JonBenet Ramsey

[pdh3]

There was no pineapple served at the Christmas party. Jon Benet had to have eaten it later, at home. Her parents have always said that she went straight to bed without eating, so the pineapple has always been a mystery.But the killer could have given it to her, or she could have gotten it herself after her parents were in bed, although I doubt it.

I think the DNA in Jon Benet's underwear proves that it was not her parents. That DNA has not been connected to anyone in the Ramsey's immediate circle, so it had to have come from a stranger. Plus there is the manner of death. A garote is very unusual, and can be connected to a type of sexual activity, so I think someone was waiting in their house, and was hiding out looking for an opportunity to molest her. I think the killing may have been an outcome of that. The note was never conclusively connected to Patsy Ramsey, it's just that they could not rule her out either.John was ruled out as the author of the note.
I have always thought it was someone who was watching the family for a while. Like that guy did with the Groene family.

[FoolsGold]

>There was no pineapple served at the Christmas party.
No one knows about pineapple.
Fleet White was not asked about it for quite some time and could only later say that he did not recall if the ham was accompanied by pineapple or not.
It appears that Pricilla White was never on record on the pineapple issue at all.

>Jon Benet had to have eaten it later, at home.
No, she could have eaten it before, at home. "Transit times" for such food items are highly variable and pediatric transit times are purely extrapolations from the adult tables. 

>I think the DNA in Jon Benet's underwear proves that it was not her parents.
No its not proof, but it sure is strong evidence.

>The note was never conclusively connected to Patsy Ramsey,
the note was never connected to Patsy Ramsey in any way at all.

> Like that guy did with the Groene family.
Surveillance is quite likely but not proven.

[robots]

Robots ~ was it said she ate pineapple that evening at the Christmas party they attended?  I can't remember...... and, would have already been broken down by digestive juices.....

Have you read Perfect Murder, Perfect Town by Lawrence Schiller, and/or JonBenet Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation by Steve Thomas?

What do you think about her brother, Burke.....I know he was only about 9 at the time, but I've always questioned his involvement however minimal and not deliberate.

well, i dont think the brother was involved unless perhaps he was involved and then it was covered up by the parents... yes, thats possible

but someone wrote the note and the note is quite interesting

i still say the parents were involved in the killing and the cover up

in my opinion

[robots]

>There was no pineapple served at the Christmas party.
No one knows about pineapple.
Fleet White was not asked about it for quite some time and could only later say that he did not recall if the ham was accompanied by pineapple or not.
It appears that Pricilla White was never on record on the pineapple issue at all.

>Jon Benet had to have eaten it later, at home.
No, she could have eaten it before, at home. "Transit times" for such food items are highly variable and pediatric transit times are purely extrapolations from the adult tables. 

>I think the DNA in Jon Benet's underwear proves that it was not her parents.
No its not proof, but it sure is strong evidence.

>The note was never conclusively connected to Patsy Ramsey,
the note was never connected to Patsy Ramsey in any way at all.

> Like that guy did with the Groene family.
Surveillance is quite likely but not proven.

there was a bowl that contained pineapple, i think

where is the can that the pinapple came in...?

[robots]

There was no pineapple served at the Christmas party. Jon Benet had to have eaten it later, at home. Her parents have always said that she went straight to bed without eating, so the pineapple has always been a mystery.But the killer could have given it to her, or she could have gotten it herself after her parents were in bed, although I doubt it.

I think the DNA in Jon Benet's underwear proves that it was not her parents. That DNA has not been connected to anyone in the Ramsey's immediate circle, so it had to have come from a stranger. Plus there is the manner of death. A garote is very unusual, and can be connected to a type of sexual activity, so I think someone was waiting in their house, and was hiding out looking for an opportunity to molest her. I think the killing may have been an outcome of that. The note was never conclusively connected to Patsy Ramsey, it's just that they could not rule her out either.John was ruled out as the author of the note.
I have always thought it was someone who was watching the family for a while. Like that guy did with the Groene family.

DNA came from the panties where they were made... i think

[mbs]

There was no pineapple served at the Christmas party. Jon Benet had to have eaten it later, at home. Her parents have always said that she went straight to bed without eating, so the pineapple has always been a mystery.But the killer could have given it to her, or she could have gotten it herself after her parents were in bed, although I doubt it.

I think the DNA in Jon Benet's underwear proves that it was not her parents. That DNA has not been connected to anyone in the Ramsey's immediate circle, so it had to have come from a stranger. Plus there is the manner of death. A garote is very unusual, and can be connected to a type of sexual activity, so I think someone was waiting in their house, and was hiding out looking for an opportunity to molest her. I think the killing may have been an outcome of that. The note was never conclusively connected to Patsy Ramsey, it's just that they could not rule her out either.John was ruled out as the author of the note.
I have always thought it was someone who was watching the family for a while. Like that guy did with the Groene family.

DNA came from the panties where they were made... i think

That was an early theory regarding the DNA, it was never proven.  In fact, I believe I read they determined the DNA came from a caucasion male, but I'm not positive. The DNA has been entered into the FBI Codis DNA index, hopefully someday there will be a match.

