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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #687 10/22 -11/2/07  (Read 251667 times)
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Dayhiker
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« Reply #840 on: October 31, 2007, 07:12:53 PM »

Remember that several pages were oddly "missing" from Paulus PV.  Never saw them, the page numbers jump over most of his statement in fact.

Who knows what he said but you can bet it wasn't even close to the truth.

Paulus is the most protected of the suspects, IMO.  Odd that, for someone who wasn't involved at all I think.



You have an excellent memory, Anna. Had forgotten about those missing pages in Paulus' PV. When that document was released we were too busy pouring over its contents to spend much time on the missing pages, but knowing what we know is missing from their testimony now looms large as to what is in those pages and why they were deleted in the first place. Who tampered with the statements and why are there portions missing?

BTW, one more thing that is missing. Why do we not see any questions to Paulus as to why he was looking up alcohol and drug overdose sites on the internet that morning? Surely any good investigator with a half-ass brain would want to know that?
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Dayhiker
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« Reply #841 on: October 31, 2007, 07:19:27 PM »

Or maybe we could get a Dutch Parliament update on the FBI accusations. Dompig not likely to be returning any of their calls. IMO


If this ever came before a legislatiive committee or parliment I am sure there would be more than a few questions the FBI would like to ask Dompig in return and perhaps some evidence produced as to who really inhibited the investigation, not to mention questions as to why he was yanked from the case and publicly criticized for his handling of the investigation by crime experts in Holland. Gerold better hope to whatever pagan god he prays to it never comes to that.
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Kermit
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« Reply #842 on: October 31, 2007, 07:25:50 PM »

The police are looking into Paulus van der Sloot's finances and whether he might be connected to mobsters that may have ties to Aruba's casino business," said the source. "Paulus is a known high-stakes poker player."
http://www.nationalenquirer.com/crime/63316

FBI know
DUTCH KNOW

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Observer
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« Reply #843 on: October 31, 2007, 07:27:55 PM »



Dead on the money, *******. If nothing happened in the main house, why would Ben King and Judge Wit show up to block the search? If nothing happened, why would Paulus file suit to deny the FBI access to court documents? If there was no cover-up why did the Arubans not allow the FBI to investigate, sending their divers home, refusing the agency's deep water boats access, and never turning over the documents they made a big issue of saying they were?


I think it's obvious to everyone involved that there was major forensic evidence in that house. Since when are people suspected of rape,murder and kidnapping allowed to pour concrete in there back yards and have there house blocked from being searched? Not only was it blocked on the 16th but also the 23rd when PVDS was arrested. He even screamed at Tim Miller to get off his property when he had a chance to clear his name after the first 2 searches were denied. We all know Authorities had no problems getting a warrant to search the clothes,homes and cars of two innocent men based on what they already knew were lies from 4 days earlier.

I believe these were orders given directly from the Minister of Justice and the Aruban Govt and not from just this one Judge. They certainly had a hand in everything that you mentioned above and alot more. Where is the explanation why a full property search was denied for two people arrested for suspicion of Murder and Kidnapping?


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"I lied and thats the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot
Kermit
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« Reply #844 on: October 31, 2007, 07:29:39 PM »

Paulus Van der Sloot and Arlene Ellis-Schipper

ANY WONDER WHY SHE COVERED FOR HIM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8344621/

ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: Well, I know Mr. Van Der Sloot is a very quiet, soft-spoken, kind man. I have had the pleasure actually of working with him. And we are just very shocked here on the island. And I am shocked at what has happened today.
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Kermit
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« Reply #845 on: October 31, 2007, 07:31:15 PM »


"We have a reasonable suspicion at this point that he may be involved in the disappearance of Miss Holloway," Croes told FOX Friday morning.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160558,00.html
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Kermit
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« Reply #846 on: October 31, 2007, 07:33:43 PM »

ART WOOD: In August, the Diario tip line recorded an after hours call from a woman. She advised that there was a crooked cop, his name was Halley and he took a body from the sand prior to the search. The woman said that Halley knows Paulus Vandersloot. Art copied that tape and gave it to Helen Lejuez who in turn gave it to the prosecutor to be entered into evidence. In September, Dave Holloway questioned Dompig regarding this tape and the police vehicle that he had seen. Dompig and the investigative team acted like they never heard of either account.
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Kermit
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« Reply #847 on: October 31, 2007, 07:41:55 PM »



Dead on the money, *******. If nothing happened in the main house, why would Ben King and Judge Wit show up to block the search? If nothing happened, why would Paulus file suit to deny the FBI access to court documents? If there was no cover-up why did the Arubans not allow the FBI to investigate, sending their divers home, refusing the agency's deep water boats access, and never turning over the documents they made a big issue of saying they were?


