SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #1

[klaasend]

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 10:55 pm
Why do they leave the Maze open?
Why hasn’t an Arawak probed it’s fetid depths.
Tell the Cowboys!
The Arawaks are hiding the path to the Maze for the Babylonians.

Lamb and the Elder are stepping stones into the fetid pool of deception.
 

Fetid pool..

Moko near the Sloots?
Landfill?

[Finbar]

You all may already have  this, but  came  across it  when searching one night.   I believe it is a register  of businesses that belong to the Aruba Chamber of  Commerce?   It  lists  the owner and the business address, and I have been checking it against  the other list of businesses I  posted.  If nothing else, it is  interesting to see the names on it.  My hope is that it will  be helpful to  one of  you smart Monkeys!

http://www.arubachamber.com/LC%20KLEIN%2005-06-2005.htm

http://www.visitaruba.com/business/directory/busdir.mv?search

Siren,

Yes , it is a useful tool.

Look up how many businesses Jossy owns.

Here is one for PVDS

Appearing in the Trade Register of the Chamber of Commerce and Industry in ARUBA since 18 JANUARY 2007 under serial number 35741.0 is the company with the trade name:

 
CARLO & VAN DER SLOOT
 
Business address   CONSTANTIJN HUYGENSTRAAT 5, ORANJESTAD OOST
Legal form   PARTNERSHIP
Name of the company   CARLO & VAN DER SLOOT
Date of commencement   1 JANUARY 2007
    
 
OWNERS/PARTNERS

ADVOCATENKANTOOR MR A.A.D.A. CARLO N.V.
Established at   CONSTANTIJN HUYGENSTRAAT 5, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA
Position   MANAGING PARTNER
Since   18 JANUARY 2007
Authority   FULL
 
VAN DER SLOOT, PAUL ANTONIUS PETRUS JOHANNA;
Residing in   MONTANJA 19, NOORD, ARUBA
Born in   THE NETHERLANDS, BOXTEL on 15 FEBRUARY 1952
Nationality   DUTCH
Position   MANAGING PARTNER
Effective   18 JANUARY 2007
Authority   FULL
 
OBJECTIVE(S) OF THE COMPANY

HET UITOEFENEN VAN EEN ADVOCATENKANTOOR.
 
Only valid if accordingly signed by the Chamber of Commerce & Industry Aruba - J.E. Irausquin Blvd.10, Oranjestad, Aruba.

=====

Carlo, that name rings a bell.

Hi Mum.

Fin

[jackb]

It is becoming much more likely that Freddy is the 5th suspect.  He certainly was in the mix as a witness...did Simian interchange the words suspect and witness or was he calling Freddy was he really was.....SUSPECT...it's harder to get suspects to talk...but leave them as witnesses and you get more from them.  It's that darn alibi that keeps throwing a kink in all this information. 

I think it would depend on the vantage point from where Simian was observing the case. Just thinking out loud,but the nearer the inside(to ALE), possibly the more privy to information and therefore the more likely to consider Freddy the fifth. By contrast my post referring to PVDS as the fifth is according to MSM. Clear as mud-I know.

This is what I was trying to say...LOL...must be my accent...

Sister is a police officer. Their house was listed for sale as of 12/14/2007.(Yellow…just like the Gottenbos)

CROMVOIRT, Geoffry van - 19 years old, resident of Aruba, who was detained by ALE on 4-15-2006 in an unannounced connection to the Natalee Holloway case. He is the son of the owner of an island security company that supplies equipment and personnel to beach patrol and hotels. For more information see Who’s Who - Victim, Suspects, Witnesses & Families.

CROMVOIRT, Wilhemus “Willem” Bernadus Henricus Papaya van - owner & operator of VCB Security. Father of Geoffrey van Cromvoirt. There is some question as to whether the Cromvoirt’s moved to the Netherlands. Resided at 14D, Paradera, Aruba.

