is a pretty odd, albeit original, theory
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klaasend
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« Reply #601 on: June 24, 2005, 11:08:00 AM »

Quote from: "pinemeadows"
Anybody know what time the TX group is arriving?  Earlier, or very late last night, there was discussion about them going to the VDS property to check out that "smelly pond".  

It sure seems like the police should have done that by now....and if they haven't, I'm pretty sure the TX group is not going to be allowed on private property.

What time is it in Aruba??

Aruba time = Eastern time, so it's a little after 11:00am.
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nancy_drew
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« Reply #602 on: June 24, 2005, 11:09:18 AM »

Quote from: "iquitos"
greta was in her previous life as an attorney and remains an ambulance chaser


Iquitos:

That's rather harsh.  I have no information she was an "ambulance chaser"?  Can you give us a reference to that?  Was she a personal injury attorney?  I think it's great to debate the issues, the stories, etc. But, making a suggestion like this, if it's not true is way below the belt!

I sense quite a bit of jealousy of Greta with bloggers covering this case. Not sure why?  Each has their place in this story.  I praise her work...it's been factual, fair and gutsy.  IMO that depicts the best in journalism.
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PoorPaulaNNJ
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« Reply #603 on: June 24, 2005, 11:10:18 AM »

Quote from: "BlueKyGirl"
Quote from: "PoorPaulaNNJ"
I saw the CNN story yesterday on ScaredMonkeys. The two reporters seemed so genuinely excited about this blog that I am positive they are monkeys too, probably here all day and night, except when CNN cuts to them for reporting. At that point, I think they just minimize their SM page, talk about something else, then when the cameras cut away to something else, they bring SM back up and then both women begin frantically reading pages of SM posts to catch up. LOL
No matter where you are or what your occupation, all monkeys are hooked, and lovingly face the same challenges. Thank God for Scared Monkeys.


Haha--you're probably right! Love the avatar, by the way!


Thanks, BlueKyGirl; Can't you just see them reading and mouths open right now saying. Oooooh, look, they know we're here too! );
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Rob
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« Reply #604 on: June 24, 2005, 11:10:47 AM »

Quote from: "Just Wunderin'"
Don't want to rattle any cages, but I really take exception to BHT saying that NH would never go with these fellows willingly, that she was kidnapped.  BHT needs to wake up and smell the roses.  She cannot bring herself to admit that "her" daughter would ever drink, smoke, do drugs, have sex or act in any manner consistent with most teenage behavior.  Why do you think the other kids aren't talking.  They all went down there to get blasted and get laid!  BHT is a typical southern "lady", whose personal reputation with regard to her family and home are really more important than her concern for her missing daughter.  At one point she made the comment, "I am through protecting myself."  What is that suppose to mean?....protect her reputation, that is what.  She is VERY concerned about what her neighbors and others in her community think of HER.  Take note of her reaction when one of the interviewing reporters tries to broach the subject of Natalee going with the boys, being drunk, having sex; she always brushes that aside and says something to the effect that she doesn't want to dwell on the past, she just wants to find Natalee.  I suspect Natalee did get drunk and did have sex and did, possibly, do some drugs (knowingly or not).  My theory is that she did all this with JVDS and possibly the K brothers and maybe even the D.J. also and then she decided to take a swim in the ocean and just kept on swimming, knowing that her classmates were aware of her behavior and her personal shame and knowing the shame her mother would experience as a result of her doing all these things.  I expect that BTH put so much pressure on her while she was in school and in her community that she just didn't care anymore.  They keep saying that she was so perfect, i.e., 4.0 average, gonna be a doctor, full academic scholarship, never did anything wrong, etc., etc., etc.  Come on people, we have all known parents who push their kids to the end of their rope and then that rope snaps.  In the photos of NH, her eyes are sad.  And, I am now sad for her.

And, just for the record, before anyone goes off on me.  I am a southern woman, a mother of three grown children (2 boys, 1 girl)--none of whom are perfect by a long shot.  Mine would look me in the eye and lie to me and I know that most mothers will admit the same thing.  We don't really know our kids--just as our kids never really know us.

