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Author Topic: RBN #28 6/26/05 Sunday Evening  (Read 251549 times)
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mehill10
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« Reply #100 on: June 26, 2005, 07:28:59 PM »

Quote from: "sandy"
2) Statements to BT like "what do you want with your daughter? She is no use to you now"
Never heard the last part of that statement - is it true?


where did this come from
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katya
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« Reply #101 on: June 26, 2005, 07:29:25 PM »

Quote from: "Scott"
Quote from: "Kipster"
GuyWDog:
>>With these releases it appears that all this PRESSURE they have put on the main suspect(Joran) has not worked

Unfortunately, I think that's where they are now. Joran's not cracking, sure PVDS will testify, essentially he already has. They desperately need a body.


Paulus probably told Joran...'You can spend another 100 days in here, or another 7000.  The choice is yours.'

If this case reaches a dead end, as a last resort, they should allow the FBI to be alone with Joran, and tell him, 'we've cut a deal with the Aruban authorities to bring you to the US, where you'll be tried and convicted by a jury of your peers in Alabama, and be sentenced to death.  Don't worry, a lethal injection is a quick, painless way to go.  Your Dad can't help you.  The future of the island is more important than you.'

If he doesn't sing by the time he boards the FBI's plane, then, and only then would I believe in his innocence.


So US juries convict without evidence? Sounds corrupt to me. Also as a minor, Joran is not eligible for the DP, even in the US (recent ruling by the Supremes).
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writenow
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« Reply #102 on: June 26, 2005, 07:29:31 PM »

Quote from: "inspector_detector"
According to Satish's attorney, there is no evidence in this case whatsoever, and I for one agree with him. :wink:


Oh yeah. Big shock there that a defense attorney says there's no evidence and his client is innocent.

Hey pal, that's in the lawyer handbook. They all say that even when they know their client's lying through their teeth.
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arubagirl
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« Reply #103 on: June 26, 2005, 07:30:17 PM »

icey posted it, perhaps (s)he misheard the "what do you want me to do about it" alleged response from Joran
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Sobelle
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« Reply #104 on: June 26, 2005, 07:30:25 PM »

Quote from: "HannieC"
I still don`t understand what the drinking is about, maybe it`s b/c i`m dutch and used to a more liberal way of living, but i was also young and a girl and i can absolutly understand what youths are doing if they are from home at a beatiful place with a lot of friends and new people to meet!

I think that the 'responsable drinking ' isn`t the issue here, those kids were having fun drinking or not, they are no robots either. I think that a lot of people are forgetting that they were young also.... Wink



I agree HannieC.  Sometimes the older we get "old-timers" seems to set in.  I also think that it is little bit more liberal way of living in Aruba than what a lot of us in the US are use to.  So people may need to take that in to consideration when looking at another culture. IMHO
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inthepacific
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« Reply #105 on: June 26, 2005, 07:30:35 PM »

Quote from: "Ting"
Quote from: "coco"
I feel sorry that Dash was upset - I think she's really trying to cope with a horrible situation and she's certainly been a great protector of her friend's reputation.

I think the real problem is that this is not a "Natalee Support Group" - it's a board debating/discussing a crime - and so what Dash was looking for from the discussion and what most of the discussion participants are just at odds.


To be honest, I do not know if I would advise someone so closely connected with the victim to venture beyond websites that deal exclusively with prayers and hopes that Natalee can be returned to her family, a prayer and hope that I share.


I have to agree regarding dash. When this forum first started I didn't believe she could possibly be one of Natalee's friends posting in a forum full of debate. I was proved to be wrong, she actually was real. But I think this is the wrong place for a friend of Natalee's to come to without expecting open discussion with people from all over the world commenting and debating this topic of missing Natalee.

This forum reminds me alot of forums such as Court tv and Websleuths. And I don't beleive it is a good place to read stuff you don't want to see from victims family, or victims friends. I know if I was one of those 2, it would be very hard to read some of the ideas being brought up here.
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Catriana
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« Reply #106 on: June 26, 2005, 07:31:02 PM »

Quote from: "Ting"
To be honest, I do not know if I would advise someone so closely connected with the victim to venture beyond websites that deal exclusively with prayers and hopes that Natalee can be returned to her family, a prayer and hope that I share.


I have to say, I agree with you there.  I appreciate all the insight that Dash has given us here, but I think her own well-being should come before our "desire to know".

I hope Dash takes the time to relax and get the comfort and support she needs.

A discussion forum where people are disecting a potential crime against her friend, is not the best place for her at this time.

My thoughts and prayers are with Natalee, her family and today especially.. with her FRIEND, Alana.
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puggywug
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« Reply #107 on: June 26, 2005, 07:31:05 PM »

Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "puggywug"
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Natalee introduced herself to Joran, chatted with him, invited him to Carlos 'n Charlie's, danced with him there, walked out with him, and apparently voluntarily got in the car with him. I would say she sort of liked him, although of course she couldn't have known him very well after such a short time.

la_cavalière wrote:
Joran couldn't have been THAT much of a jerk that Sunday. Natalee apparently took a liking to him, and everyone says she had great judgment. If she had thought he was an arrogant liar, I doubt she would have spent any time with him.

