Natalee Case Discussion #708 12/28 - 12/30/07

[Magnolia]

*******,....what does it say?

[Observer]

*******,....what does it say?

Haha..I have no idea  I would love to read that as well..Maybee Klaas can tell us what it says  It look's interesting as he is talking about the DNA tests and the Info that Peter De Vries provided.

[Hotshot]

I could be wrong, and have been before, but I look at the obits every day in the diario, and swear he was in there.  I remember the "Dakota" area, because it was a very dangerous part of town.  Gangs.  I am looking now to see if I can find it.

[Magnolia]

I didn't know that Wit was an ex-judge.
It is from Bondia, so it will be favorable to Wit and
the Sloots.

[Observer]

I could be wrong, and have been before, but I look at the obits every day in the diario, and swear he was in there.  I remember the "Dakota" area, because it was a very dangerous part of town.  Gangs.  I am looking now to see if I can find it.

I tried to translate the recent comments and it looks like he is still missing. One of them was asking God to bring him home I think.  Another was telling them to be patient.

coleganan di kia  said:is pesey self we not can make nothing anything we have of make ask father god for his return pace the only know where the door and we tinele in prayer come across, for his familia we is ask for have much compel and much confidence come across. we of kia also is preocupa come across!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-----------------
december 16, 2007 sharine f said: _ we is wait for gobierno of aruba can give one hand for cu the perdida of jose manuel tromp the is one jui of mother and is aruban clean we is wait for cu this if they can take action cu the buskeda because of nathally holoway they owing to make all they erfuerzo for we aruban also i am wait for cu they can make meskos for cu his majornan can is trankil if all juda can come one solucion pricipalmente gobierno that is my comentario and i am wait for cu they can succeed haje jose manuel tromp for his famianan can happen the dianan of party here feliz cu they jui thanks a lot

[Observer]

It seems Bob Wit is defending the original search of Joran's apartment only, saying the search warrant request was only for where he lived and the cars....?

That he says the dossier has much discrepancy of statements in it, that the case is strong against the 3 but does not have the proof needed to convict.

That he says his experience has shown that new evidence does come up in cases, that it can in this case and then a prosecution could take place.

It also seems he says Dompig and Peter deVries implied favoritism to the Sloot family.

Bottom line, it does seem we have a judge agreeing that this case has strong incriminating evidence in the files that needs boosting of evidence in form of a witness, or DNA, something that can be tested and linked as evidence.  MO

[Magnolia]

It seems Bob Wit is defending the original search of Joran's apartment only, saying the search warrant request was only for where he lived and the cars....?

That he says the dossier has much discrepancy of statements in it, that the case is strong against the 3 but does not have the proof needed to convict.

That he says his experience has shown that new evidence does come up in cases, that it can in this case and then a prosecution could take place.

It also seems he says Dompig and Peter deVries implied favoritism to the Sloot family.

Bottom line, it does seem we have a judge agreeing that this case has strong incriminating evidence in the files that needs boosting of evidence in form of a witness, or DNA, something that can be tested and linked as evidence.  MO

Thanks, *******.

[Observer]

I guess the search warrant changed by itself then if Bob Wit didnt change it. According to De Vries the officers were shocked when they arrived to do a full search of the property and found out it was restricted just to Jorans bedroom and a  small part of the property.

What happened to the search warrant when PVDS was arrested on similar charges a week later? I guess that just dissapeared all together? Since when do Murder and Kidnapping suspects get immunity from having their property searched? IF WIT DIDNT CHANGE THE WARRANT THEN WHO DID? If WIt is saying thats all the Prosecuters asked for was Jorans Bedroom and the 2 cars,then they have some major explaining to do!

[Observer]

I didn't know that Wit was an ex-judge.
It is from Bondia, so it will be favorable to Wit and
the Sloots.

Another article about Bob Wit in todays Amigoe.

  No alternatives for travel ban

WILLEMSTAD – Bob Wit calls the brushing off of last month’s Antillean travel ban by the Supreme Court ‘a black day for the fight on criminality in Curacao’.  “The Supreme Court took the decision on extremely debatable ground and without any argumentation”, said Wit.

