Natalee Case Discussion #707 12/22 - 12/28/2007

[robots]

When I say that God works in mysterious ways, it was something that was said to me by a Reverend that I saw as part of a healing therapy.
I can't get specific, but it had to do with a murder of someone who kinda deserved it. Someone who had harmed me. I had been consumed by anger for a year or two and would plot my revenge as the court case was blown.
I made a choice to not let that anger define me and rule all of my future actions. 
Then, someone else murdered the person, similar crime against someone else.
But, it did not help me.
Wow, someone gave me the blabber-juice for brekkie.
.
If something happened to J2K, Natalee is still gone and the harm to her family and loved ones is done.   

i hear ya loud and clear
 

but when people keep jamming the knife in Beth and Dave it is too much


stop hurting them is what normal people want, and yet the authorities in this case
never cease to amaze me with their BS antics, blame game, inept corruptness.

[Kat_Gram]

The J2K will reap what they sow. Taco has five kids. He will have some tribulations of his own at some point and then maybe he will have an epithany. Sooner or later. And I hope I am aound to see that day. I too admire Dave, Beth, Jug, etc and several other people, Mark Lunsford ( who I suspect had some very rough edges of his own ) and they are better people than me, who has to work at being an ok person every day of my life.
 

[robots]

What is a Boycott?

Each time you purchase a product, you are endorsing the product and the corporation that produced it whether you meant to or not. Likewise, by choosing not to buy a certain product, you can protest irresponsible corporate behavior. By voting with our dollars in this way, consumers have the power to change the way corporations do business.

When many consumers agree to abstain from buying a certain product it is called a boycott. Boycotts are a way to use our power as consumers as a force for positive social change. Boycotts are effective because when successful they result in increased public scrutiny of a company. This in turn causes concern inside the corporation about loss profits from deceased consumer interest and corporations are always concerned about the financial bottom line.

Boycotts are a tool for holding corporations accountable for any policies that negatively affect people and the environment. When you join a boycott, be sure to let the company being boycotted know why you are choosing not to purchase its products. This ensures that the corporation hears what changes it needs to make to earn your business.

Boycotts are an effective way to put your money where your values are.

guess who got 10 SNAIL MAIL letters this week ?

 

[robots]

how do you kill tourism in aruba ?

one ticket at a time 

[robots]

i think i had some blabber juice this morning also

 

[Observer]

Yes, I was just curious as to why the Sloots would be mentioning Lorenzo since he has absolutely no connection to them and I have never read of any of them so much as saying his name, not even Joran in his tell-all book.

Scubajap was the first I recall inventing the "illegitimate son" tale.  I notice Mos has no such delusions.

But then she also called Joran's bruises the next day "hickies" as a level of her truthfulness.  Any salacious story is good for her and Julia.

According to Jossy,Lorenzo is connected to the sloots and is very close to Joran. He has said that several times now.

[Tamikosmom]

I think everyone here needs to take a deep breath. Some have made comments on the front page and Im told in the forum recently and in the past that call for violence againt those suspects or persons of interest in this case, and some cases even the death of those involved.
I know emotions are high but I have the folowing satement to make

I do not and will never support threats of violence or any criminal action agaisnt any of the persons of interest in this case.
Crappy justice system or not that is no way to solve this case. And those that post messages even if they are joking in that manner should be ashamed.

Well then I should take responsibility for the things I have said.  I believe in an eye for an eye.  If something happened to one of the suspects I would be one happy person.  What Aruba/Holland/Sloots did to the Holloway family is unforgiving.  I have waited for justice in this case for the past 2 1/2 years and watched the Sloots laugh in the face of the law and the world.  So if this makes me a bad person then I can live with it.

San ... I feel your frustration and ... if I fail to remain focused on my Absolute God ... my thoughts reflect your.

However ... unless it is an act of self-defence or the act of defending another ... I believe that criminal justice is the sole responsibility of government.  If government fails in the responsibility of administering justice and ... we were to take justice into our own hand ... we would in then be living in a society ruled by anachary ... not laws.  The democratic system is not perfect but ... the alternative is frightening to contemplate.

