Natalee Case Discussion #700 12/3/2007

[blah]

Last week, JoeT said that they were going to file an appeal to have Joran immediately released from jail.  I don't know if that appeal was file but it doesn't look like it.  Tomorrow is the normal day that the judge will look at more evidence from the Prosecutor to see if Joran remains in jail another 60 days.

I might be wrong but I could swear I heard Mos or someone say that these pretrial detentions were not appealable by the suspects?

[NYC_lover]

I have to go for sleeping. I will see u all tomorrow.
Have a great evening!

[blah]

Judge vs. Mos

"...the case file against the brothers S.K. and D.K. does not contain direct indications that Natalee Holloway has died as a result of a violent crime against her. Equally the case file does not contain direct indications of the suspects’ involvement in a violent crime against Natalee..."

But Mos said, publicly, that he could prove that Natalee is dead.  So they're heading towards joran as voluntary manslaughter - er, it appears.

If the case file does not contain the needed "direct indications" as cited, then I wonder what are the indirect indications the file holds. 

Anybody know what "direct indications" are?

.

it says the case files AGAINST THE K2 does not contain direct indications.....

this does not mean that JORANS case file also does not

 

[crazybabyborg]

Obstruction

private eye writes: "...Solving this should be hard, slow work and should begin by prosecuting the weakest link with the strongest evidence and pursuing even small crimes, compared to what we want, because even a small amount of time to be served can force evidence to surface..."

Yes.  You are right.

But Aruban LE and prosector had that and screwed it up.

Had they held deepak as WITNESS on June 9, 2005, instead of naming him SUSPECT and detaining and arresting him, he was wide open on OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE charges that were UNDENIABLE.

Deepak not only submitted intentionally false testimony, he signed statements affirming his intentionally false testimony under the advice of counsel.  He further SUBJORNED OBSTRUCTION by enlisting his brother to corroborate the lie.  He also was open to additional charges for using the internet to transmit his lie, which became the basis for his intentionally false testimony, to an international destination in attempt to forge his alibi.

It is a crime to submit intentionally false testimony.  The crime is obstruction of justice, which could have been compounded with contempt of court charges.

But the Aruban prosecutors failed to prosecute even this obvious crime.

Why?

. 

Hi Hammer! Don't forget to add that he contacted a girl to supply an alibi for him when the Gardner's statement came out and she contacted the FBI to report it.

[klaasend]

Judge vs. Mos

"...the case file against the brothers S.K. and D.K. does not contain direct indications that Natalee Holloway has died as a result of a violent crime against her. Equally the case file does not contain direct indications of the suspects’ involvement in a violent crime against Natalee..."

But Mos said, publicly, that he could prove that Natalee is dead.  So they're heading towards joran as voluntary manslaughter - er, it appears.

If the case file does not contain the needed "direct indications" as cited, then I wonder what are the indirect indications the file holds. 

Anybody know what "direct indications" are?

.

it says the case files AGAINST THE K2 does not contain direct indications.....

this does not mean that JORANS case file also does not

 

We don't know.  Joran was already detained for 8+8 based on the current information.  Tomorrow, the prosecutor will show additional evidence to detain Joran another 60 days.  Evidentally, Joran's attorneys did not appeal and request he be released immediately.

[crazybabyborg]

AND if you read the Police Van conversation transcript, it's OBVIOUS that Deepak requested Steve Croes to back up the Holiday Inn story.

[blah]

Judge vs. Mos

"...the case file against the brothers S.K. and D.K. does not contain direct indications that Natalee Holloway has died as a result of a violent crime against her. Equally the case file does not contain direct indications of the suspects’ involvement in a violent crime against Natalee..."

But Mos said, publicly, that he could prove that Natalee is dead.  So they're heading towards joran as voluntary manslaughter - er, it appears.

If the case file does not contain the needed "direct indications" as cited, then I wonder what are the indirect indications the file holds. 

Anybody know what "direct indications" are?

.

it says the case files AGAINST THE K2 does not contain direct indications.....

this does not mean that JORANS case file also does not

 

We don't know.  Joran was already detained for 8+8 based on the current information.  Tomorrow, the prosecutor will show additional evidence to detain Joran another 60 days.  Evidentally, Joran's attorneys did not appeal and request he be released immediately.

thats why i'm guessing Jorans case file contains the indications Mos was yapping about.

Then again, Mos could have just been yapping with nothing to back it up with

[Dayhiker]

Last week, JoeT said that they were going to file an appeal to have Joran immediately released from jail.  I don't know if that appeal was file but it doesn't look like it.  Tomorrow is the normal day that the judge will look at more evidence from the Prosecutor to see if Joran remains in jail another 60 days.

Joe T lies   

The Judge clearly has a different opinion on Joran but even if he is released I will be extremely disappointed if they don't announce that they are bringing this to trial within the next 3-4 weeks. Unless Mos is a total liar,he says that he has other evidence that he will not release unless there is a trial. It's time for this 45 person team to prosecute or finish the cover up.

Unless Mos is a total liar


This is my concern. Remember Karin Janssen's numerous feints and bluffs that turned out to be total bullshit? Is Mos another Janssen or Nifong?

