Lively Case Discussion #508 8/7 - 8/8/2006

[San]

Good Morning Tyler

[Tylergal]

Good Morning Tyler

Morning, San.  Rudy Croes is not only a POS he is a DirtyHand.  HE and VanderStraaten are both a POS and VanderStraaten is Croes' dirty hand.

[mrs. red]

Good morning Monkeys....

I will be reading back .... so I will join the discussions later!

keep the faith!!!

[SunFreak2]

Good morning Monkeys.  I'm not too awake yet, so I'm not tpp sure about the Good part yet.  LOL.

I just read the Joran statement on 6-13.  Wow, Joran rated the top cop!  He cried answering those few paultry questions?  Somehow, vdStraaten must have left off a few key questions then.  

[terryd270]

I'm telling you these statements make me believe that Deepak is just a mean stupid vile guy in all of this.. I'm now interested in Satish more than Deepak and might of helped Joran and others with Natalee.. Deepak is a joke and they all know it on that island..

Questions:  Satish isn't the one that Joran called to goto C&C and therefore that makes me question Satish's role in the above.. Deepak was called because of his car and the two brothers will do anything that Joran wants..  Remember that these two brothers were not Joran's first choice that night.. I again say if Joran had stayed home that night, Natalee would be here today.. If the Kalpoe brothers stayed home that night, I believe Natalee would still be dead..

[2NJSons_Mom]

Good morning, all.

Something caught my eye this AM while rereading the statements.

Joran's 6/13 statement was signed by VanderStraaten on 6/17, approx. 5 days after the statement.  The other statements taken by various officers appear to have been signed same date 6/10, 6/11, etc. by said officers.

This may have no significance, but I find it curious that there was such a delay with that 6/13 staement.  

Wish my detective BIL was still living...he'd have so much to say.

[terryd270]

I go back and forth how guilty the two brothers are and how much they were just taxi rides that night..

Deepak was the one that yelled to Joran to shut up when Beth and Dave was questioning Joran..

Deepak was the one that called Natalee a slut and other things..

We always thought Deepak was protecting his brother but maybe Satish and Joran was setting up Deepak.. That would be betrayal wouldn't it..

I knew a guy in HS that used to called him Mother by her first name and I thought it was his way of showing no respect to her..

Kalpoe was willing to take a polygraph test and was the one that said that Joran said he could beat one of those..  

If Satish did have the dream in jail about Natalee coming at him, then he has a Conscience?  

I hope John Q. Kelly can get these questions answered???

[Tylergal]

Good morning, all.

Something caught my eye this AM while rereading the statements.

Joran's 6/13 statement was signed by VanderStraaten on 6/17, approx. 5 days after the statement.  The other statements taken by various officers appear to have been signed same date 6/10, 6/11, etc. by said officers.

This may have no significance, but I find it curious that there was such a delay with that 6/13 staement.  

Wish my detective BIL was still living...he'd have so much to say.

My assumption was it took Paulus a few days to get it back to J. vanderStraaten to sign.  I am sure Paulus had to correlate all witness statements, all sightings, any testimony by other suspects, witnesses to make sure this story sounded good.  That would take anywhere from 72 to 96 hours, right?

How is your father?  I am sorry about your BIL.  You said that affectionately as if he was a good person and BIL.

[terryd270]

Well I'm off to get some coffee and do some stuff.. So we have people that were the last seen with her saying that each of them did something bad and yet they are all free and one is the conquering hero of Aruba.. What a waste of land..

[Kimmy53]

From Joran's statement:

On my question to Joran whether he can tell me what happened after the girl had fallen asleep on the beach near Fisherman's Hut, he answered:

“I called DEEPAK and he came with two dogs. I think he raped the girl and did something to her.”

Ok - Where and what was JOran doing at this time?  Although I don't believe J's story- how could he explain that he saw Deepak come with 2 dogs?  Then he speculates - on what does he base this speculation?

[Whodunit?]

From Joran's statement:

On my question to Joran whether he can tell me what happened after the girl had fallen asleep on the beach near Fisherman's Hut, he answered:

“I called DEEPAK and he came with two dogs. I think he raped the girl and did something to her.”

Ok - Where and what was JOran doing at this time?  Although I don't believe J's story- how could he explain that he saw Deepak come with 2 dogs?  Then he speculates - on what does he base this speculation?

Is this the first we've ever head of the two dogs?  Does he really mean a slang term for people of some sort?  Like bring on the dogs?

[Whodunit?]

From Joran's statement:

On my question to Joran whether he can tell me what happened after the girl had fallen asleep on the beach near Fisherman's Hut, he answered:

“I called DEEPAK and he came with two dogs. I think he raped the girl and did something to her.”

Ok - Where and what was JOran doing at this time?  Although I don't believe J's story- how could he explain that he saw Deepak come with 2 dogs?  Then he speculates - on what does he base this speculation?

