Lively Case Discussion #675 8/8 - 8/10/2007

[ospainter]

Mrs Red,

Larry King is going to interview the young man from the X Game accident.

coming up after break.

OS

Thank you OS... did you see the youtube of the accident?  Red posted it on the front page...

NO I haven't yet, I did go the night you mentioned it, he is 1 lucky young man.

I will check out the FP soon,

OS

[mrs. red]

Mrs Red,

Larry King is going to interview the young man from the X Game accident.

coming up after break.

OS

Thank you OS... did you see the youtube of the accident?  Red posted it on the front page...

NO I haven't yet, I did go the night you mentioned it, he is 1 lucky young man.

I will check out the FP soon,

OS

he fell about 50 feet, so hard it knocked his shoes off...

[KarmaRoundUp]

this SVU is unbelievable... they obviously wrote this in the middle of all the lies and stuff...

Hi Mrs Red.SVU?Tonight?

USA channel.... it's totally the Natalee story... only they have her from Canada and visiting the USA....

Ah!
I think I saw that one but I'll tivo it,USA usually repeats.

[mrs. red]

this SVU is unbelievable... they obviously wrote this in the middle of all the lies and stuff...

Hi Mrs Red.SVU?Tonight?

USA channel.... it's totally the Natalee story... only they have her from Canada and visiting the USA....

Ah!
I think I saw that one but I'll tivo it,USA usually repeats.

yes it is a repeat.... but I haven't ever seen this one!

[Red]

I believe it's deja vu' all over again.

Blogs supposedly for Natalee comes to mind. You obsess about Simian's riddlles yet can't see the riddler of lies in your own midst. Covering for the man who obliterated Natalee, Paulus van der sloot.

Sad.

ENOUGH!

Frank, I will give you only one warning ... stop trying to cause trouble on this site. You were allowed back to post something constructive. You have had rights to post for less than 24 hrs. If you can't then please go. Do you honestly think you are stating something where I do not know what goes on behind the scenes? All you have successfully done is make the responding comments about the one you posted.

Its your decision. Add to the story or leave. If you persist, you will will make the decision easy. I am in no mood for this nonsence.

This will be the last word I say ...

[ospainter]

Mrs Red,

Larry King is going to interview the young man from the X Game accident.

coming up after break.

OS

Thank you OS... did you see the youtube of the accident?  Red posted it on the front page...

NO I haven't yet, I did go the night you mentioned it, he is 1 lucky young man.

I will check out the FP soon,

OS

he fell about 50 feet, so hard it knocked his shoes off...

On LK they showed it in slow motion. Scary

OS

[ldstlou]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

Thanks for that. I just always suspected him of definately having the personality of an addict, and especially since he was stealing $$ from parents to gamble and lying enough for his parents to take him to a shrink. Maybe he was just in the early stages. I have a sister who is a recovering alcoholic. When she is sober she is the greatest person in the world..but when she was in the midst of her addiction, it was not pretty. And the lies and the blaming everyone but yourself seems to be common traits amounst all addicts. I have a psych degree..was not trying to be nosey, I just have need to understand what is going on in the mind!! lol

[mrs. red]

OS it was amazingly hard to watch... my stomach flipped watching it.  I seriously thought he had been killed...

[Angiex911dsptchr]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

 FWIW  Not that anyone gives a crap.. I work with a gambling addict.. she takes money out of registers and the lottery money to support her habit.  Boss knows it too.. he does pay it back when she is able.. but what kills me. is she bitched and moans about not having $$.. but goes to clubs and dumps 100$ of dollars into poker machines.. I know.. I went out with her once.. and never again. she borrowed $ from me that night.. some of us went out after work and I was warned not to give her $... nice person I am. I did. She knows she has a problem.. not knokcing you Ramm.. but she can afford to gamble on the lottery... machines.. etc.. then crys she dont have $ to pay her dang rent and other bills...  Too bad for her I say. Maybe I am mean.
 I can admire a person who can admit they have problems and get help for it.. I know plenty.. Unfortunately.
 Never heard the term TOE RAG til you posted it..
  Whats made you change your mind?  I have read some vile posts of yours.. and even posted some long ago.. I will admit that.. so why now.. all of a sudden.. after so long you decide to post on the LCD thread here? Is BFN getting boring or what? Sorry I cant read there.. not a member.. just curious as to why now all of a sudden you have a change of heart. least it SEEMS that way? 

[Frank]

Red,

No offense to you, but I've heard that before on another site. Causing trouble?

For some reason I just thought of Robin Holloway and I'm not sure why.

Did you ever bother to think it's because I care about Scared Monkeys that I wanted to point out what most people "behind the scenes" know but some well intentioned people don't?

Criminals thrive on tolerance.

[ospainter]

OS it was amazingly hard to watch... my stomach flipped watching it.  I seriously thought he had been killed...

I remember, when I watched it back I thought goodness broken neck. It was amazing, he just said he will back on skates in a month.

Takes guts,

OS

[San]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

I will disagree with this part of your post.  I know for a fact this is not true.  I know a few gambling addicts who do exactly what you said they don't do.

[ldstlou]

Red,

No offense to you, but I've heard that before on another site. Causing trouble?

For some reason I just thought of Robin Holloway and I'm not sure why.

Did you ever bother to think it's because I care about Scared Monkeys that I wanted to point out what most people "behind the scenes" know but some well intentioned people don't?

