SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #1

[MumInOhio]

Lala's.....came across something yesterday which reminded me of the music man wasn't on the bill. Singing cards etc. Had always thought this referred to Steve Croes, but now I am not so sure. Will have to go and find the Shango/Simian posts tonight or in the morning and see how it fits.

[Lala'sMom]

This one has Freddy written all over it.

187.   Name: Simian | E-mail: xx | IP: xx
He had to be let go.
Posted Jun 22, 5:16 PM | Edit Comment | Delete Comment | Edit Post “Beth Twitty and the Van der Sloots' Meet” | View Post


Statement from Freddy on 6/17 - to me his status is questionable from this time - and then no more statements until 6/28, coincidentally the same date as Lorenzo's statemnt. Freddy no longer appears to be a suspect on the Dr Phil listing. Simian says above: He had to be let go.

And what date was Freddy arrested?  What date did they let Paulus go?

[MumInOhio]

This one has Freddy written all over it.

187.   Name: Simian | E-mail: xx | IP: xx
He had to be let go.
Posted Jun 22, 5:16 PM | Edit Comment | Delete Comment | Edit Post “Beth Twitty and the Van der Sloots' Meet” | View Post


Statement from Freddy on 6/17 - to me his status is questionable from this time - and then no more statements until 6/28, coincidentally the same date as Lorenzo's statemnt. Freddy no longer appears to be a suspect on the Dr Phil listing. Simian says above: He had to be let go.

And what date was Freddy arrested?  What date did they let Paulus go?

Paulus arrested 6/22 and released 6/26. Freddy became a suspect some time after 6/17 and before 6/22. Will have to go back and see if there any clues around this time. Simian's post was 6/22 and he appeared to post in real time around this time. He says ahead of time, but tells of Joran not talking and the car tapes close to the time they happened. For him to be posting about Paulus' release on the day he was arrested just does not make any sense.

[Lala'sMom]

This one has Freddy written all over it.

187.   Name: Simian | E-mail: xx | IP: xx
He had to be let go.
Posted Jun 22, 5:16 PM | Edit Comment | Delete Comment | Edit Post “Beth Twitty and the Van der Sloots' Meet” | View Post


Statement from Freddy on 6/17 - to me his status is questionable from this time - and then no more statements until 6/28, coincidentally the same date as Lorenzo's statemnt. Freddy no longer appears to be a suspect on the Dr Phil listing. Simian says above: He had to be let go.

And what date was Freddy arrested?  What date did they let Paulus go?

Paulus arrested 6/22 and released 6/26. Freddy became a suspect some time after 6/17 and before 6/22. Will have to go back and see if there any clues around this time. Simian's post was 6/22 and he appeared to post in real time around this time. He says ahead of time, but tells of Joran not talking and the car tapes close to the time they happened. For him to be posting about Paulus' release on the day he was arrested just does not make any sense.

And when was Lorenzo arrested?  He was the person they were talking about after Steve Croes was arrested the day before.  I keep forgetting those dates. I think Steve Croes was brought in on the 15th and the next day Lorenzo was questioned.  I think I have seen someone post that Lorenzo gave a PV on the 16th or 18th also.  I can't really remember for sure.  It is not in the stuff the was requested by Dr. Phil's attorneys, but I know we have talked about it before.

[klaasend]

Lala's found this - still looking:

Page 222 Loving Natalee

Peter De Vries reports that Joran almost confessed on June 18th,2005,when a Detective called Joran a devil.(We know that was Jacobs)

Joran said out of the blue "I dont know where she is buried" and mentions that he knows what they are thinking and that is that he called his father and he helped bury the body.

Once again June 18th 

DeVries called this interrogation a missed opportunity, something about ALE and language difficulties. The transcriptions are unclear.

The DeVries show and the DeVries/Jensen show transcripts are a great read. Looking back, we should not have been surprised at the Sloot Dig, with DeVries stating (about 100x) that the police no longer believed they went to the beach.

just a minor point here- We know that is all true. The ALE should have known for sure with that statement that Lorenzo was not involved. The main suspect is implicating himself and his father. How could Lorenzo have made the jump to magician and locate himself in two places at once?

Lorenzo interviewed on 6-16-2005. Joran implicating himself on 6-18-2005. At that point they had the case closed. AGAIN.

[MumInOhio]

This one has Freddy written all over it.

187.   Name: Simian | E-mail: xx | IP: xx
He had to be let go.
Posted Jun 22, 5:16 PM | Edit Comment | Delete Comment | Edit Post “Beth Twitty and the Van der Sloots' Meet” | View Post


Statement from Freddy on 6/17 - to me his status is questionable from this time - and then no more statements until 6/28, coincidentally the same date as Lorenzo's statemnt. Freddy no longer appears to be a suspect on the Dr Phil listing. Simian says above: He had to be let go.

And what date was Freddy arrested?  What date did they let Paulus go?

Paulus arrested 6/22 and released 6/26. Freddy became a suspect some time after 6/17 and before 6/22. Will have to go back and see if there any clues around this time. Simian's post was 6/22 and he appeared to post in real time around this time. He says ahead of time, but tells of Joran not talking and the car tapes close to the time they happened. For him to be posting about Paulus' release on the day he was arrested just does not make any sense.

And when was Lorenzo arrested?  He was the person they were talking about after Steve Croes was arrested the day before.  I keep forgetting those dates. I think Steve Croes was brought in on the 15th and the next day Lorenzo was questioned.  I think I have seen someone post that Lorenzo gave a PV on the 16th or 18th also.  I can't really remember for sure.  It is not in the stuff the was requested by Dr. Phil's attorneys, but I know we have talked about it before.

Here's what I found: Steve was questioned 6/15 and arrested 6/17. Lorenzo...the first post I found out of Aruba was that 'a dutch boy from Savaneta' was arrested. Posted at 4.36PM June 16th ...... and if you are ARUBAN Y ALL KNOW!