[mbs]

Also, you need to remember that the Boulder police used the DNA to eliminate other suspects (other than the Ramseys).  If they really thought it came from the factory, they wouldn't have used it to eliminate other suspects.

[mbs]

Robots ~ was it said she ate pineapple that evening at the Christmas party they attended?  I can't remember...... and, would have already been broken down by digestive juices.....

Have you read Perfect Murder, Perfect Town by Lawrence Schiller, and/or JonBenet Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation by Steve Thomas?

What do you think about her brother, Burke.....I know he was only about 9 at the time, but I've always questioned his involvement however minimal and not deliberate.

When you look at the forensic evidence regarding her injuries, it seems almost imossible to me that Burke could have been involved in any way.  The cord she was strangled with was dug deep into her neck, so deep that part of the cord wasn't visible.  It would have taken quite a bit of force to pull the cord that tight. She had marks on  her neck made by her fingernails, indicating she struggled against the cord.  She had a massive head wound delivered when she was near death.  It doesn't sound like something a 9 year old would be capable of. After her death, Burke was questioned by authorities (either police or child services, can't remember) without his parents being present.  If he had been involved, and they wanted to cover it up, he would never have been let out of their sight, imo. 

[mbs]

there was a bowl that contained pineapple, i think

where is the can that the pinapple came in...?

There was a bowl of pineapple found sitting on the Ramsey's breakfast table that morning, but no one remembered getting it out.  Jon Benet could have gotten it out herself before they went to the Christmas party at the White's.  I believe it was fresh pineapple. I've never thought it was significant.  From what I've read, it's really impossible to tell when she ate it.  Partially digested pineapple was found in her intestine, not her stomach.

[mbs]

That was an early theory regarding the DNA, it was never proven.  In fact, I believe I read they determined the DNA came from a caucasion male, but I'm not positive. The DNA has been entered into the FBI Codis DNA index, hopefully someday there will be a match.

Oops, I need to correct that.  The DNA was male, they don't know the race.  There was a pubic hair found on the blanket covering her body, the hair was determined to have come from a caucasion. 

[tcumom]

I need to digest all your opinions...so to speak.  Bottom line, I believe the parents were involved.  I believe Patsy Ramsey wrote the letter/note.  I believe John Ramsey purposefully brought the body of JonBenet upstairs....

I need to get the rest of my thoughts together.  This case has fascinated me from the beginning.....not to take away from the tragic circumstances. 

If any of you all have heard/read about the Walker Railey case, I have the same feelings about that one.....although that case did go to trial (if you can call it that).

[mbs]

tcumom, I respect your opinion, but I find that often, people who believe Jon Benet was killed by a family member are not that familiar with the actual evidence in the case.  I'm not saying that is the case with you, I'm just saying I've run into that situation before.  You may not know that Steve Thomas, the Boulder detective assigned to the case, admitted in a deposition that the Boulder police leaked "information" to the media to try to make the parents look guilty, hoping to pressure the parents into confessing.  Much of the information that was released was not necessarily accurate, such as the "no footprints in the snow" statement made by the police.  The police neglected to mention that the fact that there were no footprints in the snow around the house was meaningless, since it did not snow that night, and pictures taken of the yard and house that morning show no snow on the walkways leading up to the house, or on many parts of the yard.  There was no snow around the unlocked basement window which Lou Smit, a private investigator hired by the DA's office to investigate the case, theorizes was the entry point for an intruder.  There are many more examples of the misinformation spread by the Boulder police in this case. If you look at all the evidence, you may change your  mind.  Or not, you may be very familiar with the facts, and many people do feel as you do.

Anyway, personally, I've never thought the parents, or anyone in family, was involved, but that's just my opinon, and I could be wrong.

[robots]

I need to digest all your opinions...so to speak.  Bottom line, I believe the parents were involved.  I believe Patsy Ramsey wrote the letter/note.  I believe John Ramsey purposefully brought the body of JonBenet upstairs....

I need to get the rest of my thoughts together.  This case has fascinated me from the beginning.....not to take away from the tragic circumstances. 

If any of you all have heard/read about the Walker Railey case, I have the same feelings about that one.....although that case did go to trial (if you can call it that).

me too


i think the pineapple was significant

where is the can ??

if it was fresh, where was the core ??

6 year old cutting a pineapple.........???????????//  nawwwwwww

[mbs]

IIRC, the pineapple was in the refrigerator originally, I don't think anyone denied that the family had a bowl of pineapple in the fridge, just no one knew who took it out and put it on the table, and no one saw Jon Benet eat it.  The issue was when she ate it.  The police tried to say that she had to eat it right before she died, and therefore the parents must have killed her, because an intruder would not have fed her pineapple.  However, I don't think it makes any sense to say the parents fed her pineapple and then killed her. 

