Natalee Case Discussion #711 1/08 - 1/12/08

[Buckeye]

The show is up

http://player.omroep.nl/?aflID=6213320

[Rammstein]

I know we have discussed this -- but how is Devries "perceived" in The Netherlands? Is he more like Geraldo or more like Mike Wallace?

I have respect for his tenacity in investigating some crimes, but on the whole, I have close to zero respect for the guy.

Why? Is it something you can elaborate upon?

- let's himself be used by criminals
- too close to criminals who actually need investigating
- sensationalist kind of journalist
- petty kind of a person
- spoke at the funeral of one of his crime buddies (serious drugs and crime lord) and talked the guy up like he was Santa and Jesus Christ merged into 1 person.

[klaasend]

Posted at RU:

Kienstail Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 6:17 am   

In Dutch (sorry...) audio, Peter R de Vries reflects on the show and incident:

http://player.nos.nl/index.php/media/play/tcmid/tcm:5-343390/

Peter R de V sais that this proves to him Joran can't control himself and is (still) capable of erractic, agressive behaviour although Joran's parents would most likely swear J would never do such a thing.

One of the show hosts sais he can't understand the action by J either and was quite -unpleasantly- surprised.

IMO the host (who was on the vdS side earlier) lost confidence in Joran but I have to listen to the audio again to be sure. 

[robots]

I know we have discussed this -- but how is Devries "perceived" in The Netherlands? Is he more like Geraldo or more like Mike Wallace?

I have respect for his tenacity in investigating some crimes, but on the whole, I have close to zero respect for the guy.

most of the people i know say the opposite

but thats ok, people can heve their own opinion

i have zero respect for the aruba LE as well as the Dutch LE

 

[klaasend]

More from RU:

Quick scan:   seems pro- and anti VDS (or P R de V) is 50:50.
People seem to dislike PR de V but also distrust VDS.  It seems to be that people in the Netherlands (when looking at other blogs in NL,  not only based on the P&W blog) think Joran has something to hide, think that Aruba is corrupt and think Peter R de Vries has some nasty ways of pushing his will/ego/show to the foreground.

[robots]

joran killed Natalee

probably in the same way as he did with this interview

when KILLER boy doesnt get his way he kills people, dogs, probably attempted to kill his brothers, thats why his CRAZY SICK DEMENTED parents put him in an apartment

i hate joran and the whole sloot family

[ldstlou]

I wish Oprah would include some of yesterdays interview including the photo of the water tossing and an interview of those commentators thoughts after the interview to provide an independent editorial from Jorans own home country as to their thoughts on the case. Let Joran's peers provide an unbiased comment on him and the treatment of him by the Dutch system in Aruba.

Maybe have Dr. Phil offer to treat Joran for anger management, do a makeover to show Anita how to hide those udders with fabric you can't see thru and advise Paulus that he can buy zipperless pull up pants.

 Can you imagine Joran's response to discipline from Poopa and Anudder?

 Do you reckon he would throw something at or hit a girl or boy who told him no?

I missed the photo, did he throw the glass or water? Do men throw water at people? hahahahaha roflmao AGAIN!!!!

It burned DeVries eyes and his associate had to get him water to rinse the eyes out (he couldn't see).  So I'm guessing the sporter was drinking something with alcohol in it.

It is "crystal clear" to me 

lol

[NM]

Seems that after the incident, Joran and Paulus ran out and Anita stayed to explain and defend Joran's behavior......doesn't she always have his back??  Anita runs the show....if those boys would just follow the plan....everything would be fine....they just keep showing their true colors.....Anita will have to call on her friend...once again.. for the defense.  How fast will Moonshadows (Hemingway) and Glenda and MF get to the keyboards?? Spin coming...

Buckeye,
Thank you for bringing this info here.

The vds' are a well oiled machine of deciet and crimes.

Go get em' Peter DeVries!!!!!!!!!!

[sharon]

most of the people i know say the opposite

but thats ok, people can heve their own opinion

i have zero respect for the aruba LE as well as the Dutch LE

 

How do you feel about people who have their own agendas -- that have NOTHING to do with receiving JUSTICE FOR NATALEE. 

Hope you had great holidays, Robots 


Matthews -- good. Ben King -- bad.  Dutch judges -- corrupt.

Matthews -- good. Ben King -- bad.  Dutch judges -- corrupt.

Matthews -- good. Ben King -- bad.  Dutch judges -- corrupt.

AVOID ARUBA AS IF YOUR LIFE DEPENDED ON IT -- IT DOESJustice for Natalee

[robots]

most of the people i know say the opposite

but thats ok, people can heve their own opinion

i have zero respect for the aruba LE as well as the Dutch LE

 

How do you feel about people who have their own agendas -- that have NOTHING to do with receiving JUSTICE FOR NATALEE. 

Hope you had great holidays, Robots 


Matthews -- good. Ben King -- bad.  Dutch judges -- corrupt.

Matthews -- good. Ben King -- bad.  Dutch judges -- corrupt.

