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Author Topic: SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #1  (Read 1372189 times)
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finngirl
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« Reply #3700 on: March 21, 2008, 01:31:41 AM »


thank you buckeye and *******

for clearing up my confusion re discovery log data:
whether or not we had confiirmation of LvR's interrogation

canceling lobotomy appt  Wink



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finngirl
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« Reply #3701 on: March 21, 2008, 01:39:07 AM »

PLEASE!! Let's read Simian in context...there are things in some of the quotes above that is not in the original quote ... There is no mention of Paulus in this conversation of Simian's ... I like to read it as it was originally written. 

thank you!!!

I been like: WTH ... ?

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:16 pm
He had to be let go
Paulus' duties were suspended on or about 6/17/05.
He had been brought in for questioning that day





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finngirl
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« Reply #3702 on: March 21, 2008, 01:46:57 AM »

5th said he was home with some friends until the morning

the partygoers need to be pinched (perjury?)

pinched/slang for arrested = perjury/false witness statement?

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finngirl
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« Reply #3703 on: March 21, 2008, 01:59:22 AM »


http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/06/17/

June 17, 2005

BREAKING NEWS: 4th Person Arrested in Natalee Holloway case
(CORRECTION NO 5th PERSON)

9:14am **** UPDATE ****
4th arrest made in Natalee Holloway case

At 9:50 am: MSNBC & Fox have just reported the arrest of a fourth suspect. A 27 year old man.

Fox News now reporting: Sources: 4th Person Arrested in Aruba Mystery

From the AP: Fourth Person Detained in Holloway Disappearance

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (AP) - A fourth person has been detained in Aruba in the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway, authorities announced Friday. The person “suspected of being involved” in Holloway’s disappearance was identified by the attorney general’s office only as a 26-year-old with the initials S.G.C.

further down the page:

UPDATE- CORRECTION
Fifth person was detained, but released last night.


last night precedes this morning ...
detainment/release last night = 4th suspect

morning arrest = 5th

the music man waltzed away?


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CapsLockWizard
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« Reply #3704 on: March 21, 2008, 02:48:16 AM »

LALA: Klassend:

Do you have any of Info on the Band that play in the Holiday Inn Casino
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #3705 on: March 21, 2008, 06:32:08 AM »

LALA: Klassend:

Do you have any of Info on the Band that play in the Holiday Inn Casino


No clue at all.  I am sure if it is out there someone will know. Actually,never thought about a band in the casino before. LOL
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« Reply #3706 on: March 21, 2008, 06:48:42 AM »


http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/06/17/

June 17, 2005

BREAKING NEWS: 4th Person Arrested in Natalee Holloway case
(CORRECTION NO 5th PERSON)

9:14am **** UPDATE ****
4th arrest made in Natalee Holloway case

At 9:50 am: MSNBC & Fox have just reported the arrest of a fourth suspect. A 27 year old man.

Fox News now reporting: Sources: 4th Person Arrested in Aruba Mystery

From the AP: Fourth Person Detained in Holloway Disappearance

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (AP) - A fourth person has been detained in Aruba in the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway, authorities announced Friday. The person “suspected of being involved” in Holloway’s disappearance was identified by the attorney general’s office only as a 26-year-old with the initials S.G.C.

further down the page:

UPDATE- CORRECTION
Fifth person was detained, but released last night.


last night precedes this morning ...
detainment/release last night = 4th suspect

morning arrest = 5th

the music man waltzed away?







Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:16 pm
He had to be let go
Paulus' duties were suspended on or about 6/17/05.
He had been brought in for questioning that day
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #3707 on: March 21, 2008, 01:16:55 PM »


thank you buckeye and *******

for clearing up my confusion re discovery log data:
whether or not we had confiirmation of LvR's interrogation

canceling lobotomy appt  Wink





Keep in mind those discovery logs are incomplete.
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texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #3708 on: March 21, 2008, 01:45:05 PM »

I would really like to know who Steve Croes parents are.  Even if he isn't the 5th, I think it might shed some light into why he involved himself with the case to begin with.  We know that he is friends with GVC, was his original lie that confirmed the JVDS/K2 beginning alibi of dropping Natalee off an effort to draw attention away from GVC?  I don't believe his story of overhearing Deepak on the phone at the internet cafe talking about the HI dropoff story as his only reason for inserting himself in the case to begin with.  There's more to it.  Have there been any hints as to who his parents are that I've missed?  There was a Hendrik Croes in the Solagnier/genaruba geneology information; but not in recent history.  I'm curious as to if his purpose of supporting the original alibi might not have been to protect the "elders", if not GVC.  SS seems to have a better source of geneology information than I'm able to find.  If he reads this maybe he will see what he can find.
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #3709 on: March 21, 2008, 01:56:49 PM »