And my dear friend Freddy was interviewed by Sir Frosted Flakes at 15.30 on, of course, 6/16.

Have also seen posts from June 10th saying LVR was mentioned earlier in the week and way back in the beginning. Spin machine was already in full force, so not sure what to make of Steve Croes, seems they deliberately crossed their suspects, ie Lorenzo Wever, Steve Croes - influential family, though his uncle is a retired cop, and of course my favorite: Lorenzo Locoman!

Keep in mind Lala's that what is in the Dr Phil logs is listed under Aruban Counsel, and am presuming that it's the Kalpoes Counsel list. Do not really think that explains why some interviews aren't listed, except if I recall 2Ks Counsel do not get anything that does not pertain to them.

[Lala'sMom]

Lala's found this - still looking:

Page 222 Loving Natalee

Peter De Vries reports that Joran almost confessed on June 18th,2005,when a Detective called Joran a devil.(We know that was Jacobs)

Joran said out of the blue "I dont know where she is buried" and mentions that he knows what they are thinking and that is that he called his father and he helped bury the body.

Once again June 18th 

I am confused by your comment...How would this absolve Lorenzo?  Sorry, I know it's plain as the nose on my face, but I am missing your point.
DeVries called this interrogation a missed opportunity, something about ALE and language difficulties. The transcriptions are unclear.

The DeVries show and the DeVries/Jensen show transcripts are a great read. Looking back, we should not have been surprised at the Sloot Dig, with DeVries stating (about 100x) that the police no longer believed they went to the beach.

just a minor point here- We know that is all true. The ALE should have known for sure with that statement that Lorenzo was not involved. The main suspect is implicating himself and his father. How could Lorenzo have made the jump to magician and locate himself in two places at once?

Lorenzo interviewed on 6-16-2005. Joran implicating himself on 6-18-2005. At that point they had the case closed. AGAIN.

[Lala'sMom]

I give up!  I even missed the point of the quote line in the above post.  Sorry I am in there somewhere. LOL

[Lala'sMom]

Back to Freddy as the 5th suspect...did he meet Natalee earlier in the week?  That is the question.

[MumInOhio]

Back to Freddy as the 5th suspect...did he meet Natalee earlier in the week?  That is the question.

I haven't been able to find out very much about earlier in the week. Just read that some MB'ers went to C&Cs on Thurs, no indication that Natalee did.

Cool crazy guy (Locoman) and meets another boy in the same casino(Joran). Has to be the HI. Only way I can put Freddy there is with him working next door. Could be part of the pimps routine to case out the tourist groups when they come in.
Do they tromp around the casinos on a daily basis to see who is there? Or is this where Guido or GVC come? Guido would see them in the casino and GVC around the beach. Anita was out of town, so I'm sure Joran was there a lot that week, with whom, is the question?

There seems to be a lot of secrecy surrounding both Freddy and Lorenzo. Also confusing info. Most info on Lorenzo has come from posters up until his recent arrest. Somehow whatever their involvement is, they have both managed to stay pretty well under the radar as far as MSM is concerned.

Still waiting to have my CP checked out before I pop off any emails, Lala's. And I do agree with your Mr Pink theory from the other night.

[Lala'sMom]

I don't know how right my Mr. Pink theory could be, but although in the Dana interview Jug could not make any porn connections and he pretty much wouldn't because his focus was on finding Natalee, but leads me to wonder how the children of the elders made all that money. Didn't seem to be able to make much gambling, yet Joran had cash to blow on shots of 151 for his "dates" at Carlos and Charlie's and Deepak was driving a really nice car compared to others on Aruba, I would bet. So the money is coming from somewhere...doubt the Internet Cafe was paying $25.00 an hour to Deepak. Besides, most of the Kalpoe family money was going to educate Satish to be a doctor, right?

[Lala'sMom]

I am posting this portion of Simian in it's entire context...it is a bit long, but you need to read everything in between to see how disjointed the conversations are at times and how difficult it is to determine what is being said.  The best thing is to just read it and then think about it.  You will see that even the FP posters were wondering about Simian and who he or she was.


#  Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:23 pm

The news in Aruba has reported that Joran has shut down.
# jburnham on June 22nd, 2005 4:23 pm

I don’t think she ran away. + she left without her passport, right?
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:24 pm

And Jon I want to say you, your community and especially, the Twitty’s and Holloway’s that I hope that NH returns safely to her parents
# jon on June 22nd, 2005 4:24 pm

to ladyja i think she was druged ,GHB is very easy to slip in someones drink and it will make you feel very disoriented. The reason i say this is because its not in her character to get in a car with strangers to fashionqueen why would she take her phone to a nightclub in aruba where she had no reception.
# pktbk on June 22nd, 2005 4:25 pm

simian…shut down?

jb…the chaperones had their passports.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 4:25 pm

Simian - “The news in Aruba has reported that Joran has shut down. ” What does that mean?
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:25 pm

Simian what does that mean??
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:27 pm

Stopped talking.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:27 pm

He has gone in a sort of downer mood. Is not saying anything anymore.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:28 pm

Sim - are you going telling us your info or not from earlier?
# VANESSA on June 22nd, 2005 4:28 pm

Shut down as in not talking anymore….possibly about to crack.
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 4:29 pm

Yeah, Daddy VDS prolly jumped his son’s ass again… “I TOLD YOU TO SHUT UP, BOY!!!”
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:29 pm

Sim - Right now we hear Joran has changed his story again - what do your hear?
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:29 pm

JON—-Ok I kinda figured something like that and I know you have heard several stories from allot ppl who were on the trip that is if you were’nt, but did anyone say y they didnt stop her? Or is it that no one saw her go in the car period?
# frank on June 22nd, 2005 4:30 pm

Wild stories. Things must be different in Aruba. In the US this would have already been leaked to the media.

