Lively Case Discussion #509 8/9 - 8/10/2006

[San]

From Deepak's June 16th Statement:

 If you want to find out what happened to the girl and where she is, you have to be with Joran van der SLOOT

Isn't the wording of this curious if they contend they left her on the beach?

Joran van der SLOOT is a disturbed/sich person, he has admitted that he is in the care of a psychologist and that he hits his brother. If the police wants more information about Natalee, then you have to be with Joran.

What would motivate Deepak to make this comment about Joran being disturbed.  Again I believe this shows knowledge of something happening to Natalee.

Also notice how Deepak throws in the statement about hitting his brother.  Is he saying Joran hit Natalee.

great point San...did not pick up on that...he just may be trying to show his violent tendencies..also why he mention psychiatrist. Did you also notice he is seeing psychiatrist instead of counselor or psycholgist?! This would suggest he is receiving meds too!!

If he was receiving meds he was not taking them.  With his attitude he feels he doesn't needs meds because there is nothing wrong with him.

[Kimmy53]

From Satish's June 11th Statement:

. Joran told my brother that he had then tried to wake up the girl but that she had not awakened.

Could there be truth in this statement?  

 Joran told my brother that he had looked to find his shoes but that he couldn't find them. Joran told my brother that he had left the girl on the beach and that he had walked home barefoot.

Joran was in a hurry to get away from wherever he was...

[San]

if in fact he was receiving meds...which if he was seeing a psychiatrist rather than anger management counselor or psychologist...mixing them with alcohol??!! LIVE WIRE!!

Exactly.  And lord knows what other drugs he was taking.

[ldstlou]

From Satish's June 11th Statement:

. Joran told my brother that he had then tried to wake up the girl but that she had not awakened.

Could there be truth in this statement?  

 Joran told my brother that he had looked to find his shoes but that he couldn't find them. Joran told my brother that he had left the girl on the beach and that he had walked home barefoot.

Joran was in a hurry to get away from wherever he was...

definately see panic here...but also see panic from Deepak when he speaks in an earlier statement about driving back fast from lighthouse after she falls asleep in car. Definate need to analyse.

[Kimmy53]

Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx.

Oh - had Deepak gotten some more minutes by then?  Thought he was out of minutes.

[ldstlou]

if in fact he was receiving meds...which if he was seeing a psychiatrist rather than anger management counselor or psychologist...mixing them with alcohol??!! LIVE WIRE!!

Exactly.  And lord knows what other drugs he was taking.

doing google search to see what meds would be prescribed typically for anger management...anyone know off hand?

[ldstlou]

Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx.

Oh - had Deepak gotten some more minutes by then?  Thought he was out of minutes.

no crap!! a lot of myths debunked here frm their own statements!! Deepak LOW on minutes but definately not OUT!!

[the big hammer]

Blood In Kalpoe Car


FROM DEEPAK'S JUNE 16TH STATEMENT: To your question whether I can state anything about the case of the missing girl, I can say the following. Joran had made up the story that there were traces of blood in my car. My car was ripped open by the police and one could see that was this was a lie.

This is the third mention of blood in car:

1.  FBI to BHT early on.
2.  Obduber to Beth during meeting
3.  Here in deepak's June 16 statement, attributed to jvds.

Deepak arrested/detained June 9.  Description of items impounded does not include car on that day.  There was a timeline posted indicating kalpoe car was impounded and seized by polis on June 13.

Point being of course that visit to Automotive Enterprises to "fix flat" could hvae easily preceded June 9 arrest.  And date of this statement -- June 16 -- follows car siezing on the 13th.  If sieze date is June 13, just because polis throughly searched car, does not make this statement true.

Can we confirm date of kalpoe car seizure by ALE?  TIA.

[San]

Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx.

Oh - had Deepak gotten some more minutes by then?  Thought he was out of minutes.

What this all boils down to are phone records.  The ALE isn't going to release any phone calls that were made by the suspects those first few days.  They are only releasing a certain few because the suspects themselves admitted to making certain calls when they made up their false alibi.

Wouldn't you love to see Paulus' phone records.

[ldstlou]

Effexor's pros and cons:

Pros: If anything is going to cure the deepest, blackest depression, it's Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride). Perhaps Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) in combination with an antipsychotic, but for deep, despairing clinical depression that is going to respond to the standard tweaking of the popular neurotransmitters, Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) pulls people out of the abyss.

Cons: The absolute worst discontinuation syndrome of an antidepressant. Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) is a medication people utterly loathe to have taken. It is not uncommon for someone to change doctors during or immediately after Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) discontinuation.

Effexor's Typical Side Effects: The usual for SSRIs and SNRIs -  headache, nausea, dry mouth, sweating, sleepiness or insomnia, and diarrhea or constipation, weight gain, loss of libido and a host of other sexual dysfunctions. Most everything but the weight gain and sexual dysfunctions usually goes away within a couple of weeks.  Although some women will notice that the sexual side effects will diminish above 200-225mg a day when the norepinephrine kicks in.  Maybe.