I would really like to know who Steve Croes parents are.  Even if he isn't the 5th, I think it might shed some light into why he involved himself with the case to begin with.  We know that he is friends with GVC, was his original lie that confirmed the JVDS/K2 beginning alibi of dropping Natalee off an effort to draw attention away from GVC?  I don't believe his story of overhearing Deepak on the phone at the internet cafe talking about the HI dropoff story as his only reason for inserting himself in the case to begin with.  There's more to it.  Have there been any hints as to who his parents are that I've missed?  There was a Hendrik Croes in the Solagnier/genaruba geneology information; but not in recent history.  I'm curious as to if his purpose of supporting the original alibi might not have been to protect the "elders", if not GVC.  SS seems to have a better source of geneology information than I'm able to find.  If he reads this maybe he will see what he can find.
The reason I mentioned the Solagnier/genaruba information is that IMO Finbar led us there to discover something about Steve Croes being the 5th or find an ex-monkey.  If it was to discover info about Steve Croes, the last name of the uncle who is retired ALE was spelled Solognier; plus the uncle stated in news transcripts that Steve was his nephew by relation to his wife.  Maybe I'm wrong.  Do we have any idea what the grandparents names are? Or Rufo Solognier's wife's maiden name?
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #3710 on: March 21, 2008, 04:40:10 PM »

LALA: Klassend:

Do you have any of Info on the Band that play in the Holiday Inn Casino


No clue at all.  I am sure if it is out there someone will know. Actually,never thought about a band in the casino before. LOL

The only thing I can find is it's called the "Excelsior Casino Band" and it's hear the bar area.
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jackb
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« Reply #3711 on: March 21, 2008, 09:30:21 PM »

curiously, Simian does not use PVDS name until he knew (IMO) that it would hit the news:

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:56 pm
The 5th suspect has an alibi so strong that he has everybody baffled.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:00 pm
The 5th suspect was the boyfriend from earlier in the week.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:03 pm
The party-goers said the 5th one was with them. He was the host. How could he have left?

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:09 pm
A scorned lover needs a motive? Drives some people to some crazy deeds.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:13 pm
A jealous boyfriend was at home with some friends. He couldn’t have done it. Sometimes friends will cover for each other.

Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 5:16 pm
He had to be let go
Paulus' duties were suspended on or about 6/17/05.
He had been brought in for questioning that day


He had to be let go  is the 5th suspect that is not mentioned by name.

From what i saw in a Nova interview PVDS said he took time off from his job himself. So as not to be thought of as a person with a conflict of interest. Judging by the chronological order of arrests he was indeed the 5th suspect. But for the life of me i just can't fit in the cool and crazy guy and him being the host of the party. Unless the party is supposed to mean the tragic chain of events. But then he is still not the cool and crazy guy

FWIW - the time difference between Paulus' suspension on 17th and Simian's post on the 22nd leads me to believe that it is another person to which Simian refers.

He had to be let go

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Paulus has been picked up.


Maybe it meant he had to be let go from jail, such as was Guido and some of the other ones who never was in jail.

Let go from a job:  PVs, SC, GVC, Guido, Posner left too, perhaps let go in a job or let go from jail as we do not know for sure they quit.  Someone wrote that GVC was no longer working beach patrol at the time, but others say he was.  He had on a uniform in the "searching for NH" group.  Those people are the biggest liars in the world.  They should start a Liars Club of Aruba.  It is a wonder half aren't starved to death thinking their mama was lying when she called them to supper.   Jack/b
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #3712 on: March 21, 2008, 09:36:32 PM »


Info on Jean Akers

Mum left these links that must contain some info about Akers...I didn't find much in them though.  I am still looking at her older posts to find some of her better info. 

http://www.bcnavyleague.org/PressReleases/SeaPowerMagJuly05.htm

On May 7, the council hosted a gala dinner at the Divi Resort that was
attended by representatives from the American Embassy in Barbados and
the American Consulate in Curacao. Vice-Consul Jean Akers from Curacao
attended with her mother, Barbara. American Vice-Consul Donald Carroll
from Barbados and his wife, Georgina, made their first visit to St.
Maarten/St. Martin for the event.
++++