Matthews -- good. Ben King -- bad.  Dutch judges -- corrupt.

AVOID ARUBA AS IF YOUR LIFE DEPENDED ON IT -- IT DOESJustice for Natalee

 

[Buckeye]

EURobert

Is translating and transcribing the show on the FP.  Very interesting reading.  Might be nice to leave him a comment, for all his work.

[ldstlou]

oh Wow!! quick comment and then I have to run...I'm late, I'm late!!!
I was watching the video of the sloots, look at paulus's stature, it is SOOOOOO the video casino!!!! His slouch...man..bet he wasn't thinking about that one!! Maybe we can do some comparisons.
See you all tonight Monkeys...have a great day!!!

[klaasend]

Posted by EURobert on the front page of SM - transcription of the show last night:

Transscript and translation of last nights Pauw en Witteman tv-show (Please excuse me for all the grammatical and typing errors that will be in here; it’s to time-consuming to do it flawless…. Mr. Witteman’s first name is Paul so I’ll call PaulvdS: ‘Paulus’; that’s easier for me… To not get confused…)

Witteman: Good evening. Yes, Joran van der Sloot was brought back to Aruba end of november to be interrogated. That interrogation produced nothing. He was let go and the case was dismissed.
Pauw: Joran is here, together with his father Paul and with his mother Anita to have as they themselves say, their last tv-interview about this case.
Witt.: Here as well is Peter R. de Vries who has made a television-documentairy about the NH-case and the role JvdS played, and who has his doubts. He has called Joran a lier, so their is something to be discussed.
Pauw: (Looking at Joran) Yes, well.., you can confess now, so we have that behind us…? … … … … Are that the jokes you hear the most? Or what are you bothered with more Joran?
Joran: Well, I’m not really bothered by others.. But you have to keep making jokes. As you just said yourself… else you don’t get through all this.
Pauw: Do you have the feeling now that the whole matter is over now… or do you still have the feeling that if you somewhere hear a sirene… that could be for me?
Joran: Well… Not really like that but uh it’s something that you’ll never forget. It’s something… It sticks with you all the time. You best just keep going on but… It’s something you won’t easily forget. But I think in the judicial sense it now is over yes.
Pauw: Are you addressed on this often?
Paulus: Uhhmmm… No, actually not so… I’m not addressed on this often. Uhh… All-days live goes it’s normal way… And the people at Aruba have had it with this.
Witt.: Yes, they’ve had it with this… But do they believe you?
Paulus: Uuhhm… I think so.
Witt.: So if you walk the streets you don’t think: ‘Oh they look at me… Maybe indeed a murderer… Or some other creepy-person…?’
Paulus: No, I don’t have that feeling at all. No it’s on the contrary very remarkable… uhhh… such a small community as Aruba is… and as it has had very much negative effects because of all this… That they keep and kept being supportive towards us. That has uh amazed us and… it has… our hearts… strengthened… as well. (Unintelligible.)
Witt.: Were you bothered by it?
Anita: Uhhm… Well I wasn’t bothered by it so much… You know that there is talk… I mean in every community… there is talk about what has happened. Actually… uhm, uhm, it was more like… the people they were very supportive. Neighbours, people you didn’t know at all, that still came to you… We lived on Aruba for almost twenty years… And people know Joran from the time he was very small… They saw Paul or me pushing the pram… And a former teacher of him that came by who said: ‘Well this can not at all be possible… Such a sweet kid…’ So that you felt as if this story must have had a different cause… Something else is going on… And… uh, the support… Well it sounds very strange but… it was very big. Really very big.
Witt.: Well, now the case is dismissed, in the judicial sense over with.., is that the reason you agreed to sit at the table with Peter R. de Vries?
Paulus: Well yes we have allways uh, said that uh, as soon as uh, this case us no longer in court.., when uh, the OM uh, is no longer prosecuting it, we uh, are willing to give uh, another interview, in uh, a reliable tv-show. Uh… To show we have nothing to hide. (I have to skip all the ‘uhs’ here now… the’re just to much of them.) And it is so that all this publicity has had a very big impact on this case. It has even at some point taken over it. We thought that as long as this case is going on it was not right to get in the lamplights - however at some times it was necessary - because we didn’t want to frustrate this investigation in any way.
Witt.: Yes, well uhm, Peter R. de Vries is here… He’s tried before… on Aruba as well, to get in contact with you… We’ll show a little clip how that sometimes went. (Clip of PRdVries at Jorans student-house in Arnhem, confronting Joran with fabricated photo of him with Natalee.)
Pauw: Well there were, before we started this show, some jokes made at this table like: ‘Well Peter… where’s your hidden camera…’ Well that hidden camera is not here right now. Peter, you have tried to get in contact with the VanderSloot-family a couple of times to have interviews… So you didn’t just walk behind them with your hidden camera… Do you understand something of the answer of Paul van der Sloot?
PRdV: No, to be honest, I don’t understand very much of that. I think it’s strange to hear him say here, he has nothing to hide, and he didn’t want to frustrate the investigation… But than I have to notice that they did nothing to help the case. Because Joran vdS has when he was at Aruba the last weeks, and could explain all his actions / conducts, maybe could end the mysteries, maybe could shed some light on that.., he has for weeks ‘kept his molars close on top of each-other’ (dutch expression = didn’t speak). Has not spoken a word, not answered one question! That is not what PvdS says…… this nice saying ‘We have nothing to hide’. Then I think… If you are innocent… and you did nothing wrong… why don’t you just tell your story, why don’t you answer questions from the police? The fact that you just kept your jaws closed (dutch expr.) I think in these circumstances is very strange…..
Pauw: Let’s agree that somewhat later in this show on this question, this is one of your questions but you have more of them, get answers from Joran or his father or mother… But first we…
Peter: Yes…. Just give hime some time to think…..
Pauw: Yes… So you have time to find the ‘right’ answer… (LOL) But firs before we talk about this whole matter let’s give the people at home a small summary of what has all happened and what is known… (CLIP of the NH-case)
Witt.: Were you suprised that you were re-arrested?
Joran: yes, off course… I uh… hadn’t expected that at all… I thought they were joking me… when the police arrived at the door… telling me ‘you’re under arrest again’… Because yes, uh I knew they could have nothing on me… so why would they again….
Witt.: Well it was said that there were new facts, so there were new grounds to arrest you again and take you to Aruba to interrogate you.
Joran: Yes, but I knew that would be impossible… that… that…
Witt.: But what than did you think… if it was impossible, what would be the reason they arrested you again?
Joran: Well I don’t know… Maybe I thought somebody has falsely stated against me, or something bad was said about me. I don’t know… Something like that… That’s what I thought… In that direction… Maybe something like that.
Witt.: And what did it turn out to be?! Because… You got there… You were interrogated…
Joran.: Well there turned out to be abslolutely nothing. No new evidence at all… Just old statements that they looked at in a different way.
Witt.: How did the interrogation go?
Joran: Well, just as mr. De Vries said, I just kept silent. I didn’t say anything.
Witt.: Why not?
Joran: I don’t have any trust anymore in the OM at Aruba… I think that they…. they are not trying to find the truth… or trying to find out what happened in this case. They are just literally doing…. they just want somebody to hang for this…