The former judge in the Joint Court of Justice of the Antilles and Aruba and currently in the Caribbean Supreme Court is the person that in July of 2004 imposed the ban as special stipulation for the drug couriers sentenced to conditional imprisonment; during their probation, drug courier are banned from traveling from any part of the Kingdom (especially from Curacao) and the public prosecutor confiscate their passport for that period of time.   

Up till the decision of the Supreme Court on November 6, the OM confiscated and returned after the probation period, a few thousand passports.  Wit says that the travel ban was part of a ‘very careful, well thought-out, humane, and nonetheless or perhaps therefore extremely successful punishment mete out policy of the judicial power of the Dutch Caribbean’ that the Supreme Court did away with ‘in one sacral, epileptic sense, obviously without discussing or maintaining any argumentation’.

Wit is of the opinion that the ‘series of words used by the Supreme Court that in the beginning look inscrutable’ have some weak points and pass over the fact that jurisprudence really exists that can impose special conditions to stop suspects from committing the same kind of crimes again.  “If the Supreme Court had maintained his own jurisprudence, he would have never concluded that the special condition of the travel ban is inadmissible.   The travel ban was meant to stop convicts exporting narcotics from Curacao again.”  Wit knows that if the passport is not confiscated, after having been caught with drugs at the airport of Curaçao and not immediately put behind bars, the drug mafia will pressure these drug carriers to try to transport the extremely profitable merchandise to the Netherlands again.   

The introduction of this travel ban has to do with the explosion of the drug transportation, the measures that followed (Hato team and the 100 percent check) the increased number of cases against drug couriers, and the eternal shortage of cells in prison, whereby letting the convict walk around free was more a rule than an exception.  The special condition of the travel ban has been very successful, says Wit.  The number of arrests on Schiphol from Curacao dropped from 415 to 130 in the first quarter of 2005 and to 40 in the third quarter of that same year; this number continued to drop and was even 17 in the second quarter of 2006.   Also the number of murder crimes in Curacao dropped to 50 in 2004 and 25 in 2005.  The Curacao community is since then back to normal, even though it is no oasis still. 

http://www.amigoe.com/english/

[Tylergal]

This man looks like a pedophile.  Look at his face.  Ugh.

[Observer]

Aruban Authorities Investigate Blood in Car
Sunday, June 12, 2005

ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Authorities investigating the disappearance of Alabama honors student Natalee Holloway were seeking clues on the source of blood found in the car used to transport the missing teen to the beach nearly two weeks ago, Aruban Justice Minister Rudy Croes (search) said.

"We have found some blood in the car, but we don't know to whom it belongs," he said.

The teen's mother, Beth Holloway Twitty, reportedly gave blood to authorities to determine whether the DNA matched that of the samples taken from a silver Honda.

Forensic expert Michael Baden told FOX News on Sunday, "Everyday that passes makes it more ominous,” in referring to the amount of time that has passed since the woman went missing. He added that "the blood in the car could be due to a struggle" and also said of Aruban authorities: "There’s a great pressure not to convict local people.”

An Aruban judge Saturday ordered the three young men who reportedly spent time with Holloway at a lighthouse on an Aruban beach before she disappeared to stay in jail, as Aruba's attorney general and others denied reports that one had confessed and said he would take police to the body.


As rumors mounted about the fate of 18-year-old Natalee Holloway, a spokeswoman for her family, Carla Caccavale, told The Associated Press: "The family confirms that a body has not been found."

http://forum.fok.nl/topic/710730/3/50

[NYC_lover]

*******,....what does it say?

I translated this article read now. It come over few minutes.

[Observer]

Dutch bloggers talking about the 5th suspect,2 dutch brothers and a Colombian 

Automatically translated text:   
On Sunday, June 19, 2005 19:33 wrote milagro the following:

     [..]

     Ms. strange it is, yes.

     That son has a kind of thought I appartementje own, to his parents' house, own entrance therefore, I assume, so I assume again, that zoonlief can come and go without Ma and Pa in the eye, and how or what Who etc.


