Natalee Case Discussion #697 11/29 - 11/30/2007

[Blue Moon]

Joran has not let anything stop his love of gambling.
http://www.pocketfives.com/profiles/joran_sloot   
One of his nicknames is angryshark 68

Here is a new cute mug shot  http://joranvandersloot.spaces.live.com/photos/cns!9E74C66583487C84!780/
(Dont know how to post pictures)

Thanks..Looks like he he was on cloud 9 with his biggest win ever on 11/20/07. He won $4,776 on a $33 tourney. The next day he wasnt so lucky 

For real???

I can't believe a jobless college freshman can play in that kind of stakes.

But I don't think Joran sells drugs because he is too lazy.  He would have to really hustle in either Aruba or Netherlands, too much competition and he is just not going to work that hard to make any amount of money to support all this.

I don't know where he gets his money but might be money laundering for the casino owners or something like that but Joran is not one to work hard enough to make money selling drugs in my opinion only.

.

He was not playing cheap tournaments either. I saw that he played up to $133 a game and judging by his wins he played a great deal. Especially in the last month.

Remember, he has money from his BOOK sales

[crazybabyborg]

Freddy's on board with this whole thing. Remember the transcript with him offering to buy Joran new shoes?

Deepak told Joran, "Freddy needs to tell the truth"

Freddy's backing up Joran.

Anna, you know he will be. Tacky's like roaches. He mutates to accommodate repellants, and you just can't get rid of them!

[Observer]

Frank Rizzo is a councilman from Philadelphia.

Now resides in Aruba.  I was thinking it was mayor, but you are right although that was pretty close guessing. 

Yes you were close  and Frank Rizzo also was quoted in some of his comments about Aruba. I thought hiring Ernie Rizzo out of chicago was very interesting back then and I still do. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if Posner and PVDS were friends. This PI out of Chicago,Law Firm(Tacopina)out of NY and the Law firm out of Chicago suing for 800 Million are all very suspicious hirings. Even more suspicious is who is paying for these very expensive services.

http://tinyurl.com/2ep8xk

The original article that accompanied the ABC news video that some think is Paulus in the casino (I can't tell if it is or not but think it might be, doesn't matter he was there and likely oogling the girls whether on vid or not)but anyway that article said Posner was a friend of the family of the Sloots.

Then POOF, that sentence was REMOVED from the article.

Strangest things just vanish like that but I read it with my own eyes and am sure others posting here did as well.

.

  That is strange..Is Posner just advising his Aruban friends on what Criminal Defense Lawyers and PI'S to hire or is he paying for them himself? Posner  said he hired Investigators in this case..I'm assuming that was not Rizzo but someone else? That would be solid proof if they linked Posner to Rizzo because we know for a fact he worked for the Van Der Sloots.

Why is this money trail so hard to follow? Someone is spending Millions!!!! Certainly can't be the sloots or the kalpoes.

[Anna]

Ado had a theory that Joran picked up a pair of shoes like his but wrong size, right brand.  On his little walk from the racquet club the next night, he may have planted them to prove he was at the FH when in fact he may not have been at all and also to say he sent the Kalpoes back to retrieve his shoes.

Unfortunately for the sporter, they vanished.  Somebody may have stolen them or he may not have left shoes at all as someone I think Janet just posted.

But the thought was to prove he was at FH and that Kalpoes went back to get shoes.

Freddie buying his a new pair is a load as Robots would say and just something to draw attention to the faked alibi.

Even stupid Deepak said shoes to somebody at the HI the night Beth arrived.  Then he pretended to try to take it back.  At that point in time why did Deepak say shoes already if the story was HI.  Did he know the FH story already?

That is another thing that is totally out of sequence of events but if you check the PVs you will see Deepak mentioning Joran losing his shoes already.  He should not have been saying shoes for this was still the HI version of events.  They had been plotting.  This is because they were talking about how could leave shoes somewhere for alibi to prove you were there.  Even if you weren't.

MO

Speculation only

.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Frank Rizzo is a councilman from Philadelphia.