We are all over speculating. An arrogant 17 year old kid is not that savy. A 26 year old DJ does not have a lot of credability either. If either of them had the kind of contacts necessary to pull of a human smuggling plot they would all already dead. It took the police over a week to arrest, trust me the mastermind behind something like that would have made sure there were no weak links. Like a mouthy 17 year old kid.

Here is the kicker though. Even in the simplest and most likely theory that something went wrong and they dumped the body. These kids would 100% leave obvious clues. They are not criminal masterminds. I am sure that the FBI knows what to look for immediately. Simple things, that even intelligent people like an Aruban judge would overlook.

The 26 year DJ puzzles me simply becuase of how he fits in and why…If I was dropped off by my friends and committed this crime alone. I would not tell or bring in a soul. I would figure this out on my own. You can never count on anybody not to talk. That is why serial killers do not traditionally have partners.

Even if this kid had an accident, maybe went skinny dippping and NH did not resurface. He should fry. He should fry for holding out and having a cavalier attitude.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:30 pm

Vanessa - either that or he has told all he knows.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:31 pm

I tried to, but I got a message saying that my post would bo placed in through the moderator. I tried again and got the same message. Maybe I am not allowed to say what I know.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 4:32 pm

You mean he has been talking for the past 3 weeks, and NOW he decides to shut up? What a jerk. Obviously since Nat has not been found, he hasn’t given much concrete info to begin with. Why shut up now Joran. I mean have you even given authorities a clue on where Nat might be? Why stop talking now.

give me a break!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



#  CountryMoon on June 22nd, 2005 4:32 pm

I second all that Jon has said. Stop the rediculous rumors. Nat is a great girl. She has no reason to want to run away.
I never implied anything *******.
We second what Jon has said, we just want her to come home safe so that this whole nightmare can finally be over. Its interrupted everyones life and its very hard to deal with all of this. I think that is the main reason why we have come and read these polls, we want answers just like everyone else. Any little bit helps.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 4:33 pm

Sim - say it in another language and we’ll translate.
# Stefe McHearthy on June 22nd, 2005 4:34 pm

@ MOFOfromMO
Don’t you have any job or obligation to fulfill?

Or are you the one sponsored by Bin Laden….
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 4:36 pm

We have to know that “Montana” (house where Joran and family lives) is really part of “Noord”. I reported yesterday that there was something going on. It was the parents finally meeting each other. Aruba is working.
# Red on June 22nd, 2005 4:36 pm

Just a heads up …

according to CNN, Scared Monkeys is supposed to be featured on “Inside the Blogs” today at 4:50 - 4:55 pm.

Thanks
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:37 pm

Checkme - any new tidbits you can provide today? Do you still think what we talked about yesterday to be true?
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 4:38 pm

CountryMoon - I think the best thing Nat’s family has done is to keep this story in the spotlight!!! My advice to you and her family is to try and keep it in the front page of every newspaper, and on the news in every state/country. I think with enough publicity Nat will come home! KEEP THE MEDIA involved. Even if what they say are rumors and nothing is a fact, it keeps the story in the news!!!! That is what’s important. GOD BLESS NATALEE!
# frank on June 22nd, 2005 4:39 pm

Also, if there is more than one party involved. Somebody needs to explain to this kid that he is about to ass-raped for a very longtime. How long depends on who cracks first…

How is that for drama. Just like Law and Order
# Mark 2 on June 22nd, 2005 4:40 pm

I don’t know Natalee, but I don’t see any way that Natalee would run away and put her mother through such grief. The pictures they show of them together indicate they have a pretty close bond. Unless she is an absolute cook, which she doesn’t seem to be, there is no way she would put her mother through this.
# pktbk on June 22nd, 2005 4:41 pm

jake….that is true. even if her parents have to leave. they need to be on tv or newspapers everyday to keep this going.

checkme—you were spot on yesterday.
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:42 pm

Country Moon do u believe she was drugged also?
# frank on June 22nd, 2005 4:42 pm

and either way, wether this punk thinks he can be free in 120 days or whatever the law is. If I was NH family and this does not come to a close by then. I would make sure he is silienced for good. One way or another.

Just make sure they hire someone that will torture the little punk first. Everyone is talks tough until you cut a finger off.
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 4:42 pm

**Stefe McHearthy Says:

June 22nd, 2005 at 4:34 pm
@ MOFOfromMO
Don’t you have any job or obligation to fulfill?

Or are you the one sponsored by Bin Laden….**

You are a LOSER. And I don’t need a reject trying to be my daddy, when I already have a wonderful one.

Don’t YOU have a life, other than attempting to cast insults on people obviously better than you are?

Good grief! You are pathetic!!! No wonder some animals eat their young!
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 4:43 pm

June 16, 2005 08:26 AM on RiehlWorldView:

“I have always loved Aruba for it’s multi cultural society. Even to see how under extreme stress we can still see each others humanity gives me hope. On this island the distances are very short so you cannot remain distant and judge coldly. “
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:43 pm

Is Simian gone??
# pktbk on June 22nd, 2005 4:44 pm

do you think it odd that not only do we mainly hear about joran, not the brothers. but also that steve croes is a friend of the brothers, not so much joran. i think there is something going on in regards to the brothers. there is no spotlight on them right now.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:45 pm

I hope they find her. The gov’t and the private sector should give the whole island the day off to go wave her goodbye at the Airport.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 4:46 pm

Do you guys believe that Simien tried to send us a message and got placed in a “moderator”????? Do you think he’s for real? Or are his walls padded? Or maybe he needs a nap?
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:46 pm

pktbk I totally agree, b/c they were the first ones sent to the big Prison not Joran, so y him and not them.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 4:47 pm

You got it pktbk.