     Zoonlief to 06.30 tomorrow benefited from the 5th suspect, which is only recently revealed, it is that the 5th man now suspected,.
     Mss want them now only know from Dad or something he noticed that morning and drive to a third party or something

Tokse maandag 20 juni 2005 @ 00:28
I thought that this is the fourth suspect was one Steven Croes? Question wondering what is true of these two Dutch (not surinaamse) brothers and a colombiaan suspected? I think half of that island is suspected, how many people live there?

In short, strange mess with all these stories that you read, they sleuren more and more people, to the son of youknowwho to save ofzo. There is no ass of the whole story, and I wonder whether it only by the news of the amerikanen. I think there is also something very tilted sits on Aruba (skating them there are ash, and also straight or tilted?)



http://forum.fok.nl/topic/716218

[private eye]

It seems Bob Wit is defending the original search of Joran's apartment only, saying the search warrant request was only for where he lived and the cars....?

That he says the dossier has much discrepancy of statements in it, that the case is strong against the 3 but does not have the proof needed to convict.

That he says his experience has shown that new evidence does come up in cases, that it can in this case and then a prosecution could take place.

It also seems he says Dompig and Peter deVries implied favoritism to the Sloot family.

Bottom line, it does seem we have a judge agreeing that this case has strong incriminating evidence in the files that needs boosting of evidence in form of a witness, or DNA, something that can be tested and linked as evidence.  MO

For Wit, and I purposely omitt the respectable title of judge as I think he does insult to it, to claim that he felt that Joran's parents home was not the home of Joran because he had a detached living space in the home place is absurd. Joran lived with his parents, he ate their food, prepared in the main house, ate in the main house, his clothes were laundered in the main house, and he had complete run of the main house. His Dad claimed to have set hours of curfew for Joran so Joran defintely lived under their control, had not been emanciapated as far as I know, and thus was still a child. Wit, please go blow smoke up some other idiots ass. You insult the intelligence of all civilized people and you are personally responsible for the demise of Aruba and the torment of Beth.

[NYC_lover]

Papiamentu translating to English
Willemstad – “My owing to actua correct and owing to base of proceduranan estableci in the Natalee Holloway case”. So ex huez commissioner in the affair Bob Wit owing to tell it relates with ponencianan with owing to come fast in last dianan for her as with the investigation in the case owing to march. During one week with, Mr. Wit  awendia is afiliá at cuts of husticia of Caribbean, owing to fungi because; huez commissioner in the case here. At aruba the boss principal of the investigation of the time yonder Gerald Dompig owing to tell with the mature with huez commissioner not owing to accord looks for proof in the case of the pareha van der Sloot owing to stroba the investigation. The Dutch investigator of crimes Peter R. de Vries owing to alegá the same cos. Remarcabel was in the case here with after owing to accord if one are of investigation of the Netherlands enter the case and the territory of the family. Owing to creates the impression also with because; with was deal of civil employee with was learn for become huez, owing to previlegiá the family. Paul van der Sloot, father of Joran van der Sloot, after owing to become suspect in the case. It was in the formacion of raio. Mr. Wit owing to tell with at instant with owing to come the peticion for her listramento at the site caminda Joran van der Sloot was live, owing to come for the request of looks for in his apartment and also in two cars of the family. Niun instant owing to ask look for more far. One huez comissioner not can haci another, because the request for listramento have to is substansia. With another word if owing to accord look for another caminda and esee do not cubri for her request of Ministery of Justice all proof with possibly obtené is ilegal. “Esey is signify with we owing to haci we work correct”, So Mr. Wit owing to tell. the ex huez commissioner owing to tell also for thing is deal the case self with the suspect van der sloot and again the Kalpoes is strong. “My owing to constatá for of the dossier/document with had various contradiccion in they declaration. But esey do not sufficient for succeed one condemns it. In the case with not find the rest deadly hour is deal of one crime do you have to of material adicional with is as declaration of one or more witness with owing to see thing owing to happen or do you have to find tracks of blood or can example cabei for tèstnan of dna”, so the magistrado owing to tell. For thing is the case self, Mr. Wit owing to tell with owing to arrive of happen in happened with after of time owing to come new element with still can conducí at one persecution of the suspect. “My owing to see much trip in my work with cualke instant can come new information new with is throw one another light on case with was slope”, so Mr. Wit owing to comentá. Ministery of Justice of Aruba owing to anunciá the week here with in the case here the accomodate of caducacion of the “crimes” is 7 year for murder and 10 year for murder premeditá (homicide). Come across