——-
More to come….

Joran: … they just want somebody to hang for this… They just want for their own egos to… That they themselves come good out of this…
Witt.: Even if it is an innocent person as well…
Joran: Yes, even if it is an innocent person as well. I’m convinced of that.
Peter: Well I think it’s a bit awkward that you say the Aruban OM is not trustworthy where it was you who lied all the time?!
Joran: Yes I lied and I admitt that but there were reasons for that and you don’t know them and….
Peter: Yes! I would like to know those reasons! … To lie about what you have done where you supposedly have nothing to hide!? Why do you have to lie then, tell me that?!
Joran: Well I did that extensivly in my book allready. And you have read that so you allready know the reasons.
Peter: But you are here now to tell your story or…?!!!
Witt.: Let’s agree that we the second part of the show will give you the opportunity to do that but first let’s tell the story of the VdSloot-family according to the rules we’ve in advance agreed on with Joran namely that we first look at what actually happened. Because you say I kept my mouth shut. I didn’t tell them anything more and they didn’t come up with anything new. Were those interrogations despite that tough?
Joran: Uhmmmmm… Well in fact compared to the first ones they were not. They turned out less tough than I’d expected. There was a Dutch detective-team that told THEIR story and in fact it was just speculating what they did. The allready talked in terms of ‘a girl that was dead’, you name it, where in fact it’s just a missing girl.
Pauw: That is all in the file is it… Because in the file of the judge-commissionar it says that it has to be put first that there are strong indications that Natalee is dead.
Joran: I would like to now that know as well…
Pauw: Because there is now evidence you know of she’s dead?
Joran: (Shakes his head.)
Pauw: Well, Deepak Kalpoe had stated that ‘her death was not good’?
Witt.: One of your friends there…
Joran: Yes, that uhhh… I don’t know either how that has went/gone (?) exactly… That’s something you should ask them.
Pauw: Didn’t you ask that to them ever? Like: ‘What have you said now?’
Joran: No (Unintelligible.)
Pauw: But what did you say than?
Joran: No I never asked him that. I uh, I mean we were so often interrogated by the police and we’ve in the beginning made so many statements… And I have allready said all there is to tell. So I think also… Yes… Why do I have to make the same statements twenty times to the police? I think that… the only thing they try is to find a little difference in them…
Pauw.: What we do here Joran, is just citing the report of the Judge-commissionar who has used that at Aruba. In this way Deepak Kalpoe stated that her death was not good, has Satish Kalpoe - which is the other friend or brother, what is it exactly? …
Joran: His brother.
Pauw: … Kalpoe thinks that suspect - you - has hit her to death, you yourself supposedly have stated about the burying of Natalee Holloway? That are some hard fact because of which you suggest that indeed something IS going on?
Joran: Yes, … I, I, … It’s three years ago now and in the beginning we’ve been really treated tough by the police and made to say things that we… wouldn’t say ourselves. And yes I have the feeling they made me want to say things that weren’t true.
Pauw: Did you never say… Or have you never spoken about burying Natalee Holloway?
Joran: No I have never discussed that with the pollice.
Anita: Can I go into that for a moment?
Witt.: Off course.
Anita: Uhmmm… When Joran was arrested for the first time I was the only one who was allowed to see him. Because he was a minor and they wanted to keep out Paul because of his function. Uhm, I have spoken to Joran some times but only short, some 15 to twenty minutes. And I am his mother. I love him very dearly. And I’m really convinced he wouldn’t do anything to that girl. These first emotions, these are very important to me… to see them in him as well… For a moment I doubted him. I’ve thought… By Jingo, could an accident have happened? Has something happened? Doesn’t he want to tell… He is just having his final exams… He knows he has final-exams-celebrations… He has a girlfriend… so he’s cheated on her… His father will be very angry with him… Etc. etc…. So I very directly spoke with him and one of the confrontations… that I came over there… And I was taken by an Aruban detective… And Joran was very upset… He before that was beset for hours and hours… Words were put in his mouth… which he never said… that were put to paper but that he never signed. And they showed that to me…: ‘This is what he said!’
