Natalee Case Discussion #707 12/22 - 12/28/2007

[Observer]

I was wondering how many crab traps might be down there.

Does the junk on the bottom flow/shift from the shallow areas <100 ft. to the deeper areas?

I would imagine they would move in the direction of the currents which is west towards panama.

Hotshot:

Your right,they seem to be looking in a north west direction off the Aruban Coast. In this interview they said the western part of the island.

"Searching the western point of the island"

http://tinyurl.com/2hlo3q  (Pops up in IE)

OK, I was talking about what Kyle said on the site.  I try not to listen to Media anymore, they screw things up, as we well know. 

Thats what Tim Trahan(Project Management) told that news station out of Louisiana.

[WhiskeyGirl]

When I look at the shallow and deeper water, I wonder what the boat traffic was on Monday night.  Would there have been cruise ships arriving and departing?  Any late night traffic from the Soul Beach concert?  Maybe an early morning ferry?

Does anyone know where the cell pings off Aruba came from?  Which peninsula?  Perhaps both?

[Observer]

Does anyone know where the cell pings off Aruba came from?  Which peninsula?  Perhaps both?

I have never seen anyone confirm this,I think all I saw was Bo Dietl who talked about cell phone pings and other jursidictions. If it is true and TES is aware of this info then I think it greatly increases the odds of Natalee being found.

[Magnolia]

I was wondering how many crab traps might be down there.

Does the junk on the bottom flow/shift from the shallow areas <100 ft. to the deeper areas?

I would imagine they would move in the direction of the currents which is west towards panama.

Hotshot:

Your right,they seem to be looking in a north west direction off the Aruban Coast. In this interview they said the western part of the island.

"Searching the western point of the island"

http://tinyurl.com/2hlo3q  (Pops up in IE)

OK, I was talking about what Kyle said on the site.  I try not to listen to Media anymore, they screw things up, as we well know. 

Thats what Tim Trahan(Project Management) told that news station out of Louisiana.

This is what Kyle said today on his blog.  It looks to me like they are
around the area that says "Noord Put" on the depth chart.

Update: Wed 26-Dec -0320 hrs
The sonar search is progressing smoothly and the end is within sight. The ROV team has flown into Aruba and will reunite with the Persistence tomorrow. Below is a 3-D perspective view (looking west) of the bathymetric portion of the search on the NW side of Aruba. The contour interval is 25ft, showing water depth ranging from about 60 ft to almost 900 ft. The search area with bathymetry shown below is 22 square miles (the size of Manhattan).

[WhiskeyGirl]

Does anyone know where the cell pings off Aruba came from?  Which peninsula?  Perhaps both?

I have never seen anyone confirm this,I think all I saw was Bo Dietl who talked about cell phone pings and other jursidictions. If it is true and TES is aware of this info then I think it greatly increases the odds of Natalee being found.

I was thinking three pings.  Aruba and both peninsulas.  "Triangulation"

[Observer]

Does anyone know where the cell pings off Aruba came from?  Which peninsula?  Perhaps both?

I have never seen anyone confirm this,I think all I saw was Bo Dietl who talked about cell phone pings and other jursidictions. If it is true and TES is aware of this info then I think it greatly increases the odds of Natalee being found.

I was thinking three pings.  Aruba and both peninsulas.  "Triangulation"

The Colombian Peninsula is pretty far out and if pings were recorded off of that coast then that is very far from where they are searching now. I guess the same could be said about the Venezuelan Peninsula. The 22 square miles they are searching are definetly around Aruba and not a direct line to one of the neighboring countries.MO

[MumInOhio]

WhiskeyGirl According to Joran's book there were lots of people there that weekend from both Columbia and Venezuela. I wonder if  Freddy's family had a reunion.reunion.I would assume a lot of boats stayed overnight.

Joran said in his book that he wanted to be a pilot, just like his friend. And we have two virtual pilots.

Silverfox.. Thanks, I found their website last week, but didn't find anything on our Rudy. Looked at all the pics and he wasn't there. So it's his son!Kept seeing conflicting reports as to whether Rudy, Hendrik and Betico were brothers or if the latter was their father. Still don't know!

