SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #1

[JE]

Here are a few of the conversations that happened on the FP just before Simian appeared.  As you can see, Checkme was already posting.  They are discussing the 4th and 5th person arrested.  It is confused already by this time.  The media in USA seemed to be saying Steve Croes was arrested first and then the 5th person...notice then that both are reversed according to Checkme.


Story from FP of Scared Monkeys: June 17th, 2005
9:14am **** UPDATE ****
4th arrest made in Natalee Holloway case

9:17 am: From one of our great sources in Aruba, americaninaruba …

    today 6am police go into house in Sta Cruz where they go with one person ……with initials S.C. this arrest took place 6am this morning…surprised the family with this arrest….we got different information, but we want to get all concrete things together before we bring this news to you…..we dont want to confuse anyone! we want to say that their is suspicion that she is ALIVE! but we dont want to bring up any suspicion to anyone but we will be back with info if this person has information for this case…also in Savaneta they took someone for interogation…..we are hoping this will come to an end, with all this suspicion we believe shes alive…..stay pending…..thank you harry

****
At 9:50 am: MSNBC & Fox have just reported the arrest of a fourth suspect. A 27 year old man.
It has been confirmed by Fox speaking to individual in Justice department 4th arrest 26 year old friend of joran

Fox News now reporting: Sources: 4th Person Arrested in Aruba Mystery

    Authorities in Aruba arrested a fourth man in connection with the disappearance of missing Alabama honors student Natalee Holloway, sources told FOX News.

    The new person detained is a 26-year-old friend of Joran van der Sloot — who was with Holloway the night she disappeared, sources said. Van der Sloot, 17, has been detained but not charged.

****
Unbelievable, after 18 days a fourth suspect now confirmed arrested, 26 year old, son of a prominent businessman and alleged friend of joran van der Sloot. Aruban authorities state there is an search going on with regards to this arrest but did not state where.

The boy has the initials SGC, and his father is also high in the judiciary.

Update: 1045 There is a rumor of another person taken into custody, his father recently committed suicide and that he has had serious mental issues since. He has two homes, a house on the main road of savaneta and also another one in Seroe Alejandro, and was know for having underground parties.

This is getting a little bizarre.

From the AP: Fourth Person Detained in Holloway Disappearance

11:00 am:

    ORANJESTAD, Aruba (AP) - A fourth person has been detained in Aruba in the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway, authorities announced Friday.
    The person “suspected of being involved” in Holloway’s disappearance was identified by the attorney general’s office only as a 26-year-old with the initials S.G.C. The office did not disclose the gender or say when the person was detained.

According to Top 95 via American in Aruba

The arrest this morning was of a 26 year old. There wwere 2 dutch brothers questioned yesterday may have provided some information that led to this arrest. Also , a family friend of Joran Van Der Sloot was on the radio saying the Joran was a quiet nice boy who liked to go out with friends. The station is holding out hope publicly on the radio that she may be alive.

Let us hope and pray.





#  Checkme on June 17th, 2005 1:23 pm

Connie,
The guy this morning is not Dutch. The guy they brought in last night is. However, it looks like the not-Dutch guy is JvdS’s friend and the Dutch guy is the Kalpoe’s.


# Connie on June 17th, 2005 1:27 pm

I was thinking last night, and I may be reaching a bit. What type of equipment do archiologist use to locate skeletal remains of dinosaurs? Some type of machine that sends echo waves into the earth to determine if there’s something there. I am not quite sure how this equipment works, but that may be something they could use to see if she may have been burried.


# Connie on June 17th, 2005 1:29 pm

Oh, thanks Check, then it is possible that the guy I was this morning was “Freddy” from the pics. I know initials were given, but right off hand I can’t remember what they were. and I’m too lazy to scroll up to see what it was. (lol)


# Jeff Dowder on June 17th, 2005 1:29 pm

Those Kalpoe guys look like those people who work at 7-11’s or indian restaurants.

