New news calls for new theory (so obvious though)

[jpoops]

I am pretty much sold on the date rape drug theory.


Rumors are floating that JVS had bragged in the past about drugging girls, and I know rumors are a bad source, but I just think it makes the most sense at this point.

After watching some news-feeds on fox, namely the ones with NH's friends, it seems that JVS had told the group the island sucks on Sundays. They said it seemed damn ironic that he was at C&C's late that night, considering the island "sucks" on Sundays. He went out because he had a mission.

Liquid G will take you from zero to sixty in 15 minutes, and it explains the conflicting accounts of her "drunkenness" by the boys, in contrast with her "soberness" at the bar.

I think JVS went out late on that night because it was going to be another notch in the belt for him, one more tourist to brag about... I think he was surprised/scared/crapped himself when she stopped breathing. The slightest mis-measurement of GHB can be deadly and it is a strange toxin where if you induce vomiting or an EMT pumps you stomach it can be fatal. GHB has such a unique protocol for recreational (voluntary) use hat people who take it will write the letter "g" on their hand to alert EMT's etc etc not to pump their stomachs if they pass out.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Many many moons ago... I had 2 friends that ended up in comas on that stuff and I remember seeing a person dragged out of a party by EMTs completely passed out cold and unresponsive. Very dangerous stuff and my vote is hat Joran uses this on his ladies.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He went out with one thing in mind- he was not with her to start a relationship, make a new friend, or introduce her to Depak and Satish, in fact they did not even talk to her according to their mother (I know, it's their mother but she seems credible...) He was looking for an easy one-nighter for bragging rights.


Q- So, if he did not intentionally try to kill her, why is he being held on premeditated murder?

A- As I said before, he went out that night with one thing in mind. He wanted to add a notch to the belt and he knew the only way to do this was with the drug in her drink. Him having the drug before he went to the bar, with the intent of going there to put it in her drink, hat right there was the premeditation. He put something in her drink and he planned to do it right after he left the Casino and she mentioned she would be at C&C's that night. After all, if he told the Mountainbrook kids that the island "sucks" on Sundays, why would he be out- after all it was a school night...


Another thing I noticed while watching news feeds- Nat’s friends said JVS seemed like a normal and quiet guy, not outgoing or anything- he did not seem exceptionally introverted. So tell me, how else would a shy kid like that expect to sleep with a tourist after only knowing her for a few hours? Also, NH was probably going light on the drinking because her flight was the next day, one of her friends (out of 2 total) said she left C&C's an hour before closing.

I think this is terrible if true but I think the idea of being lost forever as a slave or something is worse. I change my theories based on what I see for new developments and this is m new theory based on the latest.

I have also said this in another thread, but I think the father quarterbacked the entire 'security guard' story... JVS's dad also got the DJ to possibly assist as the DJ was arrested because he was telling the same lie.

Paulos Van Der Sloot (JVS's dad), in my opinion, coached all of the boys on what to say- he could have even blackmailed the DJ as it has been my suspicion that govt officials are taxing drug dealers on the island. "Croes, if you don't stick to this story I'll have you locked up for your drug trafficking anyways, so lie here and stay out of jail..."

Croes had no choice in the matter and I think Croes also was Joran's indirect supplier, possibly direct to the older Satish brother (Depak?). I think Croes has some easy access to GHB seeing as he works on a late night party boat.

I bet this happens all the time but people are not dying, they just wake up on the beach with no idea what happened, why they are naked on a beach, and how they got there... most victims that are tourists probably do not report those incidents due to embarrassment or lack of faith they will seem believable. After all, most victims probably just convince themselves to think they had way too much to drink as an easy way to cope with the uncertainty.

Now enough dilly-dally, throw the book at these kids. And IMO I think this can be considered premeditated because he specifically went out that night knowing he would drug and rape her, specifically her, not just a random girl.

The part about the father coming up with the story also explains why everything got so delayed. Everyone has the same lie. Frame the black guys, and daddy will try to sweep the evidence under the rug.

I have no doubt I am right based on the evidence thus far, I think this is so obvious that it is not worth even writing, but maybe some people just haven’t thought of this yet…

And who knows, maybe this is true but she is still alive- I hope she is, but I am starting to think she is not.


ALL OPINION & SPECULATION

[homeontherange]

Your theory is probably correct. But let's think of what happens next. I have not heard a credible explanation of how the body was disposed of.

