Natalee Case Discussion #700 12/3/2007

[ldstlou]

o/t for quick sec...no ones in the lounge!! My son does his First Reconciliation tonight...in the box and confess it all!! lol I am so nervous!! Hope he doesn't come out crying like is do..eerrr did...errr..hope he doesn't cry!! lol makes people wonder you know!!

[Lala'sMom]

I want to know for certain...I mean no more speculation...about that casino video...Why was Paulus sitting there with Natalee?  If it isn't Paulus...then surely Greta can find this guy and ask him some questions.  Such as...who was Joran really paying attention to that night?  Was it one of the other girls?  What did this guys hear that night?  I know the answers...I just want final clarification...Greta has the means...go find the answers.


Why did this DEA agent on vacation or retired or whatever hinder the investigation in any way?  What did he do?  He was there to help the family find this guy that was last seen with Natalee.  How in the heck did that cause a problem?  He met Charles Croes at a gas station...a gas station for pete's sake! What happened?  This guy needs to get out there an tellus his side of the story.  Just exactly what was said or done by this DEA agent that prevented the prosecution from getting answers?  Heck!  It did not seem to me that the ALE present that night were making any effort to find out anything.  How did the DEA agent know to ask Beth to remain in the car while they talked with Paulus?  Someone tell me...Greta?  Don't you ever do any leg work on your stories? 

Yes, what was Paulus doing with Natalee at 4 AM in the morning?  Where did he picked her up from or where was he planning on taking her?  4 A M!!!  Why doesn't someone find out these details...Greta never seems to notice the things that  just knock you down and beg to be answered? 

I have more, but my BP is up again...I can feel it...

[JusticeforNatalee]

Aruba just wants to put the blame elsewhere; it's just an excuse--blaming the family, DEA agent, media.

Aruba is full of excuses.

But lacking in answers and justice.
-------
Aruba, big day tomorrow. Don't blow it.

[Helen Back]

It was from the decision of the superiour court of Aruba that said basically paulus was lying and had 2 contacts with Natalee and was likely responsible for her disappearance.

Right.  But I don't remember there being a press release about it, if you know what I mean.  How did we become aware of that ruling?  Was it in a Diario article?

[Frank]

It's been here and everywhere for awhile. It was released to the public. Janet has it, she's posted it many time on this forum.

[Observer]

It was from the decision of the superiour court of Aruba that said basically paulus was lying and had 2 contacts with Natalee and was likely responsible for her disappearance.

Right.  But I don't remember there being a press release about it, if you know what I mean.  How did we become aware of that ruling?  Was it in a Diario article?

Yes I have seen the Diario translation and it is posted here on SM

[Helen Back]

It's been here and everywhere for awhile. It was released to the public. Janet has it, she's posted it many time on this forum.

Thanks, Frank. I remember seeing it many times as well. I'll keep looking.

[Frank]

    “With attention to the lying declarations that the son of Paulus, Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (hereafter Joran) gave about his last contact on the 30th of May 2005 with the disappeared Natalee Holloway, the suspicion is not unreasonable that he made himself guilty of a conduct that can be qualified as murder, manslaughter, or kidnapping that resulted in death.
    The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a tapped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court). The tapped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.”

[Puzzler]

I want to know for certain...I mean no more speculation...about that casino video...Why was Paulus sitting there with Natalee?  If it isn't Paulus...then surely Greta can find this guy and ask him some questions.  Such as...who was Joran really paying attention to that night?  Was it one of the other girls?  What did this guys hear that night?  I know the answers...I just want final clarification...Greta has the means...go find the answers.


Why did this DEA agent on vacation or retired or whatever hinder the investigation in any way?  What did he do?  He was there to help the family find this guy that was last seen with Natalee.  How in the heck did that cause a problem?  He met Charles Croes at a gas station...a gas station for pete's sake! What happened?  This guy needs to get out there an tellus his side of the story.  Just exactly what was said or done by this DEA agent that prevented the prosecution from getting answers?  Heck!  It did not seem to me that the ALE present that night were making any effort to find out anything.  How did the DEA agent know to ask Beth to remain in the car while they talked with Paulus?  Someone tell me...Greta?  Don't you ever do any leg work on your stories? 

Yes, what was Paulus doing with Natalee at 4 AM in the morning?  Where did he picked her up from or where was he planning on taking her?  4 A M!!!  Why doesn't someone find out these details...Greta never seems to notice the things that  just knock you down and beg to be answered?  I have more, but my BP is up again...I can feel it...

I've sometimes thought that very thought

[Observer]

[/URL]



Superior Court - Diario - 02-14-2007
The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. (Translation Credit: Diario)
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2007/2/14/

http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/


Superior Court
January, 2007

The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a taped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court).  The taped information and his declaration that  he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.”


---------------------------------------------


Beth Holloway Twitty
'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
September 19, 2005

HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... I don‘t think there was ever a question that Joran and Paulus Van Der Sloot had been in that Excelsior Casino, and, particularly, on the night of the 29th where he and his father met Natalee.

