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Author Topic: Lively Case Discussion #658 7/15 - 7/17/2007  (Read 121847 times)
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klaasend
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« Reply #440 on: July 16, 2007, 06:05:55 PM »

Quote from: "thirdstrike"
Quote from: "klaasend"

Well, they may not need any cooperation from Aruba if in international waters.  Also, Aruba would be foolish to attempt interferrance.


Good point!  Although, wouldn't be nice if they could for once do the right thing and be of assistance?  I mean, c'mon...isn't two plus years enough?  She needs to be found and laid to rest already!!

Hope everyone has been doing ok, btw...

I don't think ALE can do anything to help.  The ships (2), the personnel and equipment are very sophisticated.  There will be people that do their specific jobs.  They don't need ALE to assist them.  They need ALE to stay out of their way.

Everything is great!  Did you see we got back some of our old archives?  Go to the main forum and scroll down to the locked archive threads.
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« Reply #441 on: July 16, 2007, 06:11:37 PM »

I went through all of americaninaruba posts last night. Two things interested me.1.She knows the Van Der Sloots.2.Van Der Straaten opened his mouth too soon to the dutch press.She knew the layout of the VDS property and its obvious she has been there. In another post she described Jorans Apt being 5 feet away from the main bldg and the layout of the property.

***NEWS****
Vander straten informed ppress dutch…of al information and informed them that the case has been solved, and will give less htan 24 hours to announce the result…and aparently theirs many police that are moving towards area of marriott hotel completely CLOSED no one is allowed they are searchign something either them or the dogs are searchign somethign or if Natalee is here….it iis not known what is happeneing

Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 2:55 pm Post subject:

ok i have to say you guys have a totaly wrong view of the VDS social status...they have a small house nothgin big just a normal neighbor hood home, the pool is very recent about 3 months, they ahve 2 cars that are like 7 years old (in aruba people change cars every 4 to 5 years), none of the kids have their own cars, they are the cheapest poeple youll ver meet and i think the mother hasnt had new clothes since 2000 becuae ive seen her in the same thign since forever! they DO NOT have a yacht and much less a mansion! just do get our perspectives in place...oh and the HOnda belonged to the Kalpoe brothers, JORAN does NOT have a car! he cant even drive! you get your licnese at 18 here NOT 16
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« Reply #442 on: July 16, 2007, 06:16:34 PM »

Quote from: "*******"
I went through all of americaninaruba posts last night. Two things interested me.1.She knows the Van Der Sloots.2.Van Der Straaten opened his mouth too soon to the dutch press.She knew the layout of the VDS property and its obvious she has been there. In another post she described Jorans Apt being 5 feet away from the main bldg and the layout of the property.

***NEWS****
Vander straten informed ppress dutch…of al information and informed them that the case has been solved, and will give less htan 24 hours to announce the result…and aparently theirs many police that are moving towards area of marriott hotel completely CLOSED no one is allowed they are searchign something either them or the dogs are searchign somethign or if Natalee is here….it iis not known what is happeneing

Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 2:55 pm Post subject:

ok i have to say you guys have a totaly wrong view of the VDS social status...they have a small house nothgin big just a normal neighbor hood home, the pool is very recent about 3 months, they ahve 2 cars that are like 7 years old (in aruba people change cars every 4 to 5 years), none of the kids have their own cars, they are the cheapest poeple youll ver meet and i think the mother hasnt had new clothes since 2000 becuae ive seen her in the same thign since forever! they DO NOT have a yacht and much less a mansion! just do get our perspectives in place...oh and the HOnda belonged to the Kalpoe brothers, JORAN does NOT have a car! he cant even drive! you get your licnese at 18 here NOT 16


well there may be some truth to that.  Anita does wear her clothes until they are so worn out you can see through them  Laughing
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« Reply #443 on: July 16, 2007, 06:23:01 PM »

*******,

Maybe she means five meters for we can see it is farther than five feet from the ariel photo.

BTW, I read that article about the two little girls when I ran across it trying to read about GHB being used to drug and infect people with HIV and I don't know which is the sickest but guess the one involving children would qualify. Evil or Very Mad
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Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
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« Reply #444 on: July 16, 2007, 06:26:09 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"
*******,

Maybe she means five meters for we can see it is farther than five feet from the ariel photo.