[jackb]

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 10:55 pm
Why do they leave the Maze open?
Why hasn’t an Arawak probed it’s fetid depths.
Tell the Cowboys!
The Arawaks are hiding the path to the Maze for the Babylonians.

Lamb and the Elder are stepping stones into the fetid pool of deception.
 

Fetid pool..

Moko near the Sloots?
Landfill?

Joran = Arrested 6-9-05, released 9-3-05 by Judge R Smid , under “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence”

Deepak = Arrested 6-9-05, released 7-4-05, under “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence” Re-arrested on 8-26-05 under suspicion of the primary criminal act of committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately, rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences, and even more alternately, raping somebody

Satish = Arrested 6-9-05 along with his brother Deepak, & Joran. Seemingly unemployed 18 year old citizen of Suriname under “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence.”

Paulus = Arrested 6-23-2005 around 2:15 pm, released 6-26-05. Suspicion of complicity to premeditated murder, complicity to murder and complicity to kidnapping

Guido = Arrested on 5-20-06, released on 5-23-06, under suspicion of accessory to murder, kidnapping and heavy battery.

Geoffrey Cromvroit detained April  2006.

[jackb]

Is it possible  "the lamb" in Shango's riddle is not Joran?  Maybe they were going to make Guido the scapegoat.   I find it VERY interesting that Paulus contacted him.  And we KNOW it was not about Joran winning money, such an  obvious  lie.   They were making it all up day by day.  No wonder Joran was claiming his dad had a bad memory.  Once Paulus was jailed, he was  terrified Joran would say something that would incriminate him.  Paulus knew what a big mouth, stupid punk his son was.  He couldn't even believe or trust him.   Yes, Paulus is the  fifth suspect, waltzing away.

oran = Arrested 6-9-05, released 9-3-05 by Judge R Smid , under “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence”

Deepak = Arrested 6-9-05, released 7-4-05, under “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence” Re-arrested on 8-26-05 under suspicion of the primary criminal act of committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately, rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences, and even more alternately, raping somebody

Satish = Arrested 6-9-05 along with his brother Deepak, & Joran. Seemingly unemployed 18 year old citizen of Suriname under “reasonable suspicion of murder, manslaughter or intentional containment with the dead as consequence.”

Paulus = Arrested 6-23-2005 around 2:15 pm, released 6-26-05. Suspicion of complicity to premeditated murder, complicity to murder and complicity to kidnapping

GVC detained in April 2006.

Guido = Arrested on 5-20-06, released on 5-23-06, under suspicion of accessory to murder, kidnapping and heavy battery.

Geoffrey Cromvroit detained April  2006 would make him 5th suspect if the two security guards are not counted and if they are you have anouther 5th suspect being Joran.  So it would be my guess either way Joran and/or GVC are the 5th suspects and maybe just as culpable.    jack blue

[jackb]

Here is what I think......suspects were arrested. Witnesses were questioned, Guido later was charged, maybe making him a suspect in 2006. no? Anyway depending on if you include the security guards or not, and it seems S+S made few references to them therefore I think they weren't counted in the line-up. Paulus on the other hand was actually charged. So I think

1)Joran
2)Deepak
3)Satish
4) Steve Croes
5) PVDS

http://tinyurl.com/23wv9q

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159862,00.html

http://tinyurl.com/2x7vyu

Croes was more like a witness at the time wasn't he?

Joran
Depak
Satish
Palus
GVC      April 06
Guido    May 06

I thought that would be the way it went.

[COLOMBO]

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 10:55 pm
Why do they leave the Maze open?
Why hasn’t an Arawak probed it’s fetid depths.
Tell the Cowboys!
The Arawaks are hiding the path to the Maze for the Babylonians.

Lamb and the Elder are stepping stones into the fetid pool of deception.
 

Fetid pool..

Moko near the Sloots?
Landfill?