Hi, la_cav  Very Happy .  Maybe you missed my previous response because it was on page 50 of the last thread.  I wrote:

We really don't know if Natalee "took a liking to him" or not. How would we know that? For all we know, he saw her and her group leaving the bar and walked out to try to catch her and spend more time with her. We don't know that she spoke to him other than introducing herself earlier that day. And just because you introduce yourself to someone doesn't mean you took a liking to them. It is being polite. When my husband and I were in Vegas, if we were at a table gambling for a while with the same people, we would introduce ourselves or strike up small talk. That didn't mean we wanted to date the people.

I'd also like to add that I don't recall anyone saying she invited him to CnC's or was dancing with him at the bar.  One more thing.  Last night a woman told of her experience when she was unknowingly drugged with a "date rape" drug.  He husband told her that she was walking and talking coherently, yet she had no memory of it.  ***PERHAPS Natalee was drugged when she left the bar with the group of MBers and then Joran asked her if he could ride with her back to HI.  IN THIS THEORETICAL SCENARIO, she would have been willing to get in the car with him, but she would not have been cognizant of her actions.  JUST A THOUGHT  Very Happy


Hi Puggy! (My nick should be BeagleWeagle). I still think the chances are greater that Natalee sort of liked Joran than she was trying to evade him the whole night.

I don't know if she invited Joran, but I know she told him she was going to CnCs that night. Why would you do that if you thought he was a jerk? And why would she dance with him? Why would she walk out with him? If she didn't like him, she could have asked one of the dozens of MBH students there to walk out with her.
I remember being in situations where a guy I didn't like was hanging out around me, and I would be sure to join my friends to get rid of him.
I'm sure Joran can be very charming with the ladies, and he was likely charming in Natalee's eyes that evening.

Hi, all I'm saying is that no one said she danced with him, to my recollection.  And she could have just asked, "What are you doing tonight" as a way to chit chat while they are sitting at the same gambling table.  WHat I mean is that I don't think we should assume she was interested in him.  There has been so much misinformation out there, and I have been basing my theories (plural - again, I have not made up my mind!  Smile ) on what Dash, Dash's mom, and other parents of kids from the trip have posted.  When she left the bar, it was at the same time as a group of MB kids.  Dash asked her a question and Natalee replied that she was going back to the HI quote, "with them" and pointed to the group of MB kids.  That is one thing I believe happened.  Smile
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mehill10
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« Reply #108 on: June 26, 2005, 07:31:29 PM »

arubagirl  Is it against the law in aruba to lie to the police?  in the USA it is  the cops can lie to you  but you lie to they  it's aother charge
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arrabba
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« Reply #109 on: June 26, 2005, 07:31:52 PM »

Quote from: "wwizard"
Quote from: "coco"
I feel sorry that Dash was upset - I think she's really trying to cope with a horrible situation and she's certainly been a great protector of her friend's reputation.

I think the real problem is that this is not a "Natalee Support Group" - it's a board debating/discussing a crime - and so what Dash was looking for from the discussion and what most of the discussion participants are just at odds.


thank you


IMO Dash is suffering now, her feelings are a little too raw to have any salt poured on them.  My heart goes out to her.
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blfit
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« Reply #110 on: June 26, 2005, 07:32:19 PM »

Surprisingly a lot of people are defending Joran, I dont agree with a lot of what they say, but it is good to have them here to balance things out.[/quote]

I agree with that.  What I am saying is that I think everyone at times speaks from their emotions and get's carried away without realizing it.
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nancy_drew
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« Reply #111 on: June 26, 2005, 07:32:20 PM »

What's with the stars today?

I just received what I consider a very offensive PM who says they are writing with their ADMIN hat off.  This person said there was a time when "Dallas" protected the kids from my questions.  Since I have never, ever posted anything that would be offensive to those kids, I take real issue with such a comment.

The poster/admin went on to say:
Quote
There have also been huge inconsistences in what dash and other MB students posted, they contridicted their own interviews.


Are we now the FBI?  Are we law enforcement? We feel we can now hold kids experiencing deep trauma and loss accountable?  These kids owe us?  Give me a break.

If this is a serious crime forum, why did we welcome these kids here to begin with?  Sure, we got what we wanted from them,  sought their friendship and now we're done with them?

I think at least two of the Admins here should resign...that does NOT include Catriana...she rocks.  But, the PM's I've received from two of them are absolutely nuts.