-------------------------------------------------------

Beth Twitty
NANCY GRACE
August 12, 2005

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Oh -- oh, it`s a very critical detail. And the night that we arrived on the island -- you know, Jug does not misinterpret a 4:00 AM time pickup to 11:00 PM. I mean, Paulus Van Der Sloot stated that he picked them up up at 4:00 AM on May the 30th. Then -- we don`t know who they were, but then even as far as June 16 and June 17, Mr. Van Der Sloot was still stating this 4:00 AM pickup. Only until around -- maybe it was when he was picked up or arrested did he change it to 11:00 PM that I had knowledge of.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roy Tromp - lead Investigator
Paulus van der Sloot's Interrogator
CBS NEWS
August 5, 2005

Tromp said investigators believe van der Sloot, who turns 18 on Saturday, is the prime suspect and that he had some assistance from his father, Paul, an apprentice judge on the island. "We believe something went wrong with the girl, and the first person you are going to call is your daddy," said Tromp. "In this case, daddy would know exactly what to do." Tromp, who declined to provide details about exactly what investigators believe happened to Holloway, said that Paul van der Sloot has also changed his account the night Holloway vanished.  "Why should you do that if you are telling the truth?" he said.

[MuffyBee]

o/t for quick sec...no ones in the lounge!! My son does his First Reconciliation tonight...in the box and confess it all!! lol I am so nervous!! Hope he doesn't come out crying like is do..eerrr did...errr..hope he doesn't cry!! lol makes people wonder you know!!

O/T
Lisa ~ I left you a post/message in musings.

Who was it just a few days ago posting at SM that said things would get a lot worse before they got better?  I think sometimes that may be the case.  We aren't in trial mode yet, but I think all along there has been this undermining going on of the character of Natalee, her family and friends and etc.  The closer we seem to get to the truth, the uglier and nastier things seem to get.  It ain't over till it's over...

[Frank]

I have written "on the record" a dozen times with that superior court decision, no response.

Love to hear taco's opinion about that opinion.

[Lala'sMom]

We know that is Paulus..but I want Greta to ask Joe Taco if it's him and then when he says no ask him to provide the person it really is....if it isn't Paulus.  Heck!  If it was any other human on this planet and you were there that night...would you not have already made it known?  Would you not wish to tell your side in hopes that it helps?

[klaasend]

Posted by Lazlo at RU:

Lazlo Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 6:59 pm   

Sentence expected Wednesday.

De rechter op Aruba besluit waarschijnlijk woensdag of de gebroeders Satish en Deepak K. terecht zijn vrijgelaten. Het Gemeenschappelijk Hof van Justitie van de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba liet dinsdag weten ernaar te streven woensdag een uitspraak te doen.

link:  http://tinyurl.com/282pzu


The judge on Aruba will probably decide Wednesday if the release of the brothers Satish and Deepak K. was justified or not.
The Hof of the Common Court of Justice of the Dutch Antilles and Aruba announced Tuesday to strive to pronounce a sentence Wednesday. 

[Anna]

I have written "on the record" a dozen times with that superior court decision, no response.

Love to hear taco's opinion about that opinion.

Frank,
I have never read that as stating for a fact Paulus actually did all that, only that he SAID he did in the course of one fo the many versions of the events he and Joran have fabricated over first weeks.

It is worded in such a convoluted manner, could mean just about anything as their statements always are, IMO.

[Frank]

Anna,

I'm not sure what you mean, "stated as fact?" This was the superior courts own writing.

It's a fact he has lied. It's a fact that the court believes he lied and is likely responsible for her disappearance.

[Anna]

Anna,

I'm not sure what you mean, "stated as fact?" This was the superior courts own writing.

It's a fact he has lied. It's a fact that the court believes he lied and is likely responsible for her disappearance.

It is saying Paulus SAID these things, not that they are true as fact.  Evidently, he stated them to ALE and also was tapped SAYING them but they do not say one word about an eyewitness or other collaboration than Paulus saying these things.

Quote:  The tapped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgment of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.”


Just sharing how I read it, Frank.   You read it differently.  Apparently, most others do as well.  And I have read it a hundred times and always come back to the conclusion it is talking about words from Paulus, not evidence of events that actually happened other than the words of Paulus.  Those are not worth much to me, I guess.

.

[Anna]

Will everyone post any media coverage you see for this evening, please.

Not sure I can take another night of it but will give it my best shot.

.

[klaasend]

Will everyone post any media coverage you see for this evening, please.

Not sure I can take another night of it but will give it my best shot.

.

If it's any consolation, I think Greta was in New Hampshire and will be interviewing Mitt Romney tonight.

I'll keep on the lookout for any coverage.  Most likely tomorrow there will be if the decision comes from the judges regarding K2.

Has anyone heard anything about Joran's attorneys filing a motion to have him released immediately?  His regular hearing is Friday.

[Anna]

Wonder why the Kalpoe attorneys are asking for them to be given all the creature comforts that Joran has asked for if they are so sure this will not be overturned on appeal.

But how stupid would that look to release them then reel them back in two days later?

This whole business of days and new evidence and more days seems much more like a child's board game than a legitimate judicial system.  It is more about inventing rules and regulations than getting at the truth and just plain sucks.

MO

.