Lively Case Discussion #510 8/11 - 8/12/2006

[Anna]

Was the bloody mattress one from Joran's apartment? The one with dog blood and does not Joran refer to women as dogs?

Valid question.

I am not sure to whom Joran was referring as "dogs" for I do not believe the Kelpoes have dogs and roosters both.  First we have heard of canines in that household.

And whatever Joran meant by it, it is apparent that Uncle Jan approves of this term as well for he gave no clarification and seemed just AOK with it therefore I conclude that if Joran refers to women/girls as dogs, so does Uncle Jan.  Perhaps it was even Uncle Jan who used the term since he is dictating the "report" or whatever you would call his attempt at protecting his best friend's son.

.

[Nut44x4]

Joran may be a tad obsessed with oral sex, in my opinion...but we still seek answers in the case of Natalee. There is a lot to swallow here as we move forward. I am enjoying all I read on bfn and sm in the case. Bring it on.....let's see more.

[klaasend]

Electronic record timeline for May 30:

Joran calls Deepak.

3.07 am: Val on computer

3:15 am: Joran sends Deepak text messge from his cell phone.  Message says: Hey Swa I am home now, I will see you tomorrow (stated by polis in Joran 6/14 statement)

?? am:  Deepak sends message to Joran.  Message says: OK (stated by polis in Joran 6/14 statement)  

3:25 am: Deepak sends message to Joran.  Message says: Are you there?

3:25 am: Deepak sends message to Joran.  Message says: Anyways nice to hear you are home I will talk to you tomorrow I am going to bed

3:25 am: Deepak sends message to Joran.  Message says: Take care

3:33 am: Joran sends IM to Deepak.  Message says: Hey swa

3:35 am: Joran sends IM to Deepak. Message says: topa/loca pimp heehehe

3:35 am: Joran visits hotmail

3:40-3:45 am: Joran visits four soccer-related sites

3:46 am: Joran visits porn site

3:56 pm: Joran vists porn site, downloads two porn movies

4:30 am: Joran visits hotmail

5:50 am: Something about Anita and outlook express/e-mail

7:02 am: Paulus visits hotmail

7:34-7:37 pm: Paulus vists several stock-related sites

7:37 pm: Paulus googles "alcohol", beer", and "drugs".  Visits sites containing information on alcohol and drugs, the dangers of these for young people, and a lawyer's office.  The sites are visited only briefly.

9:18 pm: VDS computer infected with virus

----------------------------------------------------


What is the 5:50 record with Anita about, she was not home

Good question, do they all share accounts?  Makes you wonder if Valentijn signed on at all.

[Tylergal]

Wanna guess where I'll be tomorrow!

Go buy your raffle ticket!!

WIN A 2007 HARLEY DAVIDSON Softail Standard! (click here for flyer, details & restrictions)  The Hou-Tex HOG Chapter #5075 will raffle off a 2007 Harley Davidson Softail Standard at the “HOGS & Horses” Fundraiser being held on Saturday, August 12, 2006 for Texas EquuSearch at the Pasadena Rodeo & Fairgrounds, 7601 Red Bluff, Pasadena, TX, 11am – 6pm. Only 1500 raffle tickets printed! Click here if you’d like to pay using a credit card. Please fax a copy of your receipt along with your name, address & phone number to Fax #281/534-6719 by 8/10/06.
read more >>
http://www.texasequusearch.org/

Very cool Sunny - take lots of pictures!

Yes, and give our regards.

[flyingmermaid]

I know that it is going to be unpopular opinion around here but I think most teens this age are experimenting with sex - remember the bases? (1st Base)

Nonetheless - they make me ill!  Just the glib way that they answer the questions?

It's the calousness that gets to me.

 

[Anna]

Wanna guess where I'll be tomorrow!

Go buy your raffle ticket!!

