Natalee Case Discussion #699 12/1 - 12/3/2007

[crazybabyborg]

Thanks to everyone for answering me. I'm going to chalk that one up as one of life's mysteries, and let it go at that.

I agree about Kimberly. She seems much more on top of things and far more capable of cutting through the crap to get to the obvious.

Speaking of crap; Tacky said he was going to try to get Joran released today................wonder how that will go!?

[Anna]

My dear SB,
With all due respect to you and your position in life, there is not a heterosexual male alive who would recognize a catfight if he fell over it before it came to blows.  At least that has been my experience.  No, calling this a catfight is not what we are saying at all.  They are not fighting over Dave!  Beth has moved on in her life and is fully accepting of his current marriage I am sure.

The problem is that saying Dave came out of this meeting and then went directly to one with this person who has said such horrible things about Beth and Natalee was totally unnecessary.  It was not necessary to even mention these horrid people let alone endorse them.

They have said terrible things about most of us here as well, especially Klaasend because she is the General.  They once had a whole thread devoted to bashing just me, for example.  They quote almost everything Tyler posts and make fun of it.

So it offends me when someone says they are good people, should be consulted, etc.

It makes me wonder what am I doing here.  Then I have to remind myself that I am here for NATALEE and NATALEE only and for those like her MOTHER who are striving to find the truth of what happened to her.

But it is insulting to read that these people who have said these things are ones to be praised. 

It's far from a catfight, it's about the glowing terms with which people who have attacked so many of us, you included on occasion, Natalee and Beth.  We are concerned and puzzled and even hurt by it.   If these people are right, we are all blithering idiots and should shut up and go away.   Well, I'm sure that would make some very happy as they could more easily get on with their lives.

I hope we can just put this behind us and go forward but I did want to at least try to explain why this has hurt some of our feelings.

Now I will drop it.  We have more important things to deal with such as any motions filed today for the early release of Joran.

.

[Anna]

So posting a bold-face lie is just as good as posting the truth?  How does this lead to finding out what happened to Natalee to post lies and slander?

I am missing something here but trying very hard to be accepting of people dealing with things in different ways.

I dont believe you.


Liar.






 

 




Hey, wasn't Jossy looking for some of this?

[sb]

Anna, I haven't read a refugee site in a year or more, so I don't know what they are saying over there about you or Tyler or anyone else. I can figure that it's not nice.

I know that I would deal with people like mip6 and glenda MUCH differently than Dave and Robin have, but that's because I know what it looks like when people embrace you while hiding the knife that is about to be plunged into your back. Dave, being in the insurance business, by rights ought to know this too, for there is no more cutthroat profession around this side of law/politics.

What I was talking about last night had to do with some posters trying to tun the Robin thing into a clash between Robin and Beth. I KNOW you and Tyler and about 95% of the people in here would not sign on to that but there are some (who I think very highly of) who are doing that.

That is NOT what's at issue right now, we need to focus on this case and not on the depths of the dynamics of the relationships in this family.

And yes I agree, I generally wouldn't know what a girl catfight was unless actual blood was spilled right in front of me. 

[Anna]

I feel like I am bringing everybody down so for everybody (except Blah)

[Anna]

Joran's in jail!  

[dennisintn]

Posted by Lazlo at RU (makes sense):

Lazlo Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:06 am   

They probably wanted to question Beth about all the claims made recently by a source called "Trina".

Gielen made it to the newspapers to have "Trina" on tape claming Jug told her Natalee just got out of rehab, and Natalee using her creditcard twice after she disappeared.

They cannot and would not want to ignore this, even the "FBI hearings" made it to the Dutch Parliament even though it was just an internet initiative.

If they go to trial they cannot have "Trina" appearing as a witness making all sort of claims, so they probably confronted Beth with that and whatever else and may have asked her to provide material, to not have any surpises if this goes to trial, IMO 

IMO Trina is the WACKJOB @ BFN who goes by the name 'Observera' ...she is obsessed with her own story of some envelope Beth and Jug received at the Alto Vista Chapel. Trina was the Taxi driver. I think. She is a real flake.

better know in polite circles as observadummy.  those of us who aren't particularly polite have more appropriate names.
dennisintn

[Anna]

Yes, SB,

You are right.  I think this is our best and maybe only shot at justice.  Very important to stay focused on the right things especially now.  Good to see you posting with the early morning monkeys but I do miss the Late Nite Crew and Spooky turning off the lights and all we used to discuss then as well.