CRS, all still stands dude.
# CountryMoon on June 22nd, 2005 4:47 pm

If those three boys want everyone to believe that they did to her what they had claimed in their first, second, and third version of their stories, when they were trying to smear her name, then given her character she would have had to of be drugged. I am not saying that she was though. There are different interpretations on how she looked when she left that night. Every one was just so busy having a good time, and the idea of something bad actually happening was the farthest from everyones minds. I can not really comment further on that.
# Stefe McHearthy on June 22nd, 2005 4:47 pm

@ MOFOfromMO
Thanks for confirming!
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:47 pm

what was up with Checkme’s last post. Checkme, give me something today - you are always right on.



I think I would be safe in saying that the poster Checkme was most likely ALE or in the prosecution office.  In other convos both Simian and Checkme knew each other although you don't know that in this conversation.  Also, keep in mind that Lucy and CRS knew who they were too. 

[Lala'sMom]

The 5th Suspect: Here we go!

#  Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:48 pm

I am here. Can’t say the things I want…
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:48 pm

Thanks checkme!!
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 4:49 pm

Sorry CRS, gotta go.
# frank on June 22nd, 2005 4:49 pm

We only hear from Joran because he is the weakest. The other 2 do not have as much to loose.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:50 pm

Tom/Red - can you elaborate at all on Simian?
# pktbk on June 22nd, 2005 4:50 pm

*mouth wide open*

all i can think is what came from an aruban poster in regards to them not really liking the dutch or other minorities. so scapegoat the two black security guards, and scapegoat the rich dutch boy….
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 4:50 pm

Jake to Simian: Oopsey…I think Simian’s back. Maybe he could answer about the ‘padded walls’. :O
# Stefe McHearthy on June 22nd, 2005 4:50 pm

@ MOFOfromMO
And now comes the true hard part:
Put down that bottle!
I realize it is very hard but give it a try. There are people who care about you!!
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:50 pm

Some people on the other side of the pond know more than what they are saying. There testimony, there’s security footage, there are witnesses.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 4:52 pm

WO!
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:53 pm

Sim can you elaborate anymore than that? Is this your opinion or based on something mre concrete?
# pktbk on June 22nd, 2005 4:53 pm

wow…..we’ve made more progress in the last five minutes than all week!!
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 4:54 pm

pktbk - sim is contradicting what checkme says. Thoughts?
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:55 pm

pktbk— where did u hear that they didnt like black or the dutch kid, b/c they seemed to hang out with him more than once.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 4:55 pm

What did CheckMe say?
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 4:56 pm

The 5th suspect has an alibi so strong that he has everybody baffled.
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 4:57 pm

Stefe:

****yawn****

You’re boring me.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 4:57 pm

Sim - what is the other side of the pond? Is it a place, or is it an organization?
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 4:58 pm

wat alibi does the 5ht suspect have??
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 4:59 pm

Who is the 5th suspect? There are now 4. Who is the 5th?
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 4:59 pm

“the other side of the pond” - the Aruban Mafia
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:00 pm

The 5th suspect was the boyfriend from earlier in the week.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:02 pm

The other side of pond I assume is the us and you are insinuting it is her friends/family involved.
# ladyJA on June 22nd, 2005 5:02 pm

whose boyfriend earlier in the week??????
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 5:02 pm

Huh Simian?
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:02 pm

What boyfriend? Whose? I am confused Sim.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 5:03 pm

This is getting really bizarre. Who’s boyfriend from earlier in the week?
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:03 pm

The party-goers said the 5th one was with them. He was the host. How could he have left?
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 5:03 pm

Simian:
Boyfriend from earlier? Can you elaborate??

Thanx!
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:03 pm

Sim - i am totally lost on what you are saying.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:04 pm

SImian
Is #5 Van Rijn????????
# Stefe McHearthy on June 22nd, 2005 5:04 pm

@ MOFOfromMO
And I want to say that I care about you! But you need to work on yourself! That is not easy. Nobody sais it is easy! You will receive the guidance and love you need if you step up and be honest!

Stefe.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:06 pm

I think he is saying NH had an earlier aquaintance during the first couple of days of the trip — I think.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:06 pm

crs
I think you blew the cover.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:06 pm

Stefe - why have you gone psycho on mom, chill out.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 5:07 pm

This is BS. I don’t believe that NH family or friends had anything to do with this! This is not what this case is about. Stop trying to throw us off track here. The MAIN SUSPECTS and CULPRITS in this case are the ones that are in jail right now. I don’t think we should let anyone take us away from that. We heard from Country Moon that Nat and Family are really good people, and I believe it! I truly do! You can tell by all the pictures. I still believe it is Joran and friends!
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:07 pm

rem - you may be right.
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 5:07 pm

Stefe:

What exactly is your purpose in this forum????

No one cares what the hell you are talking about. Please stay on topic or go back to pre-school.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:09 pm

A scorned lover needs a motive? Drives some people to some crazy deeds.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:11 pm

Was the lover on the trip??

[Lala'sMom]

#  Stefe McHearthy on June 22nd, 2005 5:12 pm

@ MOFOfromMO
You know it is exactly on topic.
Do what you feel is right.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:12 pm

Sim -Surely your not saying a local MT brook boyfriend would be involved in this, would you.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:13 pm

A jealous boyfriend was at home with some friends. He couldn’t have done it. Sometimes friends will cover for each other.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:14 pm

Sim -I think your reaching
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 5:15 pm

How could a local MT boyfriend be involved. The FBI would have cracked this case already through phone records and the internet. I don’t believe this. This is yet ANOTHER rumor!
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:16 pm

He had to be let go.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:16 pm

Does seem a little far fetched.
# born 2 b wild on June 22nd, 2005 5:17 pm

I love the cock fighting that goes on in this blog -complete w/razor blades attached to the spurs

We should take odds on the hour for the latest round

Right now we got Stefe in this corner and MOM from MO (the “show me MOM”) in that corner

p.s: checkme - check this
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 5:17 pm