I suspect that JVDS, the K brothers, the DJ and PVDS are all aware of what happened.... and the problem is that they did nothing to help her, they just took advantage of her condition and then let her swim away......... Sad


just shut up!  {{{edit:  Rob.. others have a right to their opinion, please don't abuse your fellow posters. Thank you! The Zoo Keeper}}}
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« Reply #605 on: June 24, 2005, 11:12:49 AM »

Quote from: "Twelve Monkeys"
From Caribbean Girl on Riehl World Message board.


I live in the Caribbean as an Expat. The van der Sloots are Expats living in Aruba. The attitude of people coming from mainland countries to island nations to live is the key here. Why do they leave family and friends behind to move so far away? Well the obvious is the weather but there is more to the story. There is opportunity for mediocre people to make something of themselves. Expats also tend to have an arrogance about them, a false sense of superiority. They view themselves as the "smart, sophiticated" people coming from the big country to help the poor stupid island people.

The comment Anita VDS made about Paul giving 15 years of service to the island yada yada yada.... I have heard that beofre from Expats who think their (you know what) doesn't stink. They act like they have scaified so much to to come there and help the "poor" people of the island when in fact they have have no sense of altrsism at all they have only been their to line their pockets. More than likely PVDS would never have been able to reach the professional level he has in Aruba back home in Holland. If you compare his abilities to the main stream back home he wouldn't measure up. But in the Caribbean he feel he is a big shot. That is why their son, raised as an Expat, has the arrogant attitude that he does.

Now all that said when trouble occured their "superior" attitude made them belive they could just cover up the mess and use their "influence" to pressure the locals, which is what was happening the first week. They throught the stupid locals would never figure it out.

I am sure since Anita was away, Paul was having himself some fun and went out with Joran. Expat men are notorious for running around and boozing while their wives go on the long trips back home to visit family or on on shopping trips to the USA (can't buy that much on a small island and the US isn't that far away).

I live this life so I know. I recognize it for what it is. I hope they pay for all their sins which are many, and may the Aruban people rid themselves of this vermen. Other Expats be on notice that you ned to change your attitude.

Posted by: caribbean girl | June 24, 2005 09:06 AM
 

twelve monkeys.  thanks for that.  i too have lived the expatirate life as a mediocre petty bureaucrat (did not realize it at the time) and can identify with some of the poster's observations.  i think paul is probably a petty bureaucrat who may not have been competitive in the metropole.  but they did make their life in aruba and they were probalby too old to go home and start over what with young kids to support. i don't know that they were arrogant.  it is possible, but i imagine more that one aruban is revelling in their predicament. it is such a caricature.  sweating, deer in the headlight dutchies caught up in the same system they have perpetuated beyond its natural life.  they have been running the place since 1623.  tune in to 95.1 the news is on.
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tkubi7
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« Reply #606 on: June 24, 2005, 11:13:01 AM »

Just wonderin..let me see if I understand your theory. 1) Natalee got drunk and did drugs
2) natalee had sex with 1-3 of the boys
3) natalee took a swim (in her skirt and blouse)
4) Natalee was so distraught over her non southern behaior that she just kept swimming to avoid bringing shame on herself and her mother

OOOOKAAAAY. Sounds like every teenager I ever knew...not
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islandgurl
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« Reply #607 on: June 24, 2005, 11:13:34 AM »

Quote from: "pinemeadows"
Anybody know what time the TX group is arriving?  Earlier, or very late last night, there was discussion about them going to the VDS property to check out that "smelly pond".  

It sure seems like the police should have done that by now....and if they haven't, I'm pretty sure the TX group is not going to be allowed on private property.

What time is it in Aruba??