I think it's obvious to everyone involved that there was major forensic evidence in that house. Since when are people suspected of rape,murder and kidnapping allowed to pour concrete in there back yards and have there house blocked from being searched? Not only was it blocked on the 16th but also the 23rd when PVDS was arrested. He even screamed at Tim Miller to get off his property when he had a chance to clear his name after the first 2 searches were denied. We all know Authorities had no problems getting a warrant to search the clothes,homes and cars of two innocent men based on what they already knew were lies from 4 days earlier.

I believe these were orders given directly from the Minister of Justice and the Aruban Govt and not from just this one Judge. They certainly had a hand in everything that you mentioned above and alot more. Where is the explanation why a full property search was denied for two people arrested for suspicion of Murder and Kidnapping?





Simian Says: June 24th, 2005 at 5:51 pm Remember when they were pumping the pond by the Marriott? That is what they need to do in Montaña Noord.
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #848 on: October 31, 2007, 07:49:36 PM »


<snipped>


Superior Court
January, 2007


The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a taped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court).  The taped information and his declaration that  he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.”

yes, he was denied his cmpensation based on his having had contact with her TWICE

Funny how those in the JK2 camp want to ignore that fact

Every time the truth is revealed in the Natalee Holloway case ... Beth's words are affirmed.

Janet

++++++++++++++++++++++


Beth Twitty
NANCY GRACE
August 12, 2005


BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Oh -- oh, it`s a very critical detail. And the night that we arrived on the island -- you know, Jug does not misinterpret a 4:00 AM time pickup to 11:00 PM. I mean, Paulus Van Der Sloot stated that he picked them up up at 4:00 AM on May the 30th. Then -- we don`t know who they were, but then even as far as June 16 and June 17, Mr. Van Der Sloot was still stating this 4:00 AM pickup. Only until around -- maybe it was when he was picked up or arrested did he change it to 11:00 PM that I had knowledge of.


Paulus van der Sloot
NOVA
June 28, 2005


Paulus van der Sloot: That was not told to me when I was apprehended. During the apprehension I was told that I was suspected of complicity to murder manslaughter and usurpatory freedom spoliation (kidnapping). During the session with the judge [5], it was told that the suspicion originated, because that Monday night, when so many people were standing there in front of the door, I allegedly declared that at four o'clock, I picked up Joran. And someone else, allegedly declared that I picked up Joran and Natalee, while my own declaration was, directed at police officers, that I picked up Joran at eleven o'clock at the McDonald's. That is, of course remarkable that the public prosecutor's office adds two witness statements of people who were standing somewhere in the back, and not the witness declaration from the police officers, where I direct myself to, and directed myself to, as much as possible.


A few possibilities come to mind about the 4:00 v. 23:00 time -

  • Freudian slip
  • I don't remember
  • I am not a lying witness
  • The witness' statement was edited
  • I corrected myself at some point in time
  • I was not aware of how loud I was speaking
  • The police was trying to trick me by asking me about 4 o'clock
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #849 on: October 31, 2007, 08:00:01 PM »

Where did Paul Van Der sloot come into contact with Natalee? Casino,House or Car? Or all 3?

We know they were arrested for suspicion of murder and kidnapping but still the search of the VDS home was never done until 2 years later. Since they didn't block searching Joran's little Apt then there had to be major evidence elsewhere. It's probable that Paul Van Der Sloot came into contact with Natalee in the Main House,Garden or Pool Area.
Which car was Paul seen driving on May 30th 2005? By his own declarations,wiretaps and witnesses he said he picked up and dropped off Joran and Natalee at 4AM. Two hours after his son and Aruban officials told the world Natalee was last seen.



