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Author Topic: RBN #24 6/25/05 Daytime  (Read 212334 times)
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RazzyBerry
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« Reply #100 on: June 25, 2005, 09:58:23 AM »

Quote from: "MominTN"
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "RazzyBerry"
Quote from: "iquitos"
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Quote from: "iquitos"
Joran didn't have to do with what?  What did Joran do after he left the club with Natalee and the Kalpoes?  I don't know, you don't know.

 Maybe Joran did not do anythng more than have Natalee pass out on him.  He left her there  She never showed up at her hotel room and nobody who is talking noticed until the next morning.  

Joran was embarrassed and lied.   He would have been better off not saying anything when confronted by the cops and the family.  Our little story would have been neater.  I would say Joran has plenty of reason to lie, since he lied in the beginning and was caught out.  we don't know how many story changes there have been.  We have no access to the investigative file.  

For me, it is hard to imagine a scenario in which Joran would kill Natalee by himself.  Murder is just too extreme for the imaginable circumstances involving Natalee and Joran alone.  Either it was an accident, or something happend to Natalee after Joran left.  Joran is under arrest and under intense pressure to confess a crime he may not have committed.  The cops are not looking for the truth, but a confession.  If Joran did not do anything to Natalee he can't confess, so he has to keep feeding the cops stories.  That is the same thing a captured military person would do to avoid revealing sensitive information  The Arubans desperately need to solve the crime and have already rushed to judge the wrong guys once.  Absent a body and evidence, they could be grasping at straws again and the stakes are now much higher.  

There is a logical explanation for this but it is not that Joran killed her and then he and others disposed of her body to cover it up.  It could have happend that way but it would not make sense.


Thats a very touching story, but Joran killed natalie, lied to authorities 3times and asked his friends to help substantiate a false alibi.  Try again.
 

I do not know where you get your information.  I can't imagine where you get your insider information.  Are you the Dutch prosecutor handling the case?  Of course Joran is changing his story becasue he lied on the first try.  Too bad he was not professionally interrogated.  Then, we think, at some later time, he was finally professionally interrogated and told another story.  We don't know what that is either.  Has it changed, we do not know.  Is it the same one he told his mom?  We don't know.  

We can speculate until the cows come home, but hey, if we knew, the case would already be solved!  Oh, by the way, how did he kill her and what did he do with the body?  .


Ive studied enough murder cases to know where this one is going.  He probably accidently suffocated or strangled her.


KEY WORD:  accidentially.

We can also speculate that she died of say alcohol poisoning, reaction with alcohol and another medication she was on, aspiration of vomit, drugs someone else administered before the boys showed up.


There is no such word in the English language.  While I appreciate your desire for Joran to get off, most people think he murdered her.  I think he has a violent side.  His own mother said she tries to talk with him when he kicks his brothers.  He is a big person.  I do not think he respects women either.  So more likely, he strangled her to shut her up.


I think so too, my original comment about an accident was just trying to keep an open mind.  Hes a big guy and he probably wanted to have sex with her and she didnt want to.
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RazzyBerry
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« Reply #101 on: June 25, 2005, 09:59:25 AM »

Quote from: "rkymtncjngrl"
IN the pictures I've seen of Joran, he really does have an evil look. Anyone else notice this? Confused


I think he looks like Frankenstein without the neck bolts.
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Dublin
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« Reply #102 on: June 25, 2005, 09:59:50 AM »

Quote

cover her mouth to keep her from screaming.


I think you'd have to cover the nose and mouth, and for several minutes, and beyond the point at which she lost consciousness.  It takes 4 minutes with a lack of oxygen to die. So, if that scenario were true, he had to have gone way beyond trying to keep her from screaming.