BTW, I read that article about the two little girls when I ran across it trying to read about GHB being used to drug and infect people with HIV and I don't know which is the sickest but guess the one involving children would qualify. Evil or Very Mad


Anna, glad to hear your family is on the mend.  Just read about the accident last night.  Hope all continues to go well.
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« Reply #445 on: July 16, 2007, 06:26:15 PM »

Interresting blog posted at BFN.  The owner of the blog is actually posting at BFN now.

http://tinyurl.com/yqmqgv

Saturday, July 30, 2005
Vacation Aruba-A Real Crap Shoot

As soon as the Holloway/Twitty family offerred a one million dollar reward for information leading to the safe return of Natalie Holloway, and another substantial reward for information leading to any information that would finally solve the case, they should have known. After all, Aruba is an island dotted with casinos, and a good many of the foreign tourists, as well as the islands inhabitants, are gamblers. So it was no time at all before witnesses came crawling out of the woodwork, with sudden recollections of mysterious activities on such and such a date, at such and such a time, some times involving the suspects in the case. Perhaps they are sincere, but perhaps this is wishful thinking. Would Joran Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe Brothers try to bury Natalie Holloway in a two inch deep stream, secure in the knowledge that a hurricane would soon turn this area into a deep enough pond that it would require draining over a three day period? Would somebody haphazardly take her to a landfill, and take the time to bury her in as deep a pile of garbage as they could find?

Probably not. But if it pans out, the reward is substantial. A crap shoot.

My opinion is the surest way to find out the truth of what occurred to eighteen year old Alabama High School student Natalie Holloway, who disappearred on the last night of her school trip to the island, would be by way of a confession by Joran Van Der Sloot. One way this might occur would be if the truth were beat out of him. Of course the police won't do this, but if he were ever eventually released, and caught out by enough of the right people at the right time, I have no doubt there are a substantial number of the islands residents who would eagerly do this. The Kalpoe Brothers might eventualy suffer the same fate, as far as that goes. Of course, another obvious avenue for closure in this bizzarre case would be if one of them, quite simply, were offerred the reward money, in addition to guarantees of freedom from all future threats of further prosecution.

But failing this, and assumming none of the myriad crap shoots that seem to be on-going as of now ever really pay off, it seems conceivable to me that the best answer, the most logical one, is as follows:

Natalie Holloway was pressured into having sex with Joran Van Der Sloot, and possibly the Kalpoe Brothers as well, once they got her out in a drunken state to a remote area, probably the area of the California Lighthouse. She wasn't actually physically raped, just more or less intimidated into acquiescing. Which is of course a kind of rape, but maybe not in the minds of three young teenage boys who are drunk, and high, and under the equally coercice influence of their own raging hormones, secure in the knowledge that the girl would be leaving the island the next day, and would probably be too humiliated to admit to what happenned, let alone complain or press charges. After all, she was drunk. She went there willingly. So, they got their rocks off, then took her back to the hotel area. Only now, an enraged Natalie Holloway threatened them, threatened to tell everyone what they had done to her, that she would accuse them of rape, that all would know what they were, what they had done. They would pay, and pay dearly.

At one point, she might have gotten into Van Der Sloots face, possibly punched or kicked him, or both. Angry, humiliated now, and afraid of the potential consequences, he strikes out at her, striking her with his fist, as hard as he can, in addition causing her to fall and hit her head. Or possibly one of the Kalpoes did this. Whoever did it, Natalie Holloway now lay motionless on the beach, the deserted beach, to all intents and purposes, no one around but the four of them. Only Natalie is no longer moving. She doesn't seem to be breathing. One of them shakes her, yells at her, to no avail. Try though they may, they can not revive her. She is obviously dead.

Joran calls his father, Paulus Van Der Sloot, who comes as quickly as he can. They drive to his house, where he tries to calm the boys. The dead girl out in the trunk of their car, he explains, can cause no problems if she is never found. She will just be assummed to have run away. Perhaps she might turn up in a crack house. She could conceivably have even been sold into sex slavery in Venezuala, so far as anyone knows. But you have to come up with an alibi, in the event questions are asked. You let her out in front of the hotel. She was drunk, and fell and hit her head, but got up, and was helped inside by a security guard, a black security guard. If her body is found, the fall would explain the injuries to the face. And to be on the safe side, you had all better admit that you had sex with her. As long as there are no obvious vaginal injuries, no one can prove the sex was accomplished through intimidation, and so not really consensual. In the meantime, we will do the best we can to try to make sure the body is never found.