COUNTRY MOON:

Thank you for taking the time to come on and talk to us. We appreciate your time, even though we can’t imagine how hard this must be for you and your community-we do understand. We all have been pretty caught up in this case, it’s tearing everyone apart. People have been listening to the news, radio and checking online forums faithfully. We all want Natalee to be safe, and we all understand that there is more to the story. As typical Americans though, we don’t understand WHY we can’t hear the truth. We know that Mrs. Twitty is keeping it together for SOME reason other than the simple hope of Natalee being alive. She has to KNOW that she is alive. Any information that we hear is helpful…and just the fact that you say OUTLOUD that there is more to the story keeps us all hanging on. It is hard to try and justify what Natalee is really like, when we don’t know her and we hear all of the rumors. It would help us all to understand MORE if we knew if Natalee has dissapeared before. But as you said, you probably can’t answer that.
I figured I would give it a shot anyways, and if you still can’t answer, I respect that.
Do you believe that she is alive but in another country?
# sunny71 on June 22nd, 2005 5:17 pm

Some insight from a local:
the coverage of this case is ridiculous, but I can understand the fixation on the ‘exoticness’ of this case, what with the weird Aruban laws and all.
Fact is, the police here has every interest in getting this thing resolved asap, if only because of the negative publicity.
The investigators screwed up in the beginning, because vdSloot Sr. is well known in those circles and they took Jr.’s story at face value at first. Understandable under the circumstances, but stupid in hindsight.
Jr. would have confessed a long time ago if he had done it. Interrogations by the local police are not a walk in the park for the suspects, as some of you might think. Aruban police knows a thing or two about pressuring a suspect.
My question is: did NH go back to her hotelroom and sneak out that night and are her roommates keeping mum about that? Just a thought.
I think Steve Croes and the Kalpoe’s should be the focus.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 5:17 pm

Good try Sim….I hope this story (rumor) breaks tonight. That will mean more air time for the Natalee Case!!!
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:18 pm

Sim - again is this your theory or something more concrete?
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 5:19 pm

Hey Sim?

Didn’t you mention earlier that when you were ‘awaiting moderation’, that it occurred when you typed (the word for a place to gamble)???
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:20 pm

Kristin - Country seemed to discount that earlier that she had been kidnapped and was possibly on another island - she seemed to point the finger at Van Der Sloot.
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 5:21 pm

Born 2 B Wild:

Now, don’t get excited. I’m not in any corner, cuz I don’t humor TROLLS for long.

Besides, I’ve already flushed him down the commode with the rest of his little ‘brown friends’.

***Whhhhaaaa-Shhhhhhhhhh***
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:22 pm

This is not my theory. This is for real.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:23 pm

Sim - I will give you your props if it proves correct.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:25 pm

Sim - let me get this right - seriously - you are saying NH’s ex killed her on the trip and the friends are covering up that he did this? Hence giving him an airtight alibi as you say.
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 5:25 pm

crs- can you put together a small little paragraph on the latest theory from Sim.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:25 pm

Sim - You have lost me!!
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:25 pm

Sunny 71
I do not know if it is true, but about 12 days ago it was reported that the roomates had not worried because she had only slept in the room the first night. Did not say if she had slept at other friends’ or elsewhere.
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 5:25 pm

Seriously guys, what are we talking about? WHO is suspect # 5? AND, something along these lines WOULD make sense, seeing as how everyone in Aruba knows whats going on and they all seem calm about it. If Joran really did something to Natalee, you think Mrs. Twitty would be hugging his mother and being friendly with his Dad? NO. I don’t care how nice she is, she wouldn’t do that.

Thanks CRS for being so helpful.
GOD-WHAT is going on??? And WHEN are we going to find out????????????
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:26 pm

The alibi story is the almost the latest.

The latest is that there’s a gap in the time-line for the boys.

It is true that one of them tried to off himself.
# Midway on June 22nd, 2005 5:26 pm

Joran’s probably innocent
# MOMfromMO on June 22nd, 2005 5:28 pm

I’m outtie, folks. Have a great evening..Thank you everyone, for all the updates!!

Peace out.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 5:28 pm

Simian is late with facts and wring with his speculations.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:28 pm

Kristin
Mrts. Twiggy didn’t hug Mrs. Van Der Sloot. Mrs. Van Der Sloot kissed Mrs. Twiggy on the cheek, as she left her house.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:29 pm

I did not say an ex. Do you people read? I not into repeating myself.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:29 pm

Sim - your not making any sense- on the one hand you seem to be saying an ex killed NH and on the other hand you are back talking about the boys - why would one of the boys try and kill himself if he is being framed?
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:29 pm

elaborate Checkme
# Midway on June 22nd, 2005 5:29 pm

The two security guards set Joran up
# Jake on June 22nd, 2005 5:30 pm

But who is the ex-boyfriend? Is he someone from the US, or did Natalee meet him in Aruba? Who is Van Rijn?
# Rob on June 22nd, 2005 5:30 pm

Sim,

Was this #5 perhaps someone Joran was having a confrontation with in C&C’s?
# pdl on June 22nd, 2005 5:30 pm

Mrs. Twitty after leaving the Van Der Sloot’s home said that she felt sure there would be more arrests leading me to think that she is being held somewhere by others.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 5:30 pm

He said the ex was at “home.” He said the 5th had an alibi - that is not necessarily the ex.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:30 pm

Checkme- that is what i figured as you have by far been the most accurate and I am with you on your theory.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:31 pm

Checkme
Please put us up-to-date.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:31 pm

Sim is saying that her ex’s friends had something to do with this, her ex was back in alabama, right Sim
# concerned4natalee on June 22nd, 2005 5:31 pm

DOES ANYONE HAVE A CLUE HERE?
# concerned4natalee on June 22nd, 2005 5:32 pm

WHO’S THE 5TH PERSON??
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:33 pm

Concerned - Ask Sim, he’s like my mom, he knows everything.