WIN A 2007 HARLEY DAVIDSON Softail Standard! (click here for flyer, details & restrictions)  The Hou-Tex HOG Chapter #5075 will raffle off a 2007 Harley Davidson Softail Standard at the “HOGS & Horses” Fundraiser being held on Saturday, August 12, 2006 for Texas EquuSearch at the Pasadena Rodeo & Fairgrounds, 7601 Red Bluff, Pasadena, TX, 11am – 6pm. Only 1500 raffle tickets printed! Click here if you’d like to pay using a credit card. Please fax a copy of your receipt along with your name, address & phone number to Fax #281/534-6719 by 8/10/06.
read more >>
http://www.texasequusearch.org/

Very cool Sunny - take lots of pictures!

I am a little disappointed NOMAD's great post to raise money just by searching didn't get a more positive response.

MONKEYS!!  PLEASE USE THAT SEARCH ENGINE TO RAISE MONEY FOR TES!!  


And Sunny may can even let them know to expect it if Nomad did't already tell them she put them as her charity

[Kimmy53]

Jaime's Statement:

 I at least did not call Joran because I had no money/minutes left on my pre-paid phone so I couldn't call him.

Deepak:

 I had almot no more minutes on my pre-paid phone so I called him in a way that produces what in English is called a “miss call”. After that my brother phoned me back, I asked him where they were and he said they were still inside and that he would come.

There are other references to Deepak having no more minutes.  WHY is this such an important thing to keep on emphasizing?

[Atlmetroguy]

Jaime's Statement:

 I at least did not call Joran because I had no money/minutes left on my pre-paid phone so I couldn't call him.

Deepak:

 I had almot no more minutes on my pre-paid phone so I called him in a way that produces what in English is called a “miss call”. After that my brother phoned me back, I asked him where they were and he said they were still inside and that he would come.

There are other references to Deepak having no more minutes.  WHY is this such an important thing to keep on emphasizing?

*****************************
The bolded statement is an absolute lie...when I pre-paid cell phone is out of minutes the only call it will place is an emergency call like 911

[Jacqueline]

I know that it is going to be unpopular opinion around here but I think most teens this age are experimenting with sex - remember the bases? (1st Base)

He's rounding first and really turning it on
now, he's not letting up at all, he's gonna
try for second; the ball is bobbled out in center,
and here comes the throw, and what a throw!
He's gonna slide in head first, here he comes, he's out!
No, wait, safe--safe at second base, this kid really
makes things happen out there.

Paradise by the dashboard light...

Seemed more innocenct back then......

[mishy]

Joran may be a tad obsessed with oral sex, in my opinion...but we still seek answers in the case of Natalee. There is a lot to swallow here as we move forward. I am enjoying all I read on bfn and sm in the case. Bring it on.....let's see more.

Joran obsessed with oral sex b/c he has no interest or inclination to satisfy his partner. It's only about his gratification...He's a self-centered, pschopathic, habitual liar with a narcissitic grandeur regarding his intellect. Swallow that, Jackass, errrr, I mean Joran...    

[Anna]

.
I thought the Dutch, only under pressure from International NGO's, raised the age of consent to 16?  Is this not correct?  Many of these PIMPS are not minors and even should these very young girls be consenting if you can call somebody stoned out of their gord consenting, should still be illegal.

If a seven years old gives consent, does that make it OK?  Willing is not a factor in much of this activity by such people as Freddie, Jamie, Deepak and all the older ones IF in fact there is participation in these druggings and rapings.

In any event, a person too incapicitated to give consent is just that and even if they say yes, it does not count for they may change their mind when they sober up and this is how laws are written and for a very good reason.

If you search "gang rapes" and under Johns Hopkins there is interesting information that it is often a homosexual urge to have sex with other males and this is the closest thing they can get to it and still deny their homosexuality and stop short of a sexual encounter with a male.

In any event, it is not the behavior of real well-adjusted males who are secure in their own masculinity and is more an expression of suppressed hatred of women, etc.

Just my thoughts on the matter but you can find all kinds of information on this kind of behavior as it is sadly becoming more common.

.

[Kimmy53]

Joran may be a tad obsessed with oral sex, in my opinion...but we still seek answers in the case of Natalee. There is a lot to swallow here as we move forward. I am enjoying all I read on bfn and sm in the case. Bring it on.....let's see more.

