Natalee Case Discussion #693 11/25 - 11/26/2007

[truthseeker2]

Joran of "the ditch"....I love the translations.   Hopefully tomorrow, we'll get another "8-more day ruling" for JVDS...and that will leave me feeling a bit more confident about these developments.  I did take pause with Blah's comments earlier today - they made entirely too much sense...even though I want to be optimistic.  This crime is about WAY more than J2K and PVDS.  

It would surprise me if they had hauled his goofy butt all the way from Holland unless they were pretty certain they had enough to hold him longer than a few a days.  I think they will keep him locked up for at least eight more days.  Just my opinion.

[MuffyBee]

Thanks, All. I suppose this judge is going to be handpicked by Anita the shita.

Tylergal ~  I wondered if a special judge ("handpicked" as you said) for Joran.  Raises more questions...

[San]

Thanks, All.  I suppose this judge is going to be handpicked by Anita the shita.

 

[Nut44x4]

I hope this has not been posted...translated by Google (English version not ready yet)
 
Joran via sluiproute terug op Aruba Joran through
ORANJESTAD - The 20-year-old accused of the disappearance and death of American teenager Natalee Holloway, Joran van der Sloot, last night at ten thirty in the evening arrived at the airport Reina Beatrix on Aruba. Iets meer dan een half uur later werd hij naar de gevangenis gebracht. Just over half hours later he was sent to prison.

In tegenstelling tot wat de internationale pers eerder meldde, kwam Van der Sloot niet aan met het toestel van de KLM. Contrary to what the international press reported earlier, Van der Sloot came not with the model of the KLM. Op Curaçao maakte hij om nog onbekende redenen een overstap op een toestel van DAE. On Curacao, he still unknown reasons for a transfer to a unit of DAE. Dat werd vastgelegd door een fotograaf van Fox News . That was recorded by a photographer of Fox News.

Na de aankomst van de Nederlandse verdachte reden drie geblindeerde personenauto's door de zij-ingang van de luchthaven. After the arrival of the Dutch suspect reason blinded three cars by the side entrance of the airport. Die reden met hoge snelheid langs de aangestormde journalisten richting Cumana. That is why high speed along the aangestormde journalists direction Cumana. Hoogstwaarschijnlijk was dat volgens veiligheidspersoneel een afleidingsmanoeuvre want nog geen tien minuten later reed er een jeep uit de poort waarin de verdachte echt zou hebben gezeten. Most likely it was a diversionary tactic, according to security personnel because less than ten minutes later drove a jeep from the gate when the suspect really would have been. Dat voertuig reed in de richting van de gevangenis KIA. That vehicle drove in the direction of the prison KIA. De meeste journalisten waren toen al weg en hebben de auto niet gezien. Most journalists were already gone and have not seen the car.


24 Nov, 2007, 17:49 (GMT -04:00) November 24, 2007, 17:49 (GMT -04:00)
http://www.amigoe.com/

[casa]

It had nice color coding that didn't copy for some reason.

Anna - You can use the quote function at BFN and copy that (then back out of it at BFN) then paste it here.  Same forum software.

I just did copy and paste.  Next time I will try that Quote thing.

Some of that we have posted before but note the part about Joran drugging girls!!!

Everybody KNOWS!

..

Anna -
Someone from ISA has witnessed Joran drugging girls before and has given a statement earlier in the case.

you'll be shocked who this is when I reveal it at the end of the case. The very very end... When Joran and his crew can not harm him / her. This young person was very brave coming forward.

Rob, just wondering if they are trying to keep this a secret how you got the information.  If it needs to be a secret is it a good thing for you to be stating that here?

[Hotshot]

Is there a rule on Aruba about work permits??  Will Joe have to be approved??  Will he apply under Media Consultant?

He will apply under Mafia Consultant.

what if he already has a client on the island other than the sloots?

hmmm.....

maybe he has argued a case on Aruba we are totally unaware of or he may have been a consultant. I have no info he was - just making the point. He didn't just stumble on to the Sloots.

You're right...he didn't just stumble onto the Sloots.  But, there are some U.S. connections to those casinos and they all have lawyers.  Just saying...

