RBN#35 06/29/05 Wed-Thursday Overnight.

[Ting]

Hi ever body!  Big news night! What Greta is fixxin to say is my point exactly!  He made his lies before he had reason to know anything was wrong! I see that is a shared view!  
I'm looking forward to seeing what y'all have to say, bout that!

What I have to say is that any story that starts with some blurry babble about a mysterious phone call from a mysterious person either from the US and/or about a call from another un-named person to or from the US, with no detail about what the question was, or clarity on the caller's identity, that results in Charles Croes and an un-named young man driving around with the just-arrived Holloway family adds, by my calculations, a total of 0 to the fact total and causes the bullshit meter to explode.

[la_cavalière]

for the kidnap theory fans - this guy Charles Croes said he was called because he ran a rental cell phone company on the island and the Twitty's know him (I think I got that right) and they wanted info "about a cell phone call" - since clearly Natalee's cell phone was not from one of this guy's phone (and the "chaperone" had Natalee's cell phone and was using it to call her family) what phone call could CC be refering to???

He was very carefully not saying more than "a phone call" and Greta was too - sounded as if they had an agreement that she would not ask about that phone call as part of the interview - or so it sounded to me.

so --- ransom call?

How do you know Natalee didn't rent a cell phone from Charles Croes' company? The majority of U.S. cell phones don't work in Aruba, so you have to rent a cell phone.

[NL]

Hi ever body!  Big news night! What Greta is fixxin to say is my point exactly!  He made his lies before he had reason to know anything was wrong! I see that is a shared view!  
I'm looking forward to seeing what y'all have to say, bout that!

First of all, this is not really "news", isn't this? We all knew Joran made up the HI story on May 31st at 3AM.

Theory #1: Joran is innocent. He made up the story, because he didn't really remember what happened (he was drunk). he thinks that HI story is easier to explain.

Theory #2: Joran is guilty. He knew the police interrogating him, was a matter of time. On May 30, he made up the story with the Kalpoes (and maybe PvdS? It seems like PvdS has nothing to do with the HI story).

[Anna]

So she was drunk and doing drugs, yet all of her friends who saw her said she looked fine.

Joran's story to blame the victim.  I really doubt she was taking drugs on her own accord...if she had them in her system it was because he put them there.

Agreed. Although I wouldn't doubt that she was drinking.

<<

No mention of the friend who was with NH at the casino or even of their going to C&C or did I miss that entirely?

[writenow]

for the kidnap theory fans - this guy Charles Croes said he was called because he ran a rental cell phone company on the island and the Twitty's know him (I think I got that right) and they wanted info "about a cell phone call" - since clearly Natalee's cell phone was not from one of this guy's phone (and the "chaperone" had Natalee's cell phone and was using it to call her family) what phone call could CC be refering to???

He was very carefully not saying more than "a phone call" and Greta was too - sounded as if they had an agreement that she would not ask about that phone call as part of the interview - or so it sounded to me.

so --- ransom call?

Aye caramba. THAT's why they knew from the beginning this was different.

[someone]

Joran is telling a lie before the first news cycle.   Greta wants an innocent explanation.   Furman can't figure it out.  Ok, here's an innocent explanation:

If we assume that Joran is innocent (go with me here), why would he lie?   He has just been confronted by the parents of NH, the police, and an angry Alabama mob at 2:00 in the morning.   So perhaps he doesn't want to admit in front of his parents and her parents that he had sex with her.  There could be many reasons he would not want to admit it, including not wanting to talk about his sexual exploits in front of his parents, not wanting to talk about NH having sex in front of her parents, etc.  

So, he makes up a story about dropping her off at the HI.  Then once the mob leaves, Dad talks to him and tells him that he needs to be honest and tell the truth.  Dad assumes the first story is the truth, so Joran figures that that he can just convince his friends to go along with the story to keep the fact that he took her to the beach to have sex a secret.  In his mind, nothing happened to her once he left her on the beach, so it seems like a little white lie.   He's too young to know about the %$W&@-storm that is about to hit him.

Of course, if you think he's definitely guilty, this theory will seem as wacky as someone believing in Scientology.

Your missing the point, he made up the story with his friends before he even knew the girl was missing.

If he didn't know she was missing, or something had happened, why would he have to make up a STORY at all????

[blfit]

So she was drunk and doing drugs, yet all of her friends who saw her said she looked fine.

Joran's story to blame the victim.  I really doubt she was taking drugs on her own accord...if she had them in her system it was because he put them there.

