Lively Case Discussion #510 8/11 - 8/12/2006

[klaasend]

You all know the rules

[San]

I didn't think you were sleeping on the job because you never sleep

[klaasend]

 Contrary to popular belief, I probably get more sleep than alot of you  

After I wake up this morning I'm going to try to get some REAL work done.  ha ha

[Atlmetroguy]

Klaas - I'm looking at the cell records now...can you e-mail me the highest resolution map of Aruba you have? File size does not matter...my e-mail addy is my name at yah**

TIA

[klaasend]

Klaas - I'm looking at the cell records now...can you e-mail me the highest resolution map of Aruba you have? File size does not matter...my e-mail addy is my name at yah**

TIA

I'll see what I can find

[SunFreak2]

Paulus and Anita's judgment may never come in this life time but there is a big roaring fire in Hell for both of them.  They have neglected and abused their children to the point that they are predators and alcoholics.  These two younder children should be removed from their custody and the two of them imprisoned.

I agree with this.  It is sad that it appears Paulus and Anita won't be held accountable in this life time.  But I am a firm believer that you reap what you sow.

Let's remember that Paulus was gone from ARuba with his Judge training for a year. Joran would have been 16 and Val 13.  A fine time for teenage boys to be without their Father's influence.  Of course Joran claims that it was Anita who meted out the discipline (what discipline?) such as curfews, permission to go places, etc.  Most likely she couldn't control the boys or just didn't care.  She probably knew Paulus's proclivities and turned a blind eye, especially when Paulus was in the NL studying. It's no wonder that Paulus was bounced out of the program.  Maybe Paulus likes young boys as well as young girls and brings them home to share with Anita?         Joran sure looks like he would swing both ways.  Perhaps that is what some of his rage is over.

[flyingmermaid]

Metro everybody is hoping that you can make sense of the cell calls map!

[SunFreak2]

CHECK THIS OUT!!!      

LETTER TO THE EDITOR
Some Holloway hoaxsters unravelled
Friday, August 11, 2006

Dear Sir:


Thank you for your recent coverage of the two recent court decisions, one awarding damages to Mr Paulus van der Sloot for unwarranted detention, and another dismissing a Holloway-family suit initiated in New York State against Paulus and Joran van der Sloot, which sought monetary damages for the vanishing of the missing Natalee Holloway.

The internet and entertainment news media fueled a frenzy of sensationalism which spawned many anti-Dutch, anti-Aruba, anti-van der Sloot websites and eventually culminated in some US states' governments declaring a boycott against travel to the sovereign country of Aruba.

One website, which counts among its contributors two individuals who have written hundreds and hundreds of defamatory anti-Aruba and anti-Dutch articles on its site and on various anti-Dutch, anti-Aruba hate sites, recently offered up its contributors' posting records for review and analysis.

This review proved conclusively that a small cadre of Internet posters, sending messages from a select number of unique and readily identifiable Internet Protocol addresses, used a plethora of log-in names from intercheangable locations to flood that website with defamatory misinformation.

There is no reason to believe that this is unique to this one website; individual posters on other Holloway-related sites have posted as many as 8,000 messages since the last weeks of March, 2006, and writing styles and content, easily recognizable, suggest that there is a contingent of posters who seemingly spend their days, almost full-time, filling the Internet with messages designed to keep the interest alive and the traffic to various sites up.

What has been done to analyze the postings to this one website should be done by them all: follow the boiler room-type posters and you'll follow the money, and likely solve the mystery of the without-a-trace vanishing in the process.

Dayo Gould
Vancouver, BC

http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/cgi-script/csArticles/articles/000027/002733.htm

[Frijole]

CHECK THIS OUT!!!      

LETTER TO THE EDITOR
Some Holloway hoaxsters unravelled
Friday, August 11, 2006

Dear Sir:


Thank you for your recent coverage of the two recent court decisions, one awarding damages to Mr Paulus van der Sloot for unwarranted detention, and another dismissing a Holloway-family suit initiated in New York State against Paulus and Joran van der Sloot, which sought monetary damages for the vanishing of the missing Natalee Holloway.