Joran obsessed with oral sex b/c he has no interest or inclination to satisfy his partner. It's only about his gratification...He's a self-centered, pschopathic, habitual liar with a narcissitic grandeur regarding his intellect. Swallow that, Jackass, errrr, I mean Joran...    

My vote for post of the day!

[Atlmetroguy]

You know, I'm laughing at the Refugees and other sites that are complaining about my "rough" translations of the cell and computer records.  

Most of the information for both of those records was technical.  The idea was to get the documents posted.   Some of it needs no translation at all like the times and websites visited.  

If they don't like my rough translations they can translate themselves  

*****************************
I guess they will have a blast with my analysis of the cell phone data....

[Anna]

O/T  O/T   O/T   O/T

I know this belongs on the Political Thread and will put it there this evening but I just wanted to give a heads up on this breaking news. . .
And I have to leave right now for appointment.
,
I just heard a bit ago on Fox news that Israel's plan to get their troops north to a certain river in Lebanon was to airlift them by helicopter to get them in behind the Hezbollah.      

This was announced BEFORE any resolution has been signed and there is absolutely no assurance of the Hezbollah leaders accepting anything.

What are they thinking!!!!  Nothing like giving away the plans just in case they are needed later.  The entire coverage of this is skewed to make Israel look like the school yard bully that it is making me ill.

Between this and the airline hijackers and these thugs that have become National Folk Heros in Aruba, I am just beside myself.

This appointment will be good to get my mind off all this for a bit.

Be back when I can later. . . . . .

[KatzHome]

A Great Way to HELP TES [/color]

I came across this seach engine....it DONATES to your favorite charity much the way goodle ads work each time you use it.  I entered TES as a charity (it previously was not listed) and received an e-mail back that TES will be active as a charity tomorrow.

                            http://www.goodsearch.com

So....if each of us uses it as a search engine, and we spread the word, TES will receive money!  I think it's a great idea, and hope you do, too!

<snip>

Just go to www.goodsearch.com and be sure to enter (my charity) as the charity you want to support.  Just 500 of us searching four times a day will raise about $7300 in a year without anyone spending a dime!  And, be sure to spread the word!

 

   2. Put a logo and link to GoodSearch on your website

      http://www.goodsearch.com/Logo.aspx

 

   3. Encourage everyone you know to download the GoodSearch toolbar.

http://www.goodsearch.com/toolbar/

 

   4. Make GoodSearch the homepage on all of the computers in your company or school.

http://www.goodsearch.com/MakeHomepage.aspx

   
<snip>

What a great find!!!!!!  This is wonderful!

Okies ~ the email that received says "tomorrow" TES will be activated...  

What do we type in for TexasEquusearch to be credited?  I hope you put TES or something easy...  

I just tried putting TES in and verifying it ~ nope ~ got this notice:

No charities could be found. Try another search or click here to add a charity to our list.

Hi KatzHome! This truly is a great idea. To answer your question, I entered TES as the charity.     It will not be activated as a charity until tomorrow, so tomorrow when using it just enter "TES" in the "I'm Supporting" space.  It should then start generating dollars for TES. I hope others here use it.  You and Anna were the only ones to respond.

And thank you for answering my question!  I'll be sure to spread the word about this...

[Frijole]

Looks like Jossy has an editorial today regarding the case.  Hopefully Sandy Leiva or Whytegirl will stop in and take a stab at translating:
http://www.diarioaruba.com/diabierna/editorial/

E Caso di Natalee y pueblo Arubiano

   Mi a yega di bisa den hopi ocasion cu na Aruba, Pueblo hopi biaha no ta ser tuma debidamente na cuenta door di autoridad nan, y cosnan cu ta mishi cune directamente, cu su bienestar, e solidez di su economia, su bon nomber como Pueblo hospitalario, ta ser pusha den un skina y dera di tal forma cu e no ta haya sa di dje. E no ta ser haci pa su defensa, sino pa cumpli cu reglanan cu no ta sirbie pasobra nan ta mantene ignorante di loke ta pasando.