San ... our Heavenly Father loves Natalee Holloway and ... is the author of her life story.  The first chapter was written prior to Natalee's conception and ... the last chapter has yet to be revealed.  I wish I could peek at that last chapter ... it would take away much of the frustration and anger that I often feel at my lack of understanding of God's ways.  Waiting on the Heavenly Father to reveal His perfect plan/will is so difficult.  However ... this is when believers ... children of God must act out of love, trust and faith.

I apologize if this post crosses a line but ... my heart led me to share my thoughts.

Love, Janet

++++++

Romans 8:28
We know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.

Janet, you never cross the line.

Thank you San.

Hey ... faith and action go hand in hand.  Us Monkeys must not give up in exposing the corrupt Aruban investigation that has denied an American citizen the justice she rightly deserves under Dutch law.  Maybe a door has been slammed in the face of justice by the Aruban investigation but ... there are legal avenues of opportunies available if we look through some of those open window afforded by a democratic system.  I believe that our anger and frustrations should be focused on the media ... the American administrations ... peaceful protests ...

We cannot let Natalee Holloway become a distance memory ... we cannot let Aruba win!!

Janet

++++++++

Galatians 6:9
Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

[Kat_Gram]

The more people that know what a dangerous place Aruba is, the better.
I am not coming a this in a spiteful way either, but from the viewpoint of :
J2K were targeting young American girls, well it doesn't matter where they are from, does it ? And this activity was going on and no one was seeing anything.
In fact, they all seemed quite proud of themselves for it.
Then when " something bad happens ", it is everyone else's fault except for the offenders. And they come from far and wide to defend these animals. They start defense funds. They throw out a bunch of bloggy crap giving reasons why the guilty are innocent. They make slurs about the family of a much loved girl. They are  just as evil as the J2K.
ps, never cook while posting. make sure the stove is on LOW

[San]

I think everyone here needs to take a deep breath. Some have made comments on the front page and Im told in the forum recently and in the past that call for violence againt those suspects or persons of interest in this case, and some cases even the death of those involved.
I know emotions are high but I have the folowing satement to make

I do not and will never support threats of violence or any criminal action agaisnt any of the persons of interest in this case.
Crappy justice system or not that is no way to solve this case. And those that post messages even if they are joking in that manner should be ashamed.

Well then I should take responsibility for the things I have said.  I believe in an eye for an eye.  If something happened to one of the suspects I would be one happy person.  What Aruba/Holland/Sloots did to the Holloway family is unforgiving.  I have waited for justice in this case for the past 2 1/2 years and watched the Sloots laugh in the face of the law and the world.  So if this makes me a bad person then I can live with it.

San ... I feel your frustration and ... if I fail to remain focused on my Absolute God ... my thoughts reflect your.

However ... unless it is an act of self-defence or the act of defending another ... I believe that criminal justice is the sole responsibility of government.  If government fails in the responsibility of administering justice and ... we were to take justice into our own hand ... we would in then be living in a society ruled by anachary ... not laws.  The democratic system is not perfect but ... the alternative is frightening to contemplate.

San ... our Heavenly Father loves Natalee Holloway and ... is the author of her life story.  The first chapter was written prior to Natalee's conception and ... the last chapter has yet to be revealed.  I wish I could peek at that last chapter ... it would take away much of the frustration and anger that I often feel at my lack of understanding of God's ways.  Waiting on the Heavenly Father to reveal His perfect plan/will is so difficult.  However ... this is when believers ... children of God must act out of love, trust and faith.

I apologize if this post crosses a line but ... my heart led me to share my thoughts.

Love, Janet

++++++

Romans 8:28
We know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.

Janet, you never cross the line.

Thank you San.

Hey ... faith and action go hand in hand.  Us Monkeys must not give up in exposing the corrupt Aruban investigation that has denied an American citizen the justice she rightly deserves under Dutch law.  Maybe a door has been slammed in the face of justice by the Aruban investigation but ... there are legal avenues of opportunies available if we look through some of those open window afforded by a democratic system.  I believe that our anger and frustrations should be focused on the media ... the American administrations ... peaceful protests ...