If  this pond is on VDS property then I would hope it had already been searched.  This group from texas has cadaver dogs and sonar etc and that is great I'm hoping they can do better than the Police have.  Wouldn't the FBI have access to these tools (and more)?  This makes me think the Aruba LE isn't letting the FBI do as much as they could.
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Twelve Monkeys
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« Reply #608 on: June 24, 2005, 11:14:39 AM »

Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "iquitos"
greta was in her previous life as an attorney and remains an ambulance chaser


Iquitos:

That's rather harsh.  I have no information she was an "ambulance chaser"?  Can you give us a reference to that?  Was she a personal injury attorney?  I think it's great to debate the issues, the stories, etc. But, making a suggestion like this, if it's not true is way below the belt!

I sense quite a bit of jealousy of Greta with bloggers covering this case. Not sure why?  Each has their place in this story.  I praise her work...it's been factual, fair and gutsy.  IMO that depicts the best in journalism.


Greta made her mark like a lot of the media attorneys while covering the O.J. Simpson case. In Greta's case the cream rises to the top and here she is.
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« Reply #609 on: June 24, 2005, 11:15:20 AM »

Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "iquitos"
greta was in her previous life as an attorney and remains an ambulance chaser


Iquitos:

That's rather harsh.  I have no information she was an "ambulance chaser"?  Can you give us a reference to that?  Was she a personal injury attorney?  I think it's great to debate the issues, the stories, etc. But, making a suggestion like this, if it's not true is way below the belt!

I sense quite a bit of jealousy of Greta with bloggers covering this case. Not sure why?  Each has their place in this story.  I praise her work...it's been factual, fair and gutsy.  IMO that depicts the best in journalism.


No jealousy here - actually i considered her handling of the OJ trial one of the highlights of my viewing history - when she moved to FOX I was truly disappointed because I do not have access to FOX - I think she is doing an incredible job in this instance but I have to remark on what a fine line she is treading between journalism, lawyering, etc. - a fine line - when all is said and done - only she is agile enough to navigate.
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« Reply #610 on: June 24, 2005, 11:15:31 AM »

Quote from: "Gerben aka Pays Bas"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Gerben aka Pays Bas"
Quote from: "mojo"
Gerben, i have a question for you - a bit muddled perhaps but here goes:

if there is no body or forensic evidence
if there is nothing really in the way of emails, SMS or other communication that implicates any of the suspects
is there any likelihood that there will be no one charged, the suspects will all be released and the investigation will fail?

could we possibly looking at a scenario where this does not get resolved?


Yes, that is possible. That's why the police are quite intense, AVS called it even extreme, in their interrogations. A confession is a good thing to start from if you are the prosecutor in this case. However a confession is not needed in court if there is enough evidence that ties the suspect to the crime. No evidence and no confession basically means that you are innocent.
That's why maybe, and I am speculating here, Jorans father advised Joran not to say anything because a 'confession', even if he is innocent is basically enough te get you in jail.
There are failsaves for this in the dutch justicesystem, so any judge in this case will demand more from the prosecution than a confession.


Gerben:

Where ya been all my life?  LOL

Welcome.

Can you tell us more about the reported "premeditated murder" charge?  What does this mean?  Does it rule out an accidental death or overdose?
So glad you decided to join us...we have sooooo many questions.

Thanks
~Nancy


I've been here since june 17th and much earlier on the blog of Tom and Red. I have no lawdegree, I know some because we need to study them in school. I have still hope that someone with a lawdegree in dutch criminal law will correct my answers, but noone has come up sofar.
About your question, thats why the JD not only accuses the suspects of murder, but also of manslaughter (doodslag) and death by kidnapping (ontvoering). That is, when this case goes to court they can choose ,if you will, how to indict the suspects based on the evidence they have gathered.

/edited for spelling


I'll have to go back and find Red's post from last night....I may have read it wrong it was sooooo  late and I was so tired.  But, from what I recall he heard an Aruban official refer to the suspected charges as "premeditated murder" which was somewhat shocking to Red.  Maybe someone explained it in earlier posts...but, it has been nagging at me since.