Is this the first we've ever head of the two dogs?  Does he really mean a slang term for people of some sort?  Like bring on the dogs?

That should have said heard......

[terryd270]

Whats scary is that there are those on other sites and it seems a whole island that has put Joran on a pedestal.. Either they all have the following traits or they are just plain stupid..  We can go through what we know of Joran and he is the perfect template for a sociopath and psychopath...

Aruba the boy on the pedestal is a Sociopathy & Psychopathy:

List of Antisocial Personality Disorder Traits
 
Sense of entitlement; Unremorseful; Apathetic to others; Unconscionable behavior; Blameful of others; Manipulative and conning; Affectively cold; Disparate understanding; Socially irresponsible; Disregardful of obligations; Nonconforming to norms; Irresponsible



List of Common Sociopathic Traits
 
Egocentricity; Callousness; Impulsivity; Conscience defect; Exaggerated sexuality; Excessive boasting; Risk taking; Inability to resist temptation; Antagonistic, deprecating attitude toward the opposite sex; Lack of interest in bonding with a mate

List of Common Psychopathic Traits

Glib and superficial charm; Grandiose sense of self-worth; Need for stimulation; Pathological lying; Conning and manipulativeness; Lack of remorse or guilt; Shallow affect; Callousness and lack of empathy; Parasitic lifestyle; Poor behavioral controls; Promiscuous sexual behavior; Early behavior problems; Lack of realistic, long-term goals; Impulsivity; Irresponsibility; Failure to accept responsibility for own actions; Many short-term marital relationships; Juvenile delinquency; Revocation of conditional release; Criminal versatility

[Kimmy53]

To my question where the girl was buried then, he answered:
“I think that it was buried then next to the wall of the Fisherman's Hut, for the rest I would not know either.”
 
Once again - where would he come up with this speculation?

Does it not appear ODD (to say the least) that with the bombshells JOran just dropped that there are no follow up questions?

Now, this all happens AFTER the retracted "confession"  I think between Joran and Van der Straten, they came up with this story in hopes it would take the "place" of the supposed confession.  That they could explain away the "confession" saying it was misconstrued.

[terryd270]

Joran called his two dogs, Jamie and Freddy (maybe Koen) to help..  They are his true inner circle..  Just my opinion..   I have to go but had some thoughts..

[2NJSons_Mom]

Good morning, all.

Something caught my eye this AM while rereading the statements.

Joran's 6/13 statement was signed by VanderStraaten on 6/17, approx. 5 days after the statement.  The other statements taken by various officers appear to have been signed same date 6/10, 6/11, etc. by said officers.

This may have no significance, but I find it curious that there was such a delay with that 6/13 staement.  

Wish my detective BIL was still living...he'd have so much to say.

My assumption was it took Paulus a few days to get it back to J. vanderStraaten to sign.  I am sure Paulus had to correlate all witness statements, all sightings, any testimony by other suspects, witnesses to make sure this story sounded good.  That would take anywhere from 72 to 96 hours, right?

How is your father?  I am sorry about your BIL.  You said that affectionately as if he was a good person and BIL.

That's why it stood out.  I think it's BS that it was not signed 6/13, and think I get your sarcasm.

My father is still struggling to keep his independence, and he's physically well.  His memory won't improve, for sure, but we're taking baby steps in planning.  Thank you for asking.  It's part of our daily life, now.

BIL loved his job and was excellent at it.  He was loved dearly, and was very vocal about local cases as well as national ones, such as OJ.  The conversations with him were stimulating.  He made blunt statements mixed with humor and we all looked forward to Sunday dinners with him.  It's not the same since he passed.

[terryd270]

I wonder if Joran ever mention to his other friends that the Kalpoe's were his slaves..  I can hear Freddy asking Joran where his two slaves are or Jamie saying hey call your two slaves and have them pick us up..

[Kimmy53]

From Joran's statement:

On my question to Joran whether he can tell me what happened after the girl had fallen asleep on the beach near Fisherman's Hut, he answered:

“I called DEEPAK and he came with two dogs. I think he raped the girl and did something to her.”

Ok - Where and what was JOran doing at this time?  Although I don't believe J's story- how could he explain that he saw Deepak come with 2 dogs?  Then he speculates - on what does he base this speculation?

Is this the first we've ever head of the two dogs?  Does he really mean a slang term for people of some sort?  Like bring on the dogs?

Hmm - I never have thought of it like that..

BUT - OMG - Something just hit me - The mattress with the DOG'S BLOOD on it.
We all know Joran would not hesitate to harm a dog...

[klaasend]

[San]

Good Morning Tyler

Morning, San.  Rudy Croes is not only a POS he is a DirtyHand.  HE and VanderStraaten are both a POS and VanderStraaten is Croes' dirty hand.

You're right Tyler.