Did anyone else find Tito's remark that Beth did not look happy coming out of the meeting totally inappropriate?  She should look happy coming out of a meeting where she was likely told her child was dead for a fact.

Those people have "happy" on the brain!  I thought that was just plain foolish for him to say.  Who would look happy about something like that?  Wishful thinking on his part or else he relishes Beth's misery. 

MO

.

[sb]

Anna you aren't bringing anyone down! You are a big asset to this case.

I wish I had the time to do the research some of you do on all these other sites and I feel like I am missing out on a lot of info. You and several others keep us up to speed on all the garbage they are trying to pull.

I KNOW what those Refugees are. I regard info they spew out as being fatally flawed anyway, as fruit from a poison tree, so I wouldn't make overtures to them like Robin has done.

But we need to remember that we have PLENTY of suspicion about Greta and where she stands, yet Beth still cooperates with her. THAT is the one I find surprising.   

[blah]

I feel like I am bringing everybody down so for everybody (ESPECIALLY Blah!!!)

fixed.
 

[igsigs]

Speaking of crap; Tacky said he was going to try to get Joran released today................wonder how that will go!?

I don't think Taco understands the *system*.

I do know Mos intends to extend Joran's incarceration this week. Which will require the presentation of new evidence.

Which means...TeamSloot has not seen everything yet.

[sb]

And now my Morning Monkey time is up... see y'all tonight!

[Peaches]

Joran's in jail!  

WOOHOOO!

It's a good day already!

[BUCKSHOT]

so... what is next for this case?

joran hearing for additional 60 days.
kalpoes released and probably hanging very low.
TES to arrive later this week and begin search.
other suspects (paulus) on edge and sweating??

anyone heard any specifics about beth/dave meeting with MOS?
fox says they interviewed / interrogated them for about 5 hours.
we know they have both headed home from aruba.
any interviews or specifics given by either ??

has old regime (van derstraaten, jacobs) ruined the possibility of a decent prosecution lead by MOS ?

does everyone think that (a) prosecution will be successful in bringing the case to trial and convicting those guilty of crime(s) or (b) this is dog and pony show number two with a hidden agenda of screwing up this case to the point of no return.

[klaasend]

http://www.amigoe.com/english/

Brothers Kalpoe are outside again



Chief public prosecutor Hans Mos indicated that the OM will appeal the decision of the examining magistrate to release the brothers Kalpoe from custody.

ORANJESTAD – The two fellow suspects of Joran van der Sloot (20), the brothers Deepak (24) and Satish (21) are again released from custody today.  The Public Prosecutor (OM) has requested an extension of the custody today, but the examining magistrate ruled against it.  The OM has meanwhile announced that she will appeal this decision.
The examining magistrate says that it’s true that the current dossier of the two suspects contains serious ‘objections’ against them, but not enough to keep them longer in custody.  Custody based on the current evidence is not allowed.  This evidence was the wiping out of traces of a crime scene and the spiriting away of a body, said a spokesperson of the OM.  The two brothers remain suspects of voluntary manslaughter or in any case, serious bodily harm that resulted in the death of Natalee Holloway.   
Van der Sloot’s mother is according to reports, very happy that the two brothers are outside again, but she doesn’t know what it would mean for her son.  Ten persons were arrested since the disappearance of Holloway, but nobody is officially charged yet.
Chief public prosecutor, Hans Mos finds it striking that the custody of the Kalpoe’s is not extended, while it is based on ‘almost’ the same dossier as that of Van der Sloot.  “Were his objections serious enough to extend his custody? It looks like he has a different role in the case.”