Now resides in Aruba.  I was thinking it was mayor, but you are right although that was pretty close guessing. 

Yes you were close  and Frank Rizzo also was quoted in some of his comments about Aruba. I thought hiring Ernie Rizzo out of chicago was very interesting back then and I still do. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if Posner and PVDS were friends. This PI out of Chicago,Law Firm(Tacopina)out of NY and the Law firm out of Chicago suing for 800 Million are all very suspicious hirings. Even more suspicious is who is paying for these very expensive services.

http://tinyurl.com/2ep8xk

The original article that accompanied the ABC news video that some think is Paulus in the casino (I can't tell if it is or not but think it might be, doesn't matter he was there and likely oogling the girls whether on vid or not)but anyway that article said Posner was a friend of the family of the Sloots.

Then POOF, that sentence was REMOVED from the article.

Strangest things just vanish like that but I read it with my own eyes and am sure others posting here did as well.

.

  That is strange..Is Posner just advising his Aruban friends on what Criminal Defense Lawyers and PI'S to hire or is he paying for them himself? Posner  said he hired Investigators in this case..I'm assuming that was not Rizzo but someone else? That would be solid proof if they linked Posner to Rizzo because we know for a fact he worked for the Van Der Sloots.

Why is this money trail so hard to follow? Someone is spending Millions!!!! Certainly can't be the sloots or the kalpoes.

I know Joe Mammana (sp?) is no saint, but when he was offering the $ he did plead with Posner to do the right thing...or something like that...What was that all about?  uh huh....mmmmm

[Anna]

*******, I have always seen Rizzio, the detective not the politician, as the thing that connects the Sloots to Posner.  I thought Rizzio was hired by Paulus but he is connected supposedly to Posner via their commonality in the Chicago Outfit.


I think Posner was paying Rizzio or he was owed a favor by him. 

[San]

Frank Rizzo is a councilman from Philadelphia.

Now resides in Aruba.  I was thinking it was mayor, but you are right although that was pretty close guessing. 

Yes you were close  and Frank Rizzo also was quoted in some of his comments about Aruba. I thought hiring Ernie Rizzo out of chicago was very interesting back then and I still do. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if Posner and PVDS were friends. This PI out of Chicago,Law Firm(Tacopina)out of NY and the Law firm out of Chicago suing for 800 Million are all very suspicious hirings. Even more suspicious is who is paying for these very expensive services.

http://tinyurl.com/2ep8xk

The original article that accompanied the ABC news video that some think is Paulus in the casino (I can't tell if it is or not but think it might be, doesn't matter he was there and likely oogling the girls whether on vid or not)but anyway that article said Posner was a friend of the family of the Sloots.

Then POOF, that sentence was REMOVED from the article.

Strangest things just vanish like that but I read it with my own eyes and am sure others posting here did as well.

.

  That is strange..Is Posner just advising his Aruban friends on what Criminal Defense Lawyers and PI'S to hire or is he paying for them himself? Posner  said he hired Investigators in this case..I'm assuming that was not Rizzo but someone else? That would be solid proof if they linked Posner to Rizzo because we know for a fact he worked for the Van Der Sloots.

Why is this money trail so hard to follow? Someone is spending Millions!!!! Certainly can't be the sloots or the kalpoes.

I know Joe Mammana (sp?) is no saint, but when he was offering the $ he did plead with Posner to do the right thing...or something like that...What was that all about?  uh huh....mmmmm

I remember that 2NJSons.  He said something like Mike Posner we are cut from the same cloth and you can put and end to this.

[Anna]

2NJ, you don't suppose the Rizzio politician was behind taking Joe M down do you, lol.  I just assumed he was because he was furious about the boycott and apparently had $ invested in Aruba if he now lives there, etc.

Now I will get another hard drive fried, lol!

/

[2NJSons_Mom]

San, you are probably closer to his statement, but I know he called him out.

Anna, who knows if Frank Rizzo had anything to do with the search of Mamana's home....I doubt Frank put the gun on the nightstand, but it certainly is a possibility that I cannot prove either way. 