Pauw: Well these are maybe not the most subtle moments in this conversation but Joran, you visited a psychiatrist because you were lying all the time.
Joran: No… That was not the reason why I visited the psychiatrist. I’ve been two times to a childrens psychiatrist but that was because we had some things going on within our family.
Anita: I can explain that as well… So you can hear it from my own mouth… Paul was in Holland for the Judges-training and I had to deal with three children in my own… And Joran as many seventeen year olds… I myself work with teens… And uh… he was not the easiest one. Besides that we had problems with… I had some problems with him… That he came home way to late… Uhm… I’m rather strict… Maybe even sometimes I was a little to strict… And at a certain point after talking about it with a friend of mine, maybe it’s good when we have some consults with a youth-psychiatrist. Because I just want that he has a goal in life… that he thinks well what he wants with his life and all this ‘going out’ I just think bad about that. And at that time he started playing poker in the casino and I don’t want my son being in the casino! So I contacted I youth-psychiatrist… He wasn’t 18 yet, he still was seventeen… He went there twice, that’s correct and we had one conlusive-conversation after that. And that was it… So it was really not just about lying…
Peter: What I now think is striking is that they have no confidence what soever in the judicial authorities. where at the same time it hasn’t been a long time ago that Paul vd Sloot did his very best to work in that organisation.
Pauw: As a judge you mean…
Peter: As a judge. I think it’s striking that suddenly there is so little confidence in that organisation…
Paulus: Well look uhhhh… Mister De Vries can’t hear that good… If he would have listened carefully he would have heard that Joran said that he didn’t have any confidence in the OM (public pros.)! That’s what Joran has said. Joran didn’t talk about the judicial authorities. What you see now.., what has happened is that luckely we have judicial authorities… And we sit here again! So in the end it’s because of the judicial authorities that all has ended well.
Witt.: The judge has said: the case must be dismissed, there is to little evidence, Joran is free! Well let’s for a minute get back to that prosecution before Joran was released because Joran just said they wanted to frame me; that’s what it came to it.

—
More to come…

 NOTE - i'LL ADD TO THIS POST WHEN MORE IS TRANSLATED AND POSTED ON THE FRONT PAGE OF SM

[private eye]

So he is kind of a sensationalism journalist? We have some of those in the US.

But those were legitimate questions he was asking. If anybody can cite another case where they think that anyone who was last seen with a missing girl, who repeatedly admittedly lied about the night, who framed 2 innocent security guards and never did anything to recant the story even after they were charged with murder, kidnapping, and arrested, who later told investigators that something went wrong and she died and was buried by the fishermans hut, and I realize that he recanted the story, but I also realize he subsequently led the police to the area that he claimed she was buried in, would not be quizzed repeatedly about why all the lies if you are innocent, I would like to know of the case. Paulus being an attorney with some training as a judge had to be prepared for this type of conversation and should have been able to prepare Joran for it.

This boys lies to the police were admittedly orchestrated by the Dad. One who is the son of a judge and was being advised by his father? What we don't understand is what was the goal of the advice his dad was giving him? Obstruct justice? Endanger Natalee's life as time was of the essence? Is this why he was expelled from the training as a judge program?

The most damning evidence is not that Joran was the last to be seen with her. Its all of the acts and lies that occurred when he was questioned about his time with her? And his responses were coached by a practicing attorney, who was in training to become a judge, who was fairly successful in litigation, and absolutely knew that the best defense would have been to simply tell the truth unless the truth was that Joran killed her. Otherwise, Joran got the worst advice possible.