Glad you stopped by.  Now go find a Dutch lawyer to visit us as well.  LOL
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momto5
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« Reply #611 on: June 24, 2005, 11:15:38 AM »

Quote from: "Just Wunderin'"
Don't want to rattle any cages, but I really take exception to BHT saying that NH would never go with these fellows willingly, that she was kidnapped.  BHT needs to wake up and smell the roses.  She cannot bring herself to admit that "her" daughter would ever drink, smoke, do drugs, have sex or act in any manner consistent with most teenage behavior.  Why do you think the other kids aren't talking.  They all went down there to get blasted and get laid!  BHT is a typical southern "lady", whose personal reputation with regard to her family and home are really more important than her concern for her missing daughter.  At one point she made the comment, "I am through protecting myself."  What is that suppose to mean?....protect her reputation, that is what.  She is VERY concerned about what her neighbors and others in her community think of HER.  Take note of her reaction when one of the interviewing reporters tries to broach the subject of Natalee going with the boys, being drunk, having sex; she always brushes that aside and says something to the effect that she doesn't want to dwell on the past, she just wants to find Natalee.  I suspect Natalee did get drunk and did have sex and did, possibly, do some drugs (knowingly or not).  My theory is that she did all this with JVDS and possibly the K brothers and maybe even the D.J. also and then she decided to take a swim in the ocean and just kept on swimming, knowing that her classmates were aware of her behavior and her personal shame and knowing the shame her mother would experience as a result of her doing all these things.  I expect that BTH put so much pressure on her while she was in school and in her community that she just didn't care anymore.  They keep saying that she was so perfect, i.e., 4.0 average, gonna be a doctor, full academic scholarship, never did anything wrong, etc., etc., etc.  Come on people, we have all known parents who push their kids to the end of their rope and then that rope snaps.  In the photos of NH, her eyes are sad.  And, I am now sad for her.

And, just for the record, before anyone goes off on me.  I am a southern woman, a mother of three grown children (2 boys, 1 girl)--none of whom are perfect by a long shot.  Mine would look me in the eye and lie to me and I know that most mothers will admit the same thing.  We don't really know our kids--just as our kids never really know us.

I suspect that JVDS, the K brothers, the DJ and PVDS are all aware of what happened.... and the problem is that they did nothing to help her, they just took advantage of her condition and then let her swim away......... Sad

Interesting theory however I dont find it very likely at all. If she "swam away" then why hasnt her body been found. Someone took great steps to insure she hasnt been found dead or alive as of yet. Youre suggesting she killed herself because she had done shameful acts basically. As a mother of teenagers myself, I know kids arent always angels, however your missing some basic points in this theory. First she was off to college soon which means if she felt stifled or pushed in a few weeks she would be on her own basically. Second any acts she would percieve as shameful would have been left on the island. Sorry I dont buy it.
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« Reply #612 on: June 24, 2005, 11:15:47 AM »

Quote from: "Twelve Monkeys"
From Caribbean Girl on Riehl World Message board.


I live in the Caribbean as an Expat. The van der Sloots are Expats living in Aruba. The attitude of people coming from mainland countries to island nations to live is the key here. Why do they leave family and friends behind to move so far away? Well the obvious is the weather but there is more to the story. There is opportunity for mediocre people to make something of themselves. Expats also tend to have an arrogance about them, a false sense of superiority. They view themselves as the "smart, sophiticated" people coming from the big country to help the poor stupid island people.

The comment Anita VDS made about Paul giving 15 years of service to the island yada yada yada.... I have heard that beofre from Expats who think their (you know what) doesn't stink. They act like they have scaified so much to to come there and help the "poor" people of the island when in fact they have have no sense of altrsism at all they have only been their to line their pockets. More than likely PVDS would never have been able to reach the professional level he has in Aruba back home in Holland. If you compare his abilities to the main stream back home he wouldn't measure up. But in the Caribbean he feel he is a big shot. That is why their son, raised as an Expat, has the arrogant attitude that he does.

Now all that said when trouble occured their "superior" attitude made them belive they could just cover up the mess and use their "influence" to pressure the locals, which is what was happening the first week. They throught the stupid locals would never figure it out.