And so, the body was taken, either by the parties involved or through hired confederates who could be depended upon (Aruban police officers friendly to Van Der Sloot, and very ambitous?)
to the most remote part of the island they could find, a place that was desolate of all human habitation, a place that would be seldomly visited, a place of wild and rugged terrain and dense vegetation, a place where a variety of wild animals would eagerly feed upon the dead and decomposing body of the unfortunate girl as she lay in the midst of dense bushes and foliage, completely hidden from human view, even were there happenned by that rare person who visited the area.

Within a few short days, the body would be completly torn and scatterred about, all but demolished by the combined ravages of the native island scavengers and the hot heat of the tropical Carribbean island. The perfect way to dispose of an inconvenient body in this type of environment. All they really needed was a few days time, a week, maybe two at the most, for the ravages of mother nature to complete the job.

This is my theory of what occurred to Natalie Holloway. Of course, there are other possibilities. She could have been put into an incinerator, for example, or cremated for a price by a bribed crematory operator, or for that matter buried in what might appear to be a legitimate grave belonging to another person. She could have been run through a scrap mnetal compactor, or dumped far out to sea, perhaps in shark infested waters to the east of the island.

There is also yet the ever fading glimer of hope she might yet be alive, sold into sex slavery in Venezuala or Columbia, or even being held in a private residence. She may have been kept in a drugged state for so long, she might be little more than a zombie who no longer even knows who she is, let alone where she is.

I know that the mother of Natalie, Beth Twitty, is holding out hopes that this is the case, which is ironic in the extreme. Why else offer a million dollar reward for her daughters safe return, were she not holding out this hope? As unlikely, to say the least, that it obviousy is.

I have a great deal of respect for Beth Holloway Twitty. In her own way, she is as beautiful a woman as I have ever seen. Her efforts on behalf of her daughter are indeed of heroic proportions. Unfortunately, this case has become a ratings bonanza for the cable news media in particular, and it has become very unseemly the way the case has been overcovered, in my opinion, though conversely, the coverage has indeed propeled the case up to this point.

I wish I could advise the woman to take a break from the case, for a mere couple of days. The first day to just wind down, perhaps seek spiritual counseling. The following day, to just stay to herself, for no other reason that to allow her spirit a chance to actually attune with the spirit of her daughter, with no interference from anyone, including her husband and other family members. After all, there is obviously a strong spiritual connection between this mother and daughter. The more I think about it, the more I think maybe a week of this would be even more appropriate than a mere day. A period of silent meditation and reflection could allow that spiritual connection to come to the fore. It may not give her the answers that she is searching for now. But it may at least give her some peace.

Here is her first post at BFN under the topic of her blog:

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      Re: pagantemple website july2005
« Reply #9 on: 2007-07-14, 10:45:02 »  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for the link to my site. My theory has nothing to do with being of a "like mind", by the way, I just have an investigative intellect and personality. You have to see things from the possible viewpoint of perpetrators in order to get an inkling as to what might have happened.

The cable news channels provided a valuable service, and in so doing revealed a lot of valuable information, and they did keep the case in the public spotlight, for which they deserve credit.

Unfortunately, they soon started treating it more like a ratings bonanza than they did a serious criminal investigation. It started to look like a lot of the reporters sent to cover the case were spending more time getting tans than they were engaging in serious journalism. Fox News even sent Alan Combs down there one time, and I remembered thinking how tan he looked after having been there no more than two or three days at the very most.

My "Vacation Aruba" series of posts were critical of that aspect of the investigation, while at the same time I tried not to deride the legitimate investigation-I only wish there had really been one. That's why I formulated my theory of what happened. I actually put a lot of thought into it. A lot of the people paid to cover the story looked to me like the most thought they put into it was what was the best sunscreen to use.
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« Reply #446 on: July 16, 2007, 06:29:07 PM »

Quote from: "A's Fever"
Quote from: "Anna"
*******,

Maybe she means five meters for we can see it is farther than five feet from the ariel photo.

BTW, I read that article about the two little girls when I ran across it trying to read about GHB being used to drug and infect people with HIV and I don't know which is the sickest but guess the one involving children would qualify. Evil or Very Mad


Anna, glad to hear your family is on the mend.  Just read about the accident last night.  Hope all continues to go well.


Thank You, A's,

Bad time to have a wreck on the way to cardio vascular surgery but I would have cancelled that.  They opted to get it over with as was too difficult to reschedule so at least that part is behind him now and he is recovering nicely.  They both are, thanks.