Sinclaire Language Award Winners 2007

http://www.afsa.org/awards/awardwinners_sinclaire2007.cfm

AFSA Announces the Winners of the 2007 Matilda W. Sinclaire
AwardsProficiency in foreign languages is one of the most valuable and
important skills in today’s Foreign Service.  AFSA’s Sinclaire Language
Awards program honors language students for outstanding accomplishments
in the study of a “hard” language and their associated cultures.
Candidates for the award are nominated by the language-training
supervisors at the FSI School of Language, or by the language
instructors at the field schools. They are selected by a committee
composed of volunteer AFSA members, a member of the Governing Board who
serves as chairman and the AFSA Coordinator for Professional Issues.
Each of the winners receives a check for $1,000 from the Matilda W.
Sinclaire Endowment and a certificate of recognition signed by the AFSA
President and the chair of the AFSA Awards committee. In an unusual
move, the committee decided to award one of this year’s recipients,
Drew Schufletowski, an additional $500, in recognition of his
extraordinary accomplishment.  He is the only foreign language student
in Polish to achieve outstanding success while enrolled solely as an
online student for three semesters.  During his testing at FSI, he
received a score of 4 in speaking and a 4 in reading.  He achieved
this while working full-time with the U.S. Mission to the U.N.  The
number of nominations submitted during 2007 were the most ever received
by AFSA.  A total of 21 nominations were considered by the committee.
The languages included Chinese, Japanese, Dari, Farsi, Hungarian,
Polish, Lithuanian and Ukrainian. AFSA congratulates the 16 winners of
this year’s Sinclaire Language Award, and commends the School of
Language Studies at FSI for its dedication in preparing students of
hard languages for the intense challenges of modern diplomacy. This
year’s winners are:
Kelly Adams-Smith     Bulgarian
Mark Thornburg     Chinese-Mandarin
Eric Barboriak     Chinese-Mandarin
Carleton Bulkin     Dari
Ethan Chorin     Farsi
Jeffrey Hovenier     Greek
Carol Kalin     Greek
Berenice Mariscal     Greek
Robert Mearkle     Hungarian
Edward Kwok Hee Dong     Japanese
Jean E. Akers     Khmer ...............*****
Rona Rathod     Lithuanian
Worth Anderson     Polish
Drew Schufletowski     Polish
Christine P. Jackson     Tagalog
Viktor Karabin     Ukrainian

Here is the link to the LCD where her name comes up shortly after we began discussing the DEA agent Williams.  I will continue to look for one link in particular that was quite detailed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2417.740
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jackb
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« Reply #3713 on: March 21, 2008, 09:38:45 PM »

I would really like to know who Steve Croes parents are.  Even if he isn't the 5th, I think it might shed some light into why he involved himself with the case to begin with.  We know that he is friends with GVC, was his original lie that confirmed the JVDS/K2 beginning alibi of dropping Natalee off an effort to draw attention away from GVC?  I don't believe his story of overhearing Deepak on the phone at the internet cafe talking about the HI dropoff story as his only reason for inserting himself in the case to begin with.  There's more to it.  Have there been any hints as to who his parents are that I've missed?  There was a Hendrik Croes in the Solagnier/genaruba geneology information; but not in recent history.  I'm curious as to if his purpose of supporting the original alibi might not have been to protect the "elders", if not GVC.  SS seems to have a better source of geneology information than I'm able to find.  If he reads this maybe he will see what he can find.
The reason I mentioned the Solagnier/genaruba information is that IMO Finbar led us there to discover something about Steve Croes being the 5th or find an ex-monkey.  If it was to discover info about Steve Croes, the last name of the uncle who is retired ALE was spelled Solognier; plus the uncle stated in news transcripts that Steve was his nephew by relation to his wife.  Maybe I'm wrong.  Do we have any idea what the grandparents names are? Or Rufo Solognier's wife's maiden name?