I also think the image of the mother is very revealing. I just can't picture the mother of an 18 year old going to any party dressed in such a revealing top with a white bra showing through it.  There are slips, camisoles etc., and she is the wife of a judge. I do think it may reveal something about the dysfunction within the family and could lead to some speculation about the son's emotional disturbance. [/quote]
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MsPooh
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« Reply #103 on: June 25, 2005, 10:00:10 AM »

Quote from: "Dublin"

If this image links okay, it comes from another website that clipped images from news stories.  I think it is weird that Joran's mother is wearing such a see through blouse. Isn't that strange for someone her age?  Do you think she is trying to keep Paul home, or is it indicative of some strange relation with her son, and maybe a reason that he hates women?  Has anyone else drawn psych. conclusions on why a 17 year old would make videos of a gang rape and then sell them?  Has anyone investigated this "pimp" term that he and the brothers used to describe themselves on their websites?


o.k. sorry but this topic is like beating a dead horse, we have hashed it all out too much..whew thinking very deep this morning aren't we Dublin?O.k. I was watching Britney and Kevin and after their wedding all the guys in the wedding party were wearing sweats with the word "pimp" on the back, does that make them all bad people? I don't think so..the word "pimp" I think these days is the same as "cool" for a guy.
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Another K in Texas
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« Reply #104 on: June 25, 2005, 10:00:21 AM »

I could only see one real scenario for accidental suffocation.  He is huge and she is tiny.  If she was so inexperienced with sex that she did not know to turn her head sideways so she could breath, his chest could have sealed off her breathing for too long and he might not have even realized.  Of couse I would be biting someone to get them to move, but if she were drugged or had blacked out, that also could have her suffocate under his size.

I just don't think it was accidental suffocation.
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RazzyBerry
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« Reply #105 on: June 25, 2005, 10:00:22 AM »

Quote from: "mbhs05"
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Quote from: "mbhs05"
Can someone fill me in really quickly on what's been happening?


Joran killed natalie,tried to cover it up and the texas search team hopefully will find her soon. thats basically it.


Wait, how do you know? He admitted to it?


No but im just trying to keep everybody focused on whats the most likely scenario.
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scared-tom
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« Reply #106 on: June 25, 2005, 10:00:24 AM »

Quote from: "RazzyBerry"
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Can someone fill me in really quickly on what's been happening?


Joran killed natalie,tried to cover it up and the texas search team hopefully will find her soon. thats basically it.


Razz was being obnoxious. nothing has changed.

RAZZ MBHS is a friend of Natalee's, be nice.
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arrabba
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« Reply #107 on: June 25, 2005, 10:00:26 AM »

Geraldo live at 10:00 tonight on FOX
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DAG
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« Reply #108 on: June 25, 2005, 10:00:27 AM »

Quote from: "RazzyBerry"
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Can someone fill me in really quickly on what's been happening?


Joran killed natalie,tried to cover it up and the texas search team hopefully will find her soon. thats basically it.


mbhs05, that is just Razzy's take on the whole situation.  There is really no new news this morning.  The Texas Seach team is out and a new judge will be talking to the 3 boys today.  News to some out at 2:00 our time.
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Dublin
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« Reply #109 on: June 25, 2005, 10:01:13 AM »

But, they don't make and sell gang rape videos do they?
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RazzyBerry
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« Reply #110 on: June 25, 2005, 10:02:09 AM »

Quote from: "Dublin"
Quote

cover her mouth to keep her from screaming.


I think you'd have to cover the nose and mouth, and for several minutes, and beyond the point at which she lost consciousness.  It takes 4 minutes with a lack of oxygen to die. So, if that scenario were true, he had to have gone way beyond trying to keep her from screaming.


I also think the image of the mother is very revealing. I just can't picture the mother of an 18 year old going to any party dressed in such a revealing top with a white bra showing through it.  There are slips, camisoles etc., and she is the wife of a judge. I do think it may reveal something about the dysfunction within the family and could lead to some speculation about the son's emotional disturbance.
[/quote]

There are shirts in certain lights that will be more revealing at times.  Mrs VDS probably saw that picture and said OMG I didnt know you could see my bra in the bright lights.
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rkymtncjngrl
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« Reply #111 on: June 25, 2005, 10:02:18 AM »

Quote from: "arrabba"
Geraldo live at 10:00 tonight on FOX
I thought he wasn't in Aruba anymore Confused  Confused
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mbhs05
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« Reply #112 on: June 25, 2005, 10:02:29 AM »

Quote from: "DAG"
Quote from: "RazzyBerry"
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Can someone fill me in really quickly on what's been happening?


Joran killed natalie,tried to cover it up and the texas search team hopefully will find her soon. thats basically it.


mbhs05, that is just Razzy's take on the whole situation.  There is really no new news this morning.  The Texas Seach team is out and a new judge will be talking to the 3 boys today.  News to some out at 2:00 our time.