.
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Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
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« Reply #447 on: July 16, 2007, 06:32:30 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"
Quote from: "A's Fever"
Quote from: "Anna"
*******,

Maybe she means five meters for we can see it is farther than five feet from the ariel photo.

BTW, I read that article about the two little girls when I ran across it trying to read about GHB being used to drug and infect people with HIV and I don't know which is the sickest but guess the one involving children would qualify. Evil or Very Mad


Anna, glad to hear your family is on the mend.  Just read about the accident last night.  Hope all continues to go well.


Thank You, A's,

Bad time to have a wreck on the way to cardio vascular surgery but I would have cancelled that.  They opted to get it over with as was too difficult to reschedule so at least that part is behind him now and he is recovering nicely.  They both are, thanks.

.


sounds like someone had a wild weekend  Shocked
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« Reply #448 on: July 16, 2007, 06:32:47 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"
*******,

Maybe she means five meters for we can see it is farther than five feet from the ariel photo.

BTW, I read that article about the two little girls when I ran across it trying to read about GHB being used to drug and infect people with HIV and I don't know which is the sickest but guess the one involving children would qualify. Evil or Very Mad


Could be..I didnt copy her post about feet or meters..

Reading stories like that bother me big time!! That drug is just evil and I am sure rapists get away with it all the time..I dont think Joran did though..I believe he was caught even before Natalee stepped foot in Aruba but they covered that up as well. Sexual assaults like like these are ignored quite often on those ABC islands.
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« Reply #449 on: July 16, 2007, 06:41:36 PM »

Quote from: "blah"
[sounds like someone had a wild weekend  Shocked


Not me, my son and his dad totaled the car driving to Emory in Atlanta for my son to have vascular surgery.  Air bags deployed causing facial trauma to both of them and broke the father's nose and thumb.  Heavy SUV so must have been something.  

A fireman took them on to the hospital and they went ahead with the surgery while the father was treated in the ER and then the fireman even took them home again.

But son is doing well and has bandages off and is walking around a little bit now so all are on the mend.  Yes, was quite a day they had but to reschedule was not going to work with son's school schedule so they did the right thing.

Just glad it's over!

.

.
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Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
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RIP Grumpy Cat :( I will miss you.


« Reply #450 on: July 16, 2007, 06:43:41 PM »

Quote from: "Spock"
Quote from: "Dayhiker"
Quote from: "Spock"
On June 17, 2005 around 11.15 the witness S.GOTTENBOS was more closely interrogated. The statement given in Dutch and sounds as follows;

On your question if I had contact with Joran on May 29, 2005, I tell you the following; I had telephone contact with Joran on May 29, 2005, this was around 11.00.

On your question about how the conversation went, I will tell you the following; The conversation went that I asked him if he wanted to go out on my fathers boat.

He said that he could not go because he was going to play poker at the Holiday Inn. There is tournament each Sunday in aforementioned hotel and Joran participates almost each week in that tournament.

On your question what kind of boat my father has, I will explain to you the following: It is a speedboat, of the make "Sea Pro".

The boat was out the evening of Sunday May 29th.



Spock, nice find. We have heard that PVDS borrowed the Gottenbos boat. Supposedly the boat was used just after Natalee disappeared, that came out very early on from Beth and Dave so the cops must know something.


Koen Gottenbos

Friend of Kalpoe's and v/d Sloot interviewed  6/16/05  17:15 by  Luigi Croes / Juan Boezem. Also interviewed 6/18 and 6/20. Any chance we can get these statements?



I would also like to add a comment I found today as I was roaming some older posts...just to remind everyone >>>>>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Posted by msmarple
Posted: Fri Sep 15, 2006 9:26 am
 
 This was posted by Appeals on the LCD on 9/14/2006. I am including it because of a previous post here that quoted about the boat/radar tracking:

"Boats On Parade In Aruba"
By Meri Ulrich
Mar. 31, 2006

During his little show on "48 Hours", Gerald Dompig showed the audience some computer screens that are housed at the police department where he conducts his business. We saw boats being tracked and he claimed that those were the boats that were tracked on the night that Natalee Holloway disappeared. He showed that every single boat that came and went out of Aruba on that fateful night was tracked on that screen.

He lied.

On May 30th, 2005, Aruba had NO working tracking system in place. It didn't exist.

