Natalee Case Discussion #708 12/28 - 12/30/07

[sylvia]

Klaas or anyone,

Why don't we ever hear anything from the other MB students who were at the table with Natalee and Paulus?  Can't they verify if he was at the table?
 

[MumInOhio]

Lala's...I have always thought Freddy, because of the photo and 'whose hand' Well yesterday I found the photo with Freddy and J2K and the one with just J2K.

And yesterday I realised that there is another hand in that photo!



Thanks San

[klaasend]

Klaas or anyone,

Why don't we ever hear anything from the other MB students who were at the table with Natalee and Paulus?  Can't they verify if he was at the table?
 

I'm really not sure but I suspect they weren't really paying that much attention to him.  It was their last night in Aruba and they were having some fun in the casino.  My guess is because he was an older man (which they have said) they didn't really take that good a look at him. 

[Lala'sMom]

Where, at what site, so shango and simian originally place their posts? Do we know?

I have posted some of Simian's original FP posts in the Shango thread...I intended to continue but have not gone back as of yet.  I will attempt to do so today...I promise.  It's the last few pages of the Shango thread.  It will be much easier for you to just peruse what I brought over, since you have to read as many as 500 posts sometimes.  Sorry, I have been so slow to do this.

[NYC_lover]

I was sitting here drinking my coffee and reading the New York Post and came across this article.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/12302007/gossip/cindy/divine_interventions_for_2008_933027.htm

DIVINE' INTERVENTIONS FOR 2008

Cindy Adams Column

December 30, 2007 -- PAULA ROBERTS, a psychic Celt whom I have consulted since The Year of the Flood, reminds me she predicted 2007's record-breaking Kansas corn crop (the Grain Commission recently verified a 45 percent increase over the previous year) and, as verified by Oct. 7's International Herald Tribune, that the Sri Lankan army would use scorched-earth policies against the Tamil rebels. So, now her 2008 predictions:

* Natalee Holloway's remains found in February.

Hmhm.... Paula Roberts has got a Tarot card with answers that the remains of Natalee be found in February, 2008.
Which vision she had? Was it from a ballball ball or a tarot card?

What want this ballball ball sees for this year?

[private eye]

It seems to me that the authors of the 2 riddles are claiming to be material direct witnesses to a crime. If so why haven't the authorities traced the posts so that the authors can be identified and interviewed?

[MumInOhio]

Klaas or anyone,

Why don't we ever hear anything from the other MB students who were at the table with Natalee and Paulus?  Can't they verify if he was at the table?
 

I'm really not sure but I suspect they weren't really paying that much attention to him.  It was their last night in Aruba and they were having some fun in the casino.  My guess is because he was an older man (which they have said) they didn't really take that good a look at him. 

Joran describes him as being about 45 years old.....any know old Paulus is?

[private eye]

Where, at what site, so shango and simian originally place their posts? Do we know?

I have posted some of Simian's original FP posts in the Shango thread...I intended to continue but have not gone back as of yet.  I will attempt to do so today...I promise.  It's the last few pages of the Shango thread.  It will be much easier for you to just peruse what I brought over, since you have to read as many as 500 posts sometimes.  Sorry, I have been so slow to do this.

I have followed the posts, not as closely as you and others by any means, but I am familiar with them. What I think we should find is the original posting as that will have the internet address of the poster.

[Lala'sMom]

Lala's...I have always thought Freddy, because of the photo and 'whose hand' Well yesterday I found the photo with Freddy and J2K and the one with just J2K.

And yesterday I realised that there is another hand in that photo!



Thanks San

Why won't you email me?  Are you mad at me?  LOL 

I do not discount Freddy in any way...you must realize I am the keeper of the flame over in the Shango thread. I am just there to try and keep things straight. I don't necessarily believe any of that stuff...just find it very interesting.  I still haven't found that link to Joran's book you said you left for me...please one more time. TIA

BTW, if Joran's book is a confession, what is there to stop him from using it as a means of deflecting suspicion from him and onto others?  Just thinking out loud here. I like to cover all bases whenever possible.