And it is obvious Joran has an anger problem, that his parents have no control over him, and that he resorts to violence when he is frustrated or challeneged. It is also obvious that his parents are use to trying to do damage control as one chased after him, and the other remained to explain his behaviour, act as if nothing unusual happened, and continue on mitigating the episode.

Joran lost his temper and became violent even though I am positive he had been coached and coached not to act that way, knowing both parents were by his side, and knowing the stakes of his behavior during this interview would have on his future.

Is it hard to imagine him becoming frustrated with Natalee if she was as drunken/drugged as he claimed, and then in addition having told him no when he wanted to have sex, then fighting him away while he tried to satisfy his sexual urges, and finally smacking her in the head with a rock or his fist in an uncontrolled rage?

Is it not not possible to visulaize his parents falling into their usual pattern of damage control, and diminishing the death of Natalee as an inanimate object to discard or clean up, just like the glass of water, and then to be able to sit down and discuss their dear sportster as if he is an angel?

Sorry to digress, but yes we have our share of journalist like this one who can pry and irritate their guests, and their respect level varies depending on who is in the audience.

But we don't have one who can make an innocent man act so guilty, to demonstrate the lack of anger control that makes this type of crime so possible, and then to push buttons that cause the parents to immediately fall into a learned and repetitive type of damage control as this journaist did.


This should be 2 post one that responds to your comment, and I don't in any way mean to be negative to you even though this 2 part is certainly a negative post, you in no way have anything to do with the posts, it just came out in thinking about the US journalists who are sensationalist.

[klaasend]

Private Eye - it's my understanding that Peter de Vries is a crime journalist.  He claims to have solved cases that others couldn't solve.  He's one of those people you either love him or hate him.  I've seen many Dutch posters that love him.

The program last night was not his show, he was a guest on the show. 

Edited to add:  Here is a link to the Peter de Vries show website

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/

[MumInOhio]

Posted by EURobert on the front page of SM - transcription of the show last night:

Transscript and translation of last nights Pauw en Witteman tv-show (Please excuse me for all the grammatical and typing errors that will be in here; it’s to time-consuming to do it flawless…. Mr. Witteman’s first name is Paul so I’ll call PaulvdS: ‘Paulus’; that’s easier for me… To not get confused…)