    The suspects that were called suspects involved with the kidnapping, battering and murder are the ones who went to jail.  The rest are witnesses to information, etc.  Guido and GVC were arrested one month apart the best I can remember and GVC would be no. 5 counting not arresting the Sec. guards.  If the guards were counted it would fall back on Joran.  There is a list on this forum that says the arrests and how and when they were arrested.  That wimp GVC was right in the middle of it and he was NOT home as his parents claim.  That is most likely why the videos disappeared from the casinos, as his dad owns the security business that videos the place.  They lawyered him up so quick and hid him that no one would dare question him again.  They are protecting GVC more than Joran.   Jack b

Jack, where in the quotes you posted is the reference to GVC or did i miss something?

[jackb]

dirty hand is this:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:01 pm
Arawaks often go to play in small houses of Babylon with the offspring of the Elders

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:42 pm
Arawaks hold singing card from babylon
There is also a trio. One Babylonian. 2 Shivas.
Arawaks can’t let babylonian Card sing because hand holding it dirty too.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:22 pm
The babylonians knew it was dangerous to trade among the arawaks

 

It sort of sounds like IF the singing card is a PERSON that he/she is being held by the Arawaks.  Singing card is that a video with sound?  Palus had two cards up his sleeve.
Looks to me like someone is trying to say what happened, but I believe if it was on video or happened in FRONT of the judges (and may have for all we know) there would be no justice there as too many involved who can ruin each other and their children.
The US needs a more active role in dispensing justice in this case, and under the circumstances, it makes me wonder why we do not have that assurance.   Jack b

[jackb]

5th Suspect and Dirty Hand....LOL

I have seen more than my share of theories, but let's look at them...

Dirty Hand possibilities:
Jan van der Straten
Rudy Croes
Ben Vocking
Paulus van der Sloot
Ronny Bernadina
Karen Jansen
I have even seen the SG mentioned as DH and also Nelson Oduber. 

5th Suspect possibilities:
Freddy Abrambatizs
Steve Croes
Lorenzo van Rijn or Gijn
Koen or Sander Gottenbos
Paulus van der Sloot
Geoffrey van Cromvoit
I have even seen Joran, Jaime and Val mentioned.

So there you have it...just a few of the usual suspects.  So which ones fit???  I wish Caps would weigh in with his thoughts too.

Based on times suspects (not witnesses) were arrested, not counting the two black security guards it would have to be GVC, otherwise it would the three original perps, Joran would fall fifth.  There are two fifth suspects, actually and both seem to fill the bill.  Maybe there are supposed to be two fifth suspects.    Jack b

When was GVC arrested? 

april 2006?

 

Yes, I got messes up earlier.  That would put him fifth and his parents alibied him and no doubt had control over the casino videos, etc.  I believe that is why the videos in the casino are missing and they had the means and opportunity to get these and tamper with them.
Jack b

[JE]

from:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/05/23/holloway/index.html

Wever's arrest is the 10th made in connection with the Holloway investigation. All others held, including van der Sloot, have been released

If guido was arrested in may then GVC would be 9th

i need some sleep LOL 

[JE]

arrests:

1.  security guard
2.  security guard
3.  Satish
4.  Deepak
5.  JVDS
6.  Steve Croes
7.  PVDS
8.  Lorenzo??????
9.  GVC
10. Guido

3, 4 and 5: not sure about about who was arrested first or in what order
8:  Not even sure if arrested and when

[jackb]

No way will I ever believe that Paulus was the boyfriend from earlier in the week.  No way no day.  Natalee would not be interrested in him that way.  Not a chance. 

If NH had any dealings with Palus it would be that she would seem him as an older person who befriended her and she trusted him.  In the South most girls seem to trust older people and are nice to them without realizing some older people are extremely dangerous.

GVC would be out and about any and everywhere with his patrol buggies and habits of pidgeonholing girls without them being aware of any danger.  Many of the ISA school kids woud be in school many days of the week and have less chance to encounter during the day.  It is pointing to the LE - security factor in that his father knows what information to destroy, how to alibi and there is VDS and the daughter of Cromvroit who works there.  NH dissed him in his eyes and probably heard she was not loose and maybe even she had not been "around" so to speak.  I think he thought he owned that particular "quail" (in his eyes, quail) and may have used his authority to intervene and finally participate in the "party."  He would be afraid to rave because of his job and may have planted drugs on NH as a rouse to arrest her IF she did not cooperate.  Everywhere I go seems to come back to this young man, Joran, K2, Palus, and Freddy.  Steve Croes was probably involved as a help to means of disposal, etc.  It can go no where else.  We all know, now it is a matter of them doing something about it or our own country doing something about it.  If they do not we need to find out why.    Jack b