I have read that Steve Croes father and Palus played music together.  Lately, then or when I do not know.   You might find out who played in the musical group with PVs.   jackb
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yapperz1
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« Reply #3714 on: March 21, 2008, 09:48:33 PM »

My question is..DOES Lorenzo fit the criteria for the 5th suspect????
I have never been able to rule him out.
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I STAND WITH THE GIRL, NATALEE HOLLOWAY

ARUBA
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« Reply #3715 on: March 21, 2008, 10:16:41 PM »

This is the cryptic information that Fin gave us about the ancestral tree of the fifth suspect. The names in the genealogy tree seemed to point toward Steve Croes and his uncle/neighbor Rufo Solognier.  There are several words in the cryptic clues that still have no meaning, including ex-monkey. The genealogy data that was found is very old with many generations missing between the recorded data and present family members. There was also information found about the connection between Alex Salangier and Jossy Mansur regardling the illegal tobacco and drug smuggling. 

http://www.publicintegrity.org/Report.aspx?aid=355
http://www.public-i.org/Content.aspx?src=search&context=article&id=579
http://duncan.gn.apc.org/bat/Health_Committee_Evidence_1.htm
http://duncan.gn.apc.org/bat/Health_Committee_Evidence_1.htm

3/17/08 Finbar
Yes, the Mormons have a great database. Info only good as those who submit lineage, or those two guys on the bikes have time to find. There are others.

Perhaps, to find more fruit, one might need to seek another family tree.

Maybe shake the tree of a retired ex-polis and see what kinda flavour falls out.

Who knows...it may lead to the fifth and a monkey.


3/18/08 Finbar
Flip tha coin again, sour mash gal.

There is more than one retired polis....

Maybe search: Solagnier + genaruba
=

"...Frenchman...."
"Blue blood...."
"Cousins"
"Crows"
"South American"
"Curacao"
"grandmother"
"Insurance"
"Blogs"
"ALE"
"Ex-monkey"


Fin3/19/08
Not Shango.

Search: Solaganier + genaruba

ah ... Tio Rufo, SGC's next door neighbor? Rufo... rings a bell. Is he a neighbour?
fin thinks SGC the 5th? Why would he lie? Any reasons? Any relations to an ex-monkey?

the monkey is ex/not current? Posts the cage no more.

RUFO SOLOGNIER
Retired ALE Police Chief

Now that rings a louder bell.

No typos in

Search: Solagnier + genaruba.

Do names through genealogy histories always stay the same?

The ex-monkey is not a Crows, but is related to Crows.

Steve Crows is not the ex-monkey, but maybe related to one.

Shake the Solagnier + genaruba and an ex-monkey will fall out of the tree.

Rufo cannot find a razor, think he could type?


Two words above to be searched with a "+" in between. Does the s-engine still work?


This is the search result for Solagnier + genaruba.

108.   Nicolaas Croes, born 1732 in Curaçao103.  He was the son of 216. Lourens Croes and 217. Susanna van der Westen.  He married 109. Maria Elizabeth van der Biest 01 november 1770103.
109.  Maria Elizabeth van der Biest  She was the daughter of 218. Harmen van der Biest and 219. Suzanna van der Woestijne.

Children of Nicolaas Croes and Maria Biest are:
  i. Hendrik Croes, born 15 oktober 1769104; died 09 oktober 1854 in Aruba104; married Anna Clara Poppe 16 augustus 1826 in Aruba105; born 25 februari 1773106; died 26 september 1841 in Aruba106.
  ii. Lourens Croes, born 08 januari 1777107; died 12 augustus 1850 in Aruba108; married Magdalena Specht 1801109; died Bef. 1850110.
  iii. Regina Jacomina Croes, born 14 oktober 1781111; died Bef. 1831111; married Michel Benoit Solagnier; born 09 juni 1754 in Marseille, France112; died 28 april 1831 in Aruba112.
54 iv. Jan van der Biest Croes, born 12 november 1783; died 20 juni 1859 in Aruba; married Maria Elizabeth Specht 27 augustus 1834 in Aruba.

27 in Aruba80; born 10 september 1798 in Aruba81; died 08 november 1881 in Aruba81.
  ii. Jan Pieter Croes, born 15 februari 1812 in Aruba82; died 28 december 1904 in Aruba82; married Sarah Zagaria Castro 11 november 1857 in Aruba83; born Abt. 1823 in Aruba84; died 01 november 1908 in Aruba84.
28 iii. Casper Theodorus Croes, born 17 mei 1825 in Aruba; died 13 juli 1889 in Aruba; married Regina Jacomina Ravine 11 augustus 1847 in Aruba.