[MumInOhio]

Lala's...I have always thought Freddy, because of the photo and 'whose hand' Well yesterday I found the photo with Freddy and J2K and the one with just J2K.

And yesterday I realised that there is another hand in that photo!



Thanks San

Why won't you email me?  Are you mad at me?  LOL 

I do not discount Freddy in any way...you must realize I am the keeper of the flame over in the Shango thread. I am just there to try and keep things straight. I don't necessarily believe any of that stuff...just find it very interesting.  I still haven't found that link to Joran's book you said you left for me...please one more time. TIA

BTW, if Joran's book is a confession, what is there to stop him from using it as a means of deflecting suspicion from him and onto others?  Just thinking out loud here. I like to cover all bases whenever possible.

Lala's...just logged out as my cousin is coming. This is why I wanted you to read it! Its on the second page of the Important Case Docs. Joran's Book Translation-Island Boy. Pay particular attention to Chapters 3 and 5.
Will email as soon as I can!

[Lala'sMom]

Where, at what site, so shango and simian originally place their posts? Do we know?

I have posted some of Simian's original FP posts in the Shango thread...I intended to continue but have not gone back as of yet.  I will attempt to do so today...I promise.  It's the last few pages of the Shango thread.  It will be much easier for you to just peruse what I brought over, since you have to read as many as 500 posts sometimes.  Sorry, I have been so slow to do this.

I have followed the posts, not as closely as you and others by any means, but I am familiar with them. What I think we should find is the original posting as that will have the internet address of the poster.

Klaas will need to answer that question once again..sorry.  If you want to email me cindoal@yahoo.com. 

[Lala'sMom]

It seems to me that the authors of the 2 riddles are claiming to be material direct witnesses to a crime. If so why haven't the authorities traced the posts so that the authors can be identified and interviewed?

I promise I will explain if you will email me...I promise.  The FBI was given this info by one of our posters.

[NYC_lover]

Klaas or anyone,

Why don't we ever hear anything from the other MB students who were at the table with Natalee and Paulus?  Can't they verify if he was at the table?
 

I'm really not sure but I suspect they weren't really paying that much attention to him.  It was their last night in Aruba and they were having some fun in the casino.  My guess is because he was an older man (which they have said) they didn't really take that good a look at him. 

Joran describes him as being about 45 years old.....any know old Paulus is?

Paul A.P.J. van der Sloot, born in the Netherlands (1952)

[bleachedblack]

In my opinion:

Half the time, you have the wrong Lorenzo.  Lorenzo van Rijn is not the one with the escort services at all.  He is a RECLUSE.  This means he does not go to night clubs or casinos much at all if ever.  He does not have RAVE parties and his nickname is not XTC.  My source for this is two people on the island.

He grows weed and from the looks of it, I would suspect that it is that Nederweed.  Some of the Dutch have turned their exquisite and exceptional botanical skills to the development of this product which is reported to be ten times stronger than regular pot.

The "party" the night Natalee disappeared had six people in attendance if you want to call that a Rave.  Did you ever think people might be protective of him because he suffers from problems and his father committed suicide making him four time more likely to do so himself by statistics? 

He is no more Joran's half brother than I am and Jossy has always qualified any statements about him, which are ALWAYS in answer to a question and never just on his own, with it is a rumor or "it is said."  That is a pure Julia rumor if I ever heard one, straight out of soap opera lore.  He was born in Aruba before Paulus moved there for one thing. 

He was questioned because of his previous drug arrests back when he did deal in XTC to see if they asked him to buy drugs or if he had sold them any X or GHB.  If he were really Joran's half brother or anything could be pinned on him, I believe Joran would have mentioned him in his book and certainly Anita and her minions from hell would have been doing so long ago.