If this hard drive fries, I'll be in rehab with D T's. 

[Observer]

*******, I have always seen Rizzio, the detective not the politician, as the thing that connects the Sloots to Posner.  I thought Rizzio was hired by Paulus but he is connected supposedly to Posner via their commonality in the Chicago Outfit.


I think Posner was paying Rizzio or he was owed a favor by him. 

I totally agree as Rizzo goes back many many years in Chicago and they both claimed to hire PI'S in the same time period. I feel the same about Tacopina also. I watched taco closely this week when he mentioned his firm is involved with whats happening in Aruba and working a advisory role. I almost get the feeling that whoever hired him doesnt trust the Legal team in Aruba and wants him supervising so the sloots don't go down. I really see no proof that Posner is involved in anything but this is all way too suspicious.

Could be all BS by Tacopina..But why the heck is he even involved?? Who's interests is he really protecting besides the Van Der Sloots? Just seems highly unlikely Paul Van Der Sloot would hire Joe Tacopina and even less likely he could afford him.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Natalee's case is going to get either the last or next to last few minutes on Greta's show tonight.  Scott Peterson is also going to be squeezed into the final few minutes.

[Tamikosmom]

No man has a good enough memory to make a successful liar.
Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln's quote is especially applicable to Joran van der Sloot.  On June 14, 2005 in his suspect statement ... he conveys two different accounts in regard to Deepak picking up his shoes from the beach.  It is so obvious that Joran is attempting to implicate Deepak when the inconsistencies in his statement pertaining to his shoes is considered.  The truth would imply that there would be one account.

Janet

++++++++++++++++++++++


Joran Van der Sloot
Suspect Statement - June 14, 2005

I told Deepak that I left my shoes at the Marriot Hotel.  Deepak told me not to worry that he would go back the next day and pick them up for me.  I had left a pair of white and blue shoes of the make "K-Swiss", size "14" on the beach. These shoes I bought in the USA.


Joran Van der Sloot
Suspect Statement - June 14, 2005

I was dropped off at my house by Deepak on May 30th 2005 at approximately 03.45. When I was getting out I asked him if he would go "on-line" again. Deepak answered me that he would. I also told him that I would call him tomorrow.  I had asked Deepak if he could pick up the shoes I left behind at the beach. Deepak told me that he would immediately go and get them.  Then Deepak drove off.

[San]

From Greta:

Lawyers for Joran and Kalpoes were all in court today.

Two important motions on behalf of the suspects.

Joran now has the bible he requested.

The Kalpoes could be set free as early as tomorrow.

Joran's lawyer said outside the court this new incriminating evidence is no slam dunk at all.

They said the evidence deals with a lot of the old interrogations and evesdropping.  Basically a language problem.

[klaasend]

From Greta:

Lawyers for Joran and Kalpoes were all in court today.

Two important motions on behalf of the suspects.

Joran now has the bible he requested.

The Kalpoes could be set free as early as tomorrow.

Joran's lawyer said outside the court this new incriminating evidence is no slam dunk at all.

They said the evidence deals with a lot of the old interrogations and evesdropping.  Basically a language problem.

Thanks San - so nothing new from earlier today.  We won't know anything until tomorrow afternoon most likely.

[2NJSons_Mom]

  Janet, 'next day' then 'immediately'....very perseptive.

Natalee's case got the last minute of Greta's show.  The reporter (surfer guy..sad I can't remember his name a few minutes later after a week)...called it a cold case in his closing....with Greta in DC....just wondering what info is being swapped behind the scenes between Joe T & the likes....skeptical...hope I'm being silly....

[San]

From Greta:

Lawyers for Joran and Kalpoes were all in court today.

Two important motions on behalf of the suspects.

Joran now has the bible he requested.

The Kalpoes could be set free as early as tomorrow.

Joran's lawyer said outside the court this new incriminating evidence is no slam dunk at all.

They said the evidence deals with a lot of the old interrogations and evesdropping.  Basically a language problem.