   Na DIARIO basta aña pasa nos a tuma e decision di no sconde nada pa Pueblo, di no warda nan den cashi pa despues bente den e pos di olvido. Tur loke nos haya sa nos ta pasa directamente pa Pueblo, pa e ta na altura di loke ta pasa riba su isla.  E caso di Natalee no ta un excepcion, sino e confirmacion cu nos no ta bay tene nada den secreto, y loke cay den nos mannan, nos ta pasa di biaha pa Pueblo, pa e tambe tin e ultimo noticianan pa e por huzga loke a pasa den e caso.

   Ayera nos a publica e transcripcion di e un combersacion cu polis a graba den un auto di polis cu tabata treciendo e tres sospechosonan (Joran, Deepak y Satish) di KIA pa Corte di Husticia, tanto na Hulandes como na Papiamento. E ta un documento hopi revelador di e caracter di e tres sospechosonan, nan manera di papia, nan formulacion di frasenan y nan violencia.

   For di e transcripcion ey nos a haya sa for di boca di Joran cu su tata ta esun cu a pone abogado pa e Kalpoenan; cu Deepak nos a tende cu e ta adverti Joran cu si nan haya e mucha muher cadaver of cualke resto di dje, Joran lo bay cera 15 aña; cu Joran nos a scucha e menaza cu si rumannan Kalpoe papia cu Polis e lo conta nan cu Satish a dal un mucha muher cu auto; en fin, acusacion y contra-acusacion, pero tur basa riba un conocimento categorico cu tur tres tin di loke a pasa cu Natalee. Di esey no tin duda. E ta sali claramente pa dilahti den e transcripcion di e grabacion riba audio-tape.

   E abogado di Joran ta blo ta bati boca na Merca comosifuera e ta un gran Mesias cu sa tur cos; un di su coleganan a acusami di a "leak" e documento, siendo cu ta te antayera nos a haye den nos postbus, despues cu tur e canalnan Americano tabata tine caba y tabata te hasta pasando pida pida di dje; Tacopina ta pinta Joran manera un angel cu halanan di pureza; cu e ta un bon studiante; cu e tin un beca; enfin, cu tur loke e falta pa bula yega cielo ta halanan di sneu. Sin embargo evidencianan recopila pa DIARIO ta pinta un Joran completamente diferente; un hoben

violento; abusador cu muchanan mas chikito na su school (y na su cas!); un hoben sin control cu a mete cu placa di otronan indebidamente; un hoben sin educacion den su forma di papia; un instinto criminal cu el a exhibi den e transcripcion otra cu den momentonan di rabia e kier kibra smul y te hasta a bay asina leu di menaza di mata e dos rumannan Kalpoe; enfin, un potret

completamente diferente di esun di Tacopina.

   Cu ami a revela e nomber di Geoffrey? Si, pasobra esey no ta nada particular. Ningun   momento y ningun caminda a acusa e mucha di a comete cualke infraccion contra Ley; loke nos re-porteronan a haci ta busca su identidad pa nos sa ta di kende nos ta papiando. Hopi hende a puntrami kico mi opinion ta di dje, si e porta meti den e caso. Mi contesta tabata negativo, pasobra mi no ta kere cu e ta meti directamente den e desaparicion di Natalee. Loke si mi ta kere ta cu e por a conta polis o fiscal cu el a mira tal y tal cos, of a scucha tal y tal cos, of tin un video saca e dianan di e desaparicion di Natalee cu por tin imagennan revelador riba dje. Esey mi ta kere ta posible, pero no cu e ta un participante den e desaparicion mes. Mi por ta completamente

ekiboca, pero esey ta loke mi ta pensa.

  Ami no ta kita mi wowonan for di e tres sospechosonan, Joran, Deepak y Satish, pasobra nan a demostra den e grabacion cu nan ta completamente al tanto di loke a pasa e mucha muher.

Ademas, un ta acusa otro (entre Joran y e rumannan Kalpoe) di un castigo di 15 aña (Deepak contra Joran) si haya e mucha muher, y e trapamento di un mucha muher cu auto (Joran contra

Satish)..