[sylvia]

Evening Monkeys,

In case you haven't seen it, Klass set up a thread to wish Happy Holidays and New Year to the Holloways, Twittys, Persistence, TES, etc.   They will be told to check this area for messages.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2475.0

Wishing all a Joyous, Healthy and Successful New Year.

Sylvia

[WhiskeyGirl]

WhiskeyGirl According to Joran's book there were lots of people there that weekend from both Columbia and Venezuela. I wonder if  Freddy's family had a reunion.reunion.I would assume a lot of boats stayed overnight.

Joran said in his book that he wanted to be a pilot, just like his friend. And we have two virtual pilots.

Silverfox.. Thanks, I found their website last week, but didn't find anything on our Rudy. Looked at all the pics and he wasn't there. So it's his son!Kept seeing conflicting reports as to whether Rudy, Hendrik and Betico were brothers or if the latter was their father. Still don't know!

I wonder where they park all those boats?  Do they go through immigration everytime they visit the island?  Pay a tax or something?

How many boats did Freddy have access to? 

Or maybe the friends from Columbia?

[Pita]

Does anyone know where the cell pings off Aruba came from?  Which peninsula?  Perhaps both?

I have never seen anyone confirm this,I think all I saw was Bo Dietl who talked about cell phone pings and other jursidictions. If it is true and TES is aware of this info then I think it greatly increases the odds of Natalee being found.

snipped....

From The Big Story Bo Dietl, Phil Keating 11/23 TRANSCRIPT

Bo Dietl

They also have text messaging; the text messaging from Aruba don't originate in Aruba, they come from Venezuela, they come from Columbia, it's what they call pings and this kind of information takes a long time to get since you have to serve subpoenas on them and this is the problem here which I think again, I think they've gotten that information also on the text messaging.

[yapperz1]

This post by Merian Ernest came to mind when reading about the "pings"

Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 5:51 pm Post subject: They call him bifrons...
Find Aruba. Find the Haystack. Find Santa Marta. Trace with your finger what the Antenna
has spoken about.

[Tylergal]

I wonder if there is massive junk on the bottom of the ocean from all the cruise ships dumping garbage at sea which we all know they do even thought they vehemently deny it.

Would the whole ocean floor be covered is junk or what?  What happens to things thrown in by boaters, accidentally and on purpose?  I guess that is why itn is good to have a signature of how a fish trap would show up to tell it from the rest of the stuff down there?

.

I thought we were told early on in this investigation that their waste is taken out to sea.  If so, there should be an ocean floor covered in dangerous and toxic materials (such as ocean waste) but perhaps they were wrong about dangerous waste being taken out to sea, as Paulus and Joran were never taken out and dumped at sea.

[Tylergal]

This post by Merian Ernest came to mind when reading about the "pings"

Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 5:51 pm Post subject: They call him bifrons...
Find Aruba. Find the Haystack. Find Santa Marta. Trace with your finger what the Antenna
has spoken about.

My little grandson who was quite young at the time kept having nightmares about "haystacks" and Natalee.  That gave me shivers when I heard there is a place "Haystack" in Aruba.

[Tamikosmom]

When I look at the shallow and deeper water, I wonder what the boat traffic was on Monday night.  Would there have been cruise ships arriving and departing?  Any late night traffic from the Soul Beach concert?  Maybe an early morning ferry?

Does anyone know where the cell pings off Aruba came from?  Which peninsula?  Perhaps both?

I could be wrong but ... David Kock was the only person ... who was in a position of knowledge ... who publicly mentioned a cell phone signal that identified a specific location.  Satish's attorney conveyed to Greta that a cell phone signal places Joran in the Palm Beach area on the morning when Natalee Holloway went missing.

Janet

++++++++++++

David Kock
On the Record w/ Greta
August 24, 2005

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So your client, 2 o'clock to 3 o'clock, is on the Internet at home. I've been in his room. I've seen the computer, or at least where it was. And he gets phone calls at 2:40 and 3 a.m. from Joran. Where do the cell records place the phone that Joran is using at 2:40 and 3 o'clock in the morning?

DAVID KOCK, SATISH KALPOE'S ATTORNEY:: Well, there's not an exact pinpoint indication, but the general area is the area here in north in Palm Beach of the hotel.

VAN SUSTEREN: So it looks like he's not home at that hour, but someplace near the Marriott, is that right?

KOCK: That is correct. He is in this neighborhood.

