Natalee Case Discussion #690 11/21 - 11/23/2007

[Port Valerie]

I'm looking for photos of Joran handcuffed, LOL

I'll go through you link...thanks!

Maybe tomorrow. 

[Observer]

Yup back on Aug 1st 2005 ALE was looking for a pair of K-Swiss blue and white stripe size 14. Size 10 1/2 or 14? Blue and white stripe or all white 

http://tinyurl.com/2pu8r9

Yes *******, but how do we know for sure?

I think they should hand the security tape of the casino over to us so we can look at a few things I dont see why he would change sneakers after the casino..So most likely the shoes they are looking for are the same pair he wore in that casino.IMO

[klaasend]

I'm looking for photos of Joran handcuffed, LOL

I'll go through you link...thanks!

Maybe tomorrow. 

Yep.  I think someone mentioned Joran should arrive in Aruba around 9pm tomorrow.  Hopefully we'll get some photos of him upon his arrival. 

[truthseeker2]

Yup back on Aug 1st 2005 ALE was looking for a pair of K-Swiss blue and white stripe size 14. Size 10 1/2 or 14? Blue and white stripe or all white 

http://tinyurl.com/2pu8r9

Yes *******, but how do we know for sure?

I think they should hand the security tape of the casino over to us so we can look at a few things I dont see why he would change sneakers after the casino..So most likely the shoes they are looking for are the same pair he wore in that casino.IMO

Not to mention the additional footage that could be seen of "someone" sitting just to the left of Natalee at the blackjack table.

[klaasend]

Yup back on Aug 1st 2005 ALE was looking for a pair of K-Swiss blue and white stripe size 14. Size 10 1/2 or 14? Blue and white stripe or all white 

http://tinyurl.com/2pu8r9

Yes *******, but how do we know for sure?

I think they should hand the security tape of the casino over to us so we can look at a few things I dont see why he would change sneakers after the casino..So most likely the shoes they are looking for are the same pair he wore in that casino.IMO

I don't really agree, if he changed his clothes he may have very well changed his tennis shoes.  We really just don't know.  We have ALE looking for blue and white K-Swiss and Joran saying on Greta the K-Swiss he was wearing were identical to the ones he wore to the interview.  Too many lies to be certain of anything.

[Port Valerie]

9 PM -- just in time for Greta. I hope the cameras are there. Maybe Mama and Papa will meet him at the airport. Or the police station. (When I came home from college, I could never decide whether I wanted my Mom and Dad to pick me up at the airport or the police station after my questioning.  Sometimes I did it one way, sometimes the other ...)

[snoopy]

Hi Everybody!!  Hope ya'll had a wonderful Thanksgiving.  IIRC the video of Joran entering the casino are white tennis shoes.  Image wasn't very good, but that's what I think.  Don't see why he would have changed is shoes.

[Dihannah1]

Ok, more from Dutch poster I copied earlier

Comment by RM
November 22nd, 2007 at 11:57 pm
OK. I read some more. Apparently the authorities have incriminating info from phonetaps.

[Observer]

Telegraaf.nl

23 nov 2007, 00.34 of of the ditch Friday to Aruba ORANJESTAD - Joran of of the ditch, the 20 person whose birthday it is suspected of involvement at the death of Natalee Holloway, Friday is transmitted to Aruba where he will arrive in the evening (local time). It has confirmed that Public Prosecution Service on Aruba. Also the Dutch lawyer of of of the ditch, L. of pine Eeden, goes from that of.

 Of of the ditch Thursday has been interrogated by the rechter-commissaris in arnhem. At the request of justice on Aruba he was arrested Wednesday in its place of residence arnhem. According to of pine Eeden its customer is emotional. "he had resumed exactly the grip on its life, which becomes now if a donderslag said Thursday to Eeden at clear sky done by this arrest", of pine after the verhoor. The parents of of of the ditch, Anita and Paul of of the ditch, have had contact still no with their zoon. That unusually if you are net have been apprehended, do not react the father, who is lawyer of profession. Of new proofs I am not informed, but we follow the matter as well as possible. On Aruba the international media tricke into. Meanwhile a camera plough of the American nieuwszender ABC has already met with Public Prosecution Service, and is CNN and European media approaching.