[Lala'sMom]

Notice how Simian is just a tad jealous of that fact that all the posters believe Checkme and not Simian:


#  Stefe McHearthy on June 22nd, 2005 5:33 pm

@ MOFOfromMO

Think, it is your life!
Please be blesseth!
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:33 pm

Checkme and Simian
This is it for you guys. You need to deliver something, since you have created all this expectation
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 5:34 pm

rem - your mom taught you well
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 5:35 pm

Seriously, please tell me something. PLEASE.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:36 pm

Lucy - i think Sim is a long shot, this is the first day i have seen him on the boards and he has not been right so far but i would stick with Checkme.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 5:36 pm

I think it’s Checkme’s turn to deliver.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:37 pm

I agree with CRS. Checkme, where do we stand?
# Snippy on June 22nd, 2005 5:37 pm

MOM, that was I that mentioned that gambling place called a C…just thought I’d peek in and see what the therories are now…so Sim thinks a kid on the trip did the deed? Can’t figure out for the life of me what he’s saying..SPIT IT OUT…instead of playing these word games for goodness sake.
# concerned4natalee on June 22nd, 2005 5:37 pm

????????
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:37 pm

crs
Will follow your advise. For a while I thought he was a java duplicate.
# concerned4natalee on June 22nd, 2005 5:38 pm

THIS BLOG IS ALL SPECULATION… FRUSTRATING…
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:38 pm

NH’s mom and Greta reminded me of Room Raiders on MTV last night, I thought they were going to throw Sr. Sloot in the back of a van for a second and try and get him a date.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 5:39 pm

lucy - what’s a java duplicate?
crs - what is checkme’s theory?
Sim - what?
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:39 pm

I think I scared he/she off with the last comment directed toward friends of NH’s ex.
# TK Ice on June 22nd, 2005 5:41 pm

..been lurking for the past couple days - had no intention of posting, but these last few minutes have been like a Chinese (oops Asian) fire-drill
Reminds of an old Abbott & Costello routine:
Who’s on first? Who
What’s on second? right, what
I don’t know. Third base
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:41 pm

Checkme believes NH is part of a kidnapping and has been moved most likely to Columbia - he believes Joran is totally innocent - he believes the brothers and Croes to be involved.
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 5:41 pm

Oh and do we all remember how the aruban veteran had said that natalee’s friends and family needed to take the polygraph test, or whatever? Now some of this is starting to make sense. Maye they need to give more information now. He wouldn’t say that for NO reason.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 5:41 pm

What you do with what I say is up to you Lucy. I give a finger, you “expect” a body.

Simian, a motive from Joran we do not have.

Twitty will let Joran free soon.

CRS, good hearing you again, proly because you followed my trail. I think that’s because you have read and felt what I have and tie it all together to the seemingly most likely scenario. Like Simian, I hate repeating myself.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:41 pm

Simian Says: Your comment is awaiting moderation.
June 22nd, 2005 at 5:40 pm
Simian Says: Your comment is awaiting moderation.
June 22nd, 2005 at 5:38 pm
Checkme…check this…and please recheck:

Girl comes to Aruba. Meets cool and crazy guy in C@$ino. Goes out with him. He declares that to be the case. Can’t deny it. It’s on tape. Everybody in the C@$ino knows the group of teens, they have been drinking in there for free the whole week.

After a couple of days girl meets another boy in the same C@$ino. Goes out with him. This makes first guy really mad. So mad he confronts second boy.

First guy never denies the affair. He knows they know he was with her. However, he has an airtight alibi. Some friends say they were at home with him. Until the morning.

How can this ever be solved?
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:42 pm

I think Lucy thought sim and checkme were the same person.
# rem05 on June 22nd, 2005 5:43 pm

Everybody including me wants to throw in 2 cents worth and hope that somebody on
the other end really has information, most times we are being deceived by speculation, that’s all it is, speculation.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:44 pm

Checkme - you have not been wrong so far and I think what we have talked about to be very possible.
# Trisher on June 22nd, 2005 5:44 pm

You are both verrrrrrrrrry interesting.

[Lala'sMom]

# Snippy on June 22nd, 2005 5:45 pm

Sim..I get you now..THANKS…you could be right..I “See” you mentioned that dreaded C word like I did and had your post deleted…
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:45 pm

Trisher
I guess I have started to really believe that I was one more of the detectives on this case. Around 4:48 CRS asked Chjeckme if he was around. Simian said, a few lines afterwards something like I am here but can’t say everything. Out of the blues, I decided that Simian and Checkme perhaps were the same person. In computer languages, I think they call Simian a code that identifies a duplicate.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:47 pm

Can someone explain to me in Sim’s theory who is guy 1 and guy 2, which is Joran?
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:49 pm

Checkme
I don’t expect a body. Perhaps a short summary of your latest discovery. Did not mean to be pushy, but just like everyone, just want your info updates to keep coming. My apologies.
# Rob on June 22nd, 2005 5:51 pm

Simian,

Hence the confrontation with Joran that the other students reported seeing at C&C’s?
# sunny71 on June 22nd, 2005 5:52 pm

so NH only slept in the assigned room with her roommates on the first nioght of their vacation? Is that correct?
If so, I’m really starting to wonder about this girl. Where did she sleep all the other nights? Did she have her bags packed the whole week, ready to leave at a moments notice?
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:53 pm

I wonder what crazy antics Greta and Beth will be to tonight.
# born 2 b wild on June 22nd, 2005 5:53 pm

jghfti llhjmy rhedcxedb dmcxcki fjrnrffu*n llamcd bgt fllrt gmmmm?