The internet and entertainment news media fueled a frenzy of sensationalism which spawned many anti-Dutch, anti-Aruba, anti-van der Sloot websites and eventually culminated in some US states' governments declaring a boycott against travel to the sovereign country of Aruba.

One website, which counts among its contributors two individuals who have written hundreds and hundreds of defamatory anti-Aruba and anti-Dutch articles on its site and on various anti-Dutch, anti-Aruba hate sites, recently offered up its contributors' posting records for review and analysis.

This review proved conclusively that a small cadre of Internet posters, sending messages from a select number of unique and readily identifiable Internet Protocol addresses, used a plethora of log-in names from intercheangable locations to flood that website with defamatory misinformation.

There is no reason to believe that this is unique to this one website; individual posters on other Holloway-related sites have posted as many as 8,000 messages since the last weeks of March, 2006, and writing styles and content, easily recognizable, suggest that there is a contingent of posters who seemingly spend their days, almost full-time, filling the Internet with messages designed to keep the interest alive and the traffic to various sites up.

What has been done to analyze the postings to this one website should be done by them all: follow the boiler room-type posters and you'll follow the money, and likely solve the mystery of the without-a-trace vanishing in the process.

Dayo Gould
Vancouver, BC

http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/cgi-script/csArticles/articles/000027/002733.htm

That's funny.  Maybe we should start forwarding all of the witness statements to the Caribbean net news for them to decide who is telling the truth and who is lying???

 

[klaasend]

Klaas - I'm looking at the cell records now...can you e-mail me the highest resolution map of Aruba you have? File size does not matter...my e-mail addy is my name at yah**

TIA

Metro - I just emailed you 2.  I have another that may help but I have to search for it.

[sharon]

Yayyyy!

Almetroguy to the rescue


Tylergal & San (from last thread)...

I think that's the part that I couldn't grasp -- why I couldn't accept that this has been done before..

I agree with you San -- I think if it were my daughter (I don't have any children) the boy would be fish food, if I had to spend the rest of my life in jail

Although I was severely put down for that position on a different site (the daughter had enough trauma, wouldn't want to subject them to more, need to protect them, what do I know I don't have children) I still feel that way.

Why aren't the parents of these girls yelling louder? How can they perpetuate the shame by not helping thier children learn that one way to NOT be a victim is to fight back.

How do they expect their daughters to 'heal' and regain 'esteem' if they perpetuate the shame

If this is the majority opinion of Aruban parents -- it's no woner the PIMP thing is going strong. And you're right -- probably started a long, long time ago

[SunFreak2]

After reading these statements and seeing what and who was on the computer, it is obvious this family is nothing but a bunch of perverts and liars, and Paulus is the perpetrator.

We should have guessed that long ago when he was so quick to summon the Kalpoes to his house and set them up. Kalpoes need to tell the truth and so does Freddy. They all know it was Paulus. Who was it that Paulus called to help him.

He did make a call early morning to Steve Croes. Was Steve Croes the bifron? What is Steve Croes' uncle's name?

Rufo Solognier, retired Aruban "police" officer, uncle to Steve Croes, and his next-door neighbor,

[Atlmetroguy]

Klaas - I'm looking at the cell records now...can you e-mail me the highest resolution map of Aruba you have? File size does not matter...my e-mail addy is my name at yah**

TIA

Metro - I just emailed you 2.  I have another that may help but I have to search for it.

*************************
Thanks Klaas....got it...looking at them now..

[the big hammer]

Oh My!  Look At All Those Statements!

It's gonna take some time to explore these latest ones.  ANd from reading last nite's thread, it looks like I'll need some disinfectant to work through this depravity.

But I sense the lid being ripped off something.  And while Aruba may now attempt to close case, it may another attempt that fails.  With some of these revelations -- and startling new FACTS, it seems increasingly strange that "someone" was successfully charged and prosecuted in this case.