For tips on how to cope with these side effects, please see our side effects page.

Effexor's Not So Common Side Effects: Increased or lowered blood pressure, sweating, farting, anorexia, twitching, shock-like sensations.

 These may or may not happen to you don't, so don't be surprised one way or the other.

Effexor's Freaky Rare Side Effects: Alcohol intolerance and alcohol abuse. So Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) is going to be just the thing to talk about at AA meetings. Someone's reflexes increased and someone else's breasts got bigger, proving that there is no pleasing some people. Someone else's hair changed color and, really, no Revlon was involved. But the most disturbing freaky rare side effect with Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) is what Wyeth disingenuously calls "withdrawal syndrome," that once you acclimate to Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) you are basically hooked for life. The discontinuation syndrome never goes away if you try to stop. For someone with unipolar depression that's a pain in the ass, but something you might be able to work around barring any really adverse side effects, but for someone who is bipolar you can be royally screwed because Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) can really aggravate mania and especially rapid cycling.

I've been getting a few e-mails and reading a few reports about how Effexor has caused Effexor users, as well as friends and relatives using the med to really hit the booze, so alcohol abuse may not be that rare a side effect after all.   Best guess to date on that - Paul of Leeds (in the U.K.) posits that Effexor's broad spectrum use of liver enzymes probably interferes with alcohol clearance and tolerance, thus leading to the type of alcoholism that affects people without the proper enzymes to effectively metabolize alcohol.  Between that and the way Effexor works your liver, you're probably better off giving up booze entirely if you're taking this med

Kind of interesting!! This seems to be a common med for people who have anger management problems...would explain the alcohol abuse!!

[klaasend]

Blood In Kalpoe Car


FROM DEEPAK'S JUNE 16TH STATEMENT: To your question whether I can state anything about the case of the missing girl, I can say the following. Joran had made up the story that there were traces of blood in my car. My car was ripped open by the police and one could see that was this was a lie.

This is the third mention of blood in car:

1.  FBI to BHT early on.
2.  Obduber to Beth during meeting
3.  Here in deepak's June 16 statement, attributed to jvds.

Deepak arrested/detained June 9.  Description of items impounded does not include car on that day.  There was a timeline posted indicating kalpoe car was impounded and seized by polis on June 13.

Point being of course that visit to Automotive Enterprises to "fix flat" could hvae easily preceded June 9 arrest.  And date of this statement -- June 16 -- follows car siezing on the 13th.  If sieze date is June 13, just because polis throughly searched car, does not make this statement true.

Can we confirm date of kalpoe car seizure by ALE?  TIA.

HAMMER - According to this article, the Kalpoe car was seized on June 9th:

Nancy Grace - June 16th, 2005

GRACE: Well, there has been many days since Natalee went missing.

Very quickly, back to Karl Penhaul, CNN correspondent there in Aruba. Karl, what can you tell us about this evidence that was seized? We know many bags of evidence were taken from these three suspects` home.

And let`s get it straight, Karl. At the beginning, two minority security guards were arrested, all right, taken into custody in connection with Natalee`s disappearance. The three young men that took her from the bar, Carlos and Charlie`s, that night, were not arrested. They were questioned and released. Now they`re behind bars, and the two security guards have been released. Now, what was in the evidence taken from these three young men`s home?

PENHAUL: The only evidence that we can confirm we know has been taken was that, in the first raid on the three suspects` homes, which was a week ago last Thursday, we saw taken out of the Kalpoe brothers` houses a computer hard drive. And we also saw a silver gray Honda being impounded at that house.

[Kimmy53]

Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx.

Oh - had Deepak gotten some more minutes by then?  Thought he was out of minutes.

What this all boils down to are phone records.  The ALE isn't going to release any phone calls that were made by the suspects those first few days.  They are only releasing a certain few because the suspects themselves admitted to making certain calls when they made up their false alibi.

Wouldn't you love to see Paulus' phone records.

Oh - we'll never see those records for sure.  And you are right - I'd love to know what we could find out from Pvds records.

[Kimmy53]

Blood In Kalpoe Car


FROM DEEPAK'S JUNE 16TH STATEMENT: To your question whether I can state anything about the case of the missing girl, I can say the following. Joran had made up the story that there were traces of blood in my car. My car was ripped open by the police and one could see that was this was a lie.

This is the third mention of blood in car:

1.  FBI to BHT early on.
2.  Obduber to Beth during meeting
3.  Here in deepak's June 16 statement, attributed to jvds.

Deepak arrested/detained June 9.  Description of items impounded does not include car on that day.  There was a timeline posted indicating kalpoe car was impounded and seized by polis on June 13.

Point being of course that visit to Automotive Enterprises to "fix flat" could hvae easily preceded June 9 arrest.  And date of this statement -- June 16 -- follows car siezing on the 13th.  If sieze date is June 13, just because polis throughly searched car, does not make this statement true.

Can we confirm date of kalpoe car seizure by ALE?  TIA.

Along a similar line:  Where would Joran get info to tell that there was traces of blood in the car?  