So----- 1:30 Leave NH leaves C&C's thinking she's getting a ride to HI. She's got the mickey in the system. 1:45 till she's out and JVS unloads her  where he plan's to "get some". 2:00 JVS "satisfied" enjoying the afterglow, ready to return NH to HI. Calls in the "taxi" 2:10 "taxi" arrives as JVS realizes something is wrong with NH. The three try to figure out what to do. 2:30 NH is dead and DA3 know it, decide they need advice from PVS. 2:40 arrive at PVS home. 2:45 wake daddy and explain problem. 3:00 Daddy worried and trying to come up w/ a plan. According to Weather.com, sun comes up @6:17 today, probably @6:25 5/30 but light @ 6:00 or a little before. So you've got less than 3 hours for inexperienced murderers to either A: hide a body so that nobody on a 70sq mile island with an average of 1000 permanent residents per sq/mi plus who knows how many tourists won't EVER find it? Are these guys outdoorsmen? They've got shovels and plastic and whatever else handy. They know the "Perfect spot". Nobody sees a car pulling down a back road? Hard to believe. So B: Dump the body in the water. But---bodies float, so -- disembowel the body? Use weights? Where do they come from? How much is enough? How do you get them and the body to where the disposal occurs. It could be a pool on the island -- I doubt it, something would turn up sooner or later. It couldn't be just offshore, the body, or parts of it would wash up sooner or later.  Take it way offshore -- maybe but your telling me you organize the boat, personel, wieghts, move the body and get this all done in less than 3 hours. I don't think so, when your a wreck like they all would have been in this situation, NOTHING GOES RIGHT. It just doesn't work. If she's dead, the body was stored to be disposed of later or is still in storage. Otherwise she was handed off to somebody(s) else. I don't know if she's still alive but something isn't right about the "She's dead" theories either.

[mia]

Could Joran have taken Natalee onto the Party Boat, even though, I believe it was not operating on a Sunday night?  Was DJ on the Party Boat waiting for Joran to bring Natalee, having been informed by 2K brothers?  Did Natalee become upset because she didn't want to ride the small boat out to the Party boat?  Did another larger boat pull up next to Party boat and take off with Natalee onboard?

[Dutchlady]

See my forensic profile on posts from 21st June on

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/06/natalee_hollowa_32.html?

[maritzka]

Edit/Delete this post
I think she was a target from the moment Joren and his dad saw her at the Casino. She is a beautiful girl, a True blonde which is rare and coveted. She was attracted to him (he reminded me of her prom date with shorter hair). When two ppl have an attraction it is invisible sometimes to anyone but them, it's nice to savor those secret thrilling moments and share them with no one but each other.. They BOTH know they will see each other again. A drink at the concert, maybe two and later to Carlos and Charlies. It was like a girls gone wild, and it was fun being with friends in a grown up atmosphere. And in walks Joren,she catches her breath, and knowing there is not much time left before she had to go, and with the fortitude of a couple vodka drinks she got right up and walked over to him. He reeled her in right there. He really only needed Depak and Satish for the ride and being the great homies they were they obliged. I think he alone disabled her by medicating her last drink. He waits for her to become disoriented and THEN he has the boys drop them at his house. They promise to pick her up and drive her back to the hotel in the am when Joren calls them. He says "thanks bro', peace out." He takes her home and she passes out. She wakes up while he is having sex with her and tries to fight him away, but he is much bigger and he is too strong. I think because she was in unfamiliar surroundings she was confused due to alcohol and some kind of drug. They struggle, she screams, his dad awakens and comes in. I think dad thinks WTF (however you'd say it in Dutch), He says "OMG Joren what's going on here?" Immediately he becomes VERY concerned for his position in the Dutch community. I don't think they dirty their hands by murder, they tie her up. Dad PAYS someone to TAKE CARE OF IT for them. He doesn't want to know any details. That's where the rope, tape and anchors come in. This person, connected with someone in South America, perhaps Venezuela or Columbia took her. She was alive then, I do not feel (I hate to say it) that she is now. I think the next person to be arrested will have a BIG connection to South America, and that is the person that KNOWS if she is STILL alive. Although she would be quite valuble there, but now too highly visible to be an asset, and that is my biggest fear. Sometimes I think the huge media attention hurt this case in that respect.

[MominTN]

Could Joran have taken Natalee onto the Party Boat, even though, I believe it was not operating on a Sunday night?  Was DJ on the Party Boat waiting for Joran to bring Natalee, having been informed by 2K brothers?  Did Natalee become upset because she didn't want to ride the small boat out to the Party boat?  Did another larger boat pull up next to Party boat and take off with Natalee onboard?

The Tattoo also has two smaller boats for ferrying crew and passengers back and forth.  They probably used one of those to dispose of the body.

[alpha_fruit]

I am pretty much sold on the date rape drug theory.


Rumors are floating that JVS had bragged in the past about drugging girls, and I know rumors are a bad source, but I just think it makes the most sense at this point.

After watching some news-feeds on fox, namely the ones with NH's friends, it seems that JVS had told the group the island sucks on Sundays. They said it seemed damn ironic that he was at C&C's late that night, considering the island "sucks" on Sundays. He went out because he had a mission.

Liquid G will take you from zero to sixty in 15 minutes, and it explains the conflicting accounts of her "drunkenness" by the boys, in contrast with her "soberness" at the bar.

I think JVS went out late on that night because it was going to be another notch in the belt for him, one more tourist to brag about... I think he was surprised/scared/crapped himself when she stopped breathing. The slightest mis-measurement of GHB can be deadly and it is a strange toxin where if you induce vomiting or an EMT pumps you stomach it can be fatal. GHB has such a unique protocol for recreational (voluntary) use hat people who take it will write the letter "g" on their hand to alert EMT's etc etc not to pump their stomachs if they pass out.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Many many moons ago... I had 2 friends that ended up in comas on that stuff and I remember seeing a person dragged out of a party by EMTs completely passed out cold and unresponsive. Very dangerous stuff and my vote is hat Joran uses this on his ladies.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He went out with one thing in mind- he was not with her to start a relationship, make a new friend, or introduce her to Depak and Satish, in fact they did not even talk to her according to their mother (I know, it's their mother but she seems credible...) He was looking for an easy one-nighter for bragging rights.