I am sure since Anita was away, Paul was having himself some fun and went out with Joran. Expat men are notorious for running around and boozing while their wives go on the long trips back home to visit family or on on shopping trips to the USA (can't buy that much on a small island and the US isn't that far away).

I live this life so I know. I recognize it for what it is. I hope they pay for all their sins which are many, and may the Aruban people rid themselves of this vermen. Other Expats be on notice that you ned to change your attitude.

Posted by: caribbean girl | June 24, 2005 09:06 AM


This rings soooo true!!!
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iquitos
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« Reply #613 on: June 24, 2005, 11:16:40 AM »

Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Just Wunderin'"
Don't want to rattle any cages, but I really take exception to BHT saying that NH would never go with these fellows willingly, that she was kidnapped.  BHT needs to wake up and smell the roses.  She cannot bring herself to admit that "her" daughter would ever drink, smoke, do drugs, have sex or act in any manner consistent with most teenage behavior.  Why do you think the other kids aren't talking.  They all went down there to get blasted and get laid!  BHT is a typical southern "lady", whose personal reputation with regard to her family and home are really more important than her concern for her missing daughter.  At one point she made the comment, "I am through protecting myself."  What is that suppose to mean?....protect her reputation, that is what.  She is VERY concerned about what her neighbors and others in her community think of HER.  Take note of her reaction when one of the interviewing reporters tries to broach the subject of Natalee going with the boys, being drunk, having sex; she always brushes that aside and says something to the effect that she doesn't want to dwell on the past, she just wants to find Natalee.  I suspect Natalee did get drunk and did have sex and did, possibly, do some drugs (knowingly or not).  My theory is that she did all this with JVDS and possibly the K brothers and maybe even the D.J. also and then she decided to take a swim in the ocean and just kept on swimming, knowing that her classmates were aware of her behavior and her personal shame and knowing the shame her mother would experience as a result of her doing all these things.  I expect that BTH put so much pressure on her while she was in school and in her community that she just didn't care anymore.  They keep saying that she was so perfect, i.e., 4.0 average, gonna be a doctor, full academic scholarship, never did anything wrong, etc., etc., etc.  Come on people, we have all known parents who push their kids to the end of their rope and then that rope snaps.  In the photos of NH, her eyes are sad.  And, I am now sad for her.

And, just for the record, before anyone goes off on me.  I am a southern woman, a mother of three grown children (2 boys, 1 girl)--none of whom are perfect by a long shot.  Mine would look me in the eye and lie to me and I know that most mothers will admit the same thing.  We don't really know our kids--just as our kids never really know us.

I suspect that JVDS, the K brothers, the DJ and PVDS are all aware of what happened.... and the problem is that they did nothing to help her, they just took advantage of her condition and then let her swim away......... Sad


just shut up!  {{{edit:  Rob.. others have a right to their opinion, please don't abuse your fellow posters. Thank you! }}}


just wonderin is one perceptive monkey.
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pinemeadows
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« Reply #614 on: June 24, 2005, 11:18:13 AM »

Quote from: "nancy_drew
Iquitos:That's rather harsh.  I have no information she was an "ambulance chaser"?  Can you give us a reference to that?  Was she a personal injury attorney?  I think it's great to debate the issues, the stories, etc. But, making a suggestion like this, if it's not true is way below the belt! I sense quite a bit of jealousy of Greta with bloggers covering this case. Not sure why?  Each has their place in this story.  I praise her work...it's been factual, fair and gutsy.  IMO that depicts the best in journalism.[/quote


Nancy, Iquitos got up on the wrong side of the bed today or something...so far, there've been comments about Southern hypocrites, Greta being an ambulance chaser, and a snide comment about Scientology.  Just a few attacks on a lot of people in this forum.
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Ella's Mom
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« Reply #615 on: June 24, 2005, 11:18:13 AM »

I accidently posted this as its own topic, but meant to post here.  Just wanted to know what any of you thought.


This may have been brought up before and if so I apologize. But does anyone think that maybe Daddy VDS is way more involved in this and Joran is being so "wishy washy" to protect his Dad and not necessasarily himself?

