SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #1

[Debra]

Allegro Hotel...."Royal club Suites"
Owners:
De Diego...............Madrid
Aznar, Ambrosio.....Barcelona, Spain
Cardoso...............Zamora, Spain
Trimon.................Aruba

Wyndham Hotel..."Presidential Suites"
Owners: Rob Smith & Riversol

[Tibrogargan]

We have been search Thinking Like America... We need to think duct and a lot new info comes up but in dutch

Lios = Leeuwen
Lion = Leeuw
Geheim = Secrets
VDA = Veiligheid Diend Aruba (Aruba Secret Service)
Government=Overheid

Dirty=Vuil or Vuile

so search for "Aruba Vuile Overheid leeuwen"

or search for "Aruba Overheid geheim"

If we are not Dutch, do not understand the Dutch language and therefore can not think like the Dutch then it is very difficult to interpret it in any other way than the way we already think and understand.
That is why I am in awe of all the clever monkeys that have worked with these riddles since they were first posted and have come so far with their findings, as not very many of them had any prior understanding of the Dutch or Aruban cultures.
I will now step back and watch with renewed interest while the Dutch monkeys solve this for us.
.

[Tibrogargan]

*******...thanks...I remember reading that now

Tib....can't see the esses for the zees...LOL

Chata....anymore that you can remember?

COLUMBO...I expected to see you this morning!

Can anyone open those Lion's links this morning...maybe it's just me....again!

Mum - yes   LOL   Or the zees for the zeds  LOL

I have the most trouble with dates though : 4/5 could be 4 May or 5 April.  Guess you have become used to it by now?

OT - I have a query about WA and you may have lived there then.  Can you email me when you find time please.  Lalas should have my addy somewhere in her Shango files   LOL

[MumInOhio]

I'm not sure who Simian considers to be the 5th suspect
She does post about a "wild & crazy boy" (at start of vacation) jealous of Joran
GVC tried to dance with Natalee on Friday night

Simian: Who said the alibi played for Van der Sloots?
The fifth suspect is waltzing away......

Could just be a figure of speech
Was the alibi for another?

Shango: Shango has not danced with the lions......

That he is not a part of this "brotherhood" And watches from a distance

Interesting that you think that Simian was a female and Chata thinks connected to music, Lala's thinks someone with inside info to ALE (I think)....

If indeed Simian was a female, she may not be with us anymore, another arubacide!

Not sure if Simian is/was female though...

[MumInOhio]

Mum:

Could you repost that link from RWV about LVR & SGC being brought in????

tx

Is this it?....over-rode my favorite yesterday and accidently cleared my history the day before....sounds like something Aruba would do....you just have to open the comments to the story...and I'm not sure what you're looking for...at the top of the page are dates for back or forward...much like our fron page....

  http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/week24/index.html

[MumInOhio]

From BFN:


Aristotle wrote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am going to go out on a limb here.  This is only my opinion, like it or not, i don't care.  I reread shango recently and after devries "confession" by joran, i finally think i understand what shango was saying.  IMO joran is still lying to protect others.  IMO Mos should go to Bonaire and question vanderstraten.  I won't bore you with my line by line translations, but here is the gist. (and by the way, more than one source in aruba have confirmed that they have heard that these parties DO exist).

long ago in holland, a tradition was started where older influential men would meet and party..drugs, etc., and a younger girl or girls would be brought to them to satisfy their sexual pleasures.  Some of those men over the years transplanted to Aruba, yet they kept up the tradition, allowing others into their "group." These others likely consist of politicians and others in "power" positions.

there was one of these parties held in May 2005.  The "guest of honor" at this party...the young girl... was natalee.  She was lured to the party by joran.  The 2k dropped them off, as the 2k were not permitted at the party.  Something bad happened to natalee at the party.  joran was not the one who directly harmed her...he just lead her to this party.  Paulus and Vanderstraten know about these parties, and this party in particular.  Vanderstraten knows who harmed natalee. Other members of the ALE attend these parties as well.  joran cannot tell the truth about what happened to natalee because to do so would expose all of these other people.  Many of the politicians and policemen of aruba, and others...possibly judges, attorneys, etc., would lose their jobs over this and tourism would decline because tourists would not feel safe on an island littered with crooked cops.