I noticed from last nite's thread that Tylergal seems pretty strong that paulus was directly involved in assault / murder of Natalee.

Was wondering if anyone could summarize what she sees that brings her to that conclusion.

While there is now so much new material to wade through, I did want to offer a pov I had formed from study of Kalpoe statements of 6/16 and prior.

Increasingly, I believe Natalee was drugged at C&C.  And base this on the timing of deepak's bathroom break at C&C and satish's well timed receipt of vibrating call from his brother while he was standing next to goon and Natalee.  Satish receives the call just as jvds and Natalee go to "take a shot".  And deepak is conveniently absent from the shot taking scene.  Based on their need to distance themselves from this important event at C&C that nite, it's almost certain, imo, that Natalee was drugged there.  This further informs the need for for jvds to tell deppak upon arrival to car to "drive around" to allow for effects of drug to take hold.  Further, they may have fed her additional dosages somewhere along the way.  And I think it explains their descriptions of Natalee as alternately falling asleep and waking, etc.

Based on above, and imo, I also think it's safe to conclude that significant portions of the beach story as related by K2 are false.

[Tylergal]

CHECK THIS OUT!!!      

LETTER TO THE EDITOR
Some Holloway hoaxsters unravelled
Friday, August 11, 2006

Dear Sir:


Thank you for your recent coverage of the two recent court decisions, one awarding damages to Mr Paulus van der Sloot for unwarranted detention, and another dismissing a Holloway-family suit initiated in New York State against Paulus and Joran van der Sloot, which sought monetary damages for the vanishing of the missing Natalee Holloway.

The internet and entertainment news media fueled a frenzy of sensationalism which spawned many anti-Dutch, anti-Aruba, anti-van der Sloot websites and eventually culminated in some US states' governments declaring a boycott against travel to the sovereign country of Aruba.

One website, which counts among its contributors two individuals who have written hundreds and hundreds of defamatory anti-Aruba and anti-Dutch articles on its site and on various anti-Dutch, anti-Aruba hate sites, recently offered up its contributors' posting records for review and analysis.

This review proved conclusively that a small cadre of Internet posters, sending messages from a select number of unique and readily identifiable Internet Protocol addresses, used a plethora of log-in names from intercheangable locations to flood that website with defamatory misinformation.

There is no reason to believe that this is unique to this one website; individual posters on other Holloway-related sites have posted as many as 8,000 messages since the last weeks of March, 2006, and writing styles and content, easily recognizable, suggest that there is a contingent of posters who seemingly spend their days, almost full-time, filling the Internet with messages designed to keep the interest alive and the traffic to various sites up.

What has been done to analyze the postings to this one website should be done by them all: follow the boiler room-type posters and you'll follow the money, and likely solve the mystery of the without-a-trace vanishing in the process.

Dayo Gould
Vancouver, BC

http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/cgi-script/csArticles/articles/000027/002733.htm

That's funny.  Maybe we should start forwarding all of the witness statements to the Caribbean net news for them to decide who is telling the truth and who is lying???

 

Dayo Gould is someone who is dangerous and you do not want to mess with him.  His financial interests in Aruba are wide and sinking as fast as Anita's chest.

[klaasend]

I think Dayo Gould has a split personality, one minute he's accusing Medleyrelay of being Natalee Holloway and having multiple nicknames and locations on boards and now he's accusing the family friendly sites.  

[San]

Oh My!  Look At All Those Statements!

It's gonna take some time to explore these latest ones.  ANd from reading last nite's thread, it looks like I'll need some disinfectant to work through this depravity.

But I sense the lid being ripped off something.  And while Aruba may now attempt to close case, it may another attempt that fails.  With some of these revelations -- and startling new FACTS, it seems increasingly strange that "someone" was successfully charged and prosecuted in this case.

I noticed from last nite's thread that Tylergal seems pretty strong that paulus was directly involved in assault / murder of Natalee.

Was wondering if anyone could summarize what she sees that brings her to that conclusion.