Actually Joran and his father found Taco.  Joran asked me if I knew any good Attorneys in NY, "back when he used to talk to me" and I did tell him one, LOL, my hubbys Best Friend.  He chose Taco instead.  Oh wellllll, I'd rather laugh at Taco, then a friend of mine. 

[Dayhiker]

I hope this has not been posted...translated by Google (English version not ready yet)
 
Joran via sluiproute terug op Aruba Joran through
Most likely it was a diversionary tactic, according to security personnel because less than ten minutes later drove a jeep from the gate when the suspect really would have been. Dat voertuig reed in de richting van de gevangenis KIA. That vehicle drove in the direction of the prison KIA. De meeste journalisten waren toen al weg en hebben de auto niet gezien. Most journalists were already gone and have not seen the car.


24 Nov, 2007, 17:49 (GMT -04:00) November 24, 2007, 17:49 (GMT -04:00)
http://www.amigoe.com/

What, no press conference for Joran? Where are Cohen, Dilella and Pauley? I thought they arranged such things for the sporter.

[AnnieMW1]

Hi Hotshot - I knew you had ties to Aruba but wasn't aware that you knew Joran personally.  Do you think he's guilty?  Just ignore me if you don't want to answer!! :wink:

[truthseeker2]

I hope this has not been posted...translated by Google (English version not ready yet)
 
Joran via sluiproute terug op Aruba Joran through
Most likely it was a diversionary tactic, according to security personnel because less than ten minutes later drove a jeep from the gate when the suspect really would have been. Dat voertuig reed in de richting van de gevangenis KIA. That vehicle drove in the direction of the prison KIA. De meeste journalisten waren toen al weg en hebben de auto niet gezien. Most journalists were already gone and have not seen the car.


24 Nov, 2007, 17:49 (GMT -04:00) November 24, 2007, 17:49 (GMT -04:00)
http://www.amigoe.com/

What, no press conference for Joran? Where are Cohen, Dilella and Pauley? I thought they arranged such things for the sporter.

Well, I can't imagine wha has happened to the rest of them, but I fear Paulus has drowned in his own sweat.

[Dayhiker]

From the comments in a Telegraaf article.  I found the babelfish translation rather comical:

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/2606557/Joran_in_de_tang.html?p=28,1

Joran, en die twee andere pipos zijn totaal arrogante kleine mannetjes!! Schuldig of niet!! En de vader van Joran is nog veel arroganter en weet er veel meer van!! De aap zal uit de mouw komen!!
ikke, hier  |  15:28 | 25.11.07


Babelfish Translation 

Joran, and those two other pipos are totally arrogant small males!! guilty or not!! and the father of Joran are still much more arrogant and weet of!! the monkey much more will come from the sleeve!!

Not to mention they're guilty of doodslag.  (whatever that is)

[Dayhiker]

What, no press conference for Joran? Where are Cohen, Dilella and Pauley? I thought they arranged such things for the sporter.

Well, I can't imagine wha has happened to the rest of them, but I fear Paulus has drowned in his own sweat.

TS- Wouldn't you love to know who picked up the tab for Joran's press conference and send-off party to Holland? And who greased Judge Smid's palms?

[truthseeker2]

What, no press conference for Joran? Where are Cohen, Dilella and Pauley? I thought they arranged such things for the sporter.

Well, I can't imagine wha has happened to the rest of them, but I fear Paulus has drowned in his own sweat.

TS- Wouldn't you love to know who picked up the tab for Joran's press conference and send-off party to Holland? And who greased Judge Smid's palms?

Yes, I would love to know which alphabet group in Aruba paid for all of that.  ATA/ATHA or whatever those letters are.

[klaasend]

From the comments in a Telegraaf article.  I found the babelfish translation rather comical:

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/2606557/Joran_in_de_tang.html?p=28,1

Joran, en die twee andere pipos zijn totaal arrogante kleine mannetjes!! Schuldig of niet!! En de vader van Joran is nog veel arroganter en weet er veel meer van!! De aap zal uit de mouw komen!!
ikke, hier  |  15:28 | 25.11.07


Babelfish Translation 

Joran, and those two other pipos are totally arrogant small males!! guilty or not!! and the father of Joran are still much more arrogant and weet of!! the monkey much more will come from the sleeve!!

