Natalee Case Discussion #697 11/29 - 11/30/2007

[klaasend]

Mrs. Red - we are just thinking the whole shoe thing may have been Joran trying to pin the crime on the Kalpoes.  No proof of that though 

[crazybabyborg]

I remember you saying that Mrs. Red! It, apparently, was just an epiphany for me today! 

It finally clicked with me there was crucial motive for making up the story about loosing his shoes. He could place the Kalpoes as last with Natalee if he could say he sent them to pick up his shoes at the beach.

SORRY! I didn't realize everyone else was already on board with that! It was an original thought for me! 

[crazybabyborg]

Van derStratten and Paulus probably came up with it, and purposefully leaked that a shoe was missing after the search of Joran's apt. to substantiate Joran's assertion that a Kalpoe went back and may have killed her.

[Port Valerie]

From Greta:

Lawyers for Joran and Kalpoes were all in court today.

Two important motions on behalf of the suspects.

Joran now has the bible he requested.


The Kalpoes could be set free as early as tomorrow.

Joran's lawyer said outside the court this new incriminating evidence is no slam dunk at all.

They said the evidence deals with a lot of the old interrogations and evesdropping.  Basically a language problem.

Minor clarification:

The first motion today concerned Joran and resulted in his getting a Bible.

The second motion today concerned allowing the Kalpoes to have the same lawyer; it was heard but not decided today.

The Kalpoes could be set free tomorrow as part of a third action -- the decision to keep them, or not, for another eight days.

[mrs. red]

I remember you saying that Mrs. Red! It, apparently, was just an epiphany for me today! 

It finally clicked with me there was crucial motive for making up the story about loosing his shoes. He could place the Kalpoes as last with Natalee if he could say he sent them to pick up his shoes at the beach.

SORRY! I didn't realize everyone else was already on board with that! It was an original thought for me! 

Well I remembered being told I was smoking crack basically, when I first said that.. and it's ok, didn't change my mind... in my opinion it was one of those weird details that joran put in the story for a reason, planted evidence against the K2 makes perfect sense, that is an ephinany for me... LOL... but he just had a look on his nasty face that said to me that he was charming Greta and thinking that he had fooled her the entire time he was sitting there...

and he made some comment to the effect that the missing shoes were "just like these" and I thought... yeah, because they were those...

anyway... it's one small thing I got right ... (and if I didn't, let me live in my bubble anyway)

[Anna]

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/29/aruba.holloway/index.html

November 29, 2007

Natalee Holloway's parents to meet with Aruban prosecutor
Story Highlights


By Susan Candiotti
CNN

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- The chief prosecutor in the Natalee Holloway investigation has agreed to meet Saturday with the parents of the missing Alabama teen, who is presumed dead.

"I'm really anxious to meet him," Beth Holloway told CNN. "I've waited a long time for this meeting."

A lawyer for Beth Holloway contacted prosecutor Hans Mos last week after suspects Joran van der Sloot and brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpoe were arrested on suspicion of manslaughter.

"There's no doubt in my mind that [Natalee Holloway] is dead. ... I think we have enough evidence to prove the girl is not alive anymore, even without a body," Mos said last week.

Natalee Holloway's mother said she has hope that Mos will be able to solve the case.

"He seems great. The case seems to be handled well. I'm going to ask him some long-awaited questions," she said.

The family is encouraged that the meeting will take place, Holloway attorney John Kelly told CNN. Two years ago, the previous chief prosecutor -- who has since returned to the Netherlands -- would not sit down with them.

Kelly said Beth Holloway and her ex-husband, Dave, want to share information they've gathered since their daughter disappeared in May 2005 while on vacation with about 100 classmates. See a timeline of the case »

Neither he nor Beth Holloway would provide details.

Questions about evidence

Lawyers for the three suspects were in court in Aruba on Thursday on behalf of their clients. They argued that last week's rearrests were baseless and that prosecutors have no new evidence against their clients. They said they have no idea what happened to Holloway.