I'm glad a new judge is talking to them...maybe he'll be more successful in questioning them.
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RB
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« Reply #113 on: June 25, 2005, 10:02:37 AM »

I don't know about that, Dublin.  Plenty of women have a fashion sense issue Smile  Doesn't make them dysfunctional, it makes them perhaps a tad naive.

Also, I have to mention that the word dysfunction applied to this family may not, IMO, be correct used in a context we're familiar with.  I've seen rampant the posts condemning the VSD father and son for gambling, for example, but going to the casino is something that may be accepted as the norm there, isn't it?
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DAG
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« Reply #114 on: June 25, 2005, 10:03:15 AM »

Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "DAG"
Quote from: "RazzyBerry"
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Can someone fill me in really quickly on what's been happening?


Joran killed natalie,tried to cover it up and the texas search team hopefully will find her soon. thats basically it.


mbhs05, that is just Razzy's take on the whole situation.  There is really no new news this morning.  The Texas Seach team is out and a new judge will be talking to the 3 boys today.  News to some out at 2:00 our time.


I'm glad a new judge is talking to them...maybe he'll be more successful in questioning them.


It was stated that they wanted "fresh eyes" to look at the case.
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columbo
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« Reply #115 on: June 25, 2005, 10:03:30 AM »

Quote from: "pinemeadows"
Quote from: "columbo"
Does anyone else find it interesting that Paul VDS was at the Holiday Inn casino when Joran first met Natalee?  Natalee sees the Dad at the beach, freaks out and something bad happens.

The whereabouts of Paul VDS are not known, his wife was out of town and his only alibi is he was home sleeping. Just speculating......


I believe she was drugged; it's after that things get very unclear....and this is certainly a possibility in my book.


Dad sees pretty girl at Casino, knows he can't get a young girl for himself, sends son (player) to meet her. Son goes to C&C, drugs her, brings her to Dad waiting at the beach. Nat's drugged, but has enough sense to see an older man waiting, freaks out, he kills her.

Son lies to cover for Dad.

We still don't know how Joran got home that night. It could be that he didn't need a ride because Dad was with him all along.

Again, just speculating.......
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bendex
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« Reply #116 on: June 25, 2005, 10:03:30 AM »

Quote from: "rkymtncjngrl"
IN the pictures I've seen of Joran, he really does have an evil look. Anyone else notice this? Confused
yes indeed I agree might he be devil himself or sent from hell to destruct lives ?
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momto5
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« Reply #117 on: June 25, 2005, 10:03:36 AM »

Quote from: "bendex"
I wonder what the average education level is of the people who visit this blog


Maybe we should make a poll? hehe
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mbhs05
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« Reply #118 on: June 25, 2005, 10:03:36 AM »

Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
Quote from: "RazzyBerry"
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Can someone fill me in really quickly on what's been happening?


Joran killed natalie,tried to cover it up and the texas search team hopefully will find her soon. thats basically it.


Razz was being obnoxious. nothing has changed.

RAZZ MBHS is a friend of Natalee's, be nice.


Hey ya'll-I do want to clear something up, because people keep thinking I'm a close friend of hers, and I'm not. I am a classmate, and I'm friends with her friends, but I'm not really a friend of Natalee...we're just aquaintances.
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Terry
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« Reply #119 on: June 25, 2005, 10:03:42 AM »

Quote from: "Dublin"


If this image links okay, it comes from another website that clipped images from news stories.  I think it is weird that Joran's mother is wearing such a see through blouse. Isn't that strange for someone her age?  Do you think she is trying to keep Paul home, or is it indicative of some strange relation with her son, and maybe a reason that he hates women?  Has anyone else drawn psych. conclusions on why a 17 year old would make videos of a gang rape and then sell them?  Has anyone investigated this "pimp" term that he and the brothers used to describe themselves on their websites?
I seriously doubt Mrs VDS meant to wear a blouse such as this. In fact, it was probably the flash of the cam. Plain silly for anybody to think she purposely did this. She ain't no movie star..........LOL...... Wink I think part of Joran's problem is that he likes women way too much, which I believe is normal for a boy of his age. Porn video is a rumor, and pimp is a term a lots of young men use. Even older ones....
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