Also, the Ramseys said Jon Benet was asleep when they got  home from the White's Christmas party, and they carried her straight up to bed. The police theory was also that if she ate pineapple after she got home, the parents were lying about her being asleep, and must be lying about everything.  However, the experts said she could have eaten the pineapple several hours before she died, I believe one expert even said up to 24 hours before she died, and there was no way to narrow it down.  Also, the Whites could not remember if they served pineapple at their Christmas party.  And, I couldn't see any reason for the parents to lie about it, even if they were guilty.   So that is why I don't think the pineapple was significant.  JMO.

[robots]

IIRC, the pineapple was in the refrigerator originally, I don't think anyone denied that the family had a bowl of pineapple in the fridge, just no one knew who took it out and put it on the table, and no one saw Jon Benet eat it.  The issue was when she ate it.  The police tried to say that she had to eat it right before she died, and therefore the parents must have killed her, because an intruder would not have fed her pineapple.  However, I don't think it makes any sense to say the parents fed her pineapple and then killed her. 

Also, the Ramseys said Jon Benet was asleep when they got  home from the White's Christmas party, and they carried her straight up to bed. The police theory was also that if she ate pineapple after she got home, the parents were lying about her being asleep, and must be lying about everything.  However, the experts said she could have eaten the pineapple several hours before she died, I believe one expert even said up to 24 hours before she died, and there was no way to narrow it down.  Also, the Whites could not remember if they served pineapple at their Christmas party.  And, I couldn't see any reason for the parents to lie about it, even if they were guilty.   So that is why I don't think the pineapple was significant.  JMO.

the thing is,

the pineapple was there and no one in the house admits to who may have eaten it
and yet pineapple was found in her stomach, so therefore one might have to conclude
that the bowl of pineapple that was in their house was eaten by jonbenet.

pretty simple. deduction
if you ask me

ok, lets move on

6 years old, and she gets up out of bed, gets a bowl, puts some pineapple in it,
eats its and is caught by an "INTRUDER" or maybe a parent that had told her to go to bed
and not eat anything because you might pee your pants in the middle of the night

UH OH........... parent explodes...


NEXT

this damn intruder sits in the living room and practices the ransom note
but also doe not leave any evidece behind, he uses the ramsey notepad and pen to write the
note, uses the rope from the house and the paint brush to fashion his death weapons

not a very prepared intruder, if you ask me


 

[tcumom]

Not prepared ~ but yet, at ease enough to sit down and write out a 2-page ransom note ~ wasn't it for 180,000.00?

I need to get my books out and jog my memory.....

I think Patsy just finally snapped that night .... when JonBenet wet the bed yet again.

Maybe that's too simple, but I do believe it just *happened* ~ not premeditated.

And, then......they're trapped.....and had to come up with the note, the body hidden in that small back room in the basement....

I just can't see the intruder theory, although I know many folks do. 

[robots]

Not prepared ~ but yet, at ease enough to sit down and write out a 2-page ransom note ~ wasn't it for 180,000.00?

I need to get my books out and jog my memory.....

I think Patsy just finally snapped that night .... when JonBenet wet the bed yet again.

Maybe that's too simple, but I do believe it just *happened* ~ not premeditated.

And, then......they're trapped.....and had to come up with the note, the body hidden in that small back room in the basement....

I just can't see the intruder theory, although I know many folks do. 

i cant see an intruder theory at all

if the INTRUDER wanted to,,, why not just take the girl out of the house and get the thing rolling from his HIDEOUT and try and get the money


i mean, he climbed in, found paper and pen, found rope, walked all over the house and yet could not find the front door to walk out


naw................  parents are involved

in my opinion

you dont write a note and then leave the body

the problem was......... the note was written and the sun was coming up and there was no where to go...

why the note..???


crazy people do crazy things

[tcumom]

Now I'm rereading my Lawrence Schiller book and the Steve Thomas book.

I just don't believe the intruder theory ~ how did the person get inside?  Simple question ... is there an easy answer?

Just all these questions I'm thinking about?  Why would John Ramsey leave the house after his discovery of her body?  That is incredible to me.

[FoolsGold]

I just don't believe the intruder theory ~ how did the person get inside?
I don't know but several doors and windows were unlocked and there were 26 keys that had been given out to contractors and one key hidden near the front door.
The basement window grate had been lifted and replaced down on top of fresh green vegetation with some indictions of debris having been brought from the ledge to the interior of the basement as if by someone scooting into the home through the building.

>Why would John Ramsey leave the house after his discovery of her body?
Well, the police told him to. That might be the reason he did it.

[tcumom]

I just don't believe the intruder theory ~ how did the person get inside?
I don't know but several doors and windows were unlocked and there were 26 keys that had been given out to contractors and one key hidden near the front door.
The basement window grate had been lifted and replaced down on top of fresh green vegetation with some indictions of debris having been brought from the ledge to the interior of the basement as if by someone scooting into the home through the building.

>Why would John Ramsey leave the house after his discovery of her body?
Well, the police told him to. That might be the reason he did it.

I don't think so.....I need to read back tonight.....*if* I remember correctly, he slipped out for an hour or so, and it wasn't noticed 'til someone was asking for him. 
I could easily be wrong....I'm just trying to recall.