As he rushed out of the closed hearing before a judge, van der Sloot's lawyer told CNN that authorities have no reason to hold van der Sloot in jail again as they did two years ago. He said the so-called new incriminating evidence is worthless.

"To say it's less than nothing is too much. But it's not very much. It's very, very thin," Ariean de Bie said.

Van der Sloot's parents were allowed to provide him with a Bible but no other reading materials, the lawyer said. Van der Sloot is forbidden from seeing any visitors and can meet only with his lawyers and interrogators.

De Bie said van der Sloot has not provided authorities with any new information since his rearrest and extradition from the Netherlands, where he'd been attending college. He said his client would rather be anywhere than in a prison cell.

"He's not very happy about it," the attorney said.

Van der Sloot's co-counsel -- New York attorney Joe Tacopina -- said he has no doubt his client is innocent.

"Whatever they're holding in their bag, whatever they don't want to show anyone ... it's not going to amount to a hill of beans against Joran van der Sloot because he had no involvement in Natalee's disappearance," Tacopina told CNN.

Tacopina said he'll be in Aruba next week and try to meet with van der Sloot in his jail cell.

Attorneys for the Kalpoe brothers will meet with a judge in separate jailhouse hearings Friday to argue that their clients should be set free and not held another eight days.

A judge will decide whether prosecutors can continue to hold the Kalpoes even longer.

Van der Sloot will have a similar hearing next Friday when prosecutors are expected to ask to keep him jailed another 60 days.

Mos has said he hopes to decide by the end of the year whether he will try all three suspects for Holloway's presumed death, which he suggests was an accident. The prosecutor won't say what his new evidence is until his investigation is complete. (note from me:  I think the reporter used their words and not MOS's words)

New search for remains

The Holloways still have not given up the search for their daughter. In fact, a benefactor is donating an estimated $500,000 to help map the waters offshore.

On Thursday, Natalee's father watched Louis Schaeffer's crew load a boat equipped with the latest sonar equipment and a remote operated vehicle (ROV) to search the waters where Holloway's remains might be.

"I've got a feeling that if she's in the ocean, these guys are gonna find her," Dave Holloway said. "No doubt about it." Watch an interview with Natalee Holloway's father »

Schaeffer said he's retired, has the money, and was touched by the Holloways' tragedy and wanted to help.

"My only objective is to find Natalee, to bring her home for Dave and Beth and also to help identify the people that did this to her. This is a terrible thing, an injustice, and I want to help solve the case," said Schaeffer.

"We've known since [May 2005], the FBI told us Natalee's not with us anymore," Dave Holloway said.

The boat is expected to take about 10 days to get to Aruba. It'll take a few more days to set up a search.

The family says it has no new information about where to look. The Holloways just want to exhaust every area they can offshore with equipment that wasn't available to them two years ago.

Thanks to Schaefer, that's changed.

"We are just so thankful that he's got a big heart and willing to do that," Dave Holloway said.

Don't shoot me for the stack quotes but I wanted this on this page so no one would miss it.

This is wonderful news!  This means everything we have sent to the families can be shared with Mos, not that he needs it or that there is anything he can use but it is good to know he will have it as we did a lot of work, research and thinking.

And the family will share any evidence they have that he does not and he will finally maybe answer their questions!  He is like a real prosecutor instead of an AHATA pawn.

Great news!  Thanks, Klaas.  You are always on top of everything.

.

[robots]

look, here is the best part as to why i think Mos is on our side

the SEARCH with the BOAT going to aruba

he is not STOPPING it, he wants it done
and there aint a chance in hell they are going to go down there without having a real real real good idea as to where she is...

they heard something with the BUGS that were in the houses

BANK IT
BET IT ALL
BET EVERYTHING


K2 and joran are worried and skerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrred like you would not believe

anita and JOE T spewing all week about how there is nothing

BULL CRAP

 

[mrs. red]

I agree Robots....

this is it...

I would bet but it's Christmas time and I am broke... 

but.... I agree with you...

good nite monkeys...

keep the faith!