Dead on the money, *******. If nothing happened in the main house, why would Ben King and Judge Wit show up to block the search? If nothing happened, why would Paulus file suit to deny the FBI access to court documents? If there was no cover-up why did the Arubans not allow the FBI to investigate, sending their divers home, refusing the agency's deep water boats access, and never turning over the documents they made a big issue of saying they were?

I've never seen anything to suggest that the little art studio was searched.  Never read about what was in there or how it was set up.

Most art studios I am aware of are well lit because artists need light. 

I recall reading that the JVDS team requested all evidence against him including recordings.  Maybe that's where the police budget went, making all those copies.  I wonder if Aruba has a before and after inventory of the case file.
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Dayhiker
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« Reply #850 on: October 31, 2007, 08:01:59 PM »

Paulus Van der Sloot and Arlene Ellis-Schipper

ANY WONDER WHY SHE COVERED FOR HIM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8344621/

ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: Well, I know Mr. Van Der Sloot is a very quiet, soft-spoken, kind man. I have had the pleasure actually of working with him. And we are just very shocked here on the island. And I am shocked at what has happened today.


She also forgot to mention her cousin Guido, who publicly announced he was Joran's gay lover and was arrested for heavy battery againt Natalee Holloway, had lready been hauled in for questioning. Convenient memories they have on Aruba.
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #851 on: October 31, 2007, 08:10:09 PM »

I've never seen anything about the 'recording' equipment that was special ordered for this case. 

Just a few thoughts about origins -

VHS type equipment
pawn shop repos
confiscated media equipment
'blew' the police budget
professional equipment
'skeeter' type set up
that's why JVDS had to give the camera back to Freddy
current location
other

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« Reply #852 on: October 31, 2007, 08:11:19 PM »

The police are looking into Paulus van der Sloot's finances and whether he might be connected to mobsters that may have ties to Aruba's casino business," said the source. "Paulus is a known high-stakes poker player."
http://www.nationalenquirer.com/crime/63316

FBI know
DUTCH KNOW

"Joran is believed to be friends with a known ecstasy dealer in Aruba and police think that's where he got the drug," said the source.

"When Natalee died, Joran got in touch with the dealer. The theory is that the dealer had an incentive to dispose of her body so that police wouldn't trace the drugs back to him. But the dealer made it clear to Joran that if he talked he'd disappear too."

On a similar note, police are investigating whether Paulus, a former justice department official, helped his son get rid of Natalee's body by contacting shady characters he knows.

"The police are looking into Paulus van der Sloot's finances and whether he might be connected to mobsters that may have ties to Aruba's casino business
," said the source. "Paulus is a known high-stakes poker player."


Obviously they were implying the Extasy dealer to be Lorenzo..I dont buy this theory at all. So what if he supplied the drug..It could be found in hundreds of places in Aruba. I dont see him being fearfull at all that police could trace back a few hits of X that he gave to Joran. If he was involved in disposing of her body it's because he did it himself,was a witness or he was helping out family or close friends. I seriously doubt he has threatened the Van Der Sloots and if anything is working with them.

The second theory is more likely and only one person comes to mind and thats Posner. We don't know much about him except that he took it upon himself to hire his own Private Investigators..Why would he do that? To cover his own ass or to help out a friend? I havent seen him say much except..He knows nothing about nothing..This would be a guy to be fearfull of..

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Dayhiker
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« Reply #853 on: October 31, 2007, 08:15:18 PM »


I've never seen anything to suggest that the little art studio was searched.  Never read about what was in there or how it was set up.

Most art studios I am aware of are well lit because artists need light. 

I recall reading that the JVDS team requested all evidence against him including recordings.  Maybe that's where the police budget went, making all those copies.  I wonder if Aruba has a before and after inventory of the case file.


If Joran was on the computer as stated he would have had to have been in the main house that night, plenty of reason for the residence to be searched. Anita said Joran did not have a computer. I am trying to remember if a computer was shown being siezed on that videotape of the faux search that day. Maybe that tape is still available. Does anyone recall?

Judging from what has been aired of the typical Aruban police officer Whiskeygirl, the budget went to glazed donuts, Big Macs and beer. It certainly didn't go for fitness training. Jacobs, Van der Straten, and Dompig all have guts that hide their belt.
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #854 on: October 31, 2007, 08:24:41 PM »

Paulus Van der Sloot and Arlene Ellis-Schipper

ANY WONDER WHY SHE COVERED FOR HIM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8344621/

ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: Well, I know Mr. Van Der Sloot is a very quiet, soft-spoken, kind man. I have had the pleasure actually of working with him. And we are just very shocked here on the island. And I am shocked at what has happened today.