Not to mention they're guilty of doodslag.  (whatever that is)

dood: 1. dead | 2. death

slag: 1. action, battle, scuffle, struggle | 2. blow | 3. knock | 4. snare, trap | 5. expertness, skilfulness, skill, skillfulness | 6. movement | 7. grasp | 8. agony | 9. kind, sort | 10. turn

[Dayhiker]

Joran of "the ditch"....I love the translations.   Hopefully tomorrow, we'll get another "8-more day ruling" for JVDS...and that will leave me feeling a bit more confident about these developments.  I did take pause with Blah's comments earlier today - they made entirely too much sense...even though I want to be optimistic.  This crime is about WAY more than J2K and PVDS.  

Agree 100 percent Annie and Blah. While there's nothing I'd like to see more than Joran go to prison there are a lot more cells they should fill, starting with Paulus and some select ALE cops and Dutch judges.

[Tamikosmom]

Rob it doesn't look like she had it on ????

O/T

I wonder if anybody has been able to come up with a fishnet that resembles the top that Natalee was wearing on the morning of May 30, 2005.

Janet

+++++++++++++

IMAGES OF FABRIC

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/?p=1318
 
July 24, 2005

Last night the Scared Monkeys Discussion Board found an image of some material at the same site where the duct tape with the brown hairs were found. There coloring of the material bears a distinct resemblance to the the shirt Natalee was wearing the night that she disappeared.
 
Below you will find the images that we looked at, at this time due to the poor quality of the screen shots we are unable to say anything definitive, but the resemblance was enough to bring this to your attention.


WHERE IS THE FABRIC NOW?

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/12/03/natalee-holloway-stop-spinning-the-real-reasons-why-there-is-a-boycott-in-of-aruba/

December 3, 2005

The disappearing fabric that matched Natalee’s blouse. FOX News videotaped a search around the time that duct tape with blond hair was found. The videotape showed a police officer climbing down some rocks at the edge of the ocean (near the Lighthouse), holding a piece of fabric in his right hand. This fabric appears in enhanced photos to match the fabric of the blouse Natalee was wearing when she disappeared. The Holloway family allegedly was told by the ALE it was fishnet and there is fishnet that color “all over the island.” This find was never mentioned again, although FOX continued to run the video. It is not known what has since happened to this fabric.


Jossy Mansur
DANA PRETZER
June 18, 2006

Dana:  I see pictures that a park ranger picks up fabric and it looks to me similar fabric to a top that Natalee was wearing, But we were told it was fish net, but if you look at the picture it looks like her top for sure.

Jossy:  It does look very familiar to what she was wearing, but I am unable to confrim it.  We would have to go search for the fabric itself which has disappeared since. Every piece of evidence or what appears to be evidence has disappeared or we never heard about it again

[Dayhiker]

Not to mention they're guilty of doodslag.  (whatever that is)

dood: 1. dead | 2. death

slag: 1. action, battle, scuffle, struggle | 2. blow | 3. knock | 4. snare, trap | 5. expertness, skilfulness, skill, skillfulness | 6. movement | 7. grasp | 8. agony | 9. kind, sort | 10. turn

Mammy you da most! Thanks Klaas, makes sense now.

[Rob]

http://www.tacopinalaw.com/pdfs/superlawyer.pdf

Joseph Tacopina is the founder of Joseph
Tacopina, P.C., a Manhattan-based firm
that focuses on criminal, civil, and securities
litigation. Fluent in Italian, Tacopina
has an international office in Milan, Italy.
According to USA Today, Tacopina is one
of a handful of elite powerhouse defense
attorneys who has risen to the “pinnacle
of prominence.” Tacopina’s courtroom
charm, slick lawyering, and handsome


-snipped-

why does he need a office in Milan? and I also notice he only has 80 cases listed on that PDF. Also, he must have a Italian Law License. I'm not sure if some countries give a reciprocal license. I doubt it, he probably passed the bar.

http://tinyurl.com/2vxyfk

Here he is involved in the LOUIMA TRIAL - very high profile. Published: June 3, 1999

-snipped-

A lawyer for Officer Wiese, Joseph Tacopina, said that another reason for Mr. Louima to make up the story about being beaten in the police car was that he was so angry over the torture that ''he wanted everyone or anyone who had anything to do with his arrest that night to pay.''

http://tinyurl.com/36uzhr

Here he is involved in also in the Louima trial

JOSEPH TACOPINA -- Mr. Tacopina, 32, represents Officer Thomas Wiese. He is a former assistant district attorney in Brooklyn who, in private practice, has represented defendants charged with white-collar crimes as well as police officers.