Seek ye DirtyHand and the Fetid Arawak King who wishes to blame the babylonians for the behaviour of lowly minions.

[COLOMBO]

off topic....somewhat:

http://www.amazon.com/Delivery-Man-Joe-McGinniss-Jr/dp/0802170420/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1203857428&sr=8-1

[MumInOhio]

Caps....I've been googling away and I bet you know what this means...TIA

Of course I don't mind Lala's...

Responsive to Request 41
+ Name: Jorge Porras Sanches
Date: 21 June 2005 / 14:20
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Juan Boezem / Johny Erasmus
Description: witness statement

CAPS
Do you know who this person is? 

Which one

Johny Erasmus:

Johny work for Sonesta Hotel in Aruba. He hanga out a lot in the Casinos.
Jaun Boezem: is being check....I know his brother is a KIA Guard

Caps who is this and what does it mean? TIA


Responsive to Request 41
+ Name: Jorge Porras Sanches


Book

P178

"Despite the fact that i stuck to the same statement for two and half months, i was interrogated many times per week."

Guards treated Joran very well but the interrogators did not. Every interrogation was recorded but sometimes they turned off the camera. One police officer hit him.

CHAPTER 14

Chapter 14 Slapped by the police

July 16,

The police arrived for a further interview. They ask if Joran would give a DNA sample. Although he does not have a problem with it, his parents and lawyer’s oppose the idea.

Joran takes the police on another walk-through outside the Marriott.

The police asked if this “Location indication” was truthful, Joran refused to answer.

Upon his return to jail, Joran was interrogated by a police officer Boezem. Boezem turned off the camera and began shouting at Joran. He grabbed Joran by the shirt.

Boezem screamed that Joran was “a murderer.” “Everybody hates you” Boezem continued. “Your family hates you. Nobody believes you. Your whole family and your lawyers should be locked up since they all know the truth.”
At this point Joran tells Boezem to f*** off at which point, Boezem slaps Joran across the forehead with his bare hand, causing Joran to fall off the chair.

Page 210 -212.

The assault left a mark. Two guards reported the incident and a social worker called a doctor to visit Joran and make a report.

[Lala'sMom]

Caps....I've been googling away and I bet you know what this means...TIA

Of course I don't mind Lala's...

Responsive to Request 41
+ Name: Jorge Porras Sanches
Date: 21 June 2005 / 14:20
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Juan Boezem / Johny Erasmus
Description: witness statement

CAPS
Do you know who this person is? 

Which one

Johny Erasmus:

Johny work for Sonesta Hotel in Aruba. He hanga out a lot in the Casinos.
Jaun Boezem: is being check....I know his brother is a KIA Guard

Caps who is this and what does it mean? TIA


Responsive to Request 41
+ Name: Jorge Porras Sanches


Book

P178

"Despite the fact that i stuck to the same statement for two and half months, i was interrogated many times per week."

Guards treated Joran very well but the interrogators did not. Every interrogation was recorded but sometimes they turned off the camera. One police officer hit him.

CHAPTER 14

Chapter 14 Slapped by the police

July 16,

The police arrived for a further interview. They ask if Joran would give a DNA sample. Although he does not have a problem with it, his parents and lawyer’s oppose the idea.

Joran takes the police on another walk-through outside the Marriott.

The police asked if this “Location indication” was truthful, Joran refused to answer.

Upon his return to jail, Joran was interrogated by a police officer Boezem. Boezem turned off the camera and began shouting at Joran. He grabbed Joran by the shirt.

Boezem screamed that Joran was “a murderer.” “Everybody hates you” Boezem continued. “Your family hates you. Nobody believes you. Your whole family and your lawyers should be locked up since they all know the truth.”
At this point Joran tells Boezem to f*** off at which point, Boezem slaps Joran across the forehead with his bare hand, causing Joran to fall off the chair.

Page 210 -212.