Raytheon Canada to Install Coastal Surveillance Radars in Dutch Caribbean
Posted 30-Nov-2005 03:10
Related stories: Americas - Other, Coastal & Littoral, Contracts - Awards, Europe - Other, Radars, Raytheon
Also on this day: 30-Nov-2005 »

Raytheon Canada won a contract valued at approximately $12 million (EUR 10 million) from the Royal Netherlands Navy and the Coast Guard of the Netherlands Antilles & Aruba (CGNA&A) to build an integrated coastal surveillance radar network on the islands of Aruba, Bonaire and Curacao, including long-term maintenance and training.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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« Reply #451 on: July 16, 2007, 06:50:20 PM »

Didn't they have some antique old system and the one you mention wi the "upgrade"?
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« Reply #452 on: July 16, 2007, 06:52:37 PM »

Quote from: "*******"
I went through all of americaninaruba posts last night. Two things interested me.1.She knows the Van Der Sloots.2.Van Der Straaten opened his mouth too soon to the dutch press.She knew the layout of the VDS property and its obvious she has been there. In another post she described Jorans Apt being 5 feet away from the main bldg and the layout of the property.

***NEWS****
Vander straten informed ppress dutch…of al information and informed them that the case has been solved, and will give less htan 24 hours to announce the result…and aparently theirs many police that are moving towards area of marriott hotel completely CLOSED no one is allowed they are searchign something either them or the dogs are searchign somethign or if Natalee is here….it iis not known what is happeneing

Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 2:55 pm Post subject:

ok i have to say you guys have a totaly wrong view of the VDS social status...they have a small house nothgin big just a normal neighbor hood home, the pool is very recent about 3 months, they ahve 2 cars that are like 7 years old (in aruba people change cars every 4 to 5 years), none of the kids have their own cars, they are the cheapest poeple youll ver meet and i think the mother hasnt had new clothes since 2000 becuae ive seen her in the same thign since forever! they DO NOT have a yacht and much less a mansion! just do get our perspectives in place...oh and the HOnda belonged to the Kalpoe brothers, JORAN does NOT have a car! he cant even drive! you get your licnese at 18 here NOT 16


She is obviously a friend of the family.  I will never understand why Van der Straaten opened his mouth so quickly.  Was he getting ready to charge the security guards and this all blew up in his face.

You can't gamble and drink until your 18 but that did that stop Joran.  

Does anyone remember the article in which they found a whole in the ground where they could have possibly fit a body.  I believe it was in the Enquirer or Globe.  I wonder if this was near the Marriott.  I have to look through my old papers.
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« Reply #453 on: July 16, 2007, 06:54:17 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"

Not me, my son and his dad totaled the car driving to Emory in Atlanta for my son to have vascular surgery.  Air bags deployed causing facial trauma to both of them and broke the father's nose and thumb.  Heavy SUV so must have been something.  

A fireman took them on to the hospital and they went ahead with the surgery while the father was treated in the ER and then the fireman even took them home again.

But son is doing well and has bandages off and is walking around a little bit now so all are on the mend.  Yes, was quite a day they had but to reschedule was not going to work with son's school schedule so they did the right thing.

Just glad it's over!

.

.

Anna ~ You must feel emotionally exhausted ~ I'm so glad they were okay.....your son must be something else to have been able to go ahead with the surgery!   Shocked  Shocked
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« Reply #454 on: July 16, 2007, 06:56:20 PM »

Well,I think a guy a perv like joran doesn't quit,even in europe.He can't,it is in his blood,now.The pimps haven't quit,just new and younger prey.Koen was not questioned,his father gave the answers .
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« Reply #455 on: July 16, 2007, 06:57:34 PM »

Quote from: "Tiger"
Well,I think a guy a perv like joran doesn't quit,even in europe.He can't,it is in his blood,now.The pimps haven't quit,just new and younger prey.Koen was not questioned,his father gave the answers .


That's very strange about Koen, isn't it?
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« Reply #456 on: July 16, 2007, 06:58:14 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"
Quote from: "blah"
[sounds like someone had a wild weekend  Shocked


Not me, my son and his dad totaled the car driving to Emory in Atlanta for my son to have vascular surgery.  Air bags deployed causing facial trauma to both of them and broke the father's nose and thumb.  Heavy SUV so must have been something.  

A fireman took them on to the hospital and they went ahead with the surgery while the father was treated in the ER and then the fireman even took them home again.

But son is doing well and has bandages off and is walking around a little bit now so all are on the mend.  Yes, was quite a day they had but to reschedule was not going to work with son's school schedule so they did the right thing.

Just glad it's over!

.