Well blame the victim and play the victim.  Didn't he say that he felt uncomfortable that she was coming on to him???  Please!!!

[klaasend]

UPDATE

We have successfully, uh, well "repelled" a certain individual who had begun flooding our board with connection requests to make the board inaccessible to you.  So we can more easily stop this kind of stuff,(which we think we'll get again as more people are coming here and we're getting better known) we will be requiring all members to log in to read our posts. I'd post something to the "floodbot" guy who tried to do this, but alas, he's probably weeping over the smoldering ruins of what's left of his cable modem.

To those of you who are new with us and have been just reading, we welcome you and hope you'll start to participate in our community.

Good work!

[la_cavalière]

What I have to say is that any story that starts with some blurry babble about a mysterious phone call from a mysterious person either from the US and/or about a call from another un-named person to or from the US, with no detail about what the question was, or clarity on the caller's identity, that results in Charles Croes and an un-named young man driving around with the just-arrived Holloway family adds, by my calculations, a total of 0 to the fact total and causes the bullshit meter to explode.

MDR!!!! (French for LMAO)

[medleyrelay]

Troll - I would say that this might be possible - I just am not 100% that Joran is guilty of anything worse than being a 17 year old kid that is rather advanced in some of his partying, sex and late nites gambling. But then again so are many US teens - and most young people do not want to talk about sex with adults and never with parents or the parents of someone they might have had sex with.

So - not wanting to be naive here - but still willing to keep an open mind - I still need more evidence than what we have heard so far!

[Mom in Ark]

Hi ever body!  Big news night! What Greta is fixxin to say is my point exactly!  He made his lies before he had reason to know anything was wrong! I see that is a shared view!  
I'm looking forward to seeing what y'all have to say, bout that!

What I have to say is that any story that starts with some blurry babble about a mysterious phone call from a mysterious person either from the US and/or about a call from another un-named person to or from the US, with no detail about what the question was, or clarity on the caller's identity, that results in Charles Croes and an un-named young man driving around with the just-arrived Holloway family adds, by my calculations, a total of 0 to the fact total and causes the bullshit meter to explode.

ROTFLMAO!!! with TEARS!!!!

[TTownMike]

I think Greta means that the three boys had concocted an alibi, some lies, even before the people arrived at his home.

I think she is saying they knew something had gone wrong before the Holloways arrived.

consciouness of guilt.

BINGO!

That has been my point since day one!  Why HAVE A LIE rather than a truth if you have nothing to hide!
The key point in this whole deal! Sotaspeak!

[iquitos]

excerpt, purported deepak email:

The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino).end excerpt

Now, when did they have time to make this all up?  looks like joran used it and then sold it to the other two or they cooked it up on the way back from the wyndham if that is where they were instead of out disposing of a body.  i think extasy and alcohol overdose

[heavyheart]

So she was drunk and doing drugs, yet all of her friends who saw her said she looked fine.

Joran's story to blame the victim.  I really doubt she was taking drugs on her own accord...if she had them in her system it was because he put them there.

Agreed. Although I wouldn't doubt that she was drinking.

Well yeah...I would be too.  There is a significant difference between drugs and drinking.  Unless of course someone put drugs in your drink.

[~TAZ_MAN~]

I think Greta means that the three boys had concocted an alibi, some lies, even before the people arrived at his home.

I think she is saying they knew something had gone wrong before the Holloways arrived.

consciouness of guilt.

BINGO!

That has been my point since day one!  Why HAVE A LIE rather than a truth if you have nothing to hide!
The key point in this whole deal! Sotaspeak!

Ive been saying the email was sstory concocted to back up an alibi that wasnt even needed yet, because nobody knew Natalie was missing until the NEXT day...the only people that knew she was missing was the killers themself.

[dragonfly]

Joran is telling a lie before the first news cycle.   Greta wants an innocent explanation.   Furman can't figure it out.  Ok, here's an innocent explanation:

If we assume that Joran is innocent (go with me here), why would he lie?   He has just been confronted by the parents of NH, the police, and an angry Alabama mob at 2:00 in the morning.   So perhaps he doesn't want to admit in front of his parents and her parents that he had sex with her.  There could be many reasons he would not want to admit it, including not wanting to talk about his sexual exploits in front of his parents, not wanting to talk about NH having sex in front of her parents, etc.  