[JE]

arrests:

1.  security guard
2.  security guard
3.  Satish
4.  Deepak
5.  JVDS
6.  Steve Croes
7.  PVDS
8.  Lorenzo??????
9.  GVC
10. Guido

3, 4 and 5: not sure about about who was arrested first or in what order
8:  Not even sure if arrested and when

correction

1.  security guard            june 5 2005
2.  security guard            june 5 2005
3.  Satish                       june 9 2005
4.  Deepak                      june 9 2005?
5.  JVDS                        june 9 2005?
6.  Steve Croes               june 17 2005
7.  PVDS                        june 22  2005   
8.  Lorenzo??????
9.  Freddy                      aug 26 2005
10.  GVC                        april 15 2006
11. Guido                       may     2006

[COLOMBO]

No way will I ever believe that Paulus was the boyfriend from earlier in the week.  No way no day.  Natalee would not be interrested in him that way.  Not a chance. 

If NH had any dealings with Palus it would be that she would seem him as an older person who befriended her and she trusted him.  In the South most girls seem to trust older people and are nice to them without realizing some older people are extremely dangerous.

GVC would be out and about any and everywhere with his patrol buggies and habits of pidgeonholing girls without them being aware of any danger.  Many of the ISA school kids woud be in school many days of the week and have less chance to encounter during the day.  It is pointing to the LE - security factor in that his father knows what information to destroy, how to alibi and there is VDS and the daughter of Cromvroit who works there.  NH dissed him in his eyes and probably heard she was not loose and maybe even she had not been "around" so to speak.  I think he thought he owned that particular "quail" (in his eyes, quail) and may have used his authority to intervene and finally participate in the "party."  He would be afraid to rave because of his job and may have planted drugs on NH as a rouse to arrest her IF she did not cooperate.  Everywhere I go seems to come back to this young man, Joran, K2, Palus, and Freddy.  Steve Croes was probably involved as a help to means of disposal, etc.  It can go no where else.  We all know, now it is a matter of them doing something about it or our own country doing something about it.  If they do not we need to find out why.    Jack b

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 10:49 pm
The maze offers many hidden desires
deflowerings of forbidden fruits
DirtyHand knows.
So does the elder.
The lamb is a scapegoat.

[COLOMBO]

Simian said that he makes a living on the island......and he had information on the PVDS interrogations, etc......only referring to him by name after he was relieved and it became apparent that it would get into the media.....so the jealous boyfriend stuff, etc was a way to keep the maze stuff hidden-to preserve babylon.....he actually posted that he knows the babylonians and he shares the concern over wampum

but if a body had been recovered, then there was a cover story, motive, forensics, etc

Shango apparently didn't share this concern

[sirensong]

Wow, this thread is  hopping!

According to the  Kalpoes' "Van der Sloot trusts Freddy with his life."  That certainly sounds like what Joran said about "Daury".  I am convinced Freddy has much to do  with this story.   He threw  Joran to the   wolves by telling about what Joran told him on the 30th, and Joran meekly said Freddy must have misunderstood him, or remembered the date wrong.   No anger, no feelings of betrayal.

Also, Shango had said if Natalee  was not found by a particular day, that she would never be found.  I wonder how he knew this, as it looks like he was right.  Then he says "light the fires" in his postings, and I can't help but wonder if her body was incinerated either at the hospital or in a fire on that holiday that occured around that time that they all burn things. 

Just some random thoughts.

[Lala'sMom]

Wow, this thread is  hopping!

According to the  Kalpoes' "Van der Sloot trusts Freddy with his life."  That certainly sounds like what Joran said about "Daury".  I am convinced Freddy has much to do  with this story.   He threw  Joran to the   wolves by telling about what Joran told him on the 30th, and Joran meekly said Freddy must have misunderstood him, or remembered the date wrong.   No anger, no feelings of betrayal.