The assault left a mark. Two guards reported the incident and a social worker called a doctor to visit Joran and make a report.

And look at what was happening during this timeframe...


Bozeman has interviewed Joran's girlfriend..Flor and Koen Gottenbos.  Steve Croes was arrested the next day...it fits with the other stuff.  Someone was telling a different story than Joran...again.

[Lala'sMom]

According to the Timeline of the Dr. Phil documents...Bozeman questioned Koen several times after...there is something about what Koen was saying in contrast to what Joran was saying.   Of course, this is from Joran's perspective...so you have to read between the lines...if Bozeman didn't whack the sporter he will next time he gets the chance.

I think Sander and Koen were being implicated with this boat story that Joran had already told certain people...Jacobs and Straten...they were not saying anything and just letting the lower ALE carry on as if nothing was known.  Joran was trying to make Bozeman look bad in his book..but he just made me think what did Bozeman do that made Joran so nervous...I really should just take things at face value...I guess. MOO

[bleachedblack]

Finbar wrote;

Siren,

Yes , it is a useful tool.

Look up how many businesses Jossy owns.

Here is one for PVDS

Appearing in the Trade Register of the Chamber of Commerce and Industry in ARUBA since 18 JANUARY 2007 under serial number 35741.0 is the company with the trade name:

 
CARLO & VAN DER SLOOT
 
Business address   CONSTANTIJN HUYGENSTRAAT 5, ORANJESTAD OOST
Legal form   PARTNERSHIP
Name of the company   CARLO & VAN DER SLOOT
Date of commencement   1 JANUARY 2007
   
 
OWNERS/PARTNERS

ADVOCATENKANTOOR MR A.A.D.A. CARLO N.V.
Established at   CONSTANTIJN HUYGENSTRAAT 5, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA
Position   MANAGING PARTNER
Since   18 JANUARY 2007
Authority   FULL
 
VAN DER SLOOT, PAUL ANTONIUS PETRUS JOHANNA;
Residing in   MONTANJA 19, NOORD, ARUBA
Born in   THE NETHERLANDS, BOXTEL on 15 FEBRUARY 1952
Nationality   DUTCH
Position   MANAGING PARTNER
Effective   18 JANUARY 2007
Authority   FULL
 
OBJECTIVE(S) OF THE COMPANY

HET UITOEFENEN VAN EEN ADVOCATENKANTOOR.
 
Only valid if accordingly signed by the Chamber of Commerce & Industry Aruba - J.E. Irausquin Blvd.10, Oranjestad, Aruba.

=====

Carlo, that name rings a bell.

Hi Mum.

Fin

I think that is the law partnership Paulus joined in with Carlo.

[bleachedblack]

Here is what I think......suspects were arrested. Witnesses were questioned, Guido later was charged, maybe making him a suspect in 2006. no? Anyway depending on if you include the security guards or not, and it seems S+S made few references to them therefore I think they weren't counted in the line-up. Paulus on the other hand was actually charged. So I think

1)Joran
2)Deepak
3)Satish
4) Steve Croes
5) PVDS

http://tinyurl.com/23wv9q

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159862,00.html

http://tinyurl.com/2x7vyu

Croes was more like a witness at the time wasn't he?

Joran
Depak
Satish
Palus
GVC      April 06
Guido    May 06

I thought that would be the way it went.

I personally think Croes was more than a witness.....afterall he was jailed for more than a week. I know why he says he was brought in by ALE, but I have quoted it before ......
the reason he was brought in was because of statements by one of the 3 perps and this was said by jan van der straaten. This makes sense, not the fact that he "overheard a conversation" at the internet cafe. or that he saw 3 people arguing on the beach and had to go tell ALE (another line he once gave). MOO
 
As for the order of the suspects......your guess is as good as mine....
++++++

>>>>SNIP

Police Superintendent Jan van der Straaten told the AP Croes was detained based on information from one of the other three detainees.

http://tinyurl.com/2ljs2v

[bleachedblack]

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 10:55 pm
Why do they leave the Maze open?
Why hasn’t an Arawak probed it’s fetid depths.
Tell the Cowboys!
The Arawaks are hiding the path to the Maze for the Babylonians.