Criminals thrive on tolerance.

jmho...but there are some very intelligent people here at SM..we are not your average Monkeys!! lol I don't think anyone here is going to get snowed by anyone!! We can definately disagree in a civil manner.

[Rammstein]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

I will disagree with this part of your post.  I know for a fact this is not true.  I know a few gambling addicts who do exactly what you said they don't do.

I was a gambling addict. I was a councillor for 4 years and true gambling addicts IMHO and in my professional experience don't have true friends, they have people they know and people they use.

[ldstlou]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

I will disagree with this part of your post.  I know for a fact this is not true.  I know a few gambling addicts who do exactly what you said they don't do.

I have to agree San...there is a women whose son is in my son's class and she is a gambling addict, it runs in her family and unfortunately, last year her dad got so far in debt that he committed suicide. His note said he wanted his wife and kids to have the insurance $$ to get out of the debt he had put them in.
In my experience of any addict, manipulation is very much a part of the behavior and disease...I think joran is an addict...in the early stages just because of his age..but this kid is not going to get any better...he is like a run away train and he will continue to lie, manipulate and harm other people for a very long time. that is the worst part about covering up his crime, someone else is going to get hurt...there is absolutely no doubt in my mind!!

[klaasend]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

I will disagree with this part of your post.  I know for a fact this is not true.  I know a few gambling addicts who do exactly what you said they don't do.

I was a gambling addict. I was a councillor for 4 years and true gambling addicts IMHO and in my professional experience don't have true friends, they have people they know and people they use.

Which fits Joran's profile to a "T".  He used Deepak for his car.

[ldstlou]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

I will disagree with this part of your post.  I know for a fact this is not true.  I know a few gambling addicts who do exactly what you said they don't do.

I was a gambling addict. I was a councillor for 4 years and true gambling addicts IMHO and in my professional experience don't have true friends, they have people they know and people they use.

That I agree with Ramm...they are master manipulaters...and his friends attested to this.

[ldstlou]

Ramm...again I am sorry for frank's comment!! We all have flaws and admitting you had a gambling addiction that you overcame says alot about you. Even though I often don't agree with you, I definately respect the courage it took to recover from you addiction!!
What I wanted to ask was having been down that road of addiction, do you recognize in Joran the traits of an addict and what insight does it give you, into his mindset.

I do see traits of Joran that are indicative of an addict. But not a gambling addict. As said, gambling addicts don't have friends, they don't go out and they don't go blowing money on bars and things like that.

Joran was/is addicted to being seen as a "player"/"pimp". He is the archetypal jerk that is usually emotionally challenged, has low self-esteem and is in general an absolute toe-rag to most people he meets (except the ones he wants to impress).

Gambling, going out, his friends are all just the tools for him to look like he is the big man on the island where in fact he is just a loser.

I will disagree with this part of your post.  I know for a fact this is not true.  I know a few gambling addicts who do exactly what you said they don't do.

I was a gambling addict. I was a councillor for 4 years and true gambling addicts IMHO and in my professional experience don't have true friends, they have people they know and people they use.

Which fits Joran's profile to a "T".  He used Deepak for his car.

Klaas...I think I remember several of his friends talking about feeling manipulated by joran

[Red]

Red,

No offense to you, but I've heard that before on another site. Causing trouble?

For some reason I just thought of Robin Holloway and I'm not sure why.

Did you ever bother to think it's because I care about Scared Monkeys that I wanted to point out what most people "behind the scenes" know but some well intentioned people don't?

Criminals thrive on tolerance.

Frank, do you honestly think I do not know what goes on? Do you think I am that naive? Think of me as "The Shadow" ... the Shadow knows. What goes on SM is my business. What goes on in other sites is theirs and people can see the drastic difference. Do not confuse SM with others that do not support a boycott. The boycott is a sign o solidarity for the family and answers to a missing girl and Justice for Natalee.

Anyone and I mean anyone who cannot see that is blind and misguided.

Do not ever confuse SM with other sites. Just because I do not call out others does not mean I agree with what they do. It just means its their site.

Frank, you sometimes have to understand two very valuable lessons.
1. Kill em with kindness.
2. Keep your friends close and you enemies closer.

Now let's get back to the constructive business of discussing the case.

[Rammstein]

Never heard the term TOE RAG til you posted it..
  Whats made you change your mind?  I have read some vile posts of yours.. and even posted some long ago.. I will admit that.. so why now.. all of a sudden.. after so long you decide to post on the LCD thread here? Is BFN getting boring or what? Sorry I cant read there.. not a member.. just curious as to why now all of a sudden you have a change of heart. least it SEEMS that way? 

people should not think that my "innocent until proven otherwise" makes me an admirer of Joran van der Sloot. I does not believe you me. I always thought he was a git, a liar and someone I would not want to be seen dead with (or alive) but believe it or not, his book has actually made me think even less of him. Especially his total disrespect of the girls he uses brings my blood to a boil (having grown up with almost solely women around me).

No, I still post at BFN, some wonderful people post there and I think many people from there have a nick or an interest in reading here too.

And I know I can sometimes be forceful with my opinion and on occasion very critical with a tiny bit of callous in there but I wasn't aware of writing vile posts because then I have some apologizing to do because I want to be honest but I never desire to be vile towards someone. Not even to people who make blogs in which they call me a rapist