We cannot let Natalee Holloway become a distance memory ... we cannot let Aruba win!!

Janet

++++++++

Galatians 6:9
Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

BOYCOTT EVERYTHING ARUBAN.  TELL PEOPLE TO STOP GOING THERE.  AFTER ALL THEY HAVE SO MUCH MONEY FROM ALL THE DRUGS AND LAUNDERING THEY REALLY DON'T NEED OURS 

WHEN THE MONEY STOPS FLOWING TO ARUBA AND THE COMMON PEOPLE START SUFFERING BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL LOSE JOBS AND WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THEIR FAMILY THEN PEOPLE WILL WAKE UP.

PEOPLE LIKE THE SLOOTS AND RUDY CROES ARE POCKETING ALL THE MONEY AND THEY WILL NEVER SUFFER LIKE THE COMMON PEOPLE.

IT'S TIME FOR THE COMMON PEOPLE TO STEP UP AGAINST THEIR GOVERNMENT.

IF THEY DON'T WE NEED TO CONTINUE TO PUT THE PRESSURE AND NOT HAVE OUR HARD EARNED MONEY GO THERE.

[Kat_Gram]

i think i had some blabber juice this morning also

 

Yes but did you get Supersized ? With the blabber-juice ?
Do you think I would make a good juror  ?  I have been called for jury selection LOL. For the biggie ( murder, etc. ) trials in our Queen's Bench. I would love to do it, but I am way too human. That has been on my mind and it has set off something that I had put away for all times.
SIL had dreamt up a T-shirt for me to wear, with a noose and : Hang 'em High written on it.
I must respect the monkeys or I am at the who gives a crap stage in my life, thank you for allowing me to share a bit.

[Observer]

Translation by Getagrip:

Public Ministry gave erroneous information

According to attorney Wix, Deepak, Satish and Joran can no longer be investigated

Diario Aruba
12/22/2007

ORANJESTAD(AAN): Friday morning, at the offices of attorneys Ronny Wix, David Kock and Elgin Zeppenveld, a press conference was held in which the attorneys for Satish and Deepak Kalpoe reacted to what was brought forward during the last press conference by the Public Ministry related to the case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.

Atorney Wix brought up that there are various matters that were raised by the Public Ministry that are not totally correct. The lawyers continued saying that the Public Ministry, in an unusual manner, went into the details of the case on Thursday, when they mentioned among other things two facts that they considered to be new evidence in this case, which led them to the detention of the 3 suspects.

Wix said that according to the O.M., Deepak Kalpoe said that Natalee Holloway was dead, but at no time did Deepak say this. According to the lawyer, in the same period of time there was a conversation between Deepak and a friend of his in which they spoke of the Natalee case, but they also spoke about a tennis instructor that Deepak knows who died in Conchi.

In this conversation, Deepak spoke of the death of this person and not of Natalee. The conversation was in Papiamento and in the translation into Dutch, for “su morto” [his/her death], they put “haar dood” [her death], while clearly Deepak was speaking of the death of the male tennis instructor.

The Hof also realized that the O.M. took this out of context. Another of the two parts of the supposed new evidence was a conversation between Satish and a female friend of his from Suriname, where the O.M. said that the girl stated that during the conversation Satish sounded sad.

According to Wix, between the 5th of May and 6th of June 2005, which is two and a half years ago, there were 24 conversations between this girl and Satish, which were long.

This makes it difficult to remember which day this supposed conversation took place. This conversation could have also taken place before Natalee disappeared.

They interviewed the girl in June 2007 and this surely makes it difficult to remember exactly what day this conversation took place.

How could it be that if the O.M. says that the conversation was exactly on May 30? According to Wix, last month the prosecutor said that they had new evidence and that they would arrest and now he says that he doesn’t have enough evidence and that they will no longer consider them suspects.

This means that the O.M. lied a month ago or is lying now. The lawyer also said that it is not completely true what prosecutor Mos said Thursday, since at the same time that the case ends, the 3 former suspects remain suspects.