the searches, arrests, court proceedings, etc. have been orchestrated to deceive the Americans/world and hide the truth about the island. everything, right down to joran's recent "confession" has been a sham, smoke and mirrors and a horse and pony show.  The ALE knows that the Americans/world is not going to let this go until someone is blamed for natalee's death.  joran is the obvious scapegoat because he was last seen with her and did not cause her death, so he can't be found guilty of that. 

the truth of Shango's posts will remain hidden, as will the truth about what happened to natalee until these parties and their participants are exposed.  According to shango, Vanderstraten did not participate directly in these parties, but he knew about them and did not shut them down.

IMO all of the people involved in these parties, and this party in particular, should be held accountable as they have misdirected the "investigation" from the start and up to the present time.  The question is, will Mos break the case wide open by exposing this, or is he a participant in these parties and/or the cover up?

Not so far fetched at all vms. I think msany of us have thought along these lines at one time or another. Don't forget about the skeeeeeery hindu--witch doctor--masks too! Part of the sick ritual, imo.

I remember those posts from way back about the masks, only vaguely about the witch doctor....

Which path to follow....Ari's, COLUMBOS, any more?

Both the above require a huge cover-up, but what is bugging me big time is....why has Aruba not just let this die down, why have they repeatedly put this story back in the news...the glass of wine....there was no need for that interview to even happen...

I can't see any 'mafia' allowing J's antics.....

None of this makes sense to me.....

[MumInOhio]

I'm not sure who Simian considers to be the 5th suspect
She does post about a "wild & crazy boy" (at start of vacation) jealous of Joran
GVC tried to dance with Natalee on Friday night

Simian: Who said the alibi played for Van der Sloots?
The fifth suspect is waltzing away......

Could just be a figure of speech
Was the alibi for another?

Shango: Shango has not danced with the lions......

That he is not a part of this "brotherhood" And watches from a distance

I have long thought that Freddy is the 5th...I need to find confirmation on his 'alibi...so tight...so tight'.

MO...The alibi is playing for Freddy...

As San says...nothing sticks to Freddy....

That said....the early posts about an arrest on 6/11 may throw a spanner in the works and if I go with what Marianne Croes said about Freddy being held from the 9th...more quesrions...was he detained...when...when did he become a suspect...it appears not until sometime between 6/16 to 6/23

Was Guido a suspect before May 2006...was GVC?...More questions?

[MumInOhio]

The Allegro Hotel? (allegro=music)

Hotel was closed/under construction
Top floors-timeshares-open
Rendevouz Casino (for locals)
2 Security guards, Haley worked there
Underground parking area

Haley...cop...is this who Dave saw...I think at the rocks...hurriedly closing his trunk...TIA

Why does your post about the Allegro make me think of elevators or an elevator company?  I know I just something about it...top floor-timeshares...had to be elevators from the underground garage....

Didn't caps mention an underground garage...

[MumInOhio]

Mum:

I remember Mos careful statement that included a suggestion of - perhaps if there were a movie- or something along those lines

a few other clues:

Simian: Who said the alibi played for Van der Sloots? The fifth suspect is waltzing away......

Shango: Shango has not danced with the lions......

by any chance did NH dance? earlier in the week perhaps?

The MB'ers apparently went to C&Cs on the Friday night I believe. Is this where she ran into GVC? Not sure on the facts on that right now.

It has crossed my mind a few times lately that the 'earlier in the week' and 'the girl owed money' could have been someone else. I'm sure you read the posts and saw the pics.

We have never been able to get around that 'earlier in the week' as Nat only arrived on Thursday and from what I've read they didn't do anything that night.