Witteman: Good evening. Yes, Joran van der Sloot was brought back to Aruba end of november to be interrogated. That interrogation produced nothing. He was let go and the case was dismissed.
Pauw: Joran is here, together with his father Paul and with his mother Anita to have as they themselves say, their last tv-interview about this case.
Witt.: Here as well is Peter R. de Vries who has made a television-documentairy about the NH-case and the role JvdS played, and who has his doubts. He has called Joran a lier, so their is something to be discussed.
Pauw: (Looking at Joran) Yes, well.., you can confess now, so we have that behind us…? … … … … Are that the jokes you hear the most? Or what are you bothered with more Joran?
Joran: Well, I’m not really bothered by others.. But you have to keep making jokes. As you just said yourself… else you don’t get through all this.
Pauw: Do you have the feeling now that the whole matter is over now… or do you still have the feeling that if you somewhere hear a sirene… that could be for me?
Joran: Well… Not really like that but uh it’s something that you’ll never forget. It’s something… It sticks with you all the time. You best just keep going on but… It’s something you won’t easily forget. But I think in the judicial sense it now is over yes.
Pauw: Are you addressed on this often?
Paulus: Uhhmmm… No, actually not so… I’m not addressed on this often. Uhh… All-days live goes it’s normal way… And the people at Aruba have had it with this.
Witt.: Yes, they’ve had it with this… But do they believe you?
Paulus: Uuhhm… I think so.
Witt.: So if you walk the streets you don’t think: ‘Oh they look at me… Maybe indeed a murderer… Or some other creepy-person…?’
Paulus: No, I don’t have that feeling at all. No it’s on the contrary very remarkable… uhhh… such a small community as Aruba is… and as it has had very much negative effects because of all this… That they keep and kept being supportive towards us. That has uh amazed us and… it has… our hearts… strengthened… as well. (Unintelligible.)
Witt.: Were you bothered by it?
Anita: Uhhm… Well I wasn’t bothered by it so much… You know that there is talk… I mean in every community… there is talk about what has happened. Actually… uhm, uhm, it was more like… the people they were very supportive. Neighbours, people you didn’t know at all, that still came to you… We lived on Aruba for almost twenty years… And people know Joran from the time he was very small… They saw Paul or me pushing the pram… And a former teacher of him that came by who said: ‘Well this can not at all be possible… Such a sweet kid…’ So that you felt as if this story must have had a different cause… Something else is going on… And… uh, the support… Well it sounds very strange but… it was very big. Really very big.
Witt.: Well, now the case is dismissed, in the judicial sense over with.., is that the reason you agreed to sit at the table with Peter R. de Vries?
Paulus: Well yes we have allways uh, said that uh, as soon as uh, this case us no longer in court.., when uh, the OM uh, is no longer prosecuting it, we uh, are willing to give uh, another interview, in uh, a reliable tv-show. Uh… To show we have nothing to hide. (I have to skip all the ‘uhs’ here now… the’re just to much of them.) And it is so that all this publicity has had a very big impact on this case. It has even at some point taken over it. We thought that as long as this case is going on it was not right to get in the lamplights - however at some times it was necessary - because we didn’t want to frustrate this investigation in any way.
Witt.: Yes, well uhm, Peter R. de Vries is here… He’s tried before… on Aruba as well, to get in contact with you… We’ll show a little clip how that sometimes went. (Clip of PRdVries at Jorans student-house in Arnhem, confronting Joran with fabricated photo of him with Natalee.)
Pauw: Well there were, before we started this show, some jokes made at this table like: ‘Well Peter… where’s your hidden camera…’ Well that hidden camera is not here right now. Peter, you have tried to get in contact with the VanderSloot-family a couple of times to have interviews… So you didn’t just walk behind them with your hidden camera… Do you understand something of the answer of Paul van der Sloot?
PRdV: No, to be honest, I don’t understand very much of that. I think it’s strange to hear him say here, he has nothing to hide, and he didn’t want to frustrate the investigation… But than I have to notice that they did nothing to help the case. Because Joran vdS has when he was at Aruba the last weeks, and could explain all his actions / conducts, maybe could end the mysteries, maybe could shed some light on that.., he has for weeks ‘kept his molars close on top of each-other’ (dutch expression = didn’t speak). Has not spoken a word, not answered one question! That is not what PvdS says…… this nice saying ‘We have nothing to hide’. Then I think… If you are innocent… and you did nothing wrong… why don’t you just tell your story, why don’t you answer questions from the police? The fact that you just kept your jaws closed (dutch expr.) I think in these circumstances is very strange…..
Pauw: Let’s agree that somewhat later in this show on this question, this is one of your questions but you have more of them, get answers from Joran or his father or mother… But first we…
Peter: Yes…. Just give hime some time to think…..
Pauw: Yes… So you have time to find the ‘right’ answer… (LOL) But firs before we talk about this whole matter let’s give the people at home a small summary of what has all happened and what is known… (CLIP of the NH-case)
Witt.: Were you suprised that you were re-arrested?
Joran: yes, off course… I uh… hadn’t expected that at all… I thought they were joking me… when the police arrived at the door… telling me ‘you’re under arrest again’… Because yes, uh I knew they could have nothing on me… so why would they again….
Witt.: Well it was said that there were new facts, so there were new grounds to arrest you again and take you to Aruba to interrogate you.
Joran: Yes, but I knew that would be impossible… that… that…
Witt.: But what than did you think… if it was impossible, what would be the reason they arrested you again?
Joran: Well I don’t know… Maybe I thought somebody has falsely stated against me, or something bad was said about me. I don’t know… Something like that… That’s what I thought… In that direction… Maybe something like that.
Witt.: And what did it turn out to be?! Because… You got there… You were interrogated…
Joran.: Well there turned out to be abslolutely nothing. No new evidence at all… Just old statements that they looked at in a different way.
Witt.: How did the interrogation go?
Joran: Well, just as mr. De Vries said, I just kept silent. I didn’t say anything.
Witt.: Why not?
Joran: I don’t have any trust anymore in the OM at Aruba… I think that they…. they are not trying to find the truth… or trying to find out what happened in this case. They are just literally doing…. they just want somebody to hang for this…

——-
More to come….