[Kiwi]

Good nite all! Tomorrow will answer these questions hopefully!!!

[Dihannah1]

Good question on Gretawire Klaas,  I was wondering the same thing. ;_

[IBE]

klass

good thinking

Joran's HOBBY is criminal law.  So, did he figure wearing the clothing he wore the night with Natalee to jail would guarantee that it wouldn't be checked for evidence?  Were his shoes hidden until after he was released?  In Joran's sick mind, could he have been wearing THE shoes when he did Greta's interview?  Remember the smirk on his face when Greta asked him if those were THE shoes?

My uncle was a Atty/Judge and would take me to Court when I was a teenager and a soaking up sponge of lots of things.

Having his Dad in the Prosecutor's office for years and his Uncle as Police Chief, plus the hobby of Criminal Law, I would bet he had these "it happy 20 times before and nothing bad happened before" thoroughly thought out, until perhaps someone's rage came into the picture that night. IMO he and the pimps did things in increments.

IMO, again, perhaps things have been covered up for him before. His ego is large. Then again, he may be protecting someone else who covered for him.

In the Donna Jou disappearance thread, there is a person of interest, later labeled suspect who has the same type of smirk.

I have an urge to throw something at the TV every time I see this kind of smirk.

[Tylergal]

the dutch could have closed this a long time ago

they didnt

its over

I thought about that today, that they could have probably closed it in May when they had K2 under house arrest while they searched their house.  I think they always had all the facts, but they really wanted to give K2 and J2 a little more rope so the noose could tighten sufficiently for it to be an open-and-shut case against these crooks.

[San]

Hi Everybody!!  Hope ya'll had a wonderful Thanksgiving.  IIRC the video of Joran entering the casino are white tennis shoes.  Image wasn't very good, but that's what I think.  Don't see why he would have changed is shoes.

Joran had plans that night and he knew the end result of the evening would be dropping Natalee off on the beach.  What if he didn't want to wear his new sneakers because they would get dirty.  Maybe he kept this specific pair of sneakers for the times he had to go on that dirty beach.

[Tylergal]

the sneakers are key to this whole mess

 

   Thought about those.

Why would a person get rid of their sneakers?   Could it be they were covered with something?     Is it possible they were not left accidently, at all, but rather destroyed intentionally?

Speaking with a lot of "if's" here...

What if he left them in the ocean?  Are contained with some evidence?  Could TES just search the bottom for the outline of a gym shoe?  How much of a big gym shoe would be left after two plus years?  What is the effect of ocean water on man made material like a gym shoe?

I have to wonder if there is a stash of evidence somewhere.  If J2K were not linked to NH disappearance, could they have tried to remove any evidence that would have connected them to her?  Just to prevent a media circus?  Just to distance themselves?

Would having a son linked to a missing girl be good for anyone's career?  Would it be harder to find a job if everyone knew your family name on a small island?  Would it be better to try and keep your name out of the media spot light?

Pretend the son didn't know who the missing girl was? 

Would you scoop up your son's clothing and shoes from that night and dispose of it in the ocean?  Would you try and prevent your son from being recognized by his clothing and gym shoes?

Would anyone have been better off if JVDS name had stayed out of the media?  Would anyone have been better off if JVDS name was in the news media that Monday morning?

Could a search vessel, with some modern miracle equipment, pick up the outline or image of a gym shoe at the bottom of the ocean?

If they find the girl, they are going to see all that "shit."

[klaasend]

Telegraaf.nl

23 nov 2007, 00.34 of of the ditch Friday to Aruba ORANJESTAD - Joran of of the ditch, the 20 person whose birthday it is suspected of involvement at the death of Natalee Holloway, Friday is transmitted to Aruba where he will arrive in the evening (local time). It has confirmed that Public Prosecution Service on Aruba. Also the Dutch lawyer of of of the ditch, L. of pine Eeden, goes from that of.