Thanks San - so nothing new from earlier today.  We won't know anything until tomorrow afternoon most likely.

Right.  Basically a repeat of what was talked about today.

[adoronron]

Ado,

What is your take on Mos and the rearrests?  You have not posted much but I always found your posts fascinating and wished you would say more.

.

Anna,

Well.......I agree for the most part with Robots.
MOS has em cornered and they're going to be in jail for much much longer than any eight days or sixty days.
MOS is not part of the Aruban system, he's part of the Dutch system and he seems the type that has career aspirations. He wouldn't take any risks at ruining his future by filing manslaughter charges he can't prove. He's got the goods on them. He wouldn't say he has proof she is deceased if he didn'thave the proof. On a side note, IMO I think MOS has some photographic or video evidence. We all know the pimps were involved in the porn business.
On the ocean search - Everybody can try to figure out how he and TES know exactly where to look but right now the fact is they know where to look. How they found out where to look may become public sometime down the road but it's too soon for MOS to disclose that information. Again, the fact is they know where to look, and that to me is a major breakthrough, and MOS isn't hinting how they found out. It's has to be driving those involved in the crime nuts.
Notice that JT is trying all he can to get some sort of response from MOS and....................nothing. He (MOS) is not going to respond now matter what JT claims.
If there is an information/evidence leak MOS and the 45 KLPD will find the source.
On arresting Paulus - It would not be a good idea to arrest Paulus this soon. In doing so you would have to disclose evidence to him and he might be able to start cover up activities in motion, or get word to J2K on the "new" story line to follow.
I see a lot of folks in here claiming the sky is falling because this hasn't happened yet, or that person should be arrested and isn't, or Satish's lawyer said it's just the same old stuff. Myself, I think within a month we'll know must of what happened.
I do hope TES has some sort of navy protective support out there. This is dangerous stuff.

ADO.

[mrs. red]

In other words, Joran may have never had a missing pair of shoes at all, but the story of the missing shoes was in place just to implicate the Kalpoes and give Joran an option of placing them at the beach and last to have an opportunity to kill her.

Interviewer:  You left without your shoes. How do you... how do you explain that? 

Joran van der Sloot:  We walked onto the... on the beach in the beginning, and where we sat down there, then, I had taken off my shoes. And because, when you walk in, it was the exact same shoes that I'm wearing now. 

Interviewer:  Same kind? 

Joran van der Sloot:  Yes, exactly. 

Interviewer:  Or those aren't the shoes? 

Joran van der Sloot:  No, no. Those aren't the shoes... 

Interviewer:  Those are the same kind. 

Joran van der Sloot:  ... but those are the exact same kinds. 

Interviewer:  All right. 

Klaas, that excerpt is freaky. Thanks for posting it. I'm with Tamik, I strongly speculate there is no missing shoe/shoes. How about you?

HEy Hey Hey now... I have been saying since this interview that he was wearing the shoes... did I finally get proven correct?  That smirk said it all....

[Anna]

Ado,

Thank you so much for that positive response.  I needed that after listening to that surfer dude.  Saying the Kalpoes might be released.

Well, even if they are, Mos can STILL file charges and put them right back.

I don't believe any translation errors.  The Dutch have been watching the tape of all this and listening to the taps themselves and coming up with entirely different version of events.

But I don't want any Kalpoes released tomorrow.  I do hope Mos has them as you and Robots insist.  I THINK he does but as you say, we will know within the month.

Thanks again for your thoughts , was wondering what your take on all this might be.


.

[klaasend]

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/29/aruba.holloway/index.html

November 29, 2007

Natalee Holloway's parents to meet with Aruban prosecutor
Story Highlights


By Susan Candiotti
CNN

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- The chief prosecutor in the Natalee Holloway investigation has agreed to meet Saturday with the parents of the missing Alabama teen, who is presumed dead.

"I'm really anxious to meet him," Beth Holloway told CNN. "I've waited a long time for this meeting."