Joran: … they just want somebody to hang for this… They just want for their own egos to… That they themselves come good out of this…
Witt.: Even if it is an innocent person as well…
Joran: Yes, even if it is an innocent person as well. I’m convinced of that.
Peter: Well I think it’s a bit awkward that you say the Aruban OM is not trustworthy where it was you who lied all the time?!
Joran: Yes I lied and I admitt that but there were reasons for that and you don’t know them and….
Peter: Yes! I would like to know those reasons! … To lie about what you have done where you supposedly have nothing to hide!? Why do you have to lie then, tell me that?!
Joran: Well I did that extensivly in my book allready. And you have read that so you allready know the reasons.
Peter: But you are here now to tell your story or…?!!!
Witt.: Let’s agree that we the second part of the show will give you the opportunity to do that but first let’s tell the story of the VdSloot-family according to the rules we’ve in advance agreed on with Joran namely that we first look at what actually happened. Because you say I kept my mouth shut. I didn’t tell them anything more and they didn’t come up with anything new. Were those interrogations despite that tough?
Joran: Uhmmmmm… Well in fact compared to the first ones they were not. They turned out less tough than I’d expected. There was a Dutch detective-team that told THEIR story and in fact it was just speculating what they did. The allready talked in terms of ‘a girl that was dead’, you name it, where in fact it’s just a missing girl.
Pauw: That is all in the file is it… Because in the file of the judge-commissionar it says that it has to be put first that there are strong indications that Natalee is dead.
Joran: I would like to now that know as well…
Pauw: Because there is now evidence you know of she’s dead?
Joran: (Shakes his head.)
Pauw: Well, Deepak Kalpoe had stated that ‘her death was not good’?
Witt.: One of your friends there…
Joran: Yes, that uhhh… I don’t know either how that has went/gone (?) exactly… That’s something you should ask them.
Pauw: Didn’t you ask that to them ever? Like: ‘What have you said now?’
Joran: No (Unintelligible.)
Pauw: But what did you say than?
Joran: No I never asked him that. I uh, I mean we were so often interrogated by the police and we’ve in the beginning made so many statements… And I have allready said all there is to tell. So I think also… Yes… Why do I have to make the same statements twenty times to the police? I think that… the only thing they try is to find a little difference in them…
Pauw.: What we do here Joran, is just citing the report of the Judge-commissionar who has used that at Aruba. In this way Deepak Kalpoe stated that her death was not good, has Satish Kalpoe - which is the other friend or brother, what is it exactly? …
Joran: His brother.
Pauw: … Kalpoe thinks that suspect - you - has hit her to death, you yourself supposedly have stated about the burying of Natalee Holloway? That are some hard fact because of which you suggest that indeed something IS going on?
Joran: Yes, … I, I, … It’s three years ago now and in the beginning we’ve been really treated tough by the police and made to say things that we… wouldn’t say ourselves. And yes I have the feeling they made me want to say things that weren’t true.
Pauw: Did you never say… Or have you never spoken about burying Natalee Holloway?
Joran: No I have never discussed that with the pollice.
Anita: Can I go into that for a moment?
Witt.: Off course.
Anita: Uhmmm… When Joran was arrested for the first time I was the only one who was allowed to see him. Because he was a minor and they wanted to keep out Paul because of his function. Uhm, I have spoken to Joran some times but only short, some 15 to twenty minutes. And I am his mother. I love him very dearly. And I’m really convinced he wouldn’t do anything to that girl. These first emotions, these are very important to me… to see them in him as well… For a moment I doubted him. I’ve thought… By Jingo, could an accident have happened? Has something happened? Doesn’t he want to tell… He is just having his final exams… He knows he has final-exams-celebrations… He has a girlfriend… so he’s cheated on her… His father will be very angry with him… Etc. etc…. So I very directly spoke with him and one of the confrontations… that I came over there… And I was taken by an Aruban detective… And Joran was very upset… He before that was beset for hours and hours… Words were put in his mouth… which he never said… that were put to paper but that he never signed. And they showed that to me…: ‘This is what he said!’
Pauw: Well these are maybe not the most subtle moments in this conversation but Joran, you visited a psychiatrist because you were lying all the time.
Joran: No… That was not the reason why I visited the psychiatrist. I’ve been two times to a childrens psychiatrist but that was because we had some things going on within our family.
Anita: I can explain that as well… So you can hear it from my own mouth… Paul was in Holland for the Judges-training and I had to deal with three children in my own… And Joran as many seventeen year olds… I myself work with teens… And uh… he was not the easiest one. Besides that we had problems with… I had some problems with him… That he came home way to late… Uhm… I’m rather strict… Maybe even sometimes I was a little to strict… And at a certain point after talking about it with a friend of mine, maybe it’s good when we have some consults with a youth-psychiatrist. Because I just want that he has a goal in life… that he thinks well what he wants with his life and all this ‘going out’ I just think bad about that. And at that time he started playing poker in the casino and I don’t want my son being in the casino! So I contacted I youth-psychiatrist… He wasn’t 18 yet, he still was seventeen… He went there twice, that’s correct and we had one conlusive-conversation after that. And that was it… So it was really not just about lying…
Peter: What I now think is striking is that they have no confidence what soever in the judicial authorities. where at the same time it hasn’t been a long time ago that Paul vd Sloot did his very best to work in that organisation.
Pauw: As a judge you mean…
Peter: As a judge. I think it’s striking that suddenly there is so little confidence in that organisation…
Paulus: Well look uhhhh… Mister De Vries can’t hear that good… If he would have listened carefully he would have heard that Joran said that he didn’t have any confidence in the OM (public pros.)! That’s what Joran has said. Joran didn’t talk about the judicial authorities. What you see now.., what has happened is that luckely we have judicial authorities… And we sit here again! So in the end it’s because of the judicial authorities that all has ended well.


Witt.: The judge has said: the case must be dismissed, there is to little evidence, Joran is free! Well let’s for a minute get back to that prosecution before Joran was released because Joran just said they wanted to frame me; that’s what it came to it.—
More to come…

 NOTE - i'LL ADD TO THIS POST WHEN MORE IS TRANSLATED AND POSTED ON THE FRONT PAGE OF SM

Confused again...I thought it was Smit. 

[private eye]

Private Eye - it's my understanding that Peter de Vries is a crime journalist.  He claims to have solved cases that others couldn't solve.  He's one of those people you either love him or hate him.  I've seen many Dutch posters that love him.

The program last night was not his show, he was a guest on the show. 