[private eye]

Hello everyone. I went to a party that Beth's Mom had for her this past Saturday, and visited with them until the day after Christmas as my Mom lives next to hers, and out on their kitchen table was Beth's laptop computer the entire time so she could monitor none other than "Scared Monkeys." When the girl turned up missing in Aruba, she was hot and heavy on it with the help of Mr. Red, she was keeping current several times a day with the "Persistence" notes, and she was constantly remarking how truly amazing the Scared Monkeys posters and guests were, and how fantastic the Persistence boat and equipment was, remarking repeatedly that the owner, crew, and captain were truly the A team ( I apologize for that sentence's structure:)). If I had any doubt what all of the above people and her supporters meant to her, this Christmas removed any doubt. She literally feeds off of the passion, the diligence, the goodness, and the strength of all of you, as well as all of her supporters. This may sound a little corny but all of you absolutely have carried Beth in this journey.

Her Mom watched the different posts and with tears dripping from her eyes to the keyboard, and said I just don't understand how anyone could think that this isn't the Lord's work. All of these people helping my family and us from a small town that they had probably never even heard of before. She said that despite her loss, which I know from first hand experience was completely devastating to her, she feels blessed by the Lord at the same time. The above already mentioned,  Tim and his band of searchers, her daughters wonderful Mountain Brook friends, her personal friends, JQK, the television stations and personalities, and the millions of viewers, the internet posters of this and all sites, and anyone who I accidentally left out but who supports her daughter, could only have been assembled by God; and she will be grateful for the rest of her life and forever in their debt. While some efforts have been so great as to leave her speechless, no effort has been too small to notice or appreciate.

Natalee's grandmother also remarked that she wished Anita could find the path of the Lord so that her son could be spared the fate that awaits him at then end of the path she has chosen for her son. She said that Anita would not be so afraid of the truth if she could see the plan God has for her and Joran if they accept his will and do the right thing. Faith Anita, you have to have faith, she said over and over.

I told her about the Refugee site, and she said that she pitied them, and that there might be hope for them since the Lord takes care of babies and fools. She did utter that they don't seem to be babies:)

[Observer]

Hi Pita

Strange that Bo Dietl is talking about this information and no one else is. Maybe it was supposed to be confidential? We know TJ Ward said that PVDS may have contacted Colombians to take Natalee off the island. The problem I have is that the Colombian coast looks to be at least 3 times farther than Venezuela. I would think the most the Persistence is traveling directly west would be 15 miles,Far short of the halfway point to Colombia. I just don't see them doing that in this search. From what I have gathered they are searching the waters up to 5 miles off of the Aruban Coast and far from the two Peninsulas.MO

[private eye]

Hi Pita

Strange that Bo Dietl is talking about this information and no one else is. Maybe it was supposed to be confidential? We know TJ Ward said that PVDS may have contacted Colombians to take Natalee off the island. The problem I have is that the Colombian coast looks to be at least 3 times farther than Venezuela. I would think the most the Persistence is traveling directly west would be 15 miles,Far short of the halfway point to Colombia. I just don't see them doing that in this search. From what I have gathered they are searching the waters up to 5 miles off of the Aruban Coast and far from the two Peninsulas.MO

Isn't that because the water is deeper away from the countries?

[Observer]

This post by Merian Ernest came to mind when reading about the "pings"

Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 5:51 pm Post subject: They call him bifrons...
Find Aruba. Find the Haystack. Find Santa Marta. Trace with your finger what the Antenna
has spoken about.

I was just looking at a logbook of travels in that area. Santa Marta Colombia is at least 100 miles from Aruba.

http://www.thetwocaptains.com/logbook/caribbean.htm

[yapperz1]

This post by Merian Ernest came to mind when reading about the "pings"

Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 5:51 pm Post subject: They call him bifrons...
Find Aruba. Find the Haystack. Find Santa Marta. Trace with your finger what the Antenna
has spoken about.

I was just looking at a logbook of travels in that area. Santa Marta Colombia is at least 100 miles from Aruba.


BUT was it a call from Aruba to Colombia? Isn't that where Freddy's family is from?

http://www.thetwocaptains.com/logbook/caribbean.htm

[yapperz1]

Sorry ******* I screwed up that quote.

BUT was it a call from Aruba to Colombia? Isn't that where Freddy's family is from?