According to Wix, nothing is further from the truth. Now that the 3 boys are no longer suspects, the Public Ministry is no longer free to question the innocence of these persons.

This means that authorities cannot conduct an investigation on them. The lawyer also said that what he is unhappy with is that the chief prosecutor Mos and P.G. Jorg basically said that they will stop the case, among other things because the boys made use of their right to remain silent and that because of this the O.M. could not solve the case.

This implies that the kids know something and are not talking. This, according to Wix, is because his clients have given more than 20 statements; therefore the O.M. cannot say that they have not talked.

They have said everything that they had to say. During the last detention the former suspects told authorities that they have said everything they know and that if there was something new, they were willing to give a comment on this. Given that there wasn’t anything new, they didn’t say anything.

[translated by Getagrip]

http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2007/12/public-ministry-gave-erroneous.html

[Tamikosmom]

I knew that Aruba would reconsider their position regarding the closing of the Natalee Holloway case.  It is my understanding ... as long as the case is open ... allowed to become a cold case ... the family/FBI are not legally entitled to the documents contained in the case file.

Janet

+++++++


DECEMBER 8, 2007

Aruba prosecutor mulls closing Holloway case
He vows to end case in month unless evidence is found to charge suspect
Associated Press
updated 11:23 a.m. PT, Sat., Dec. 8, 2007

SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico - Aruba's chief prosecutor said he will close the case of missing American teenager Natalee Holloway by the end of the month unless his office finds that there is enough evidence to charge someone with a major crime.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22160620/


DECEMBER 22, 2007

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/12/21/holloway.case/index.html
December 22, 2007
Holloway case in 'new phase,' prosecutor says

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- The investigation into the disappearance of Natalee Holloway is not closed but has entered a new phase, as four detectives continue to look for evidence, Aruba's chief public prosecutor says.

Charges were dropped against Joran van der Sloot and brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe, prosecutor Hans Mos said, not because he didn't have a case but because he couldn't be sure of a conviction.

The decision not to prosecute doesn't mean "there is not a file in which these three people are primary persons of interest," Mos told CNN.

He said his office remains determined to find the truth. "We believe justice will prevail one day, but we cannot force that right now."

[robots]

JORAN is GUILTY

SATISH IS GUILTY

DEEPAK IS GUILTY

PAULIS IS GUILTY

SUE me 

[Observer]

I see some Idiot is lying and mentioned my name as making threats of violence. You should get your facts straight before you bring my name into any discussion. I have never threatened anyone with any violence and you lost all credibility for making it up. You POS!! We are ashamed you call yourself Canadian!!

[NYC_lover]

Anna wrote: Maybe NYC can help me with this but I think Hans Mos is what is called a public prosecutor.  He can prosecute civilians but he has no authority over ALE nor government officials.

For one thing, there is some union thingy involved and any investigation of ALE has to go through their union, I do believe.

Recall vdStraten saying no one was ever going to come behind him and investigate his work.  Also that Eric Zandam (not Stanley, the one who was going to write the book and did but think only in Pap) is head of the union or was.  I think he is the only one who can initiate an investigation of cops.  And Interpol has to be invited like everybody else by someone in authority.

Not sure how it works in the government but with duality of authority, part would be Aruban and part Dutch likely. 

I think Mos will be gone in three years and statute of limitation is twelve.  So there will be others who will have a shot at this but I still think he is the one most likely to buck the system and actually do something as he waited for Rudy Croes to leave and go out of the country then made his arrests.

So that is why Hans doesn't arrest everybody on the island for corruption.

Is there anything where I can help with? I can't stay there long, I have again wireless internet problems. It make my very frustrating it and has still happened for 2,5 hours now.

[robots]

I see some Idiot is lying and mentioned my name as making threats of violence. You should get your facts straight before you bring my name into any discussion. I have never threatened anyone with any violence and you lost all credibility for making it up. You POS!! We are ashamed you call yourself Canadian!!