Also, Shango had said if Natalee  was not found by a particular day, that she would never be found.  I wonder how he knew this, as it looks like he was right.  Then he says "light the fires" in his postings, and I can't help but wonder if her body was incinerated either at the hospital or in a fire on that holiday that occured around that time that they all burn things. 

Just some random thoughts.

Yes, you are correct!  It looks more everyday that Freddy could be the person that Simian is talking about. Freddy certainly gave more statements than our other "5th" prospects.  There was a good reason for that too...he knew something that ALE either wanted to hide or get to the bottom of at that time.  If you notice even the Kalpoes had a great trust in Freddy...wonder why?

[Tater]

Wow, this thread is  hopping!

According to the  Kalpoes' "Van der Sloot trusts Freddy with his life."  That certainly sounds like what Joran said about "Daury".  I am convinced Freddy has much to do  with this story.   He threw  Joran to the   wolves by telling about what Joran told him on the 30th, and Joran meekly said Freddy must have misunderstood him, or remembered the date wrong.   No anger, no feelings of betrayal.

Also, Shango had said if Natalee  was not found by a particular day, that she would never be found.  I wonder how he knew this, as it looks like he was right.  Then he says "light the fires" in his postings, and I can't help but wonder if her body was incinerated either at the hospital or in a fire on that holiday that occured around that time that they all burn things. 

Just some random thoughts.

Great random thoughts too! I think you are right..She was incinerated or dropped into very deep waters..Freddy seem's to be right up at the front with Polly the perv...

[jackb]

from:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/05/23/holloway/index.html

Wever's arrest is the 10th made in connection with the Holloway investigation. All others held, including van der Sloot, have been released

If guido was arrested in may then GVC would be 9th

i need some sleep LOL 

 

GVC was arrested 5tn not 9th.

[jackb]

But he wasn't arrested until the 22nd or 23rd.

Was Freddy ever arrested?

 

Freddy was not arrested for THIS case but quetioned because he had committed crimes on another minor.  They were supposedly wanting info from him because of his type crimes.   jack b

[jackb]

Remember that when counting suspects the security guards had already been released before Simian made his pronouncement on June 22nd. Therefore you would not count them in the mix. That leaves:

Deepak
Satish
Joran
Steve
And whoever that person was that was arrested right after Steve Croes.

 There is a person, we just do not know who it was.  Mum thinks it was Freddy, I think it was Lorenzo.  Why? Because we find evidence that these two were questioned somewhere along this time line and before Paulus was arrested on the 22 or 23rd.  Some have said Lorenzo was questioned on the 16th...that is after the guards were released and before Paulus was arrested and if true...right before Simian began posting...Freddy also fits in this same scenario too...much more  indication that he was questioned as a possible suspect before Lorenzo.  The rumor on the blogs and on Aruba, as relayed by various posters there, was it was Lorenzo....but I have nothing to prove that as of yet.  I welcome evidence to the contrary....I would like to eliminate one or both of these two if I could.

The first time paulus was brought in for a 4 hour interrogation was on saturday june 18th (he was running from reporters when leaving the police station)

 

Steve Croes was not arrested as a suspect in the murder and kidnapping more on the line of what we would call material witness.  He told a lie about the HI dropping off and they arrested him to get info, not as a suspect.   jack b

[jackb]

arrests:

1.  security guard 2.  security guard
3.  Satish
4.  Deepak
5.  JVDS
6.  Steve Croes
7.  PVDS
8.  Lorenzo??????
9.  GVC
10. Guido

3, 4 and 5: not sure about about who was arrested first or in what order
8:  Not even sure if arrested and when

correction

1.  security guard            june 5 2005
2.  security guard            june 5 2005
3.  Satish                       june 9 2005
4.  Deepak                      june 9 2005?
5.  JVDS                        june 9 2005?
6.  Steve Croes               june 17 2005
7.  PVDS                        june 22  2005   
8.  Lorenzo??????
9.  Freddy                      aug 26 2005
10.  GVC                        april 15 2006
11. Guido                       may     2006

 

satish
depak
jvds
pvds
GVC
Guido

Seem to be all (besides the security guards) who were arrested for the kidnapping, murder, battery, etc. of NH.  Counting the SGuards it would fall back on Joran, not counting them would fall on GVC.  There are two 5th suspects and both are equally guilty most likely.  PVS may have had GVC to get rid of her because she would sing (talk) and VDS was helping cover this up.  Some, if not all of the others most likely took part in other crimes against NH,  including filming, not helping her while she was being abused or whatever.   Jack blue

[Lala'sMom]

But he wasn't arrested until the 22nd or 23rd.