Sopranos actor trial - Published: October 17, 2007
 

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/10/17/arts/NA-A-E-CEL-US-Sopranos-Suspect.php

The statements were made shortly after the December 2005 shooting of Officer Daniel Enchautegui. Brancato, known for playing an aspiring mobster in HBO's "The Sopranos," is alleged to have told investigators co-defendant Steven Armento shot the officer, though Brancato urged him not to.

"You think I'm in a lot of trouble?" the actor allegedly asked after telling officers he did not have a gun.

His lawyer, Joseph Tacopina, said Brancato was sedated and "could barely speak" when he was questioned.

Rutgers Basketball suit - September 12, 2007

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09122007/news/regionalnews/imus_suit_dropped.htm

 A Rutgers basketball player who sued radio host Don Imus for calling her team "nappy-headed hos" has dropped the defamation case less than a month after filing it, The Post has learned.

Kia Vaughn gave no explanation in her "voluntary discontinuance" of the suit against Imus, his sidekick, Bernard McGuirk, and corporate radio and television partners, which she submitted Thursday in Bronx Supreme Court. Her lawyer could not be reached for comment, and Imus' lawyer declined to comment.

McGuirk's high-powered lawyer, Joseph Tacopina, said the suit had no chance of succeeding had Vaughn pursued it.

-snipped-

http://www.reuters.com/article/fundsFundsNews/idUSN1516518320070315

U.S. stock analyst charged in property fraud case - NEW YORK, March 15 2007

-snipped-

Spyro Contogouris was charged in U.S. district court with mortgaging a property belonging to his employers, who are unnamed in the indictment, and pocketing the money, the U.S. Attorney's office said in an indictment made public on Thursday.

-snipped-

Contogouris's lawyer, Joseph Tacopina, said his client maintained his innocence.

http://tinyurl.com/2llkhk

Friday, March 23, 2007

Did Houdini fail to escape from murderous bunch?

NEW YORK — For all his death-defying stunts, Harry Houdini couldn’t escape the Grim Reaper: He died on Halloween 1926, apparently from a punch to the stomach that ruptured his appendix.

-snipped-

Houdini’s family scheduled a news conference for today to give details on the plans. New York lawyer Joseph Tacopina is helping to clear any legal hurdles for the exhumation.

__________________________________________________

http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/12/21/business/nydiamond.php

Leading diamond appraiser in bribery inquiry -  DECEMBER 21, 2005

NEW YORK: Federal prosecutors are gathering information about a bribery scandal at a Manhattan diamond-grading laboratory known as the United States' most trusted evaluator of precious gemstones, people close to the inquiry said.

Pincione's lawyer, Joseph Tacopina, said Monday that his client was in Saudi Arabia and unavailable for comment. Tacopina declined to discuss the case, other than to say that he was negotiating a settlement with the institute.
____________________________

http://www.tacopinalaw.com/notable.html

Notable case load from Tacopina and Spiegel
____________________________

van der Sloot:
Commissioner Kerik:
Michael Jackson:
Abner Louima:
Melanie McGuire:
Lillo Brancato
NY Post Page Six Scandal:
Georgio Chinaglia:
Kodak Bribery Scandal:
Sticky Fingaz :
Mouseketeer Charged with Securities Fraud:
Sex Charges Dropped Against Karate Instructor:
Infamous Body Snatchers Case:
NYC Councilman Charged With Receiving A Bribe:
Salvador Dali Theft:
Brooklyn Judge Indicted:
Parmalat - Corporate Fraud:
Gym Teacher Sex Abuse:
Lexington Capital Securities Fraud:
First United Securities:
Doctors Cleared of Insurance Fraud:
MTA Plumbing Fraud Case:
Police Lieutenant Charged with RICO:
Police Officer Charged With Civil Rights Violations (Morgue Boys Case):
Staten Island Police Sergeant Cleared of Rape:
Lawyer Accused of Theft:
S.G. Cowen:
__________________