I am still not sure what Huez meant, I think a Judge, because this can be good: Huez Comisario - Judge commissioner. But I am not sure, I want ask my cousin later, when I see her.

[private eye]

hhhmmmmmmm... my thought print says the following

"joran knows what he did to Natalee and the police are getting close so better to blame it on someone else at this point"

"joran the detective " is so stupid he gives himself away all the time


who is dumber joran deepak or satish ?

A case of dumb, dumber, and dumbest?

[blah]

I think that is Larissa.  Thought Freddie photographed one of the Karens but don't think we want to show her photo.

.

I said Hi

earlier

today

 

[blah]

This man looks like a pedophile.  Look at his face.  Ugh.

sure looks like someone that in the very least needs a good ass whoopin

[Observer]

Snip of Translation of Dutch article from June 2005

schatje zaterdag 25 juni 2005 @ 10:49
The mysterious disappearance of Natalee Holloway keeps Aruba already a month in its grip. The 18-year old American girl disappeared without trace after a night steps on the island with Joran (17), a son of a Dutch judge. Although the family of Natalee hope keeps on her return, justice in Aruba there is a time assume that the girl is no longer alive. Meanwhile sit five Dutch in custody, including (since the day before yesterday), Judge Paul van der S. Does this as very intelligent magistrate described his son actually helped the murder of Natalee Holloway?

'Happy' island already month in grip of missing American girl

Raadsels on Aruba

By John van den Heuvel

Has Judge Paul S. His son helped a murder?

What happened after the zoenpartij of Joran and Natalee?

ORANJESTAD (Aruba), Saturday
The police station in the district of 'North' in Oranjestad, Aruba, Thursday evening. Just now is the Dutch Judge Paul van der S. Fascinated inward. Cameraploegen, photographers and dozens of journalists for the door to samengestroomd live report on the case which Aruba is already in its grip weeks hold: the mysterious disappearance of the American girl Natalee Holloway.
It is mainly the American media that massive on Aruba are neergestreken. Large networks such as CNN, ABC and NBC have their own teams sent by the American people to keep the search for Natalee. The arrest of Judge Van der S. Was the day before yesterday 'breaking news' on all the major television stations in the United States. Teneur of communication: especially in the popular American tourists as Aruba is no longer 'one happy island. "


Mother and father Beth Jug living between hope and fear. "The idea that there are not more Natalee is intolerable."