Got a really sick feeling about it....

Yes,the info is foggy but I recall that GVC was grinding up against Natalee at there first trip to C&C..Might have been a confrontation after that? We heard Deepak,GVC and Joran fought with a MB teen. Not sure exactly who it was if anyone.

Also:If you look at the archives of RWV at about July 25th,so many rumors and speculation. But they talk about the dead dogs..Saying Lorenzo killed them,one sacraficed by the bloody mattress,another in a bag at the allegro where they were searching for Natalee..Someone speculates it was santeria or whatever that religeon is. Which reminds me of hotshot,when she was leaving Aruba and the blood on the sidewalk as she entered her terminal..

Just read yesterday...Bryan Reynolds said that it was Joran that had a confrontation with one of the MB'ers...he said in the same interview that J2K's were the first he thought of when he heard that Natalee got in a car with someone....

I am sure Freddy and Jaime were hanging around the beach...it was their MO...for some reason I do not see the Kalpoes hanging out on the beach....no way!!!

[MumInOhio]

We have been search Thinking Like America... We need to think duct and a lot new info comes up but in dutch

Lios = Leeuwen
Lion = Leeuw
Geheim = Secrets
VDA = Veiligheid Diend Aruba (Aruba Secret Service)
Government=Overheid

Dirty=Vuil or Vuile

so search for "Aruba Vuile Overheid leeuwen"

or search for "Aruba Overheid geheim"

If we are not Dutch, do not understand the Dutch language and therefore can not think like the Dutch then it is very difficult to interpret it in any other way than the way we already think and understand.
That is why I am in awe of all the clever monkeys that have worked with these riddles since they were first posted and have come so far with their findings, as not very many of them had any prior understanding of the Dutch or Aruban cultures.
I will now step back and watch with renewed interest while the Dutch monkeys solve this for us.
.

I will google away until they decide to charge me Caps....let you know if I find anything.

I am disappointed though....not even a pat on the back for solving your little riddle yesterday...and I was so proud of myself....dir. 'T' hand

Tib...MO only...Shango and Simian posted on the front page of SM...they posted with Americans...I didn't read then, and you and Lala's would know for sure, but I don't recall any Dutch posters on the front page back then.Only American and Arubans, with a few others sprinkled in, but I can't recall any Dutch. Even if there was one or two, it wouldn't make sense to direct the posts that way...

Caps...I think you are on the wrong path here...Shango and Simian had to be directing their posts to Americans.

[MumInOhio]

*******...thanks...I remember reading that now

Tib....can't see the esses for the zees...LOL

Chata....anymore that you can remember?

COLUMBO...I expected to see you this morning!

Can anyone open those Lion's links this morning...maybe it's just me....again!

Mum - yes   LOL   Or the zees for the zeds  LOL

I have the most trouble with dates though : 4/5 could be 4 May or 5 April.  Guess you have become used to it by now?

OT - I have a query about WA and you may have lived there then.  Can you email me when you find time please.  Lalas should have my addy somewhere in her Shango files   LOL

Tib...the very first thing I stopped using...zed....every time I used it DH gave me such a strange look.

Still have a terrible time with the dates....still go to get in the wrong side of the car...funny as I don't drive...took me years to cross a road by myself

Think I have your email from Lala's...will do emails today....too much tangoing

Hope it's not about Skylab...LOL....those crazy Americans need to let this one land on Aruba...if they miss they may hit Chavez...LOL...way behind on the news...it may be down already!

[MumInOhio]

My simple opinion on Joran's confession is that he now actually believes what he has said.

A distant? relative can tell the biggest whoppers and I have listened and heard them grow for 25 years. This person would no doubt pass a lie-detector test because she believes every word that has been said. This person is convinced that the 'stories' are the truth!

The only other options to that are: he's telling the truth....or it's a setup!!!

Because I lean to more involved than just Joran and "Daury" my opinion is that he now believe's what he's saying.....subject to change though...