In my opinion only but most of that I have verified with TWO sources from the island.  Where are his photos in the bars, etc.?  There aren't any because he is so reclusive.  Of course you can continue to stalk him if you like but it's a waste of time and this has been told several times to different people from islanders and yet it is just ignored.  Odd, that.

Flame away. . . . I just don't think it's right to try to force people to be involved who aren't.

.

Anna you always seem very " protective"  whenever Lorenzo's name is mentioned. Yet in your statements of defence  contradictions exist such as , "He was questioned because of his previous drug arrests back when he did deal in XTC ". Why then would it not be possible that some there call him "XTC"?

I am just saying that I too have talked with young people in Aruba who know who LVR is and some of what you say is just not true.

[Anna]

Anna you always seem very " protective"  whenever Lorenzo's name is mentioned. Yet in your statements of defence  contradictions exist such as , "He was questioned because of his previous drug arrests back when he did deal in XTC ". Why then would it not be possible that some there call him "XTC"?

I am just saying that I too have talked with young people in Aruba who know who LVR is and some of what you say is just not true.

I am basing my statements on what I have been told by people on the island and one who has/had a blog with many more contacts than I have and what they could come up with.  They never heard of anybody calling him that, XTC, and this is what they have told me from the beginning.  But it is possible for him to be called anything.  Someone might call him Louise for that matter, no reference to poster by that name.  And TIto called Guido Lorenzo so anything is possible.  One source attended school with him and is his age.  He never heard him called that but people can say anything of course.

I don't care whether you believe me or not.  I know what I have been told from the time Lorenzo was questioned and if he is so involved, why is he not even mentioned in either Joran or Beth's book and only questioned one time as a witness?  Mos says no one is involved except the primary suspects and the rest is FABRICATION which I also believe.

It's fine for you to believe your sources but I believe mine as well.  I'm sure you can respect that.

.

[Lala'sMom]

It seems to me that the authors of the 2 riddles are claiming to be material direct witnesses to a crime. If so why haven't the authorities traced the posts so that the authors can be identified and interviewed?

Let me see if I can explain this...as I understand it Simian was ALE...one of our posters, Grande, studied this and made the determination that it may have been Clyde Burke.  Anna posted a photo of him in the Shango thread for me...(thanks).  Simian did not riddle until Shango arrived.  Shango riddles things that have been the way it is on Aruba...the good old boy network I guess you could call it.  In fact, Shango, spends a great deal of time trying to convince you that Joran was only the scapegoat.  He does not keep it simple..he implicates a whole host of people.  The judges, the elders, etc.  Most think Shango and Simian is a bunch of hooey.  That is why they gave me my own thread...so I would not bring it here and distract those that are seeking the truth.  That comment is not reflective of anyone's opinion but mine...I am just calling it as it see it. I have my theory as to who is Shango and who is Simian...they are not popular nor do they follow the established rules...but what the heck...I am rebel and I admit it.

[bleachedblack]

There sure were a whole lot of nicknames among the people we came to hear of being involved. S.A., Loverboy, Betto,Jojo, Fefi, Cul, Nepi ......I imagine just part of their gangsta persona or so they felt.
 
I just wanted to point out another already known fact......and that is what each of us personally believes to be the truth is likely only partially correct.

[klaasend]

NEW FRONT PAGE POST AND CAPTION CONTEST:

Aruban Police Crack Down on Illegal Weapons … Caption Contest

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2007/12/30/aruban-police-crack-down-on-illegal-weapons-caption-contest/

[Observer]

Lorenzo was questioned alot more than one time thats for sure. Also Jossy absolutely said Joran and Lorenzo are close and he confirmed they are brothers. I trust Jossy did his homework and has better contacts than most of us do. I am definetly not in the mood to argue about him and could care less what peoples individuals opinions are on him. Just sick of hearing the same thing over and over and over again about him when nothing new is added. I have read just as much as anybody has on him and had my own contacts in Aruba,I think I already shared my opinion on him yesterday so I will leave it at that.

[JuJu]

I am having a hard time trying to view the video on The Persistence site.  Help!