SOP

telling lies

everyone lies

why you lie to momma


 

[San]

I knew that Aruba would reconsider their position regarding the closing of the Natalee Holloway case.  It is my understanding ... as long as the case is open ... allowed to become a cold case ... the family/FBI are not legally entitled to the documents contained in the case file.

Janet

+++++++


DECEMBER 8, 2007

Aruba prosecutor mulls closing Holloway case
He vows to end case in month unless evidence is found to charge suspect
Associated Press
updated 11:23 a.m. PT, Sat., Dec. 8, 2007

SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico - Aruba's chief prosecutor said he will close the case of missing American teenager Natalee Holloway by the end of the month unless his office finds that there is enough evidence to charge someone with a major crime.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22160620/


DECEMBER 22, 2007

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/12/21/holloway.case/index.html
December 22, 2007
Holloway case in 'new phase,' prosecutor says

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- The investigation into the disappearance of Natalee Holloway is not closed but has entered a new phase, as four detectives continue to look for evidence, Aruba's chief public prosecutor says.

Charges were dropped against Joran van der Sloot and brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe, prosecutor Hans Mos said, not because he didn't have a case but because he couldn't be sure of a conviction.

The decision not to prosecute doesn't mean "there is not a file in which these three people are primary persons of interest," Mos told CNN.

He said his office remains determined to find the truth. "We believe justice will prevail one day, but we cannot force that right now."

Exactly Janet.  They cannot close this case due to the fact that the family will get to see the evidence.  I knew this is what they were plotting for a long time now.  I just didn't know the laws and how they would do it.

[Tylergal]

You know, I think it will only take 1 ship.

I saw three ships come sailing in
On Christmas day, on Christmas day;
I saw three ships come sailing in
On Christmas day in the morning.

And what was in those ships all three,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day?
And what was in those ships all three,
On Christmas day in the morning?

Our Savior Christ and His lady,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day;
Our Savior Christ and His lady,
On Christmas day in the morning.

Pray whither sailed those ships all three,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day?
Pray whither sailed those ships all three,
On Christmas day in the morning?

O they sailed into Bethlehem,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day,
O they sailed into Bethlehem,
On Christmas day in the morning.

And all the bells on Earth shall ring,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day;
And all the bells on Earth shall ring,
On Christmas day in the morning.

And all the angels in Heav’n shall sing,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day;
And all the angels in Heav’n shall sing,
On Christmas day in the morning.

And all the souls on Earth shall sing,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day;
And all the souls on Earth shall sing,
On Christmas day in the morning.

Then let us all rejoice amain,
On Christmas day, on Christmas day;
Then let us rejoice amain,
On Christmas day in the morning.

Digest of lyrics, as sung by Nat King Cole:

    I saw three ships come sailing in
    And what was in those ships all three?
    The Virgin Mary and Christ were there
    And all the Angels in Heav'n shall sing
    Then let us all rejoice again
    On Christmas Day in the morning

There are plenty of traditional versions of this that have been collected/recorded in the UK. Here is our version

    I saw the Persistence go sailing by,
    Sailing by, sailing by;
    I saw the Peristence ship go sailing by,
    On Chrissemas day in the morning.

    Monkey heroes were on the ship,
    On the ship, on the ship;
    Thinking soon Natalee will be on the ship,
    On Chrissemas day in the morning.

    Dave whistled and Beth singed,
    And all the bells in Heaven ringed;
    All the bells in Heaven ringed,
    On Chrissemas day in the morning

[Observer]

Exactly Janet.  They cannot close this case due to the fact that the family will get to see the evidence.  I knew this is what they were plotting for a long time now.  I just didn't know the laws and how they would do it.

Mos already gave his word that JQK can look at the files because he is a representative of the Family. Unless he lied about that also 

[San]

I know this will not be a popular statement but I am just going to say that I am disappointed in our own government for not helping Beth more.

I am disappointed in the fact that they let Aruba make fools of our FBI with all these antics they are pulling.

The fact that we let that horse face Arlene Ellis Schipper in our country with that so called Aruban delegate is just appauling.  She came here all smug knowing that her cousin was involved in what happened to Natalee.  What we should have done was shock the sh!t our of them when they came here and we didn't.