Natalee Case Discussion #703 12/8 - 12/11//2007

[yapperz1]

If this could have been solved from behind a keyboard, I believe we would have done it by now.  It is going to take people actually there like OceanExplorer now.

Does anyone have that post about Mary never heard the buoy?  Maybe Ocean Explorer has never seen it and would be interested.  Not necessarily to try to look there unless there is a buoy at that exact mileage or something clicks with other information.

I don't do Shango any more so I don't have it now.

.

Anna, I think those of us behind a keyboard stand/stood a better chance of solving this than any of the PTB on Aruba. At least WE tried to get to the truth!!!!

[Scandi]

Wreck,
Not you, didn't do anything wrong.  Mrs Red feels everybody stops posting when she posts sometimes.  She was trying to get the discussion going again.

Hi Anna,  Mrs Red was interested in a prayer vigil before the Persistance takes off to search.  I think it is a wonderful idea, as no matter how we posters vascilate in what we discuss, we all know the power of prayer.  Have you ever done that here before or know how it would be planned?  xox 

PS:  I don't post much, but always enjoy you.  Your mind is always on go!  YaYa

[longhaul]

I didn't mean to derail the conversation... i was lurking and reading back and just got madder and madder

Derail as in TRAIN WRECK?

????

still waiting ... what did I say/do wrong????
[/quot



Wreck, Probably messed up quotes again but u said nothing wrong.  Keepupthecheerleading, think we all need it now

[Dihannah1]

Klaas, you have mail!   At both gmail and cox addresses...

[AZLady]

Here you go, Anna.  I seem to be posting this message more and more often.

http://www.aruba-bb.com/viewforum.php?f=14
bakabl wrote:
Frist Im vary sorry to hear of the vary sad case of Natalee Holloway in such a wonderful place like Aruba but it could happen anywere at any time. There are a few questions that need to be asked of the two men that the FBI are questioning - 1st ask them about the drink that was given to Natalee around 3:15am Aruba Time the morring Natalee never retyrn to her hotel and ask them about what the drug was in the drink that Natalee drunk without her knowing. 2nd ask them about the boat and the 2-1/2 mile trip they took.

They should break dowm and tell the truth about are were Natalee can be found.

[klaasend]

Klaas, you have mail!   At both gmail and cox addresses...

Hi Dihannah - got it and responded!

Time to call it a night now...GOODNIGHT ALL!

[AZLady]

Someone was commenting a while back about two things in the video of Paulus at the Blackjack table that jumped out at me.  One, some people thought he had a videocamera and/or a small silver camera or cigarette box in front of him.  Two, someone commented on his action of reaching down under the table.  Both of these are indications of cheating.  In most casinos, cameras are not allowed and nothing is allowed to sit on the table.  These devices can be used to read marked cards.  A player is to keep both hands on the table in a casino because devices can be used, and even attached underneath a table, to assist a player in keeping a hole card to be used when it is to his benefit. 

I believe that Paulus is a cheater and heavily involved in the money-laundering that are the Aruban casinos' sole reason for existence.  Apparently, if we picked up his clumsy attempts to cheat on a video of only a few seconds, Paulus is not very adept at his game.  On the other hand, when playing with a table of naive 18 year old girls who have no idea what they are doing, he didn't need to be very skilled.  He just needed someone to blur that video sufficiently so the world didn't immediately spot his clumsy cheating.  Paulus, Paulus, Paulus--your game is so obvious that even a novice like me can see what you are doing.  That's what happens when the pickings are easy and the players get sloppy.

[ldstlou]

I still say that "MOS" needs to look at this site  http://arubassilence.bravehost.com/chicago.html
to see exactly who is in the video, and go from there to get the truth.  Question some of those people over again.  Aru-Bay I feel tells alot.  Any input on that?

Hotshot - there are so many things.  Aru-bay videos, Casino Video, piece of Natalee's top picked up by the Ranger...it's endless.

That is a great point Hotshot!! Mos would know who they are. I can't believe after 2 1/2 years we never did find out who it was in those videos!! crazy!!