She also forgot to mention her cousin Guido, who publicly announced he was Joran's gay lover and was arrested for heavy battery againt Natalee Holloway, had lready been hauled in for questioning. Convenient memories they have on Aruba.

It has been speculated that this case involved a 'crime of passion'...

JVDS went to school in the Netherlands and GW iirc, moved there shortly after Natalee disappeared.   Confused
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« Reply #855 on: October 31, 2007, 08:30:53 PM »

One thing has always bothered me and thats the 2:30AM sighting of JK2 by the pond. If it is fact and not a manufactured sighting what were they doing and where was Natalee? Did something bad already happen to her in just 1 hour and she wasnt in the car? Was she being assaulted when he drove by and thats why they freaked out? Or were they waiting on someone that had Natalee?
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« Reply #856 on: October 31, 2007, 08:34:15 PM »

We have pages and pages of statements that don't match. Cars that don't match, times that never add up. Police questioning that makes a ten year old wanting to ask the followup next question. They don't want to end this correctly. If they did, then there would be 3 people in jail now just for the security guard stories at the beginning of the case. At least a case would have been started in court and they would be seeing some prison time. But that would cause things to unravel.
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If you were one of the original 20 female tourists to encounter JVDS while on vacation call the FBI. Tell them where you were taken.
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« Reply #857 on: October 31, 2007, 08:39:13 PM »

One thing has always bothered me and thats the 2:30AM sighting of JK2 by the pond. If it is fact and not a manufactured sighting what were they doing and where was Natalee? Did something bad already happen to her in just 1 hour and she wasnt in the car? Was she being assaulted when he drove by and thats why they freaked out? Or were they waiting on someone that had Natalee?
They may have simply had two cars. Noted by the different arrival time Satish gave for arriving at the bar and leaving the bar not together. Plus the car not matching the Jewry store video. Plus a page of stuff related to the cars in general.
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« Reply #858 on: October 31, 2007, 08:49:49 PM »

Paulus Van der Sloot and Arlene Ellis-Schipper

ANY WONDER WHY SHE COVERED FOR HIM


She also forgot to mention her cousin Guido, who publicly announced he was Joran's gay lover and was arrested for heavy battery againt Natalee Holloway, had lready been hauled in for questioning. Convenient memories they have on Aruba.

It has been speculated that this case involved a 'crime of passion'...

JVDS went to school in the Netherlands and GW iirc, moved there shortly after Natalee disappeared.   Confused

Out of all the charges Guido's Heavy Battery is the most suprising isnt it? We havent heard anything at all about his involvement except a rumor that he was Joran's alibi. It would be nice to know how they came up with that charge against Guido.
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« Reply #859 on: October 31, 2007, 09:11:07 PM »

The police are looking into Paulus van der Sloot's finances and whether he might be connected to mobsters that may have ties to Aruba's casino business," said the source. "Paulus is a known high-stakes poker player."
http://www.nationalenquirer.com/crime/63316

FBI know
DUTCH KNOW




Total fabrication to cover for why Joran is caught lying time and time again.  It's an attempt to make his lying appear to be some heroic act to protect his family from the "drug dealers" when in fact I doubt they exist at all.

In no way would they be responsible for what he did with any drugs they may have sold to him and it is ludicrous to pretend they were threatening him.  Since when does selling somebody something make you culpable for what you do with it?  Example gun dealers are not responsible for what is done with the guns they sell.  Same with drug dealers.

Joran and Paulus did it all.  At least initially.  Everyone knows basically what happened including ALE.  They just refused to act on it, collect the evidence when available and then the prosecution failed to present a viable case before judges determined to help their friend Paulus.

We know this.  They know this.  They know we know this and yet refuse to act.  And I am afraid this is just how it is going to be.  If Aruba is willing to take the loss in revenue and tourism, that is the choice they have made.

.
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All posts reflect my opinion only and are not shared by all forum members nor intended as statement of facts.  I am doing the best I can with the information available.

Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
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