    Nos tarea como medio di comunicacion ta pa keda al tanto di tur e desaroyonan entorno di e caso y pasa cualke informacion cu nos haya pa Pueblo, pasobra den nos criterio, e tin derecho

ariba tur informacion di loke ta pasa riba su isla. Cu polls of fiscal no kier siek ningun informacion ta nan bon derecho, pero esey no ta conta pa DiARIO!

Klaas - I speak enough spanish to get general gist within some Papamiento articles... I read this and to me it looks identical to the one we just read the other day where Jossy talks about why he published the conversation inthe polis car and Joe Tacopinos' false claims of innocence on the US  media etc... nothing new that I spotted. fyi

[Ono]

You know, I'm laughing at the Refugees and other sites that are complaining about my "rough" translations of the cell and computer records.  

Most of the information for both of those records was technical.  The idea was to get the documents posted.   Some of it needs no translation at all like the times and websites visited.  

If they don't like my rough translations they can translate themselves  

hahahaha...you tell 'um Klaas.  Why don't they get some of their 'aruban and dutch experts' to translate them.....where is that puke gif when ya need it!!

They are even making fun of the fact that it says Joran "of the ditch".  Actually, I left it that way for fun..ha ha  

I can truthfully say I've never seen a more appropriate surname...."of the ditch" suits them all to a T....That was one reason I wondered early on if Paulus was Dirty Hand...and Joran was dirty hand.

[Kimmy53]

You know, I'm laughing at the Refugees and other sites that are complaining about my "rough" translations of the cell and computer records.  

Most of the information for both of those records was technical.  The idea was to get the documents posted.   Some of it needs no translation at all like the times and websites visited.  

If they don't like my rough translations they can translate themselves  

*****************************
I guess they will have a blast with my analysis of the cell phone data....

Atl:  If you are still here:  In one of Deepak's statements, he said that his home phone couldn't recieve calls from cell phones?  Have you ever heard of this???

[Ono]

You know, I'm laughing at the Refugees and other sites that are complaining about my "rough" translations of the cell and computer records.  

Most of the information for both of those records was technical.  The idea was to get the documents posted.   Some of it needs no translation at all like the times and websites visited.  

If they don't like my rough translations they can translate themselves  

hahahaha...you tell 'um Klaas.  Why don't they get some of their 'aruban and dutch experts' to translate them.....where is that puke gif when ya need it!!

They are even making fun of the fact that it says Joran "of the ditch".  Actually, I left it that way for fun..ha ha  

What is really says is Joran "is someones bitch".

Bitch of the Ditch.

[KatzHome]

Posted by MF at Freedom of Blog - this is an email received by Nelson of NY from Jossy.


"You can have any opinion you want, no one at DIARIO is denying you that. But you cannot accuse us of being Anti-Aruba, ‘cause you are completely wrong there with that flagrant lie. The only reason that I appear on TV is to say the truth about the things we know, and that truth is categorically against the three suspects, because they were in company of the woman that disappeared.

Instead of accusing those 3 foreigners of having caused so much damage to Aruba, you wanna play intelligent and try to accuse us. That is your error, your biased inclination or political motivation. You are not an Aruban by heart if you want to twist things just to match your way of thinking.

Everything we have said and published up to now is categorically the truth; all Joran’s lies, all the accusations against the three suspects, all the hiding and cover-up of statements that they made to Police are very clear to anyone that has common sense.

I would appreciate if you could satisfy us and do not buy DIARIO any more. Apparently we are causing you a lot of pain and we do not want to do that. Keep reading other BS (will translate later) that are on the market and keep looking at the world through your wooden glasses (local way of saying that you do not want to see the truth). That is your right. But do not deny ours. And keep your opinion, and respect ours that has the same value as yours.

And if you want to do something for Aruba, to stop this boycott that is causing more damage than what people think, put pressure on the government to start showing more interest in solving this case. ‘Cause otherwise Aruba’s tourism will continue to go down and we all will suffer for that."



Jossy M. Mansur

Yup ~ well said, Jossy ~ And you know what, Monkeys ~ I'm going to write Jossy a note at the Dario to thank him for that letter....