58.  Paulus Ravine, born 06 april 1794 in Aruba85; died 13 juli 1841 in Aruba85.  He married 59. Maria Margaretha Solagnier 16 augustus 1826 in Aruba86.
59.  Maria Margaretha Solagnier, born 25 mei 180487; died 29 oktober 1861 in Aruba87.  She was the daughter of 118. Michel Benoit Solagnier and 119. Regina Jacomina Croes.

Child of Paulus Ravine and Maria Solagnier is:
29 i. Regina Jacomina Ravine, born Abt. 1824 in Aruba; died 18 oktober 1897 in Aruba; married Casper Theodorus Croes 11 augustus 1847 in Aruba.

http://www.geocities.com/genaruba/Page5_29.html

28.   Casper Theodorus Croes, born 17 mei 1825 in Aruba46; died 13 juli 1889 in Aruba46.  He was the son of 56. Frans Muller Croes and 57. Catharina Theresa Tromp.  He married 29. Regina Jacomina Ravine 11 augustus 1847 in Aruba47.
29.  Regina Jacomina Ravine, born Abt. 1824 in Aruba48; died 18 oktober 1897 in Aruba48.  She was the daughter of 58. Paulus Ravine and 59. Maria Margaretha Solagnier.

Children of Casper Croes and Regina Ravine are:
  i. Jan Croes, born 11 januari 1848 in Aruba49; died 02 januari 1918 in Aruba50; married Abeona Croes 23 juni 1869 in Aruba51; born 19 oktober 1851 in Aruba52; died 06 oktober 1926 in Aruba53.
14 ii. Johannes Nicolaas Croes, born 29 september 1863 in Aruba; died 23 maart 1947 in Aruba; married Theolinda Robustiana Lampe 24 september 1884 in Aruba.

http://www.geocities.com/genaruba/Page12_29.html

118.   Michel Benoit Solagnier, born 09 juni 1754 in Marseille, France112; died 28 april 1831 in Aruba112.  He married 119. Regina Jacomina Croes.
119.  Regina Jacomina Croes, born 14 oktober 1781113; died Bef. 1831113.  She was the daughter of 108. Nicolaas Croes and 109. Maria Elizabeth van der Biest.

Child of Michel Solagnier and Regina Croes is:
59 i. Maria Margaretha Solagnier, born 25 mei 1804; died 29 oktober 1861 in Aruba; married Paulus Ravine 16 augustus 1826 in Aruba.


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texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #3716 on: March 21, 2008, 11:17:37 PM »


Thanks SS, I appreciate your time!  I see that you came up with the same thing as I on Finbars research suggestion. 
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #3717 on: March 21, 2008, 11:20:36 PM »

Steve Croes is the 4th person arrested...well if you don't count the SG, which had been released by the time Simian was speaking of them. 
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« Reply #3718 on: March 22, 2008, 12:54:13 AM »

Steve Croes is the 4th person arrested...well if you don't count the SG, which had been released by the time Simian was speaking of them. 

but what about the un-named person
who was detained/released the previous night?

detain/arrest: synonyms which share common definition

you say po ta to, I say po tah to ...
they fry up the same

someone detained musta earned suspect status

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whiskey for my men/beer for my horses
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« Reply #3719 on: March 22, 2008, 08:34:25 AM »

I would really like to know who Steve Croes parents are.  Even if he isn't the 5th, I think it might shed some light into why he involved himself with the case to begin with.  We know that he is friends with GVC, was his original lie that confirmed the JVDS/K2 beginning alibi of dropping Natalee off an effort to draw attention away from GVC?  I don't believe his story of overhearing Deepak on the phone at the internet cafe talking about the HI dropoff story as his only reason for inserting himself in the case to begin with.  There's more to it.  Have there been any hints as to who his parents are that I've missed?  There was a Hendrik Croes in the Solagnier/genaruba geneology information; but not in recent history.  I'm curious as to if his purpose of supporting the original alibi might not have been to protect the "elders", if not GVC.  SS seems to have a better source of geneology information than I'm able to find.  If he reads this maybe he will see what he can find.


Hi Texasmom,  I have subscription databases to many genealogy libraries, but I am finding it very difficult to locate additional information about these people.  The vital records for Aruba and Curacao aren't online.  There are quite a few generations missing between what we found and the present living individuals.  I somehow got the impression from Fin that we should be able to see a name and recognize it.  Maybe the suspect has been named after a great great grandparent.   Fin also mentioned something about a grandmother.  The only way that the name of a grandmother would be in the mix that I found, would be if the fifth suspect is quite old himself.  (I'm a she!)


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