As I said...subject to change...It was a setup....I distinctly remember Mos saying in November he had 'an infitrator'...I posted on this, speculated it may have been a girl. Not going back to find my posts..I remember what I read and posted.

Mos would not have been able to use this 'confession'.

Rudy squashed whatever Mos had in November...there turned out to be 'no new evidence' except for Deepak's comment on a drowned teacher.

There were not two infiltrators..no way...I was not born yesterday...everyone in Aruba heard this story if we did...Joran went back and set up Peter deVries...absolutely no doubt in my mind...you just have to look at Joran's face to know it was.

He threw the wine in deVries face because he knew what de Vries was going to do. I hope de Vries is hopping mad.

Juries out,IMO, on whether Patrick was a 'victim' as well...we may never know.

There's going to be lots of lawsuits...the evidence is gone...but we have the statements...or do we...

We don't even have a scapegoat any more....

How in the world can a third world country like Aruba get away with this????

Rant over...before I really go to town....

[MumInOhio]

COLUMBO...was that link what you wanted?...I just came across a post about them in a photo from the 12th .. no link..just something I found and wasn't sure.

[MumInOhio]

vms or Nut ... did aristotle elaborate any more on his posts? I know he said he didn't wnat to be a bore, but some of us would find them quite interesting...I'm sure.   TIA

[truthseeker2]

Alfonso Riversol was involved with both the Allegro and the Wyndham, in 2005.

Thank goodness....at last someone else sees this!!!!!

Yes, he was.  He was very involved in booking the entertainment for the hotel lounges.

I have been screaming Allegro since Shango first posted this:

Shango on June 27th, 2005 10:37 pm
The DiceMen must be questioned.
They to go to the Music and enter the same Maze
Mary who was not a virgin entered
The DiceMen ROLLED
Mary ROLLED


This was posted on the Allegro message board back in June 2005 and I posted it here many times:

> If there was no connection, maybe she wandered over to the other hotel
> to use their casino?  The Allegro was only a few minutes away and
> despite the renovations the casino was open.  It seems unlikely that
> she would have just been grabbed off the street in front of her hotel
> right after being dropped off.
> They said something on Fox about witnesses alerting police to
> suspicious activity at the Allegro after her disapperance, people
> coming and going even tho it was closed.

The security guards originally arrested worked security at the Allegro until the hotel closed down for rennovations. It was their uniform that Deepak chose to describe, not the uniform of the HI security. While Deepak was inventing the HI lie did he inadvertantly describe the Allegro security uniforms because that's how he saw security that night...at the Allegro?  With the casino being open, people could still enter the hotel if invited by the hotel manager/GM...right?

[MumInOhio]

*******...sorry...that was a friend of Bryan Reynolds that had the confrontation with Joran. Bryan had to separate them. I just found it in the 'student quotes' link I have.

[MumInOhio]

Truthseeker..Good Morning...how far is the Allegra from the HI and Wyndham?  Could 'small houses' be townhouses?

[truthseeker2]

Truthseeker..Good Morning...how far is the Allegra from the HI and Wyndham?  Could 'small houses' be townhouses?

Not far at all.  The Allegro is now called the Occidental Grand Aruba.  Check out this map:

[truthseeker2]

Truthseeker..Good Morning...how far is the Allegra from the HI and Wyndham?  Could 'small houses' be townhouses?

Here is a link to an old article about the Wyndham.  You will see the names of Alfonso Riverol and Rob Smith.

http://tinyurl.com/2rvow7

[MumInOhio]

Thanks...I was looking for something on the Wyndham and the security tapes - why van der Straten interviewed this person. I remembered something in the student quotes and I'm looking for it.
In I think his book, Joran gave Deepak instructions as to the route they drove because of being caught on tape.

Rambling a little, but bottom line I'm sure they were back there...

GVC Daddy would have erased all the tapes. van der Straten needed the sec. Camera guy on board....more random thoughts

Need to connect the dots....