 Of of the ditch Thursday has been interrogated by the rechter-commissaris in arnhem. At the request of justice on Aruba he was arrested Wednesday in its place of residence arnhem. According to of pine Eeden its customer is emotional. "he had resumed exactly the grip on its life, which becomes now if a donderslag said Thursday to Eeden at clear sky done by this arrest", of pine after the verhoor. The parents of of of the ditch, Anita and Paul of of the ditch, have had contact still no with their zoon. That unusually if you are net have been apprehended, do not react the father, who is lawyer of profession. Of new proofs I am not informed, but we follow the matter as well as possible. On Aruba the international media tricke into. Meanwhile a camera plough of the American nieuwszender ABC has already met with Public Prosecution Service, and is CNN and European media approaching.

I beleive the person on GretaWire is saying it's in this article they mention wiretaps.

[Tylergal]

[

[/quote]

that's greta's shoe next to jvds'.  if his is a size l4 like he has claimed, greta's got the biggest foot on the smallest body in the world.  his looks more like a l0 to me, maybe even smaller
dennisintn
[/quote]

I would want to see the 2 pairs of shoes side by side with the same camera angle before making that judgment call. I have photographed roses before while holding the camera that were as big as my face in the picture but in real life, I could hold it in the palm of my very small hands, and yes, they are small, size-4 ring finger.

[Observer]

2 articles in todays AWEMAINTA. The first is David Kock saying it's a act of desperation. The other looks like it mentions everything we already know. The search in the ocean and JVDS being extradited to Aruba.

If we have someone that can translate it..I will post it!

[crazybabyborg]

Telegraaf.nl

23 nov 2007, 00.34 of of the ditch Friday to Aruba ORANJESTAD - Joran of of the ditch, the 20 person whose birthday it is suspected of involvement at the death of Natalee Holloway, Friday is transmitted to Aruba where he will arrive in the evening (local time). It has confirmed that Public Prosecution Service on Aruba. Also the Dutch lawyer of of of the ditch, L. of pine Eeden, goes from that of.

 Of of the ditch Thursday has been interrogated by the rechter-commissaris in arnhem. At the request of justice on Aruba he was arrested Wednesday in its place of residence arnhem. According to of pine Eeden its customer is emotional. "he had resumed exactly the grip on its life, which becomes now if a donderslag said Thursday to Eeden at clear sky done by this arrest", of pine after the verhoor. The parents of of of the ditch, Anita and Paul of of the ditch, have had contact still no with their zoon. That unusually if you are net have been apprehended, do not react the father, who is lawyer of profession. Of new proofs I am not informed, but we follow the matter as well as possible. On Aruba the international media tricke into. Meanwhile a camera plough of the American nieuwszender ABC has already met with Public Prosecution Service, and is CNN and European media approaching.

English translation:donderslag [nm] (thunderclap) a single sharp crash of thunder

I'm so glad I looked that up. Makes me smile!

[Tamikosmom]

Pearl@BFN 

Lazlo of Refs posted this in response to what Joe Tacapino had said ......

Joe Tacopina also told Greta that Joran voluntarily
went to the police station. 

Lazlo:

He was 'taken' at his appt and handcuffed, then driven to the police station.
He did not resist arrest if that is what Joe T. means with 'voluntarily went'.

He did not receive a letter in advance, the decision for the arrests was made Wednesday, so the timeframe would have been to short for letters, besides that the OM mentioned it was a surprise arrest.

******* ... can you please tell me who "Lazlo" is.  Other than being Dutch ... what qualifications does she/he possess to be privy confidential /inside information which has not yet been released to the media.

Janet

+++++++++++++++

Three charged in Natalee Holloway's death
November 21, 2007

Earlier, Van der Sloot's mother, Anita Van der Sloot, told CNN her son had not been arrested, but had only reported to a police station in the Netherlands for questioning Wednesday after receiving a letter asking him to do so.
http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/21/holloway.arrest/index.html?iref=topnews
 

Three Men Re-Arrested in Disappearance of Natalee Holloway
Wednesday, November 21, 2007

Van der Sloot's mother, Anita, denied her son was arrested and said he was only taken into custody for more questioning. She said he wasn't put in handcuffs.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,312488,00.html