Edited to add:  Here is a link to the Peter de Vries show website

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/

Thanks Klass I love the interviewer, show, host, or guest whomever it was:)) I would have a little understanding for Joran and discount it except he HAD TO BE PREPARED, HAD TO EXPECT IT, AND IS STUPID ENOUGH TO KEEP TALKING AND ACTING SO ARROGANT!!!!!!!!!!AND HAD BOTH PARENTS AT HIS SIDE. NOTICE THAT ANITA DIDN'T EVEN BLINK

[private eye]

Private Eye - it's my understanding that Peter de Vries is a crime journalist.  He claims to have solved cases that others couldn't solve.  He's one of those people you either love him or hate him.  I've seen many Dutch posters that love him.

The program last night was not his show, he was a guest on the show. 

Edited to add:  Here is a link to the Peter de Vries show website

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/

Klass, someone special hasn't heard this yet and they are going to read it now. Do you know which page it is best to start at?


Thanks Klass I love the interviewer, show, host, or guest whomever it was:)) I would have a little understanding for Joran and discount it except he HAD TO BE PREPARED, HAD TO EXPECT IT, AND IS STUPID ENOUGH TO KEEP TALKING AND ACTING SO ARROGANT!!!!!!!!!!AND HAD BOTH PARENTS AT HIS SIDE. NOTICE THAT ANITA DIDN'T EVEN BLINK

[Blue Moon]

So he is kind of a sensationalism journalist? We have some of those in the US.

But those were legitimate questions he was asking. If anybody can cite another case where they think that anyone who was last seen with a missing girl, who repeatedly admittedly lied about the night, who framed 2 innocent security guards and never did anything to recant the story even after they were charged with murder, kidnapping, and arrested, who later told investigators that something went wrong and she died and was buried by the fishermans hut, and I realize that he recanted the story, but I also realize he subsequently led the police to the area that he claimed she was buried in, would not be quizzed repeatedly about why all the lies if you are innocent, I would like to know of the case. Paulus being an attorney with some training as a judge had to be prepared for this type of conversation and should have been able to prepare Joran for it.

This boys lies to the police were admittedly orchestrated by the Dad. One who is the son of a judge and was being advised by his father? What we don't understand is what was the goal of the advice his dad was giving him? Obstruct justice? Endanger Natalee's life as time was of the essence? Is this why he was expelled from the training as a judge program?

The most damning evidence is not that Joran was the last to be seen with her. Its all of the acts and lies that occurred when he was questioned about his time with her? And his responses were coached by a practicing attorney, who was in training to become a judge, who was fairly successful in litigation, and absolutely knew that the best defense would have been to simply tell the truth unless the truth was that Joran killed her. Otherwise, Joran got the worst advice possible.

And it is obvious Joran has an anger problem, that his parents have no control over him, and that he resorts to violence when he is frustrated or challeneged. It is also obvious that his parents are use to trying to do damage control as one chased after him, and the other remained to explain his behaviour, act as if nothing unusual happened, and continue on mitigating the episode.

Joran lost his temper and became violent even though I am positive he had been coached and coached not to act that way, knowing both parents were by his side, and knowing the stakes of his behavior during this interview would have on his future.

Is it hard to imagine him becoming frustrated with Natalee if she was as drunken/drugged as he claimed, and then in addition having told him no when he wanted to have sex, then fighting him away while he tried to satisfy his sexual urges, and finally smacking her in the head with a rock or his fist in an uncontrolled rage?

Is it not not possible to visulaize his parents falling into their usual pattern of damage control, and diminishing the death of Natalee as an inanimate object to discard or clean up, just like the glass of water, and then to be able to sit down and discuss their dear sportster as if he is an angel?

Sorry to digress, but yes we have our share of journalist like this one who can pry and irritate their guests, and their respect level varies depending on who is in the audience.

But we don't have one who can make an innocent man act so guilty, to demonstrate the lack of anger control that makes this type of crime so possible, and then to push buttons that cause the parents to immediately fall into a learned and repetitive type of damage control as this journaist did.


This should be 2 post one that responds to your comment, and I don't in any way mean to be negative to you even though this 2 part is certainly a negative post, you in no way have anything to do with the posts, it just came out in thinking about the US journalists who are sensationalist.

This is the greatest post I have seen yet.  Needs to be repeated and repeated often. This sums it up.  After what he did in that interview there should be not questions what he did to Natalee.  And NOW I am convinced his parents helped him clean it up just as they did on that show. And they wonder why this just doesn't go away.  The great Sporter did himself no good on that interview and his parents showed themselves for who they really are.  They could care less about the loss of life of Natalee. YES Joran, Anita and Paul SHE does have a name and it will forever be burned in Aruba's image who she is. Thanks to all of you.

[Nut44x4]

1. How long has it been since Joran took a shower??? 
2. Doesn't Paulus usually wear his watch on his other wrist?
3. Very rude and disrespectful for Joran not to remove his hat for this show    

I am having some buffering problems...will try to watch again later all the way through.