Lamb and the Elder are stepping stones into the fetid pool of deception.
 

fetid depths/ fetid pool = corruption

[Lala'sMom]

Here is what I think......suspects were arrested. Witnesses were questioned, Guido later was charged, maybe making him a suspect in 2006. no? Anyway depending on if you include the security guards or not, and it seems S+S made few references to them therefore I think they weren't counted in the line-up. Paulus on the other hand was actually charged. So I think

1)Joran
2)Deepak
3)Satish
4) Steve Croes
5) PVDS

http://tinyurl.com/23wv9q

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159862,00.html

http://tinyurl.com/2x7vyu

Croes was more like a witness at the time wasn't he?

Joran
Depak
Satish
Palus
GVC      April 06
Guido    May 06

I thought that would be the way it went.

Well, if you read the news reports and the comments from the FP posters in Aruba at the time.  It is clear that Croes was a suspect in some way. Simian is talking about a 5th person long before the April 6 and May 6 dates...so it has to be someone other than GVC or Guido.  As I said, there was a person detained as a witness, but in Aruba it seems suspect and witness is interchanged.  To me the only person that fits the suspect status is Steve or Paulus at the time...but...we still don't have a clear picture about Freddy during all this. Not to mention there is another person that even Checkme...and Aruban poster...was talking about...Lorenzo.  Again...little to go on as proof. So there remains a lot of confusion. I do understand your thinking along this line. More input please.

[Lala'sMom]

Caps....I've been googling away and I bet you know what this means...TIA

Of course I don't mind Lala's...

Responsive to Request 41
+ Name: Jorge Porras Sanches
Date: 21 June 2005 / 14:20
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Juan Boezem / Johny Erasmus
Description: witness statement

CAPS
Do you know who this person is? 

Which one

Johny Erasmus:

Johny work for Sonesta Hotel in Aruba. He hanga out a lot in the Casinos.
Jaun Boezem: is being check....I know his brother is a KIA Guard

Caps no way Erasmus works with Sonesta.  He was ALE and taking statements from this guy Sanches. He and Bozeman were both ALE.  Please recheck your sources. TIA

[Buckeye]

Lala's

In case you miss my post on the LCD, I posted the GVC / dad interview, under it's own topic (under Natalee, a little below this thread).

[Lala'sMom]

Shango's "lamb" is Joran...lambdersloot...lamb ran bleating...lamb will be sacrifice to appease cowboys.

[Chata]

According to the Timeline of the Dr. Phil documents...Bozeman questioned Koen several times after...there is something about what Koen was saying in contrast to what Joran was saying.   Of course, this is from Joran's perspective...so you have to read between the lines...if Bozeman didn't whack the sporter he will next time he gets the chance.

I think Sander and Koen were being implicated with this boat story that Joran had already told certain people...Jacobs and Straten...they were not saying anything and just letting the lower ALE carry on as if nothing was known.  Joran was trying to make Bozeman look bad in his book..but he just made me think what did Bozeman do that made Joran so nervous...I really should just take things at face value...I guess. MOO

LaLa's,
In my opinion, nothing that comes out of Aruba should be taken at face value ... I think that is why Simian and maybe Shango were posting the things they were.  You have done an outstanding job not only in unraveling some of their messages, but in keeping it all in perspective to what facts are known.  Thanks!!!
Chata

[Lala'sMom]

I don't know Chata...what do you think?  If you are looking for hard evidence in this thread your are in the wrong place.  We have tried to put as much fact as we can find with what is being said...but most of the time it is speculation on our part...then again most everything in this forum relies on someone's speculation.  Shango is cryptic...Simian a little less.