Criminal broeinest
The Dutch island in the Caribbean is a criminal broeinest holidaying parents where their daughters minute not only able to, so let the reporters in their constituencies roaring reportages know. Meanwhile, the local authorities try passionate image of Aruba to save. Only a speedy resolution of the matter seems to be the future of the island as a sunny vacation for American tourists to be able to survive.
One outcome seems since the day before yesterday a step closer. Was Paul van der S. -- A former Private Secretary to the Attorney-General on Aruba - actually the one who helped his son Joran letting disappearance of Natalee Holloway? Or is the arrest of a wanhoopspoging Aruban justice to the powerful American media to show that indeed all means be used to cover the case to solve?
Saturday, May 28. Natalee Holloway with 124 schoolgenoten on Aruba neergestreken. The girl from her parents for permission conclusion of the high school to celebrate with a rousing holiday in the Caribbean. Advance is at the school on resistance to the trip. In the very conservative staalstadje Birmingham in the state of Alabama, some parents but nothing that such a large group of children touring with the supervision "only" seven chaperonnes. The school apparently realizes that the risks to the trip stick, because the parents who leave their children in that it must sign a statement that the school indemnify of responsibility in any accidents.
The group will be subsumed into the Holiday Inn Hotel on Aruba, located on the beautiful beach of hagelwitte Palm Beach. On Friday, May 27 Natalee met at the hotel Joran van der S., a 17-year old boy on Aruba studies at the international school. Joran comes from a decent family. His father is Judge since 2002 in training and his mother teaches at the same school where her three children their lessons. The family Van der S. Belongs to the upper-class of Aruba. Joran has its own apartment next to the villa with pool where his parents live. He runs good at school, but will remain under treatment of a psychiatrist because he opvliegend quite a character.
The Holiday Inn it is clicking between Joran and Naalee, after which the two decisions together again the next day to see in the nightclub Carlos' N Charlie's. It is Natalees last day on the island, so if Joran at the end of the evening still wants to drive a piece tackles them the chance of a avontuurtje. Two Surinamese friends of Joran, brothers Deepak and Satish K., sit in the front seats, while the teenagers in the back seat against one another and begin to creep kissing. What then has happened to this day unclear.
It is not disputed that Natalee Holloway no longer revert to her hotel. If the girl the next day vanished shows great alarm is immediately beaten. Her parents divorced from flying over Alabama and the police warned. Until large incomprehension of the Americans are Joran and his friends at first only heard as witnesses. The investigation is already difficult process because there are already direct disagreement arises as to who should lead the rechercheteam. The Aruban Minister of Justice Croes alive for some time partners with the top of police and the Public Prosecutor's Office and the Minister does not want the Dutch Police Jan van der Straaten research. They will, however, support from the local politiebonden, which still Croes eggs for his money elect and Van der Straaten should stay on.
Soon, the very experienced police, who to his eve of his retirement, a police driven meeting consisting of Aruban and Dutch detectives. The team also receives support from seven FBI experts. The initial witnesses' changing rapidly as the three suspects ever changing statements accountable. Joran said earlier that he first went back home and Natalee left with his two friends. The brothers explained that they gedrieën the girl off at her hotel, where they drank inward would be gestrompeld. On the surveillance cameras of the Holiday Inn Hotel, however, there is nothing to be seen.
The three were arrested after a week and the car in which the last ride took place Natalee is for technical research into the politielab. The police will get more and more convinced that the three read about the disappearance of Natalee and gradually the research that the conviction to the police (who has trained nearly thirty detectives) that the girl has been killed by them. The research considers it most likely that Natalee was taken to the Light House 'on Aruba, an extinct place on the northernmost tip of the island. In the eyes of justice would Joran and his friends that have tried sex with the American necessary, but they would not be served and have tegengestribbeld. Natalee Holloway would then have been murdered and her body would leave one of the countless places in the island are abandoned or possibly even be dumped into the sea.

Jorans father
What happened that night and what further role Jorans father Paul van der S. Has played in the crime, is still a mystery. Van der S. Lives already seventeen years on the island three years ago and was deputy judge in training. The judiciary, however, was not satisfied with his work and had already internally decided that Van der S. Its function should be filed. There was another place within the judiciary searched for him and Van der S. Did all no more lawsuits.
The police in Aruba begins his act increasingly suspected to be found as the investigation shows that Paul gives instructions all the suspects and they are trying to keep what they do and do not have to explain. That means that Van der S. A prohibition get his son any longer to visit in the cell, after which the magistrate an interim relief order aanspant this step to challenge. Last Thursday decision Justice Paul van der S. To arrest on suspicion of involvement in the murder of Natalee. Keihard evidence is lacking for the moment, but the opaque attitude of Van der S. Calls too many questions. Whether the accusation of murder in a later stage remains in force, has yet to appear. Justice may also suspected to have landed Van der S. In assurances can. The indictment could later be adjusted, for example the removal of evidence.

http://forum.fok.nl/topic/718927

[WhiskeyGirl]

Wouldn't it be funny if Joran went into law enforcement?  Maybe van der Straaten's old job?  Maybe a vdS younger brother?  Along with Jeffrey vC's sister?

Do you think they eat frosted flakes?