[Port Valerie]

Is there anything significant in the fact that Beth and JQK are talking to CNN? Are they avoiding Fox? Can Greta only get Taco Joe and nobody else? There's a lot of negative spin coming from Fox. Should we be tracking CNN more? Just asking.

[robots]

i still say PUKE boy was driving a vehicle that night

remember when k2 were talking about a flat tire and it was jorans idea according to K2 ( that whole story)

see, the excuse for joran having to drive that night was because his buddies broke down and joran had to go to the rescue to help them (like meathead would even know how to change a tire"

MORE BULL CRAP

i can see it
i can smell it

it stinks like paulus and joran

[robots]

I agree Robots....

this is it...

I would bet but it's Christmas time and I am broke... 

but.... I agree with you...

good nite monkeys...

keep the faith!

heating oil is bustin all of us up here..
i have been splitting wood for 4 years

i was told i was crazy - who is crazy now 

[robots]

Is there anything significant in the fact that Beth and JQK are talking to CNN? Are they avoiding Fox? Can Greta only get Taco Joe and nobody else? There's a lot of negative spin coming from Fox. Should we be tracking CNN more? Just asking.

greta sucks 

[Anna]

I hope and pray they do find her at long last.  But I am afraid to get my hopes up too high because I can't imagine how they find anything in the ocean.  I know they do but it is all mysterious to me.

But for the first time I am hopeful in spite of myself trying to to expect too much to avoid disappointment if they don't find her.

Robots, I agree, they are doing this based on a TIP was what I think Tim first said.  They are not just going in blindly to search but going to a specific place.

Please let them be successful for the family first and for the investigation next.

.

[robots]

I hope and pray they do find her at long last.  But I am afraid to get my hopes up too high because I can't imagine how they find anything in the ocean.  I know they do but it is all mysterious to me.

But for the first time I am hopeful in spite of myself trying to to expect too much to avoid disappointment if they don't find her.

Robots, I agree, they are doing this based on a TIP was what I think Tim first said.  They are not just going in blindly to search but going to a specific place.

Please let them be successful for the family first and for the investigation next.

.

i will eat my snowthrower if there is not a conviction in this case 

[robots]

I hope and pray they do find her at long last.  But I am afraid to get my hopes up too high because I can't imagine how they find anything in the ocean.  I know they do but it is all mysterious to me.

But for the first time I am hopeful in spite of myself trying to to expect too much to avoid disappointment if they don't find her.

Robots, I agree, they are doing this based on a TIP was what I think Tim first said.  They are not just going in blindly to search but going to a specific place.

Please let them be successful for the family first and for the investigation next.

.

yes, and what they heard will implicate k2 and joran 

[Puzzler]

I agree with Robots.  I've had this thought in the back of my mind for some time now that the search, the timing of the search and the arrest of J2K, Dave, Dutch/Mos, FBI are all in this one together.

Strength in numbers 

[klaasend]

Is there anything significant in the fact that Beth and JQK are talking to CNN? Are they avoiding Fox? Can Greta only get Taco Joe and nobody else? There's a lot of negative spin coming from Fox. Should we be tracking CNN more? Just asking.

I don't think there's anything significant. 

[robots]

"robots, why do you have 12 cord of wood?


robots --- cause im going to need em 

[Anna]

I agree Robots....

this is it...

I would bet but it's Christmas time and I am broke... 

but.... I agree with you...

good nite monkeys...

keep the faith!

heating oil is bustin all of us up here..
i have been splitting wood for 4 years

i was told i was crazy - who is crazy now 

Well, I hope you are right about this.  That would be a wonderful Christmas present for all and a source of comfort for this family to bring her home to Sweet Home Alabama where she belongs.

O/T We have the same thing here with propane being un affordable.  If it got really cold, would be very expensive.  Supplementing with space heaters which are dangerous.

.

[robots]

I agree with Robots.  I've had this thought in the back of my mind for some time now that the search, the timing of the search and the arrest of J2K, Dave, Dutch/Mos, FBI are all in this one together.

Strength in numbers 

yep

no puzzle to figure out there..is there PUZZLER?