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Author Topic: RBN #24 6/25/05 Daytime  (Read 210558 times)
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wantsanswers
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« Reply #200 on: June 25, 2005, 10:36:20 AM »

Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Anyone out there. Have you ever gone to a 15 year old's party where they danced think Joran and that girl did? Am I missing something? Parent's did not put a stop to that? I know chaperones would put a stop to that at most proms! You are judged by your behavior right or wrong, I see why people don't have a problem bashing Joran
 

you have to understand the cultural context to understand the picture.  if you don't, please refain from comment.  otherwise you betray your ignorance.


Enlighten this ignorant person please....
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Kshe78
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« Reply #201 on: June 25, 2005, 10:37:01 AM »

Paige on Fox just said that all five suspects expect to go before a judge later today.

RB, I think you asked how many earlier, and I didn't see a reply - just got confirmation.
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DivaToo
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« Reply #202 on: June 25, 2005, 10:37:43 AM »

Morning Monkeys!!
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Praying for Natalee's safe return & comfort for her family
RB
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« Reply #203 on: June 25, 2005, 10:37:44 AM »

I agree with Razzberry. Let's face it, some folks only remind us that we are operating on rumor and speculation when they don't like our conclusions

No Professor, I don't like conclusions such as these when the tone of the post appears to want to force them down my, and others who perhaps have dissenting opinions, throat Smile  Whether it's meant to be perceived that way or not, I don't know, but there it is.
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mbhs05
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« Reply #204 on: June 25, 2005, 10:38:21 AM »

Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Anyone out there. Have you ever gone to a 15 year old's party where they danced think Joran and that girl did? Am I missing something? Parent's did not put a stop to that? I know chaperones would put a stop to that at most proms! You are judged by your behavior right or wrong, I see why people don't have a problem bashing Joran
 

you have to understand the cultural context to understand the picture.  if you don't, please refain from comment.  otherwise you betray your ignorance.


Enlighten this ignorant person please....


They are saying that this is normal teen behavior...and not a reason to judge.
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Terry
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« Reply #205 on: June 25, 2005, 10:38:22 AM »

Quote from: "DivaToo"
Morning Monkeys!!



Mornin' Diva.

 Very Happy
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RB
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« Reply #206 on: June 25, 2005, 10:38:47 AM »

Thanks kshe. Smile
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arubagirl
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« Reply #207 on: June 25, 2005, 10:39:06 AM »

mhb explained it very well, wantsanswers
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Dublin
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« Reply #208 on: June 25, 2005, 10:39:48 AM »

So, if Joran and PVDS go to clubs together, are said to have both been seen at the casino that night, then PVDS picked up Joran at the McDonalds at 11 and they both went to the casino together?  

Otherwise, why were they calling the Kalpoe brother for a ride?  NH and JVDS didn't leave the club until around 1:00.  PVDS told police he took Joran home, and Joran has said he snuck out, but what if they have PVDS on video in the club after 11:00 pm that night?

I thought the report was that he went to pick Joran up at 3 am, but I've also seen a report that PVDS called Joran on his cell at 6 am, when he suspected he wasn't at home.
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momto5
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« Reply #209 on: June 25, 2005, 10:40:15 AM »

Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Anyone out there. Have you ever gone to a 15 year old's party where they danced think Joran and that girl did? Am I missing something? Parent's did not put a stop to that? I know chaperones would put a stop to that at most proms! You are judged by your behavior right or wrong, I see why people don't have a problem bashing Joran
 

you have to understand the cultural context to understand the picture.  if you don't, please refain from comment.  otherwise you betray your ignorance.


Enlighten this ignorant person please....

It really isnt that unusual. Like it or not times and dances have changed since we were in school. Ever watch MTV when they do spring break week? I dont even think its so a much a cultural difference as it is a generation gap. JMO
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la_cavalière
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« Reply #210 on: June 25, 2005, 10:40:25 AM »

When Joran says he left Natalee on the beach, it doesn't necessarily mean he left her semi-conscious in the sand. I believe he may have meant they parted ways at the beach at the back entrance to the H.I.
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arrabba
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« Reply #211 on: June 25, 2005, 10:41:26 AM »

Heard on FOX this morning --- the texas search team vows to stay in aruba until Natalee is found.
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iquitos
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« Reply #212 on: June 25, 2005, 10:42:23 AM »

Quote from: "bendex"
Well i do not believe in this scenario at all . Why is it the most believable scenario. Question why do you conclude date rap drug , why do you conclude drugs , why do you conclude sex , and why do you conclude sex on the beach which is a public place ?

Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "iquitos"
Joran didn't have to do with what?  What did Joran do after he left the club with Natalee and the Kalpoes?  I don't know, you don't know.

 Maybe Joran did not do anythng more than have Natalee pass out on him.  He left her there  She never showed up at her hotel room and nobody who is talking noticed until the next morning.  