Joran van der Sloot’s custody was extended with eight days early this week.  An extension with 60 days will be considered late next week.  The objection that his lawyer Ariean de Bie has lodged against the restrictions imposed on Van der Sloot, is meanwhile dismissed by the Common Court of the Neth.Antilles and Aruba.  The restrictions were eased a little though since his arrest.  He received a bible and reading matters.  The request to receive visitors, like his mother, brother, a ‘different lawyer’ and friends, was dismissed.  He cannot have contact with other prisoners, he cannot watch TV, he cannot make telephone calls and write letters, and cannot read current reading material, like newspapers and magazines.  He is now allowed to sport under supervision.
 
BETH
In the meantime, the mother of Natalee Holloway, Beth Reynolds (Twitty) has arrived in Aruba.  She and her former husband, Dave Holloway have a meeting with the OM today.  Dave Holloway is also waiting for the arrival of a special investigation-boat to scan the seabed around Aruba again for possible traces of his daughter.  The boat is expected to arrive at the end of next week and allows him to search to a three-kilometer depth.  The former search action only reached a depth of 100 meters.   

[Peaches]

Anna you aren't bringing anyone down! You are a big asset to this case.

I wish I had the time to do the research some of you do on all these other sites and I feel like I am missing out on a lot of info. You and several others keep us up to speed on all the garbage they are trying to pull.

I KNOW what those Refugees are. I regard info they spew out as being fatally flawed anyway, as fruit from a poison tree, so I wouldn't make overtures to them like Robin has done.

But we need to remember that we have PLENTY of suspicion about Greta and where she stands, yet Beth still cooperates with her. THAT is the one I find surprising.   

Beth has parlayed it into air time for Natalee's case.  I have no problem with that.

[BUCKSHOT]

presenting new evidence for further incarceration seems strange to me.

it appears as though prosecutor shows judge a piece of paper with evidence and has the rest of the evidence blacked out. then, at the end of the 8 day period, he shows them the blacked out section to get 8 more days.  at the end of the second 8 day period, he pulls out yet another blacked out section to get their incarceration extended. seem backwards to me.

show them the evidence, and get it on. take them to trial already !!!

[Anna]

Blah, you make me laugh, you are silly!     How in the world can you edit MY post when I can't even do that???     Probably magic of some sort.   


I hope Joran is not released but gets the 60 day treatment.  Add to the 90 plus time he is in there now and we have about 5 months total that he has been in the slammer over this. 

Not saying that is nearly enough for what he has likely done but just saying it is a long time for a young person. . . . .

Other thoughts I am having this morning then I will hush and go to work. . . .

Does anyone else remember a while back Rob was posting some sort of maps of WATER around Aruba with little tacks here and there? 

Huuummmm. . . .

Also anyone who did not read the link Nuts44x4 posted on deep cold water preservation might want to do that.  Maybe she would even post the link again,  I did not save it and now wish I had.  It was excellent information.

While I don't think we should get our hopes up about anything and it is a gristly subject, there is a very, very remote possibility that a sort of mummification can take place of organs and such, common name of grave wax.  I had totally forgotten that there is such a phenomenon.

It should sure concern suspects far more than us, HA! 

Sometimes I just like to give them and their supporters something to think about.

.

[Peaches]

presenting new evidence for further incarceration seems strange to me.

it appears as though prosecutor shows judge a piece of paper with evidence and has the rest of the evidence blacked out. then, at the end of the 8 day period, he shows them the blacked out section to get 8 more days.  at the end of the second 8 day period, he pulls out yet another blacked out section to get their incarceration extended. seem backwards to me.

show them the evidence, and get it on. take them to trial already !!!

I agree, it's totally ridiculous to my way of thinking.  I guess I don't like their system.  Oh well.  I would rather see it all laid out and let the judge draw his conclusions from the total rather than this piecemeal way of looking at things.  Seems like it wastes a lot of time without accomplishing much either.

[igsigs]

so... what is next for this case?

IMO > Sometime in the next week or two charges will be filed. Against Joran - voluntary manslaughter. Against the Kalpoes - destruction of evidence (at minimum).

How strong the case is or how the judges will rule...i cannot guess.