Was Freddy ever arrested?

 

Freddy was not arrested for THIS case but quetioned because he had committed crimes on another minor.  They were supposedly wanting info from him because of his type crimes.   jack b

I understand that...but someone was arrested right after Steve Croes...within 12 hours of each other...that is what needs to be determined...who was that person?  Find that out and you have Simian's 5th suspect.

[Lala'sMom]

But he wasn't arrested until the 22nd or 23rd.

Was Freddy ever arrested?

 

Freddy was not arrested for THIS case but quetioned because he had committed crimes on another minor.  They were supposedly wanting info from him because of his type crimes.   jack b

Let me try this again...hey Red...I need my own edit button...yes...I do! LOL Sorry for messing that quote up...Gosh!!

I understand that...but someone was arrested right after Steve Croes...within 12 hours of each other...that is what needs to be determined...who was that person?  Find that out and you have Simian's 5th suspect.

[truthseeker2]

I have a question for all those who have worked so hard to decipher the Simian posts.  If we feel pretty confident the Simian's info came from ALE should we trust anything he/she posted that wasn't verified by the press releases?  I mean, I never felt like ALE was very upfront about anything.  Would it make sense for someone connected to ALE to give out this kind of info when everyone knew about the blogs and ALE could read them as well?

I'm just asking because at one point this thing about the fifth suspect would seem to be about whoever ALE wanted to be guilty, but could never prove it.  After that they went on to arrest many others that were never held for very long.  If ALE was seriously trying to prove that the "5th" suspect was guilty they didn't seem to be doing much to keep him locked up.

Sorry, I don't mean to offend anyone, but this thought has been nagging at me for a while now.

[COLOMBO]

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:26 pm
Simian, his lordship did not bring the expected key
the door never existed
Eden is distant

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:33 pm
Simian, His Lordship did not bring the key found in the car, it did not exist
The arawaks can’t open the door
Hope lies with the cowbous,
but the posse was too late
Eden is still distant

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:12 pm
Cowboys must behave in Indian territory
The arawaks need pemmican, they have been without wampum, 1 Moon
The Arawaks keep the singing card
One singing Babylonian and two Hindu chanters are enough
His lordships presence guarantees a trio
The key to edens door did not exist
The refrain has already begun

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:22 pm
The babylonians knew it was dangerous to trade among the arawaks
The way is clouded for the sacrifice
Rules have changed, so has the maze
the way is lost for the pioneers who went to live among the indians
The flames are growing
A sacrifice will be made to spare the police;
to spare the teepees
Singing cards have lost their power
Arawaks worried about being caught with dirty hand
His lordship will bestow the title soon….
They will save the teepees and the palace,
but first
The Sacrifice

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:43 pm
Meetings with his lordship will reveal several mysteries
the sacrifice also knows the fires have been lit

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 6:13 pm
His lordship did not bring the key, it does not exist.
doors to eden remain closed.
The arawaks hold the singing cards. They have the babylonian and 2 shivas. But the other card is dirty.
Even if you play cards in the house of babylon as an arawak, you still have DirtyHand.
If DirtyHand comes out of hiding, Babylon will fall and the cowboys will circle the wagons.
DirtyHand can destroy the Arawaks and Babylon.
Better to prepare the sacrifice quickly so the cowboys go home
….without the loot

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:32 pm
His lordship is there to preserve babylon
not the elder
remember dirtyhand!

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:34 pm
the struggle between the babylonians and the arawaks still remains hidden
the arawaks awaited the key
his lordship said no
the door to eden remains closed
they are preparing the fire

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:56 pm
The Simian knows his Lordship did not have a key to open the door to eden
the answer lies with the Arawak Nation


Any ideas on who 'his Lordship' is?

Oduber
Rudy Croes
The Govenor General

http://scaredmonkeys.com/index.php?s=posner+video

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:32 pm
His lordship is there to preserve babylon
not the elder
remember dirtyhand!