[ldstlou]

i find the post interesting but im not sure i believe it.

its certainly possible.. but i think she is on land

I agree robots.

Me too.  I've always thought that.

hi noly, im not going to throw out the possibility of a boat but it seems like
then you have too many people involved... ummmm im not sure but that is what it seems to me..
land fill - seems much less complicated - especially when you have people not allowing you to search that area 

that freaking landfill is/was toxic too... red has a huge scar from that place... like a chemical burn...

and then Julia the evil bitch, came on here and laughed about how they told them the landfill didn't have anything...etc.  Tim, Dave, eveyONE was sick after that landfill was  searched... of course for it only to be filled in and set fire to...

I fear that is where they hid Natalee.... but I want to be wrong and them find her in the ocean....


and I still say there are no innocent arubans because someone, somewhere knows and just won't say....

I agree there are plenty who know Mrs. Red. It makes me mad your husband and Dave and others had to wade through that mess, but it also warms my heart that there were such great people who stood by Dave's side to do it!!

[ldstlou]

WTF???  I'm gone for a few hours and come back to see this??? I'm still back on page 5..will catch up in a minute.  

I was looking back in the thread and looked at this picture again and I wanted to point out the sweat outline on Paulus shirt 

Eewwwwww, I didn't notice his baggage before. 

Double EEEWWW!!! It is 4:30 am!! Woke up early and haven't even finished my 1st cup of coffee...that is just too gross for words!!! Look at all the sweat too!! AAAHHH!! It's like a nightmare..lol..am I really awake?

[MumInOhio]

Someone was commenting a while back about two things in the video of Paulus at the Blackjack table that jumped out at me.  One, some people thought he had a videocamera and/or a small silver camera or cigarette box in front of him.  Two, someone commented on his action of reaching down under the table.  Both of these are indications of cheating.  In most casinos, cameras are not allowed and nothing is allowed to sit on the table.  These devices can be used to read marked cards.  A player is to keep both hands on the table in a casino because devices can be used, and even attached underneath a table, to assist a player in keeping a hole card to be used when it is to his benefit. 

I believe that Paulus is a cheater and heavily involved in the money-laundering that are the Aruban casinos' sole reason for existence.  Apparently, if we picked up his clumsy attempts to cheat on a video of only a few seconds, Paulus is not very adept at his game.  On the other hand, when playing with a table of naive 18 year old girls who have no idea what they are doing, he didn't need to be very skilled.  He just needed someone to blur that video sufficiently so the world didn't immediately spot his clumsy cheating.  Paulus, Paulus, Paulus--your game is so obvious that even a novice like me can see what you are doing.  That's what happens when the pickings are easy and the players get sloppy.

Found this in Msmaple's Murder and Crime thread...
SunFreak2 posted this on LCD 01/25/2007, also re. the above posts.


Quote
At the Caribbean Financial Action Task Force in 1997 - Rick Smid (now Judge Smid) was the expert on Money Laundering in the Casino & Gaming Industry!!! See reference below. I found this many months ago and wondered if Judge Smid now heads up the illegal money laundering operations in the Caribbean. It makes sense to me that an expert on money laundering could decide to go to the "dark side" as he would know all the ins & outs and how to avoid the law.

Smid is the Judge who freed Joran, Freddie, K2 in September 2005. He supposedly is Paulus's good buddy. Could Paulus be in cahoots with Smid in the money laundering biz? Maybe Joran & Guido were in on it too.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference
Aruba - July 16-17, 1997

The Nature and Extent of Money Laundering in the Casino and Gaming Industry
Hon. Tennyson R.G. Wells, AG and Minister of Justice-The Bahamas
Mr. Rick Smid, National Public Prosecutor-Netherlands

source: http://www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/ click on Casino & Gaming
 
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anna's reply....
This was allegedly Karin Janssen's area of expertise as well, prior to her leaving The Netherlands for Aruba.  I have often wondered if there was a connection between her and Judge Smid in this regard and if they knew each other prior to coming to the islands.

Was the idea for these two to prosecute cases of money-mishandling or participate in them?  Odd that they both would have that particular area of knowledge.