(another intergalactic relay - means “wheres the beef”)
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 5:55 pm

He has an alibi. So tight. So tight.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 5:57 pm

Sunny 71
She may have slept at other classmates room. If they hung around together, came to the hotel, and slept in somebody elses’s room.
# cancon on June 22nd, 2005 5:57 pm

ah wait a minute, wait a minute, having experienced this somewhat myself……

the rumour de jour is that Natalee only slept in her room one night, could it be Natalee did not get along with her specific roomates which would explain why they seemed so clueless last night on Fox, had there been some big blowout so Natalee was bunking with others????
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 5:57 pm

Lucy, CRS did an excellent recap for us all. Please don’t confuse me anymore with Simian. Just like van Sijn and van Rijn…

One thing I do want to repeat. It is so easy to throw mud at our authorities. Please don’t. We are all doing our best every day to have NH reunited with her family. We are not very good at the media show which is why I am also happy our system is closed while the investigative process is taking place.

I am not part of “the Aruban Authority”. Just a Human Being living in Aruba (duhhh…)

Vanessa, did you ever take a look at the links I posted for you? I send them with my warmest regards.
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:57 pm

Sim - i am going to have to think about this tonight and i will have some questions tomorrow morning.
# cancon on June 22nd, 2005 5:59 pm

or Natalee was having a feud with one or two of the girls and thusly purposely avoiding them, only spending the min time in the room……..
# crs on June 22nd, 2005 5:59 pm

Checkme, have a good night my friend, hope you have some more details tomorrow!!
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 6:01 pm

The first guy she met has all the motive. The second guy is scared shitless in a cell.

I have heard from Americans living in Aruba and and they think something completely different.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 6:01 pm

Simian

Possible alibis (or alibies) for #5:
Was in jail for DUI of illegal substances
Was filming himself
Was making a delivery
Was in Curaà §ao
Was painting his truck in Savaneta
None of the above
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:03 pm

Take care, CU tmrw. Over and out.
# Simian on June 22nd, 2005 6:04 pm

Lucy you are wrong. It was just a simple party at his house. He was “the whole time”.
# born 2 b wild on June 22nd, 2005 6:05 pm

I think the entire entourage (friends,chaperones etc…) now that they are back here in the USA, should be interviewed by the FBI,especially any who were in close proximity to (or responsible for) NH. They probably are being talked to as we speak.

Oh hang on, I just got another alien e-mail (I’ll be right back to paste it)>>>

fkvlfdidddp olggmt ffpdsmvg lsmmvnfjvhjjj vofofoggoffmsdmsamxx !!!

(translation: “born 2 be wild, you are a butt wipe”)

“I tell ya, I get no respect”
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:05 pm

Lucy!!! I am starting to like you.
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 6:06 pm

OK so if all this is true, why did Natalee leave with Joran? Why didn’t she just go back to her hotel with her friends? AND, who’s alibi is airtight?
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:07 pm

Lucy, are you from Aruba?
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 6:08 pm

Simian, can you share a little more information? Are you in Aruba?
Thanks!
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:11 pm

Kristin,

Go back to the hotel? Last nite out? Party on dudess…
# cancon on June 22nd, 2005 6:12 pm

oh Kristin i am going back to the mind of feuding high school girls…..

she may have gone off with the Aruban guys either because maybe the blowout was the girls fighting over Joran, hey women are always fighting over men who are so not worth it, so Natalee was going ha ha Joran is with me beatches or she took off with them to spite them in general or because she didn’t want to be with the gang….
# born 2 b wild on June 22nd, 2005 6:16 pm

simian means ape or primate FYI
# pdl on June 22nd, 2005 6:16 pm

News is slow on Fox and CNN. I wonder if they all went home?
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 6:17 pm

Checkme
No, I am from Santo Domingo, but have have visited Aruba many times. Have relatives in San Nicolas. My greatgrandfaher was from Curaà §ao and my great uncle moved back there. I have great childhood memories of Aruba, the carnival, the newyears eve celebrations, etc., and also my first encounter in life with oriental and asian foods.
# Donny on June 22nd, 2005 6:18 pm

@Sim:
Is that 5th suspect with a tight aliby whose father recently committed suicide and who has had serious mental issues since?
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:20 pm

Mira, Dominicana!!! My my you have traveled much. Allow me to compliment you on your perfect English.

I have seen you a lot on this blog. Why are you so interested in this case?
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 6:24 pm

Checkme
First, the desperation of the mother. Then, the fact that it was Aruba. By the way, went banck about 7 years ago, and could not believe the change from oil refineries to hotel strips. Do you still call Oranjestad, Playa?

As for my English, went to school in Massachusetts.
# jon on June 22nd, 2005 6:28 pm

simian you make up more bull another lover , it seems you are just trying to start more rumors . you have no FACTS to say so you make stuff up. TO all the others ,she had no boyfriend back home. the other side of the pond , please anyone thats interested dont listen to this guy. He has no idea what he is talking about .
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:29 pm

Sigur cu si, playa a keda playa.

My first girlfriend (Colombiana) also went to school in Massachusetts… many moons ago.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:31 pm

Jon,

Read Simian better. he did not write what you said.
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 6:31 pm

I went many moons ago too 1969-1979.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:36 pm

I came here around the same time, 1969. Things have changed indeed.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:38 pm

Before I go Lucy, if you may ask me one question, what would that question be, right now?
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 6:45 pm

Checkme
Since Aruba is so small, I won’t ask you where you came from. Perhaps later on. It was great having this small conversation on the side (of the blog). Look forward to keep reading your comments. Mis mà ¡s sinceros saludos y respeto,
# Lucy on June 22nd, 2005 6:49 pm

Checkme
Upss, didn’t read your 6:38 post until now. No questions now, will wait for your comments, today or tomorrow, depending on your return.