A lawyer for Beth Holloway contacted prosecutor Hans Mos last week after suspects Joran van der Sloot and brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpoe were arrested on suspicion of manslaughter.

"There's no doubt in my mind that [Natalee Holloway] is dead. ... I think we have enough evidence to prove the girl is not alive anymore, even without a body," Mos said last week.

Natalee Holloway's mother said she has hope that Mos will be able to solve the case.

"He seems great. The case seems to be handled well. I'm going to ask him some long-awaited questions," she said.

The family is encouraged that the meeting will take place, Holloway attorney John Kelly told CNN. Two years ago, the previous chief prosecutor -- who has since returned to the Netherlands -- would not sit down with them.

Kelly said Beth Holloway and her ex-husband, Dave, want to share information they've gathered since their daughter disappeared in May 2005 while on vacation with about 100 classmates. See a timeline of the case »

Neither he nor Beth Holloway would provide details.

Questions about evidence

Lawyers for the three suspects were in court in Aruba on Thursday on behalf of their clients. They argued that last week's rearrests were baseless and that prosecutors have no new evidence against their clients. They said they have no idea what happened to Holloway.

As he rushed out of the closed hearing before a judge, van der Sloot's lawyer told CNN that authorities have no reason to hold van der Sloot in jail again as they did two years ago. He said the so-called new incriminating evidence is worthless.

"To say it's less than nothing is too much. But it's not very much. It's very, very thin," Ariean de Bie said.

Van der Sloot's parents were allowed to provide him with a Bible but no other reading materials, the lawyer said. Van der Sloot is forbidden from seeing any visitors and can meet only with his lawyers and interrogators.

De Bie said van der Sloot has not provided authorities with any new information since his rearrest and extradition from the Netherlands, where he'd been attending college. He said his client would rather be anywhere than in a prison cell.

"He's not very happy about it," the attorney said.

Van der Sloot's co-counsel -- New York attorney Joe Tacopina -- said he has no doubt his client is innocent.

"Whatever they're holding in their bag, whatever they don't want to show anyone ... it's not going to amount to a hill of beans against Joran van der Sloot because he had no involvement in Natalee's disappearance," Tacopina told CNN.

Tacopina said he'll be in Aruba next week and try to meet with van der Sloot in his jail cell.

Attorneys for the Kalpoe brothers will meet with a judge in separate jailhouse hearings Friday to argue that their clients should be set free and not held another eight days.

A judge will decide whether prosecutors can continue to hold the Kalpoes even longer.

Van der Sloot will have a similar hearing next Friday when prosecutors are expected to ask to keep him jailed another 60 days.

Mos has said he hopes to decide by the end of the year whether he will try all three suspects for Holloway's presumed death, which he suggests was an accident. The prosecutor won't say what his new evidence is until his investigation is complete. (note from me:  I think the reporter used their words and not MOS's words)

New search for remains

The Holloways still have not given up the search for their daughter. In fact, a benefactor is donating an estimated $500,000 to help map the waters offshore.

On Thursday, Natalee's father watched Louis Schaeffer's crew load a boat equipped with the latest sonar equipment and a remote operated vehicle (ROV) to search the waters where Holloway's remains might be.

"I've got a feeling that if she's in the ocean, these guys are gonna find her," Dave Holloway said. "No doubt about it." Watch an interview with Natalee Holloway's father »

Schaeffer said he's retired, has the money, and was touched by the Holloways' tragedy and wanted to help.

"My only objective is to find Natalee, to bring her home for Dave and Beth and also to help identify the people that did this to her. This is a terrible thing, an injustice, and I want to help solve the case," said Schaeffer.

"We've known since [May 2005], the FBI told us Natalee's not with us anymore," Dave Holloway said.

The boat is expected to take about 10 days to get to Aruba. It'll take a few more days to set up a search.

The family says it has no new information about where to look. The Holloways just want to exhaust every area they can offshore with equipment that wasn't available to them two years ago.

Thanks to Schaefer, that's changed.

"We are just so thankful that he's got a big heart and willing to do that," Dave Holloway said.