.


if they got in an accident that was bad enough to total an SUV, then it was a pretty significant impact.  Sounds like all of the saftey equipment did its job if all they walked away with was some minor injuries - good to hear.

Heres a little something I can finally share with y'all - very soon you will start seeing the early stages of crash avoidance systems in the new vehicles.  There are some very impressive things going on right now with these systems, we have some things we are working on that will just knock your socks off (some very very small parts of these systems are already available in production - things such as lane departure warnings)   Its going to be several years yet before the full blown systems are available.  Some things are pending on the governments commitment - or lack of - to fund certain infrastucture that needs to be put in place.  There are other non-government entities also looking into providing the infrastructure needed for the full blown systems.
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« Reply #457 on: July 16, 2007, 07:01:01 PM »

Quote from: "blah"

Heres a little something I can finally share with y'all - very soon you will start seeing the early stages of crash avoidance systems in the new vehicles.  There are some very impressive things going on right now with these systems, we have some things we are working on that will just knock your socks off (some very very small parts of these systems are already available in production - things such as lane departure warnings)   Its going to be several years yet before the full blown systems are available.  Some things are pending on the governments commitment - or lack of - to fund certain infrastucture that needs to be put in place.  There are other non-government entities also looking into providing the infrastructure needed for the full blown systems.


Blah - thanks for sharing this with us. It sounds very exciting! When you talk about "infrastructure," can you be more specific concerning what that means? TY
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« Reply #458 on: July 16, 2007, 07:06:35 PM »

Lady Devon,

I am sooooo happy you heard from your daughter.  Laughing  Laughing I hope your daughter will get some sleep before starting across New Mexico... that stretch to Tuscon is very long, boring and hot.

Some interstates in the West desert you can make great time on for the speed is higher and the traffic less than on the Eastern Coast.

Sorry to hear about the loss of money, and the trauma, but her driving on shows she is strong. You have raised her well.

worried couldn't sleep until 5 am (8 your time) so am just checking in. Please keep us posted. Love, IBE still pages behind
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« Reply #459 on: July 16, 2007, 07:08:29 PM »

Quote from: "San"
Quote from: "*******"
I went through all of americaninaruba posts last night. Two things interested me.1.She knows the Van Der Sloots.2.Van Der Straaten opened his mouth too soon to the dutch press.She knew the layout of the VDS property and its obvious she has been there. In another post she described Jorans Apt being 5 feet away from the main bldg and the layout of the property.

***NEWS****
Vander straten informed ppress dutch…of al information and informed them that the case has been solved, and will give less htan 24 hours to announce the result…and aparently theirs many police that are moving towards area of marriott hotel completely CLOSED no one is allowed they are searchign something either them or the dogs are searchign somethign or if Natalee is here….it iis not known what is happeneing

Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 2:55 pm Post subject:

ok i have to say you guys have a totaly wrong view of the VDS social status...they have a small house nothgin big just a normal neighbor hood home, the pool is very recent about 3 months, they ahve 2 cars that are like 7 years old (in aruba people change cars every 4 to 5 years), none of the kids have their own cars, they are the cheapest poeple youll ver meet and i think the mother hasnt had new clothes since 2000 becuae ive seen her in the same thign since forever! they DO NOT have a yacht and much less a mansion! just do get our perspectives in place...oh and the HOnda belonged to the Kalpoe brothers, JORAN does NOT have a car! he cant even drive! you get your licnese at 18 here NOT 16


She is obviously a friend of the family.  I will never understand why Van der Straaten opened his mouth so quickly.  Was he getting ready to charge the security guards and this all blew up in his face.

You can't gamble and drink until your 18 but that did that stop Joran.  

Does anyone remember the article in which they found a whole in the ground where they could have possibly fit a body.  I believe it was in the Enquirer or Globe.  I wonder if this was near the Marriott.  I have to look through my old papers.


I think at that time he was ready to disclose the goods on JK2 as the security guards were out of the loop already. It looked like a slam dunk case but I think Rudy Croes stepped in at this point. Jan probably helped out Joran earlier in the year when he was accused of drugging and raping local girls. This would all come black and blow up in his face as he let Joran off the hook earlier so he is partly responsible to what happened to Natalee. Van Der Straaten knew what happened to NH and stayed for along time to make sure the case would have no evidence and was covered up to protect him,his best friend and his son.

I remember the whole found by TES as I believe it was a tip from a young boy. Not sure where that was located but Tim thinks that NH may have been buried there..
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"I lied and thats the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot
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