Joran was embarrassed and lied.   He would have been better off not saying anything when confronted by the cops and the family.  Our little story would have been neater.  I would say Joran has plenty of reason to lie, since he lied in the beginning and was caught out.  we don't know how many story changes there have been.  We have no access to the investigative file.  

For me, it is hard to imagine a scenario in which Joran would kill Natalee by himself.  Murder is just too extreme for the imaginable circumstances involving Natalee and Joran alone.  Either it was an accident, or something happend to Natalee after Joran left.  Joran is under arrest and under intense pressure to confess a crime he may not have committed.  The cops are not looking for the truth, but a confession.  If Joran did not do anything to Natalee he can't confess, so he has to keep feeding the cops stories.  That is the same thing a captured military person would do to avoid revealing sensitive information  The Arubans desperately need to solve the crime and have already rushed to judge the wrong guys once.  Absent a body and evidence, they could be grasping at straws again and the stakes are now much higher.  

There is a logical explanation for this but it is not that Joran killed her and then he and others disposed of her body to cover it up.  It could have happend that way but it would not make sense.


The simplest and most straightforward explanation is that Joran gave Natalee a date-rape drug, took her to a beach and had sex with her, where he either murdered her or she OD'd. You may not WANT to believe it, and there may be other POSSIBLE explanations for Natalee's disappearance, but that is still the most believable scenario.


i think what professor means is that this is his best guess as to what happened, purely subjective, not based on fact, just his best guess.  In other words it is what he thinks.  thinking it and supporting it are two different propositions.
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mehill10
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« Reply #213 on: June 25, 2005, 10:42:39 AM »

arubagirl In aruba if you drug someone and they die is that pre-meditated murder under aruba law? and  what kind of time do you get in jail for it?
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RazzyBerry
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« Reply #214 on: June 25, 2005, 10:42:49 AM »

Quote from: "RB"
I agree with Razzberry. Let's face it, some folks only remind us that we are operating on rumor and speculation when they don't like our conclusions

No Professor, I don't like conclusions such as these when the tone of the post appears to want to force them down my, and others who perhaps have dissenting opinions, throat Smile  Whether it's meant to be perceived that way or not, I don't know, but there it is.


Nothing has been forced down anyones throat, maybe thats your perception because the opinion just happens to be something you dont agree with.
Ive answered everyones sarcastic questions pointed at me with as much tact as I can without LOL and rolling eyes at their questions which was how they were presented to me.
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Dublin
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« Reply #215 on: June 25, 2005, 10:42:52 AM »

Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Anyone out there. Have you ever gone to a 15 year old's party where they danced think Joran and that girl did? Am I missing something? Parent's did not put a stop to that? I know chaperones would put a stop to that at most proms! You are judged by your behavior right or wrong, I see why people don't have a problem bashing Joran
 

you have to understand the cultural context to understand the picture.  if you don't, please refain from comment.  otherwise you betray your ignorance.


Enlighten this ignorant person please....


They are saying that this is normal teen behavior...and not a reason to judge.


There are "cultural" differences.  Which I suspect they will claim the images all having the two finger salute are also part of that cultural difference.  But, it was defined on here earlier and it is a disgusting symbol that is seen again and again in all of these photos.  One more way that he disses women.  It may be an imitation of the gangster look, but it doesn't make it right. I also wonder why all teens aren't effected by the need to imitate that gangster look.  All our teens are exposed to the same culture.
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arubagirl
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« Reply #216 on: June 25, 2005, 10:43:19 AM »

Oh, by the way, the TX already started searching yesterday. They searched Bubali plas (another swamp) and the dam behind JvdS's house.

Guess they didn't find anything.
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JessesMom
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« Reply #217 on: June 25, 2005, 10:43:34 AM »

I'm interested in hearing more about the guy Greta referred to who didn't return to the U.S.  She said there was a man who was on the plane to Aruba with NH and her group, that he stayed at the same HI, and there is no record of his returning to the US.  I find this intriguing but hesitant to start speculating on it.

Has anyone heard anything else mentioned about this?
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la_cavalière
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« Reply #218 on: June 25, 2005, 10:43:40 AM »

Can someone clear up if PvdS was spotted at the Holiday Inn casino with Joran when he met Natalee, or is this just a rumor that has been repeated so often it is being accepted as fact?
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wantsanswers
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« Reply #219 on: June 25, 2005, 10:43:58 AM »

Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Anyone out there. Have you ever gone to a 15 year old's party where they danced think Joran and that girl did? Am I missing something? Parent's did not put a stop to that? I know chaperones would put a stop to that at most proms! You are judged by your behavior right or wrong, I see why people don't have a problem bashing Joran
 

you have to understand the cultural context to understand the picture.  if you don't, please refain from comment.  otherwise you betray your ignorance.


Enlighten this ignorant person please....


They are saying that this is normal teen behavior...and not a reason to judge.



And I am saying the lack of respect for women is what causes the lack of
self restaint either way.  When he has no problems acting like that in front of his parents, her parents, he has a sense of I can do what ever I want when I want.. Before you start bashing, I worked in a police dept for 10years in florida. I know the type.
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