[MumInOhio]

quote from Magnolia
Mos came out with guns ablazin'.

He said that he has Explosive new evidence.
He said that he had proof that Natalee was dead.
He said that the father was definately involved.
He was willing to talk.
He gave us all hope and made us believe in him. (except San)

What happened to him?  Who got to him?
Just before the Kalpoes were released he suddenly canceled
a news conference and his next interview he blamed the
family, the media and the DEA agent. He was suddenly
like a different man.
Where is the explosive new evidence? 
How did he know that the Kalpoes disposed of the body?

It is all goofy!


Thank you, Magnolia.

  Maybe Judge Smid got to Mr Mos. I have been looking for information on both he and Wit since the last time Ramm was here defending their decisions. As is with Archer, there is not a lot out there about Judge H.C. ‘Rick’ Smid, Smit, Smitt and Judge Jacob ‘Bob’ Wit, Witt.

Smid was the principal player in this case. He ruled on the DNA and released the suspects among other things.

Wit was at the van der Sloots, with Vocking the day the search warrant was serve in 2005. He was appointed to the Caribbean Court of Justice on June 1st 2005, so why was he there to limit that warrant. Did he have the authority?

Lala’s…where do Smid/Wit, either or both, fit in as Dirty Hand/dirty hand?

[Silverfox]

Someone was commenting a while back about two things in the video of Paulus at the Blackjack table that jumped out at me.  One, some people thought he had a videocamera and/or a small silver camera or cigarette box in front of him.  Two, someone commented on his action of reaching down under the table.  Both of these are indications of cheating.  In most casinos, cameras are not allowed and nothing is allowed to sit on the table.  These devices can be used to read marked cards.  A player is to keep both hands on the table in a casino because devices can be used, and even attached underneath a table, to assist a player in keeping a hole card to be used when it is to his benefit. 

I believe that Paulus is a cheater and heavily involved in the money-laundering that are the Aruban casinos' sole reason for existence.  Apparently, if we picked up his clumsy attempts to cheat on a video of only a few seconds, Paulus is not very adept at his game.  On the other hand, when playing with a table of naive 18 year old girls who have no idea what they are doing, he didn't need to be very skilled.  He just needed someone to blur that video sufficiently so the world didn't immediately spot his clumsy cheating.  Paulus, Paulus, Paulus--your game is so obvious that even a novice like me can see what you are doing.  That's what happens when the pickings are easy and the players get sloppy.

Found this in Msmaple's Murder and Crime thread...
SunFreak2 posted this on LCD 01/25/2007, also re. the above posts.


Quote
At the Caribbean Financial Action Task Force in 1997 - Rick Smid (now Judge Smid) was the expert on Money Laundering in the Casino & Gaming Industry!!! See reference below. I found this many months ago and wondered if Judge Smid now heads up the illegal money laundering operations in the Caribbean. It makes sense to me that an expert on money laundering could decide to go to the "dark side" as he would know all the ins & outs and how to avoid the law.

Smid is the Judge who freed Joran, Freddie, K2 in September 2005. He supposedly is Paulus's good buddy. Could Paulus be in cahoots with Smid in the money laundering biz? Maybe Joran & Guido were in on it too.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference
Aruba - July 16-17, 1997

The Nature and Extent of Money Laundering in the Casino and Gaming Industry
Hon. Tennyson R.G. Wells, AG and Minister of Justice-The Bahamas
Mr. Rick Smid, National Public Prosecutor-Netherlands

source: http://www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/ click on Casino & Gaming
 
 Report to moderator    Logged 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anna's reply....
This was allegedly Karin Janssen's area of expertise as well, prior to her leaving The Netherlands for Aruba.  I have often wondered if there was a connection between her and Judge Smid in this regard and if they knew each other prior to coming to the islands.

Was the idea for these two to prosecute cases of money-mishandling or participate in them?  Odd that they both would have that particular area of knowledge.