Maybe Joran brought her home and Dad did something!!
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Scott
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« Reply #616 on: June 24, 2005, 11:19:00 AM »

Quote from: "momto5"

I havent read anywhere hes been charged but is being held under suspicion as the other suspects are. Also I think he appears nervous bc he has alot to lose, his family, job, reputation, freedom. He is a grown man with life exp and knows the implication of being convicted. The other boys are  younger with their lives ahead of them. Maybe not realizing the prison they are in might be their home for a long time if something doesnt happen soon. Makes sense to me why hes nervous.


I think in Joran's sick, demented mind, this gives him street cred amongst his wannabe gangsta friends.
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Atlmetroguy
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« Reply #617 on: June 24, 2005, 11:19:39 AM »

Quote from: "tkubi7"
Just wonderin..let me see if I understand your theory. 1) Natalee got drunk and did drugs
2) natalee had sex with 1-3 of the boys
3) natalee took a swim (in her skirt and blouse)
4) Natalee was so distraught over her non southern behaior that she just kept swimming to avoid bringing shame on herself and her mother

OOOOKAAAAY. Sounds like every teenager I ever knew...not


Yeah...I pretty much thought was a bunch of crap too. I will admit there was nuggets of truth in it, but if you've been around and looked at the history of NH's behaviour you would get the feeling that she was not that type of girl. I mean think about it, she has a life, why would she jeopardize that.

Leads me back to what I have always thought about this matter, NH leaving the club with Tres Amigo's. It's just not right and does not make sense. Rob posted earlier he felt it was a kidnapping and I do too. I think there may have been a false sense of trust on NH's part to some degree, but in the crush/confusion of leaving the bar they got NH in the car and by then the whatever drugs/alcohol took effect and she did not even know what was happening to her.

Call me crazy...I may be...but it's my thoughts...
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« Reply #618 on: June 24, 2005, 11:20:00 AM »

Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Just Wunderin'"
Don't want to rattle any cages, but I really take exception to BHT saying that NH would never go with these fellows willingly, that she was kidnapped.  BHT needs to wake up and smell the roses.  She cannot bring herself to admit that "her" daughter would ever drink, smoke, do drugs, have sex or act in any manner consistent with most teenage behavior.  Why do you think the other kids aren't talking.  They all went down there to get blasted and get laid!  BHT is a typical southern "lady", whose personal reputation with regard to her family and home are really more important than her concern for her missing daughter.  At one point she made the comment, "I am through protecting myself."  What is that suppose to mean?....protect her reputation, that is what.  She is VERY concerned about what her neighbors and others in her community think of HER.  Take note of her reaction when one of the interviewing reporters tries to broach the subject of Natalee going with the boys, being drunk, having sex; she always brushes that aside and says something to the effect that she doesn't want to dwell on the past, she just wants to find Natalee.  I suspect Natalee did get drunk and did have sex and did, possibly, do some drugs (knowingly or not).  My theory is that she did all this with JVDS and possibly the K brothers and maybe even the D.J. also and then she decided to take a swim in the ocean and just kept on swimming, knowing that her classmates were aware of her behavior and her personal shame and knowing the shame her mother would experience as a result of her doing all these things.  I expect that BTH put so much pressure on her while she was in school and in her community that she just didn't care anymore.  They keep saying that she was so perfect, i.e., 4.0 average, gonna be a doctor, full academic scholarship, never did anything wrong, etc., etc., etc.  Come on people, we have all known parents who push their kids to the end of their rope and then that rope snaps.  In the photos of NH, her eyes are sad.  And, I am now sad for her.

And, just for the record, before anyone goes off on me.  I am a southern woman, a mother of three grown children (2 boys, 1 girl)--none of whom are perfect by a long shot.  Mine would look me in the eye and lie to me and I know that most mothers will admit the same thing.  We don't really know our kids--just as our kids never really know us.