Civil cases -

Civil Cases:

Imette St. Guillen:

Diana Bianchi:

Discrimination Suit Against Time Warner:


GIA Bribery Scandal:


Suing Prominent Rabbi and Prestigious Synagogue:


Julie's Law:


Houdini Exhumation:

Suing Prestigious Jeweler:

Century 21:

Banana Republic:


Lesbian Police Officer Civil Rights Trial:

Stripper Civil Rights Action:


Waitresses Fired Because of Their Weight:

Bar Sued for Assaulting Patron:


Fasarakis:


Wrongful Death Lawsuit:
Family of New York City Department of Transportation worker files suit over the tragic death of their loved one. Read Article(pdf)

Motors Cristalli, S.R.L.:

Construction Worker Killed at Job Site:


Sexual Harassment Suit Against New York Methodist Hospital:


Kidnapping Lawsuit:
Representing brothers who were kidnapped at knife point by prominent member of New Jersey Community.

Infinity Radio Disc Jockey Lawsuit:
Representing station disc jockey in lawsuit against broadcasting giant.
________________________________

whew - that wore me out!!!

That's all I have right now.

[Nut44x4]

From the comments in a Telegraaf article.  I found the babelfish translation rather comical:

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/2606557/Joran_in_de_tang.html?p=28,1

Joran, en die twee andere pipos zijn totaal arrogante kleine mannetjes!! Schuldig of niet!! En de vader van Joran is nog veel arroganter en weet er veel meer van!! De aap zal uit de mouw komen!!
ikke, hier  |  15:28 | 25.11.07


Babelfish Translation 

Joran, and those two other pipos are totally arrogant small males!! guilty or not!! and the father of Joran are still much more arrogant and weet of!! the monkey much more will come from the sleeve!!

Not to mention they're guilty of doodslag.  (whatever that is)

Ramm posted at BFN re: Doodslag
none, it is "doodslag" or manslaughter/ or heavy battery leading to death, he is suspected of both. We don't know voluntary or involuntary when we are talking about the Dutch version of manslaughter (doodslag) because involuntary would mean it no longer was "doodslag"

Doodslag= the intentional but not pre-meditated killing of someone

In the Netherlands we speak of "intent" when the perpetrator knew that his actions could cause somebody's death, it makes no difference whether he meant to do it.

There is a distinction in the levels of "doodslag" (dutch manslaughter), we know regular doodslag (regular manslaughter) and "gekwalificeerde doodslag".

Regular doodslag means that a person is just suspected of the act of manslaughter.

Qualified "doodslag"/manslaughter means that he committed this crime in conjuction with another crime, this crime could have taken place before, during or after the crime of manslaughter and usually the manslaughter is committed to either facilitate the other crime, prepare the other crime or to cover up another crime. Example is when during an armed robbery someone is killed, that would be qualified manslaughter and will lead to a higher penalty than "normal/regular" manslaughter.


And again>>>>per Ramm @BFN 11-24-07
I don't know how the get to voluntary or involuntary manslaughter, we just have one thing called "doodslag" and under that it does not matter if you meant to kill or not, if the acts you committed have a realistic risk of killing someone, it is manslaughter. When listening to Mos or reading his interviews he speaks of manslaughter or battery leading to death. He does not use the words voluntary or involuntary.

[Rob]

Rob, just wondering if they are trying to keep this a secret how you got the information.  If it needs to be a secret is it a good thing for you to be stating that here?

Casa - there are more people than he can imagine that have witnessed him drugging girls. This one came forward.

[MuffyBee]

Wait a sec.  Back up the truck.  That list of Joe's said "Houdini Exhumation".  We had a thread about that, and I had thought Dr. Baden was going to do an autopsy to see if they could find the cause of death for Houdini.  But it went pffft.  Couldn't find anything about it and haven't heard about it again until I saw what Rob just posted.  I wonder.  Was Joe's clients trying to stop the exhumation?  And why? Or were they trying to get permission to do so?  Hmmm?