While there is now so much new material to wade through, I did want to offer a pov I had formed from study of Kalpoe statements of 6/16 and prior.

Increasingly, I believe Natalee was drugged at C&C.  And base this on the timing of deepak's bathroom break at C&C and satish's well timed receipt of vibrating call from his brother while he was standing next to goon and Natalee.  Satish receives the call just as jvds and Natalee go to "take a shot".  And deepak is conveniently absent from the shot taking scene.  Based on their need to distance themselves from this important event at C&C that nite, it's almost certain, imo, that Natalee was drugged there.  This further informs the need for for jvds to tell deppak upon arrival to car to "drive around" to allow for effects of drug to take hold.  Further, they may have fed her additional dosages somewhere along the way.  And I think it explains their descriptions of Natalee as alternately falling asleep and waking, etc.

Based on above, and imo, I also think it's safe to conclude that significant portions of the beach story as related by K2 are false.

FROM JORAN'S STATEMENT:

When we arrived at my appartement the 4 of us went inside the appartement. Chato had a hip flask containing whiskey. Chato and Karen drank from the contents. I have to say that I am not sure any more if "Freddy ZEDAN" or "Fernando VIANA" was in the appartement with us.

San wrote:

I agree that they kept on drugging Natalee.  Natalee was not in her right mind when they gave her the first drug.  It is easy to continue drugging her from there.

I believe Chato had a lot more than whiskey in that flask.

[Atlmetroguy]

Cell Phone Records

Ok..I have reviewed the "cell phone records" and strictly in my opinion this information is very very thin and there is not enough detail which should have been available. My basis for saying this is simply this:

A. The cell site id's are the numbers for the actual cell sites ie. site at H.I. is 9123 which only identifies the cell site in the network.

B. In GSM, TDMA and analog networks the network uses a "re-use" scheme to handle call traffic on the cell sites which is why you see some of the cell_id's listed multiple times. All the sites are on different frequencies thus the need for "re-use" to handle the traffic. Also it is important to note that these air interface technologies are narrowband meaning there will be multiple frequencies. Also each site has the antennas called alpha, beta and gamma.

C. The level of call detail that should have been available would show which site and specifically which antenna on the site would have handled the call and there should have been network messaging that would show where the network would direct the call next based on which way the mobile (JVDS's mobile) was traveling. Additionally, the call detail would have shown with date/time stamps call origination, each hand-over to each site(establishing direction the mobile was moving) and when the call ended. The call detail would also show (obivously) who originated the call and who received the call. Based on my research I cannot tell if Setar uses the GPS capability availability in most mobiles.

So..again in my opinion in the context of the evening in question this data only shows that JVDS was in the area around 7:25PM for a total of 2 minutes and 28 seconds and that he called Deepak at work. Based on the timeline sticky thread it appears that JVDS entered the casino at the H.I. around 7:51PM

In terms of technical relavance..theres not too much to work with. In terms of establishing JVDS location on the evening in question I believe it does establish he was in the area.

**Disclaimer - this is all strictly opinion based on my experience only and should be taken within the context offered.

[Peaches]

So if I am reading what Metro just opined concerning cell phone records, there would be more information if somebody had asked for it?  Or there is more info out there?  

I would hope there is more detail out there and I bet there is.  Does someone already have the info?  Are they going to do anything with it?

[Atlmetroguy]

So if I am reading what Metro just opined concerning cell phone records, there would be more information if somebody had asked for it?  Or there is more info out there?  

I would hope there is more detail out there and I bet there is.  Does someone already have the info?  Are they going to do anything with it?

*****************************
Peaches...there maybe or maybe not more information available. It would depend on what the service provider captures and retains. I think what is relavant is that this information while thin establishes that JVDS in the area at the time stated. Now..what was he doing in the area? I don't know but I think it's interesting that the time line states he and PVDS are seen entering the H.I. casino at 7:51PM and that the call he did make was to Deepak...were they planning the evening? Were they talking soccer? Who knows..