Could be an attempted set up - Could be that Joran knew there were traces in the car without being told.  Could be that someone was feeding Joran information as to mold his stories around it.

[Peaches]

Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx.

Oh - had Deepak gotten some more minutes by then?  Thought he was out of minutes.

What this all boils down to are phone records.  The ALE isn't going to release any phone calls that were made by the suspects those first few days.  They are only releasing a certain few because the suspects themselves admitted to making certain calls when they made up their false alibi.

Wouldn't you love to see Paulus' phone records.

Not really.  I would rather see him tied to a chair and smacked silly until the truth leaks out.  I don't care who goes first.  Or last.

[ldstlou]

for Anna...

Adolescents (10-14 and 15-19 years): Between 1996 and 1999, 15 deaths of adolescents were reported: two in 1996-1997, six in 1998 and seven in 1999. Nine of these deaths were due to external causes: six were due to motor vehicle accidents, two due to suicide and self-inflicted injury, and one due to accidental poisoning. According to a 1998 survey, 20% of children 6-14 years old who attended school do not eat breakfast before going to study; however, more than three-quarters (76%) consumed a warm meal every day or almost every day. The survey also found that children attending primary school had a higher frequency of eating fruits (46%) than vegetables (39%). Consumption of soft drink seems to be the preferred habit for 45% of the children, at a frequency of at least one bottle per day. Approximately 70% of the children bring food and a beverage to school. In 1997, a study on drug use among males aged 17 to 25 years old found that the average age for marijuana use was just under 21 years old and the average age for cocaine and crack use was slightly older than 23 years. Of great concern is the finding that roughly one-third of the people (30%) in this age group use drugs.

per Pan Amercan Health Organization. "there's that suicide/self inflicted injuries" again!! Seemd no one is murdered on island...they all commit suicide!! Why on One Happy Island?

[San]

Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx.

Oh - had Deepak gotten some more minutes by then?  Thought he was out of minutes.

What this all boils down to are phone records.  The ALE isn't going to release any phone calls that were made by the suspects those first few days.  They are only releasing a certain few because the suspects themselves admitted to making certain calls when they made up their false alibi.

Wouldn't you love to see Paulus' phone records.

Not really.  I would rather see him tied to a chair and smacked silly until the truth leaks out.  I don't care who goes first.  Or last.

I going to be good and not comment on this one because I could think of worse

[San]

FROM DEEPAK'S JUNE 16TH STATEMENT:

I asked him if he had had sex with the girl. He said that they went into the water briefly and that after that they sat down on the beach and the girl had fallen asleep, that is what I understood. His actual words were that the girl "passed out" on the beach and that he left her there.

Deepak debunks Joran's whole story that he told Greta.  What happened to the conversation that he had with Natalee and how she didn't want to go home.  Joran never talked that they went into the water.  What happened to he picked her up and was going to carry her to her hotel but she said put her down.  What BS.

[Kimmy53]

Deepak:

During the conversation I had with him I had for one reason or another shot my mouth off and said something about the sporting shoes. The man asked me what I meant by sporting shoes. I then said to him that I was thinking about something unrelated/different.

This is extremely curious to me... Deepak was conversing with the man in the green Yaris - for some reason, he "shot off his mouth"  this tells me something struck a nerve and made Deepak mad.  WHY would he mention the shoes?  Then realize what he said and pretty much change the subject?

[San]

Deepak:

During the conversation I had with him I had for one reason or another shot my mouth off and said something about the sporting shoes. The man asked me what I meant by sporting shoes. I then said to him that I was thinking about something unrelated/different.

This is extremely curious to me... Deepak was conversing with the man in the green Yaris - for some reason, he "shot off his mouth"  this tells me something struck a nerve and made Deepak mad.  WHY would he mention the shoes?  Then realize what he said and pretty much change the subject?

Deepak is always giving a little too much information and there are reason behind it.  Deepak know exactly what happened and so does Satish.  By this time Deepaks mind is racing and he sees the HI isn't going to work.

[Ono]

Blood In Kalpoe Car


FROM DEEPAK'S JUNE 16TH STATEMENT: To your question whether I can state anything about the case of the missing girl, I can say the following. Joran had made up the story that there were traces of blood in my car. My car was ripped open by the police and one could see that was this was a lie.

This is the third mention of blood in car:

1.  FBI to BHT early on.
2.  Obduber to Beth during meeting
3.  Here in deepak's June 16 statement, attributed to jvds.

Deepak arrested/detained June 9.  Description of items impounded does not include car on that day.  There was a timeline posted indicating kalpoe car was impounded and seized by polis on June 13.

Point being of course that visit to Automotive Enterprises to "fix flat" could hvae easily preceded June 9 arrest.  And date of this statement -- June 16 -- follows car siezing on the 13th.  If sieze date is June 13, just because polis throughly searched car, does not make this statement true.

Can we confirm date of kalpoe car seizure by ALE?  TIA.

Side note:  

Remember how sarcastic Satish was in the conversation between the three in the police car regarding the flat tire ?? There was NO flat tire...IMO.