I suspect that JVDS, the K brothers, the DJ and PVDS are all aware of what happened.... and the problem is that they did nothing to help her, they just took advantage of her condition and then let her swim away......... Sad


just shut up!   {{{edit:  Rob.. others have a right to their opinion, please don't abuse your fellow posters. Thank you! The Zoo Keeper}}}


I have considered the "swim" theory too. I'm thinking along the idea of a fight with joren, and swimming away is the escape route.  But drowning instead of reaching a destination would depend on several factors: how far to reach water that is perilous with rip tides or currents, stinging sealife like jellyfish etd, inability to swim due to alcohol or slipped drugs, exhaustion due to the hour of the night.....and the list goes on. I know that in FL it can be perilous to go out too far if you aren't an expereinced swimmer on the Atlantic side. Get into a rip tide and you could be in big trouble if you don't know how to deal with it.  The CNN video suggested that a body on that side of the island would end up in Panama eventually...not back on the shore. Of course if this were the scenario.....the boys wouldn't have to lie about it would they? Such a scenario would suggest just telling the truth instead of all these cover-ups..So it's probably not what happened.
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nancy_drew
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« Reply #619 on: June 24, 2005, 11:22:14 AM »

Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Just Wunderin'"
Don't want to rattle any cages, but I really take exception to BHT saying that NH would never go with these fellows willingly, that she was kidnapped.  BHT needs to wake up and smell the roses.  She cannot bring herself to admit that "her" daughter would ever drink, smoke, do drugs, have sex or act in any manner consistent with most teenage behavior.  Why do you think the other kids aren't talking.  They all went down there to get blasted and get laid!  BHT is a typical southern "lady", whose personal reputation with regard to her family and home are really more important than her concern for her missing daughter.  At one point she made the comment, "I am through protecting myself."  What is that suppose to mean?....protect her reputation, that is what.  She is VERY concerned about what her neighbors and others in her community think of HER.  Take note of her reaction when one of the interviewing reporters tries to broach the subject of Natalee going with the boys, being drunk, having sex; she always brushes that aside and says something to the effect that she doesn't want to dwell on the past, she just wants to find Natalee.  I suspect Natalee did get drunk and did have sex and did, possibly, do some drugs (knowingly or not).  My theory is that she did all this with JVDS and possibly the K brothers and maybe even the D.J. also and then she decided to take a swim in the ocean and just kept on swimming, knowing that her classmates were aware of her behavior and her personal shame and knowing the shame her mother would experience as a result of her doing all these things.  I expect that BTH put so much pressure on her while she was in school and in her community that she just didn't care anymore.  They keep saying that she was so perfect, i.e., 4.0 average, gonna be a doctor, full academic scholarship, never did anything wrong, etc., etc., etc.  Come on people, we have all known parents who push their kids to the end of their rope and then that rope snaps.  In the photos of NH, her eyes are sad.  And, I am now sad for her.

And, just for the record, before anyone goes off on me.  I am a southern woman, a mother of three grown children (2 boys, 1 girl)--none of whom are perfect by a long shot.  Mine would look me in the eye and lie to me and I know that most mothers will admit the same thing.  We don't really know our kids--just as our kids never really know us.

I suspect that JVDS, the K brothers, the DJ and PVDS are all aware of what happened.... and the problem is that they did nothing to help her, they just took advantage of her condition and then let her swim away......... Sad


just shut up!  {{{edit:  Rob.. others have a right to their opinion, please don't abuse your fellow posters. Thank you! }}}


I don't think Beth Twitty has ever fully made comment on what her daughter did or didn't do. Her focus and energy is on finding her daughter!   From all reports we have so far Natalee's character was great. And who cares?  She's the victim? She's missing.  Three kids who were the last to see her alive,  LIED THROUGH THEIR TEETH...and are changing their stories regularly!  I'll say it again, give me facts that these are the wrong suspects, that Natalee's lifestyle, her friends, or family have anything to do with this...AND I'LL GO THERE IMMEDIATELY!!!   I'm a parent of four...and my belief is NO parent really knows what their kid is doing all the time.  Parents aren't supossed to know...there is a generation gap.  But, Natalee's circle are not suspects. There is NO reason they should be.
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