Ooh you are getting warmer... and remember...Paulus used to handle contacts and "delicate" matters for Rudy Croes... now connect the dots... Contracts include the casinos, right? The government of Aruba, I am told, receives substantial revenues from those same casinos...Who does Posner pay?  "Under" the table (like in the casino video) slight of hand might be coming at all levels... If you can get the courts and the minister of justice in your pocket you are well insulated, right?  Where else in the World would Posner be able to operate a casino after what happened to him in the US...????

[MumInOhio]

Hi Siverfox, Helen Back was asking if you have any links on Posner/Smid? TIA

[Silverfox]

Hi Siverfox, Helen Back was asking if you have any links on Posner/Smid? TIA

No not directly... you have to connect the dots and follow the money...

I am assuming that this is what the separate "corruption" investigation is all about that the Dutch investigators were "also" working on when they came to Aruba.  I think perhaps father sloot was already being investigated due to his position in the judiciary as well as his past connection to the Justice Ministry == hence the first set of wiretaps ...

I think he should be very careful... If there is a mob connection at play here they do not like "loose ends and loose cannons'.... is he a liabiity?  who knows... but obviously he lost his judge opportunity prior to nat's disappearance...obviously he got special favors at the casinos and passed those on to his son... obviously he had connections in high places in government....

Remember how the mob cleaned up the casino gaming problems in the early days of vegas?  If there is a connection here then you can bet that sooner or later some "clean-up" might take place since he may have outlived his usefulness with all this publicity.

Smid's credentials on the other hand suggest that he has very deep knowledge of how things are done in the money laundering and casino business.  How in the world did the justices allow Posner to obtain the right to run a casino and happened to the missing HI manager (he is still missing, right?)... or was he ever?  maybe I got him mixed up with someone else.

[MumInOhio]

Silverfox I thought Posner was still around, but honestly not sure. He may have left just after this all started and came back. He has been discussed a lot here in the past two and a half years. Will have to go back and refresh my memory. Thanks!

[MumInOhio]

O/T...Lady Devon, if you see this, would you please go over to the Monkey Musings thread and look at Ibe's post at the bottom of page 13. Any info on this would be appreciated. TIA

[Nut44x4]

http://joranvandersloot.blogspot.com/2006/02/joran-goes-on-record-we-just-got-back.html
  March 2006....at 8:41 Pm

I just wanna say once you go to that page scroll way down near the bottom to see it, as there are hundreds of posts on there,from several days...scroll way down

That's right around the time he/she stopped updating the blog.  The comment section was left open for a long time.  Shoot, you can probably still comment on it now unless comments are moderated. But as far as new posts on the blog they stopped around March 2006.

I remember reading that too! Klaas...can you get a screenshot in case it goes 'poof'???

[Nut44x4]

seems very possible but im not sure it could have happened that same night

i guess it could have....but

The post doesn't say which night 

[Nut44x4]

quote from Magnolia
Mos came out with guns ablazin'.

He said that he has Explosive new evidence.
He said that he had proof that Natalee was dead.
He said that the father was definately involved.
He was willing to talk.
He gave us all hope and made us believe in him. (except San)

What happened to him?  Who got to him?
Just before the Kalpoes were released he suddenly canceled
a news conference and his next interview he blamed the
family, the media and the DEA agent. He was suddenly
like a different man.
Where is the explosive new evidence? 
How did he know that the Kalpoes disposed of the body?

It is all goofy!


Thank you, Magnolia.

  Maybe Judge Smid got to Mr Mos. I have been looking for information on both he and Wit since the last time Ramm was here defending their decisions. As is with Archer, there is not a lot out there about Judge H.C. ‘Rick’ Smid, Smit, Smitt and Judge Jacob ‘Bob’ Wit, Witt.

Smid was the principal player in this case. He ruled on the DNA and released the suspects among other things.

Wit was at the van der Sloots, with Vocking the day the search warrant was serve in 2005. He was appointed to the Caribbean Court of Justice on June 1st 2005, so why was he there to limit that warrant. Did he have the authority?

Lala’s…where do Smid/Wit, either or both, fit in as Dirty Hand/dirty hand?

  mmmmmmmmm...A Judge HANDS down a ruling ...in the opinion of most, that ruling HANDED down is wrong...
DIRTY HAND !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!