Bye.
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 6:50 pm

the silence before the storm…
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 6:59 pm

why cant you type in the word ca$in0
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 6:59 pm

if you try to type it, it says your post is awating moderation…WHY
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 7:01 pm

WHERE DID EVERYONE GO
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 7:34 pm

Lucy,

You there?
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 7:36 pm

yes are you there?
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 7:37 pm

did you try to type what i asked above? also did you read that flyer that some girl pointed out in the beginning of this page? is the poster supposed to be from natalee or her mother?
# Kristin on June 22nd, 2005 7:38 pm

where did everyone go?
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 7:40 pm

Kristin,

Are u Lucy?

Let us go to the other blog, the first one on NH, nice and clean start…
# Checkme on June 22nd, 2005 7:46 pm

come to:

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/?p=1175
# Hope on June 23rd, 2005 12:18 am

Jorans father is working his way into Dutch Monarchy….Joran is 17….a minor…a MINOR…if he fell victom to a mishap, (accidental homicide) he would first:
a) try to cover up
b) second rely on dad to cover up
c) third break down and confess knowing he is 17 and a minor under Dutch law….he would do no real time…his dad knows this, his mom knows this, they all know his dads Judgeship is now a pipedream…..why not confess….why does he not confess…all of us who stay here in this forum day after day, hour after hour still refuse to ask ourselves…what is really going on. Occams razor….

Occams Razor
“A rule in science and philosophy stating that entities should not be multiplied needlessly. This rule is interpreted to mean that the simplest of two or more competing theories is preferable and that an explanation for unknown phenomena should first be attempted in terms of what is already known. Also called law of parsimony.”

I drempt last night…”in my dream I smell the smell of chemicals…once before I smelled this, the smell and taste of an anesthesia right before i passed out on the operating table at the age of 14, after 15 seconds of this I drempt that something was after me, i fight to get away from this thing coming at me…then this thing becomes headless…I feel slightly safer..untill…the headless thing comes at me again, and now it feels like many many hands pulling at my stomach, more hands than this thing should have…why is it still alive pulling at me”…then I awake…I’ve been semiasleep for 20 mins. Dear lambs of God, I can say that was our angel…on 6/22/05 at 5:20am I was touched…blessed…ushered in…her soul is strong…we will not fail her.
# Willem on June 23rd, 2005 3:47 am

You guys suck big time! It’s obvious why we kicked your ick basterds out of Europe back then.

[MumInOhio]

How do we know that Lorenzo has any involvement?  Could he have been set up to take a fall for the Sloots?  Is Anita capable of putting his name out there and insisting his involvement (without her ever having to mention him) since this would clear her Sporter and get him out of hers and Paulus' lives?  Is this Anita's way of paying back Paulus and Lorenzo's mother for the affair that reportedly took place in the years before Anita?  Is Anita jealous of Lorenzo's mother?  Would she be jealous since she moved to Aruba, thinking she did it to be near Paulus?  What if Lorenzo was only brought up at the insistence of Anita.

I saw this last night and had just read somewhere that Anita and Paulus were interviewed on 6/15. I do not have any idea where I read it, but Simian says the parents were questioned by the FBI on 6/22. To me this means Beth and Dave. If I come across it again I will post.

[MumInOhio]

Lala's...thanks for yesterday's posts. Have read once and thought about it all. Will need to read and reread!


In reference to my post on the top of page, which I could not for the life of me remember what I had read at the time, and posted as to jog my memory:

Who else plays in the orchestra?

This was posted last night in the main thread.

Paul van der Sloot is indeed member of a brass band and he goes all out during the carnival, but in Aruba he is mostly known as the serious lawyer for whom the principles of justice always and everywhere comes in first place

And I found this about the Minister of Injustice. He is in a band called 'diabetico', they have a myspace and a web page. And their webpage even tells them who is visiting! Needless to sy I did not stay very long!


Quote from Stom on page 16 of this thread

I don’t know if there was a party that Joran and Natalee could bave gone to. If I am not mistaken, there was a family gathering at Freddy’s and consequently he had an alibi.  Koen Gottenbos was in Florida.  So at the risk of being overconfident with the available information, we can discard Freddy and the older Gottenbos boy as being hosts of an event that night.

[MumInOhio]

Lala's...from the above posts I am almost certain of one thing that bothered me. 'Across the pond' is the Netherlands NOT US. Searching posts from Aruba, on any subject, across the pond is Europe. Do you remember when these posters first posted. as I would like to start at the beginning?

And my little bit on my good friend Freddy for the day (from chapter 3, page 5 of Joran's book translation)
page 5:

- Joran and Freddy often went to the beach. He got him in touch with the pretty girls. He said "look there go a few pretty American girls, let's go and talk to them". Joran says Freddy introduced in to the paradise that had always been in front of him. Freddy's English sucked so it was mostly Joran who did the chatting with the girls. Freddy had no inhibitions/hang ups. He did not care if he made an ass of himself. He would be blown for 20 times but then he was lucky the 21st time

Cool and crazy guy! Thanks again Lala's!

[MumInOhio]

Just a little more on Freddy.....

Page 1: Chapter 4 of Joran’s book

- aged 16 I had already understood that to chat up girls on had to be "ballsy"

- together with Freddy and Jaime Joran would trawl the beaches and swimming pools to chat up tourists


Pages 1 and 2: Chapter 8 of Joran’s book: Is this Freddy’s family reunion?

Then Joran writes about the Soul Beach Music festival, he writes about the fact that it was memorial day weekend and who is performing, the price of the tickets and the fact that many people from around Aruba (Venezuela, other islands) have sailed/boated over the for the festivities.


  Pages 19 and 20: Chapter 8 of Joran’s book: Does this have anything to do with the 7th level?


That afternoon the cleaning lady finds a very messy room 7114: "In the room there were a lot of empty bottles of alcoholic beverages. There were about 6 yard cups. Her passport and suitcase they had left in the room".

More questions, no answers!