Q- So, if he did not intentionally try to kill her, why is he being held on premeditated murder?

A- As I said before, he went out that night with one thing in mind. He wanted to add a notch to the belt and he knew the only way to do this was with the drug in her drink. Him having the drug before he went to the bar, with the intent of going there to put it in her drink, hat right there was the premeditation. He put something in her drink and he planned to do it right after he left the Casino and she mentioned she would be at C&C's that night. After all, if he told the Mountainbrook kids that the island "sucks" on Sundays, why would he be out- after all it was a school night...


Another thing I noticed while watching news feeds- Nat’s friends said JVS seemed like a normal and quiet guy, not outgoing or anything- he did not seem exceptionally introverted. So tell me, how else would a shy kid like that expect to sleep with a tourist after only knowing her for a few hours? Also, NH was probably going light on the drinking because her flight was the next day, one of her friends (out of 2 total) said she left C&C's an hour before closing.

I think this is terrible if true but I think the idea of being lost forever as a slave or something is worse. I change my theories based on what I see for new developments and this is m new theory based on the latest.

I have also said this in another thread, but I think the father quarterbacked the entire 'security guard' story... JVS's dad also got the DJ to possibly assist as the DJ was arrested because he was telling the same lie.

Paulos Van Der Sloot (JVS's dad), in my opinion, coached all of the boys on what to say- he could have even blackmailed the DJ as it has been my suspicion that govt officials are taxing drug dealers on the island. "Croes, if you don't stick to this story I'll have you locked up for your drug trafficking anyways, so lie here and stay out of jail..."

Croes had no choice in the matter and I think Croes also was Joran's indirect supplier, possibly direct to the older Satish brother (Depak?). I think Croes has some easy access to GHB seeing as he works on a late night party boat.

I bet this happens all the time but people are not dying, they just wake up on the beach with no idea what happened, why they are naked on a beach, and how they got there... most victims that are tourists probably do not report those incidents due to embarrassment or lack of faith they will seem believable. After all, most victims probably just convince themselves to think they had way too much to drink as an easy way to cope with the uncertainty.

Now enough dilly-dally, throw the book at these kids. And IMO I think this can be considered premeditated because he specifically went out that night knowing he would drug and rape her, specifically her, not just a random girl.

The part about the father coming up with the story also explains why everything got so delayed. Everyone has the same lie. Frame the black guys, and daddy will try to sweep the evidence under the rug.

I have no doubt I am right based on the evidence thus far, I think this is so obvious that it is not worth even writing, but maybe some people just haven’t thought of this yet…

And who knows, maybe this is true but she is still alive- I hope she is, but I am starting to think she is not.


ALL OPINION & SPECULATION

I am an old woman and I hate to say this, but with our society today, I believe you are right on. I also believe teenagers are the same the whole world over.

Thanks for listening to an older head talk.

[Cerulean]

Pete and Dutchlady,

Lots of blind alleys.  Hmmm.  The first link didn't contain it.  The second, contained hundreds of posts which I scrolled through before I gave up.  I'm guessing the third is similar.  

If you guys have an actual posting of Dutchlady describing the Van Der Sloot home before Greta's interview, you're repeatedly failing to provide that information.  First the links and descriptions were wrong.  Now they are impossible to follow.  

What gives?

[wbvious]

cerulean this may be what they were trying to help you find:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/Discussion/viewtopic.php?p=26354&highlight=yellow#26354

scroll down also to the reply from bluekygirl (and you?...wtf?)

you should be glad they even went that far...

[Pete]

Pete and Dutchlady,

Lots of blind alleys.  Hmmm.  The first link didn't contain it.  The second, contained hundreds of posts which I scrolled through before I gave up.  I'm guessing the third is similar.  

If you guys have an actual posting of Dutchlady describing the Van Der Sloot home before Greta's interview, you're repeatedly failing to provide that information.  First the links and descriptions were wrong.  Now they are impossible to follow.  

What gives?

Please see my reply here, as I don't feel like typing it again.
http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/Discussion/viewtopic.php?p=38871&sid=07106ee22b4b392b780d2b11159453d4#38871

[jpoops]

edit: fixed double-post

[jpoops]

I think I might be close with this theory... but I am beginning to think these kids would have cracked by now...


Now the dad and Croes are released- this late in the investigation I cannot imagine it is for "surveillance"...


So if they are removed from he theory I have hear it still could have happened.

I am leaning towards thinking that if they don't find a body in the quarry that maybe she encountered someone else on that beach...


We really have nothing to work with except theories based on very loose information. They must have some evidence on the boys if they are still holding them... I am not yet ready to try my next theory; I am sticking with the date rape drug theory for now.