I suggest we create a thread somewhere where these kids can be welcome with open arms.  The selfish jerks can stay away from that spot.  We owe them some kind of mature caring and fairness.
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wwizard
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« Reply #112 on: June 26, 2005, 07:32:33 PM »

Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "wwizard"
heck, I'll admit it, I vacillate between the goog girl/bad girl scenarios with the attending theories.......all I know is what's on this screen


I don't think that drinking at a club, leaving with new friends, or walking alone on the beach makes someone a "bad girl". Nor does it have anything to do with the disappearance case. Rolling Eyes


there are some others blogs that paint a different picture.....heck, I don't know...I wasn't there.
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arubagirl
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« Reply #113 on: June 26, 2005, 07:32:34 PM »

mehill, if you sign a sworn statement and later it turns out not to be true, it's criminal.
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nikkibnurse
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« Reply #114 on: June 26, 2005, 07:33:04 PM »

Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "coco"
I feel sorry that Dash was upset - I think she's really trying to cope with a horrible situation and she's certainly been a great protector of her friend's reputation.

I think the real problem is that this is not a "Natalee Support Group" - it's a board debating/discussing a crime - and so what Dash was looking for from the discussion and what most of the discussion participants are just at odds.


Just because this forum is debating a crime doesn't mean we can post whatever we want.  

If I were to make a post saying that I thought Natalee died while having sex with 10 men and doing every drug known to man without any evidence whatsoever, would that be acceptable?  Obviously it isn't.  We know this because it is a) completely unfoudned b) outrageous given what we know of her character and c) blatantly insulting to a victim.  

I've seen a lot of things like this on the forum, not any as outrageous, but some have come close.  I think this is the sort of stuff that makes Dash angry.



VERY well said..ditto to that!
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GreatOwl
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« Reply #115 on: June 26, 2005, 07:33:14 PM »

Quote from: "mehill10"
Quote from: "sandy"
2) Statements to BT like "what do you want with your daughter? She is no use to you now"
Never heard the last part of that statement - is it true?


where did this come from


I have never seen that quote before.  Sounds like just another rumor.
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Scott
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« Reply #116 on: June 26, 2005, 07:33:27 PM »

Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Scott"
Quote from: "Kipster"
GuyWDog:
>>With these releases it appears that all this PRESSURE they have put on the main suspect(Joran) has not worked

Unfortunately, I think that's where they are now. Joran's not cracking, sure PVDS will testify, essentially he already has. They desperately need a body.


Paulus probably told Joran...'You can spend another 100 days in here, or another 7000.  The choice is yours.'

If this case reaches a dead end, as a last resort, they should allow the FBI to be alone with Joran, and tell him, 'we've cut a deal with the Aruban authorities to bring you to the US, where you'll be tried and convicted by a jury of your peers in Alabama, and be sentenced to death.  Don't worry, a lethal injection is a quick, painless way to go.  Your Dad can't help you.  The future of the island is more important than you.'

If he doesn't sing by the time he boards the FBI's plane, then, and only then would I believe in his innocence.


So US juries convict without evidence? Sounds corrupt to me. Also as a minor, Joran is not eligible for the DP, even in the US (recent ruling by the Supremes).


You're kidding me, right?  I didn't mean it, literally.  

I'm talking about scaring the $hit out of the kid to the point that he actually believes he's no longer protected.
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Another K in Texas
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« Reply #117 on: June 26, 2005, 07:33:56 PM »

Somehow the quote messed up.  

I agree with Nancy but have to take her quote out since it swallowed mine.


To all those who bashed the kids for staying quiet, you should be ashamed of yourselves.  This is a prime example of why they are staying quiet.[/qupote


I agree.  I just got back to the forum.  There are times when adults need to realize that vulnerable and hurting people are around.  It is not  a free speech issue.  It is a human decency issue to put a filter on your keyboard and think before your type.

Also, there is zero, no, none, zilch, nada, excuse to vilify the victim in a crime.   Sadly there are some people who just like to put people down and destroy rather than build up.


If you are one of the people that ran Dash off, first,  in my opinion you owe her and her mother an apology, and second, you really need to look in the mirror and think about yourself.  If you were that victim--would you want to have every little secret exposed and every tiny speck of dirt exposed.  

When there is a choice between going the "nice" think and the smart, sarcastic, witty thing, try picking nice for a change.[/quote]
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la_cavalière
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« Reply #118 on: June 26, 2005, 07:33:57 PM »

Film clip of PvdS on Fox: He said something like "I want to go home to my wife." The second part I didn't catch.
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mordred
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« Reply #119 on: June 26, 2005, 07:34:00 PM »

Quote from: "nancy_drew"
It makes me so sad Dash, of all people, ............
....Again, those who attacked the kids and their actions while Dash and others were posting here this afternoon, should be ashamed.


Nancy_Drew:
 I am suprised that you who seems to be very concerned about justice would interprete people's opinions that way. I have been on this forum for quite a while & I have not seen anyone attacking the MB kids in general on Natalee in particular! If she did drink, like Joran, went willingly with him, made-out, etc; there is NOTHING in those actions that constitute bad character for an 18 yr old. If she didn't, she would be weird!!!

Without being facetious, I have had opportunity to observe in the last few years that young people from the American South & those from a village in Nunavut generally act the same given similar circumstances.

Dash is off-course very sensitive about this sisnce its so close to home & her reaction is understandable.
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