So, he makes up a story about dropping her off at the HI.  Then once the mob leaves, Dad talks to him and tells him that he needs to be honest and tell the truth.  Dad assumes the first story is the truth, so Joran figures that that he can just convince his friends to go along with the story to keep the fact that he took her to the beach to have sex a secret.  In his mind, nothing happened to her once he left her on the beach, so it seems like a little white lie.   He's too young to know about the %$W&@-storm that is about to hit him.

Of course, if you think he's definitely guilty, this theory will seem as wacky as someone believing in Scientology.

Well, I can "go with you" here for the sake of trying to figure out why an innocent person would lie, but I can't go with the embarrassment over sex, as this Charles Croes just said that there was talk of sex in regards to Joran and Natalee that night coming out of Joran's mouth.

[a Troll]

Joran is telling a lie before the first news cycle.   Greta wants an innocent explanation.   Furman can't figure it out.  Ok, here's an innocent explanation:

If we assume that Joran is innocent (go with me here), why would he lie?   He has just been confronted by the parents of NH, the police, and an angry Alabama mob at 2:00 in the morning.   So perhaps he doesn't want to admit in front of his parents and her parents that he had sex with her.  There could be many reasons he would not want to admit it, including not wanting to talk about his sexual exploits in front of his parents, not wanting to talk about NH having sex in front of her parents, etc.  

So, he makes up a story about dropping her off at the HI.  Then once the mob leaves, Dad talks to him and tells him that he needs to be honest and tell the truth.  Dad assumes the first story is the truth, so Joran figures that that he can just convince his friends to go along with the story to keep the fact that he took her to the beach to have sex a secret.  In his mind, nothing happened to her once he left her on the beach, so it seems like a little white lie.   He's too young to know about the %$W&@-storm that is about to hit him.

Of course, if you think he's definitely guilty, this theory will seem as wacky as someone believing in Scientology.

Your missing the point, he made up the story with his friends before he even knew the girl was missing.

I don't think I missed the point at all.  I'm saying that it is possible that he made up the story on the spot when confronted by the mob, and deepak was standing there with him when he made it up.   I didn't catch any part of the interview with Greta where she said that Deepack and Satish also were telling that story prior to the mob showing up.   Also, were the three guys taken in for questioning right there during the confrontation, or did the police talk to them the next day.  By the next day, I think Joran had talked to Satish and Deepak and they decided to throw in the two security guards thing as an embellishment.

[Whitney]

Joran is telling a lie before the first news cycle.   Greta wants an innocent explanation.   Furman can't figure it out.  Ok, here's an innocent explanation:

If we assume that Joran is innocent (go with me here), why would he lie?   He has just been confronted by the parents of NH, the police, and an angry Alabama mob at 2:00 in the morning.   So perhaps he doesn't want to admit in front of his parents and her parents that he had sex with her.  There could be many reasons he would not want to admit it, including not wanting to talk about his sexual exploits in front of his parents, not wanting to talk about NH having sex in front of her parents, etc.  

So, he makes up a story about dropping her off at the HI.  Then once the mob leaves, Dad talks to him and tells him that he needs to be honest and tell the truth.  Dad assumes the first story is the truth, so Joran figures that that he can just convince his friends to go along with the story to keep the fact that he took her to the beach to have sex a secret.  In his mind, nothing happened to her once he left her on the beach, so it seems like a little white lie.   He's too young to know about the %$W&@-storm that is about to hit him.

Of course, if you think he's definitely guilty, this theory will seem as wacky as someone believing in Scientology.

Of course, if you think he's definitely guilty, this theory will seem as wacky as someone believing in Scientology

Do you think the JVDS is guilty as sin?  

He certianly seems to be, at this point.  

can someone put his ass just "there"...?  [/b[

[Anna]

Hi ever body!  Big news night! What Greta is fixxin to say is my point exactly!  He made his lies before he had reason to know anything was wrong! I see that is a shared view!  
I'm looking forward to seeing what y'all have to say, bout that!

<<

I remember where I heard it first, Mike, sotaspeak!

[coco]

Ting - we're on the same wavelength


Folks are saying that "we know that the 3 boys already made up the story" but we only "know" that because Deepak told Mickey Johns that in the jail. I don't remember MJ saying that Deepak said they made up the story on the 30th -and since Deepak felt bad about getting MJ into trouble and was apologizing to MJ, I can easily see him saying "hey, the family told us what to say .." to excuse his own role in landing MJ in jail.

There are still too many questions to "know" anything ...

and I wish Fuhrman would be banned from TV - sleaze!

edited to correct typo