I thought a lot of the guy when he first arrested the trio but my opinion of him went south when he blamed the family, DEA and media for the case not being solved. If he believes that he is way out in left field.

[blah]

does anyone really expect Joran to remain in jail past tomorrow?

[crazybabyborg]

AND if you read the Police Van conversation transcript, it's OBVIOUS that Deepak requested Steve Croes to back up the Holiday Inn story.

Joran: They talk good about me, but not good about you.  And also the two security guards, they have guaranteed me that they will kill you two, if you go out of jail.
Deepak: Oh, yes.
Joran:  Who has declared about the security guards, you no tme. Why? because I don't want to put anyone in trouble who has nothing to do with the case.
Deepak or Satish:(screaming) That lie was for you.
Joran: You admitted that.
Deepak or Satish:(screaming) That lie was for you.
Joran:  You two paid him off, right.
Brothers:   ha ha ha ha ha ha
Joran:  You said then via the telephone like, that I have the jackpot. You said now [?] through the phone , I have the fxxxing jackpot. You forget that the phone is tapped, right?
Satish or Deepak:  Shut your trap [hou je bek]
Joran:  You forget that, right +++++? Then you arrive home and you say how you arranged everything. You say "I have fixed it". Good for you [meaning your own fault]. because of you he is also in jail.

[Dayhiker]

thats why i'm guessing Jorans case file contains the indications Mos was yapping about.

Then again, Mos could have just been yapping with nothing to back it up with

Tomorrow should be the tale of the tape Blah. If he fails tomorrow he's in trouble unless these arrests were just part of some grand scheme to allow them to talk. From what we hear there was very little interrogation going on.

[klaasend]

does anyone really expect Joran to remain in jail past tomorrow?

Based on past experience, no.  If he does get another 60 days I will be very happy.

[Peaches]

Blaming the victim is lame.  The ALE couldn't do their job because of the media?  Why?  Were they planning to do their job?  Were they just "fixin' to" do their job? 

Mos better have some big guns.  I've been patient.  I want to hope he has a plan and that whether the Kalpoes are in or out is immaterial.   

Come on, Mos.  Show us what ya got.  I'm going to continue to boycott all things Aruban and Dutch just because they pissed me off.  Their behavior is uncivilized.

My beer is getting warm.

[Nut44x4]

does anyone really expect Joran to remain in jail past tomorrow?

no

[Dayhiker]

does anyone really expect Joran to remain in jail past tomorrow?

Not if Mos track record is an indicator. 

[Tamikosmom]

Last week, JoeT said that they were going to file an appeal to have Joran immediately released from jail.  I don't know if that appeal was file but it doesn't look like it.  Tomorrow is the normal day that the judge will look at more evidence from the Prosecutor to see if Joran remains in jail another 60 days.

Joe T lies   

The Judge clearly has a different opinion on Joran but even if he is released I will be extremely disappointed if they don't announce that they are bringing this to trial within the next 3-4 weeks. Unless Mos is a total liar,he says that he has other evidence that he will not release unless there is a trial. It's time for this 45 person team to prosecute or finish the cover up.

Unless Mos is a total liar


This is my concern. Remember Karin Janssen's numerous feints and bluffs that turned out to be total bullshit? Is Mos another Janssen or Nifong?

I thought a lot of the guy when he first arrested the trio but my opinion of him went south when he blamed the family, DEA and media for the case not being solved. If he believes that he is way out in left field.

Dayhiker ... unless refuted by Beth Holloway ... John Q Kelly's words are the foundation I derive my opinion from in regards to Hans Mos' credibility.

Janet

+++++++++++++++++++++++

Holloway Attorney: 'Extraordinarily Painful'
Tuesday, December 04, 2007

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: ... And the Kalpoe brothers are free. Satish and Deepak Kalpoe walked out of jail on Saturday. John Q. Kelly, the lawyer for Natalee's parents, spent the weekend with the Holloways in Aruba and met with the prosecutor, Hans Mos. Will there be an appeal? What's going to happen next? What do the Holloways think about all of this? All these questions for John Q. Kelly, who joins us in New York ....

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,314966,00.html

[crazybabyborg]

Is there such a thing as Obstruction of Justice in Aruba? Wouldn't justice have to exist for someone to be able to obstruct it?

[Dayhiker]

Is there such a thing as Obstruction of Justice in Aruba? Wouldn't justice have to exist for someone to be able to obstruct it?

  Is there such thing as Justice in Aruba at all may be the better question CBB. Obstructing justice would probably carry a penalty of no lolipops for a week.

[Angiex911dsptchr]

does anyone really expect Joran to remain in jail past tomorrow?

  IMO  No.. guess I won't streak thru the cage and down my street anytime soon.
 This all sucks big donkey **** !

[the big hammer]

Joran's Detention: 8+8

klaas writes: "...Joran was already detained for 8+8 based on the current information..."

Hi klaas!

Do you know what the chronology was for joran's detention?  Was there a seperate hearing, after his initial 8 day detention?  And during that hearing he was slapped with an additional 8 days?

Or was he just nailed with 8+8?

The longer detention time suggests that whatever is in joran's case file which relates to his own criminal acts, is stronger than the kalpoe case file relating to their criminal acts.

.